Reverse sneezing and sneezing

Bit of an update.
The antibiotic coarse of 45 days ran out on the 25th of jan. The whole time he was on them there was not one sneeze or any abnormal behavior what so ever. It's now the 3rd of feb and iv already started to notice some weird goings on. He has sneezed a few times, certainly not to the degree he was at the start but never the less, there was no sneezing at all while he was on the antibiotics.
He has also developed a strange cough. Some what like a furball cough but no furball. This has happened twice so far. Im not sure if it's the beginning of the return of the reverse sneezing again or if it's something new entirely. At the moment im just going keep a very close eye on him and see what comes of it. If it keeps happening over the next few days i will take him back to the vet.
I am very worried though as the vet seemed to have no answers last time i took him in. It's so stressful and confusing. As far as i know antibiotics only work on bacterial infections and seen as how they have worked 100% each time he has been on them then it must have been a bacterial infection right? why are the symptoms reoccurring?

Fodder said:

 
Bit of an update.
The antibiotic coarse of 45 days ran out on the 25th of jan. The whole time he was on them there was not one sneeze or any abnormal behavior what so ever. It's now the 3rd of feb and iv already started to notice some weird goings on. He has sneezed a few times, certainly not to the degree he was at the start but never the less, there was no sneezing at all while he was on the antibiotics.
He has also developed a strange cough. Some what like a furball cough but no furball. This has happened twice so far. Im not sure if it's the beginning of the return of the reverse sneezing again or if it's something new entirely. At the moment im just going keep a very close eye on him and see what comes of it. If it keeps happening over the next few days i will take him back to the vet.
I am very worried though as the vet seemed to have no answers last time i took him in. It's so stressful and confusing. As far as i know antibiotics only work on bacterial infections and seen as how they have worked 100% each time he has been on them then it must have been a bacterial infection right? why are the symptoms reoccurring?

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Oh, @Fodder, I was so hoping that L.B.O. was on the mend, and that the last course of antibiotics would be the one, which proved to be effective, in dealing with his reverse sneezing.

You're right, antibiotics only work on bacterial infections, or secondary bacterial infections,...so it's very perplexing that they 'control the symptoms of sneezing' but don't actually get rid of whatever is causing the sneezing.

I still think it's the tooth, which may be adding to LB's problems, especially since you mentioned the gum was swollen,...but I would not know why your Vet would not be concerned with this.

Perhaps, she is looking at the bigger picture, and thinking about all related causes to sneezing. (though, dental issues do cause infections and sneezing,...so I really don't know...and I'm not a vet, she would know better.)

One of the other threads, recently mentioned a cat and allergy to 'soy' in their food: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/332830/cat-sneezing

Has anything in LBO's food changed in the time you noticed the reverse sneezing? Even a change by the manufacturer of the food, when they update their ingredients, or anything similar?

And with the 'Culture and Sensitivity' test that the Vet had run on the nasal discharge....did the antibiotics given in the last four courses show to be effective to anything that had shown up?

Well he definitely is not as bad as he was before the antibiotics. So far he hasn't actually had a reverse sneeze, just a few normal sneezes per day and this weird cough thing. Im starting to think it is something much worse than i originally thought. Maybe heart or lung problems or even an immune system disorder like felv. I really hope that isn't the case but if this cough persists much longer i am going to insist the vet does some more thorough testing.

I think the reason she wasn't concerned that it was his tooth causing issues was that the tooth in question is in his lower jaw, the first premolar behind the canine. It is possibly not a resorptive lesion as i suspected as when you touch it he has no reaction at all. Usually resorptive lesions are quite painful and they react. She said even if it was it wouldn't cause the sneezing as it is in the lower jaw and therefor wont effect the nasal cavity. I will ask her to check it again next time i go in though.

I must have changed his food a dozen times to test if it was that. At first the sneezing started out of the blue with food he had been on for some time but i changed it to try anyway, just in case he had built some sort of allergy up but it didn't seem to help. I have been giving him a prescription food for bladder ph level balance fairly consistently though. I have cut that one out recently to try so it may still be that.  Im hoping it isn't though as he has had some awful times with bladder crystals and that food works a treat for him.

