stomatitis + worse.....what to do?

I sure hope I can find some advice here.  Thank you for caring enough to read this.......

I have two cats.  Bosco will be 17 years old this spring, Scout will be 15.  They're both indoor/outdoor cats and have been healthy all their lives, until recently......

A year ago Bosco began exhibiting strange behavior while eating.  He would suddenly leap up as if jolted by electric shock, yelp, hiss, spit and run away.  Then with his head turned to the side, grind his jaw with a loud clacking noise.  I had just switched dry cat food brands, and being sort of an older cat, I thought maybe the new brand was too hard for his teeth.  I began soaking the dry food in water and buying canned pate food, but his problems continued, so I took him to the vet.  The vet said maybe he didn't like the food and some other answers that didn't seem right.  She did an oral exam under anesthesia, removed some teeth, put him on antibiotics, but none of it made any difference whatsoever and Bosco still exhibited the exact same symptoms.  So I took him to a second vet, who did a complete blood work up, but found nothing wrong with him.

Then Scout began exhibiting very similar symptoms!  Not quite as bad, but walking away from the bowl shaking her head and grinding her teeth.  I took her to the first vet, who looked in her mouth and said she had an oral cancer that would probably kill her in a year or two, and put her on antibiotics.  I was skeptical about the oral cancer diagnosis, given that both cats had such similar symptoms.

Meanwhlle, their potty habits were getting worse and worse.  I'm self-employed and live in a wooded suburban area, so the deal from the start was, the cats were to meow by the door when they needed to go out.  More and more frequently they were going downstairs and peeing and pooping on the living room carpet.  My house has an open floor plan, so I've had to block the stairs with a board, and put duct tape sticky side up on the balcony so they'd learn not to jump up to get around the board.  It's the first thing you see when you enter the house and looks terrible, but it effectively keeps them from going downstairs.  I also put a large kitty litter box in the only place where there's room......the bathtub. 

Occasionally they'd use the litter box, but now mostly peeing and pooping on the carpet upstairs.  I put duct tape wherever this happened, but they'd just go on the carpet somewhere else.  I'd have to cover the entire floor with duct tape.  If it was summer I could just put them outside.  But being winter and given their age, not so much.  So I started keeping Bosco in the bathroom.  Even there, he uses the litter box to pee, but poops on the floor 2-3 feet from the box!  And if the litter box has been used even once, he won't use it until it's pristine again.  He even pooped into the bathroom floor vent.  Scout refuses to be relegated to the bathroom and hides.  She can't get to the litter box, even if she wanted, when the bathroom door is closed to keep Bosco in.  She can jump over a gate.  It's awful knowing she's loose in the house.  The whole house reeks of cat pee I can't exactly locate.  Every day I have to clean poop off the bathroom floor.  It's so awful here now, it's hard to believe there was a time when I used to have people over to visit.  

Another of their symptoms has been uncontrollable drooling, and their saliva is indescribably stinky.  Googling that symptom, I finally discovered stomatitis!  I'm almost certain that explains their eating fits.  From everything I've read it seems it's incurable and the best that can be done would be removal of all their teeth.  I'm not sure I could afford that.   

But it's obvious both cats go through terrible pain, mostly while eating.  Bosco especially.  He yelps and thrashes around, and it's heartbreaking to witness.  I alternate feeding them canned pate food with water added and mashed into a mush, or mush made of soaked dry food.   It seems to help, and despite all, both have maintained healthy appetites.  But today Bosco hardly ate a thing.  It's like he's giving up.  They both hate being locked in the bathroom and seem depressed.  It's awful for all of us.  

If you've read this far.....you must be a saint.  This is the most dismal situation.  What would you do? 

Thanks for any help you can offer.......

creekgirl

As a vet tech, I HIGHLY recommend you see your vet first, for a formal diagnosis!
The symptoms your kitties present do fit with a stomatitis dx, but there are also a few other diseases with similar symptoms.

Stinky breath can be a symptom of cancer, kidney disease, stomatitis, periodontal disease, liver issues, FIV, FeLV, bartonellosis, etc.

Mouth sores can also be a symptom of the aforementioned.

As far as I know, stomatitis is NOT contagious (feline herpes is, though!),so the chances of both cats having it are very low. That being said, many underlying diseases that could cause stomatitis (FIV, FeLV, and bartonellosis ARE contaigious.

Stomatitis is thought to be an inflammatory autoimmune response that affects the feline oral cavity, due to an underlying condition, such as viruses/bacteria/cancers.

There is no real "cure" for stomatitis, even if an underlying condition is found, and treat; however, the condition can be managed quite well, and with proper care, long term prognosis is excellent.

Treating the underlying condition, if one is present, is the first step. Pain medication, anti-inflammatory drugs, and a thorough dental cleaning, are follow up steps. Daily oral care at home is also recommended (brushing feline teeth).