The funny thing about the culture test is it came back negative for everything. There was no infection at all present. Isn't that the weirdest thing though? The antibiotics work 100% and only work on bacterial infections yet there appears to be no bacterial infection present. I just have no idea what that could even mean.

Thanks again cat nap for your support and suggestions. If things persist i will take your advice and try a new thread to see if i can get more advice. This one is probably too long now for the average browser to stay and read through and there have been a lot of updates since the beginning.

EDIT: You know, i just gave that tooth a bit of a poke with a cotton bud and he did react a bit. Didn't seem to like it much at all so i think il get that tooth removed. Im pretty sure something is wrong with it anyway as it looks just like pictures on the internet of resorptive lesions.

@Fodder ...I don't think it would be felv, since that is easily ruled out with a blood test.

(And from one of my younger cats, Sparky, dying at age 2.3 yrs old, of felv+ complications,...I would advise that the Felv and Fiv test be 'sent out' to a lab and not done as a snap test.

Having read that many 'snap tests' show too many false positives. It is more expensive sending the felv and fiv test out, but worth it, IMO. Though, maybe the 'snap tests' have improved, and are more economical, so I guess it depends upon your own thoughts.)

As for LBO, having possible heart or lung problems, ...since your Vet listened to his heart and lungs, then I would not worry about that, either.

(There is a heart test called a Cardiopet proBNP, which measures enzymes or hormones, circulating in the blood, and this may help, in determining if a cat has a bad heart condition.)

(One of my Vets had advised it for my rainbow cat Spotty, on finding a heart murmur, but another Vet and the cat-Cardiologist, had told me that it only picks up 40% of cases. In my Spotty's case, it worked, and allowed us to monitor his heart status.)

It makes sense, what your Vet said about the tooth being in his lower jaw, and not affecting the nasal cavity.

(I think the reason that I'm 'stuck' on the tooth issue... is from my own experience, and thinking that 'dental problems'...caused or are related to kidney problems with my rainbow cat, Spotty.

I'm sorry that I'm causing you to worry more, or be concerned with it, but I guess I just can't shake the thinking that 'dental infections' do cause other problems, in other organs.

I suppose I'm just being narrow-sighted, and this is not helpful in LBO's case, at all.)

I'm glad that LBO is not as bad as before, but yes, I would also keep a good eye/ear, on that cough thing.

For his bladder issues,...Do you have to check his ph-levels with test-strips, too?

Make sure to check with your Vet, before changing any prescription foods, too, as the food was prescribed for his bladder issues, and like you said, you don't want them to come back.

Yes, that is truly weird about the 'culture' coming back negative for everything, yet the antibiotics working.

Still sending mega health vibes, for your guy, Little Black One, LBO or LB.  

fodder
I recommend not changing away from the prescription food for the bladder issues. Antibiotics and other meds can change the body chemistry and could cause a relapse. Since LBO is a nervous kitty, I would worry about the pH balance even more. Wishing both of you good luck and hoping you find the cure for his problems

My cat used to reverse sneeze somewhat regularly (once a week) and my vet told me to give Pogo (cat) 1/4 zyrtec daily. I had taken a video of Pogo reverse sneezing and based on the symptoms and history, she thinks there's something in the environment causing the issue. Sure enough, after he started taking zyrtec, he stopped sneezing. Of course, once I stopped the meds, he started sneezing again. YMMV.

You might want to swing that idea by your vet. 

Thank you everyone for your input. I really appreciate all the help i can get.
Today he did the reverse sneeze again and so im almost certain it has nothing to do with his food. I will keep giving him his prescription food as you guys suggest. Definitely don't need more complications right now.
The cough has now vanished and its back to sneezing.

Cat nap, I think you may be right about the tooth having something to do with it. Iv noticed since the antibiotics finished his breath has gotten a little bit smelly to which would also indicate tooth issues. Im just not sure about why the vet thought there was no problems there when i took him in last time. You can clearly see a red lump on his premolar and it has been there a while now. Even with my very limited knowledge on the matter i would think that that would be cause to investigate further. It does seem to bother im a little to.
I don't even think the vet has done blood tests on him. I will be taking him back in this coming week to check that tooth again and i will ask her to do bloods on him to.
Please don't be concerned that you have caused me to worry. I am already as worried as i possibly can be. All you have done is offer support and suggestions which i am truly grateful for.

pogo16, Thank you very much for your suggestion. I have also considered that it may be due to allergy of some sort and so it is good news to get confirmation that this can actually be caused by allergy.
I will mention the zyrtec to my vet when i take him in later this week.

Thanks again everyone. It's really a big help getting your input.
 

Another update.
I took him back to the vet today. This time i saw another vet who was MUCH better! The tooth DOES have a resorptive lesion as i suspected and is going to be extracted tomorrow. I am a bit angry at the other vet really. Not only did it cost me over $100 the first time for her to just say nothing was wrong but also, even though i pointed it out to her myself, she completely missed that something was wrong with his tooth. He has been in pain for around 2 months more than he had to be because of that 

However, The new vet said this probably is not the reason for his reverse sneezing. He is going to check out his mouth more thoroughly while he is asleep getting the tooth out and also put a camera down his throat to see what he can see. He mentioned that the tissue in the back of his throat looked swollen for some reason. He said it was similar to stomatitis except there was no redness which there usually is. He also mentioned that his teeth were in very good condition aside from that one tooth.

If he is unable to find anything obvious tomorrow he said we will probably try him on an even longer coarse of antibiotics, this time accompanied by a steroid as well. I also mentioned the zyrtec which he said was also worth trying out and he will also be getting a full blood test done 

Hopefully this new vet can help him out better. He seems to be far more observant and experienced than the last vet. I was in there for more than an hour this morning talking to him about all of this, ha ha.

Tomorrow i am going to use up all those good vibes cat nap. He is going under and on top of the normal issues associated with putting an older cat under anesthetic, his breathing issues complicate things even further. Im really really worried about him but i think he is in good hands. I hope everything works out. Don't think i will be sleeping much tonight.

I'm so glad that you got another Vet to see LBO.  At least with a fresh set of eyes, and ideas, this new Vet might pinpoint what is really going on.

(I was kind of hoping that it was similar to what @pogo16 mentioned, and that zyrtec would work,...though really hoping that it was only 'seasonal allergies' and that LBO would not have to take meds, daily.

I suppose I just prefer when things are simple, and courses of medications are short. I'm pretty sure that we all do, as well.)

(It is really disappointing when one Vet says one thing, and another Vet says something different, ...but I guess that means that 'second opinions' are always worth having.

Problem is finding a 'good Vet,' who you know is knowledgeable, thorough, and caring.

I have seen many Vets, and notice that they do vary widely in explaining things, and thoroughness. Good ones are worth keeping, but they end up leaving the practice, and moving, sometimes.)

I still don't understand why the antibiotics worked, but did not rid LBO completely of the reverse sneezing.

Perhaps it is related to the 'swollen throat' in some way.

Really hoping that this New Vet gets to the bottom of it.

Also hoping that LBO's blood test comes back fine, and if anything found, it is easily treatable.

Sending LBO more Health Vibes,    times twenty. Anything and everything that works, will be coming his way.        

I so know that worried feeling of having an older cat go under anesthetic. It's kind of impossible to avoid, but remembering that other older cats go through it, and he's in good hands, plus not much choice, might make it a tad easier.

Try to get some sleep, tonight, though it's easier said than done.

Just got off the phone with the vet. The tooth extraction was a success. Im still really annoyed that the first vet left him with that tooth. When she was telling me about the extraction she said she removed what was left of the tooth, that's how bad it was.

It's not really good news though. None of the three vets that work there think that that was the problem with the sneezing. In fact none of them know what it is at all. Apparently there is some swelling at the back of his throat but there is no obvious reason why. She said it may just be fatty tissue as he is over weight but "It's hard to tell" in her words. My options are back to what they were last time. Put him on an even longer term antibiotic(10 weeks) probably accompanied by a steroid this time in an attempt to reduce the swelling in his mouth. Or take him to the extremely expensive and far away specialist for tests that probably wont reveal much if anything more than what they have already seen. Even if they were to find a tumor or something so far in his nasal cavity the operation to remove it would be extreme, costly and dangerous.
Im feeling very disheartened right now. I was really hoping the tooth might have been it, i guess there is a very slim chance that it may have been but it's highly doubtful. She also said that there really is no point to trying an antihistamine. I have completely forgotten why now but she did have a reason.