If symptoms do not improve, removal of the pre-molars and molars is sometimes indicated. This reduces the bacterial load in the oral cavity, helping to alleviate the oain of the disease.

creekgirl said:

 
creekgirl

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I had a cat with bad stomatitis and the easiest and fastest "cure" is tooth removal.  Mine had to ultimately have all her teeth removed but it was an incredible difference, she had a 100% reversal and this is common after extractions.  She eats perfectly now, no pain, both wet and dry food.  Your cats are in pain, and doing extractions would probably take care of it.  Please discuss with your vet.

Thank you both!  I called my vet today.  That is, the first vet, the one both cats have seen.  The receptionist was not familiar with stomatitis and said the vet would look at their records and get back to me.  

The other vet, the one I took Bosco to for a second opinion, had done a full blood work-up on him last summer, which turned up no underlying diseases.  Given that Scout's symptoms are so much like his, I would guess it might stand to reason that would be the case for her too.  

I guess the best news is, if full dental extraction is called for, it would be around $200 per cat.  I was afraid it would be more expensive than that.

creekgirl said:

Thank you both!  I called my vet today.  That is, the first vet, the one both cats have seen.  The receptionist was not familiar with stomatitis and said the vet would look at their records and get back to me.  

The other vet, the one I took Bosco to for a second opinion, had done a full blood work-up on him last summer, which turned up no underlying diseases.  Given that Scout's symptoms are so much like his, I would guess it might stand to reason that would be the case for her too.  

I guess the best news is, if full dental extraction is called for, it would be around $200 per cat.  I was afraid it would be more expensive than that.

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Full dental extraction is the only thing to stop the spread of the gum disease. $200 per cat sounds unbelievably low. I was quoted $2,000 here in Connecticut last year.

I agree $200 sounds very low. There is full anesthesia, blood work and a lot of mother things that go into it.

I thought it sounded low too, but I hope it's correct.  There's no way I could afford $2000 per cat.  Also to be considered would be their age.  And the pee and poop issues.  But I love these cats and would not want to have them put down.  

creekgirl said:

I thought it sounded low too, but I hope it's correct.  There's no way I could afford $2000 per cat.  Also to be considered would be their age.  And the pee and poop issues.  But I love these cats and would not want to have them put down.  

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Of course you don't. But you wouldn't want them to suffer either. I have euthanized cats if their quality of life is non-existent.

Are you still feeding the dry food that you switched to when the problem started? If so, I would eliminate it in case it's tainted with something that's making them sick. Animals die from bad pet food all of the time, often with seemingly unexplainable symptoms first.

The dry cat food I was feeding them a year ago when this started was Purina Naturals.  I had only been buying it a few months when they got sick.  Given that they seemed to have eating problems, I thought maybe the brand was too hard for their teeth, especially since they are older cats.  Since then I alternate between pate style canned cat food and Purina One dry cat food, both of which I add water and mash into mush.  They still have trouble eating, especially Bosco, who goes into the same violent fits, but as usual goes right back to eating!

It's hard to say on quality of life.  They seem weak and lethargic and I think Bosco may have arthritis.  But their appetites are good and sometimes they seem perfectly normal.  Scout can still jump 5 feet up when she wants to!  They certainly don't like being shut up in the bathroom.  They never get to roam the house or sit with me anymore.  I miss spending time with them, but not the reeking uncontrollable drool and peeing/pooping all over the house.  They seem to enjoy sitting in the sun when the weather is nice.  I guess I've figured in spring they can spend more time outdoors.  Where they can use the whole yard as their litter box!

Well, I just talked to my vet's office.  They said stomatitis is a condition, not a disease, and they want to do blood tests on both cats to find underlying causes.  I told them Bosco had a full blood work up done last summer by another vet.  They want me to fax over the results, and want to redo the tests in case of changes.  They also want to test Scout, as they said stomatitis is not contagious and she may have something else.  (???)  Also dental exams on both.  They said they will not extract healthy teeth, in any case.

When I said I read on the internet that full dental extraction is the most effective treatment for stomatitis, they said you can't trust everything you read on the internet.

I had hoped full dental extraction might be the silver bullet, but now it looks like a much more involved and expensive process.

creekgirl said:

 
Well, I just talked to my vet's office.  They said stomatitis is a condition, not a disease, and they want to do blood tests on both cats to find underlying causes.  I told them Bosco had a full blood work up done last summer by another vet.  They want me to fax over the results, and want to redo the tests in case of changes.  They also want to test Scout, as they said stomatitis is not contagious and she may have something else.  (???)  Also dental exams on both.  They said they will not extract healthy teeth, in any case.

When I said I read on the internet that full dental extraction is the most effective treatment for stomatitis, they said you can't trust everything you read on the internet.

I had hoped full dental extraction might be the silver bullet, but now it looks like a much more involved and expensive process.