There is another guy having similar problems to me on the forums at the moment. He to has been unable to find a solution after multiple vet visits.

I just wish i could find a solution for him. One thing that repeats over and over in my mind is why are the antibiotics so effective? If it was a tumor or foreign body then surely the sneezing would remain even on antibiotics right? I mean, the sneezing has stopped on the very first dose every single time and lasted past the last dose for at least a week every single time. I have probably said that or something similar to that a dozen times in this thread so far but i just can't shake that reasoning.

Sigh, im really exhausted from this. I don't have any kids and this kind of makes me glad. Im really in a state of worry 24/7 about this. If it was my child i doubt id ever sleep.


Thank you for your vibes cat nap. Looks like they got him through ANOTHER anesthetic. I hope he at least finds some relief from the tooth coming out.

I think that LBO will find relief from the bad tooth coming out.

Did they not put him on antibiotics, now, for the tooth infection? Perhaps not, since he was on the other ones, for so long.

Or give him a few days of painkillers?

Curious why the Vet would say that having a trial run of antihistamine(zyrtec) would not help?

Does it have to do with 'hydration' or something else?

Are they suggesting a 'wait and see' approach, until he heals up from the tooth extraction?

And then weighing your options, of what to do next.

Why not wait until the Senior blood tests comes back, and then decide on what to do with your Vet.

They have actually prescribed an even longer coarse of antibiotic this time. 10 weeks and also a 2 week coarse of steroids.
I need to talk to them again tomorrow before starting all of that though. It could be( and probably is) premature optimism but i have noticed since he has been home from the tooth extraction he hasn't made a peep. Not one sneeze, not one sniffle, hasn't licked his lips and swallowed at all.
It could be that they already gave him an antibiotic or a side effect from the anesthetic or what im desperately hopeful for, that the tooth was the problem.
I guess only time will tell. Im pretty sure he will need at least some of the antibiotics anyway while the tooth heals which could mask it for weeks but i will have to get more advice from the vet to see what they suggest.
Wouldn't that be amazing if it was though! I will go dancing on the moon if he has stopped sneezing.

With the antihistamine., Im not %100 sure why she didn't want to try it either. From memory she said something like there were no signs that it was allergy. I still don't know why you wouldn't give it a shot though. Im fairly sure antihistamines are pretty safe.

Also he got no pain relief meds. Maybe it was a small incision. Judging by what she told me about what condition that tooth was in, he would have probably been in much more pain before it came out anyway. It is amazing and scary how good they are at hiding pain. I am still really annoyed that the other vet left it. Not only that but she charged me almost $300 to tell me his teeth were fine.

Anyway for now it's a bit of wait and see but im crossing  my fingers,toes,legs and eyes in hopes it was the tooth   

My Himalayan cat who is almost 10 has been doing this his entire life.  I have asked and asked the vets but they never have any answers.  I have questioned them about asthma but they never seem to think he has it. They always seem to think possibly respiratory allergies.  He sometimes sounds like he has mucous in his throat.  He has flares that seem to make him lethargic and I have noticed he has shallow breathing at times.  Just this past week we had him on a low dose of prednisolone which seems to have helped tremendously after he fought it for almost a week.  The vet also prescribed transdermal antihistamines but I don't know if I can see a huge difference when we use those.  I wish you luck in finding answers.

Unfortunately it has returned. I assume the anesthetic had something to do with it being gone. And so starts a 10 week antibiotic run accompanied by steroids. Im really bummed out about it.

Thanks everyone for your input and suggestions. I don't know much about snoring but i do know it's not an uncommon thing. Cats tend to do it when they are in a deep sleep. As far as i know, as long as he doesn't have any breathing issues like coughing or wheezing or open mouth breathing then he should be fine.

@furrypurry. The fact that your guy has had it his entire life is interesting. Does it come and go or is it fairly consistent? It could possibly be FHV. You could ask your vet to do tests to check for it. My other cat has asthma and it is really quite unmistakable. She sticks her head forward and low to the ground and coughs. Quite a raspy cough but fairly different from the reverse sneezing. Similar to the cat in this video  
Thank you all for your support and ideas. It is much appreciated.

Fodder, I have always suspected that both of my boys have FHV, but they have never been tested as I understand it is expensive and often unreliable.  I think Jaspurr looks more like a reverse sneeze than the asthma attack depicted in the videos.  Right now he is doing better after the steroids but I'm sure it will return.  I am planning to try Zyrtec when he has problems again.  I talked with my vet this morning and she thinks that's worth a try.  She also mentioned that we may end up with the inhaled steroids if it gets worse as he gets older.  My other cat, Purrcy, doesn't have the severe sneeze attacks but he always has a stuffy nose and sometimes it's runny.  I use the saline drops with him and it seems to help.  Just high maintenance kitties!  But they are so worth it.  And just to mention I do use lysine. 

I hope you find a solution for your kitty.  I know how stressful it can be worrying about them and not knowing what to do.  

Francine

Unfortunately I cannot help you. However, when this reverse sneezing kicks in, I have been told by the vet to block the nostrils with my fingers to force the animal to breathe through its mouth. This calms down the episodes of reverse sneezing.

For the FHV they do a polymerase chain reaction test (PCR). You are right about it being somewhat unreliable but if your cat is displaying symptoms at the time of testing there is a good chance they will pick it up. As far as i know it costs around the same as other lab tests like blood tests etc but that's not to say it's cheap. Vet visits are rarely cheap. Im down to my last pennies trying to help Lb out and things only get more costly from here 

The antihistamines do sound promising in your case though. Especially because the steroids seem to help. I really hope it's a nice simple fix for you. For some reason my vet seems to think they aren't worth trying for LB. Im still not %100 sure why. Maybe there are tell tail signs for allergy that he is not displaying but i would have thought that since we have tried almost everything else under the sun and that they are fairly harmless that she would have given them a shot.
They seem to think it is most likely he has a tumor or foreign body stuck deep in his nasal cavity which is not cool. Thing is, it is almost impossible to see up there. He has had xrays and flushes and this and that but there is still no evidence of anything. My only option really now is the specialist which i don't want to do for a number of reasons but im really out of options.

As im typing this he is having a reverse sneeze attack. It's breaking my heart 

I wish I'd seen this thread earlier... I have a cat that does this too (though far more intensely). It's nothing to worry about, it's just a hairball that isn't expelled! It's not large enough to be vomited up but still causes irritation. I see it in the poop the next day as a long thick stringy bit of hair instead of a properly formed hairball. The antibiotics likely made him feel nauseated which may suppress the apatite or reduce grooming which could explain why it "went away" temporarily.

I honestly believe this is nothing to be worried about at all. If you look at the video from the point of view of the stomach not the "reverse sneezing" aspect you can see it's a convulsive response - trying to expel something from the stomach/intestines and around 55s the cat swallows - that's the small bit of hair and/or vomit going back down.

jmjimmy said:

I wish I'd seen this thread earlier... I have a cat that does this too (though far more intensely). It's nothing to worry about, it's just a hairball that isn't expelled! It's not large enough to be vomited up but still causes irritation. I see it in the poop the next day as a long thick stringy bit of hair instead of a properly formed hairball. The antibiotics likely made him feel nauseated which may suppress the apatite or reduce grooming which could explain why it "went away" temporarily.

I honestly believe this is nothing to be worried about at all. If you look at the video from the point of view of the stomach not the "reverse sneezing" aspect you can see it's a convulsive response - trying to expel something from the stomach/intestines and around 55s the cat swallows - that's the small bit of hair and/or vomit going back down.

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Thank you very much for your reply. Unfortunately i think it might be different for LB. For a start, he has had it for a year without any signs of it letting up except for when he is on antibiotics(sometimes 12 weeks at a time with only a 10 day break between his next ones). He often sneezes 10 to 20 times a day along with a few reverse sneezes. Sometimes he will blow out some nasal discharge and other times you can hear him trying to clear his nose. Sort of like forcing air out a bit.
He has had xrays and also had a camera down his throat. Also on a separate occasion he had one up his nose and had a nasal flush, maybe 2, i can't remember everything he has had now.
He doesn't malt much either. I have never had him throw up a furball.
Thank you again for your response though. I really appreciate any ideas or suggestions