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In this case the internet is right and your vet's office is sounding very odd.  There are 2 and only 2 treatments for stomatitis, steroids that may help for a while and may not, and extractions.  Sometimes a partial extraction will do it, otherwise a full mouth extraction is needed (we tried partial with my cat but had to go back and take the rest out, so cheaper if done once). Stomatitis can be diagnosed by a competent vet in about 30 seconds by looking at the gums.  And this isn't about extracting or not extracting healthy teeth, its about ending the auto immune response your cat's mouth is having in response to the presence of the teeth.  this is a good link from a reputable source.  I personally don't like the sound of your vet's advice.  http://healthypets.mercola.com/site...06/dr-becker-discusses-feline-stomatitis.aspx

Excellent link from Stephen above. My Harry at 10 months had to have a full mouth extraction. No way was I going to let it develop to stomatitis.

Thank you for the link, Stephen.  I don't think it would change my vet's mind, though.  Her office was very set in their opinion, even kind of irritated with me.  I would just have to take my cats to a different vet.  Oddly enough, Bosco seems better!  He's more active again, eating very well, has fewer "fits."  Does this condition fluctuate?  

I was looking through threads on dental extractions and came across yours. My cats have nothing like yours, I am so grateful! What has happened? I so hope your kitties are much better now, causes found and treated. If you are still having problems with the vets, do you have a university with a vet curriculum? They would have multiple vets and lots of good, updated equipment.

Please, an update?

An update:

I was wrong, Bosco has not gotten better.  Both cats are neither better or worse, as far as the stomatitis is concerned.  Life around here, though, has become ghastly.

As mentioned previously, I have to keep both cats in the bathroom, as they had taken to peeing/pooping all over the house.  I only have 1.5 bathrooms, so to take a shower I have to haul out the litter box.  That wouldn't be so bad if they used it.  Instead one cat or the other or both were using the litter box to pee, but pooping on the floor.   I have brown tile and would sometimes not see it and step in it.  One of them pooped into the heating register.  I clean the litter box 2-3 times a day, basically after any use, still one or both poops within just a few feet of the litter box.   EVERY DAY I have to clean cat poop off the floor. 

NOW one or both is no longer even peeing in the box, but on the floor or wherever.  I can't see it, but I can smell it.  The bathroom REEKS so bad it is hellish to even just open the door.  It is miserable to take a shower.

Even worse.......Scout took to sitting on the bathroom counter, on top of the tray that holds my comb and toothpaste, with her head over the cup that holds my toothbrush, drooling her stinky drool all over!

Yesterday I was about to leave for a party, stopped real quick to get a hairband from the bathroom and.......stepped right in cat poop.  Had to clean it off the heel of my boot before I could leave.

EVERY day I mash up their food with water to soften it so they don't have to chew it.  If it is a warm day, I carry them outside and let them sit in the sun, and bring them back in at night.

But I can't go on living like this.  The stench of urine, the cat shit on the floor every day.  It's disgusting and un-hygenic and miserable!  I thought if I could just hold out until summer, then I could just have them both live outside mostly.  But I don't know that I can stand it until then.  

There is no place here to set up a pet cage.  A pet carrier is too small.  What can I do?

I know I expressed reluctance to have one or both cats "put down."  But maybe I should reconsider.  Would a vet even do it under these circumstances?  

Maybe you guys know.  

Advice appreciated.

I would get them to a vet asap going outside the box means they are not well. As for the stomatitis if your current vet won't do anything get a second opinion. It is a treatable condition.

Has there been an actual diagnosis here? Has anything been done to help these cats? If it is the same as you described in the beginning, I am stunned the cats are still able to eat in that amount of pain.  

creekgirl
Stomatitis is a treatable condition, but the costs could be substantial. Your current vet does not appear to be up to date on the best treatment options.

You also need to consider the quality of life your cats have, and the care and facilities you are able to provide

This is an article about quality of life and making decisions:
http://www.thecatsite.com/a/when-is-it-time-making-the-difficult-decision

Only you can decide what actions are right for you and your cats

You would not be the first person here who has had to make a decision based on quality of life

Thank you all for your thoughts.  

I can't afford all the vet bills for tests, diagnosis and treatment.  But even if I could, would it change the cats' pee/poop habits?  I seriously doubt it.  They were originally trained to meow at the door to go outside.  This was fine for over 10 years, but as they've grown older, they started going on the floor and carpet instead.  I don't think it is linked to illness.  More likely age.  (And stubborness!  It's like they expect me to cave and say, okay, I give up, you win, have it your way.)

btw.......there are 4 piles of poop on the bathroom floor waiting for me to clean up, just from the last 12 hours.  With a clean litter box a few feet away!  It's like I go through this process of special food preparation only to be rewarded with more poop to clean up.  The whole bathroom reeks, I clean best I can and it just reeks again.  The cats are depressed from being locked in the bathroom.  I'm depressed from living this way.  I wish it was warm enough that I could just throw them outside (not LITERALLY throw them) but even if it was summer, would outdoor living be safe and healthy for them, esp. at their age?  Probably not advisable, and I'm just locked in this intolerable situation.