When to put to sleep- FelV

I'll try to make this concise as possible...

I picked up a cat from a bad area (a double shooting down the block last week).  He's an adult male, friendly, etc.  

I noticed he had an upper respiratory infection (congested, conjunctivitis) and he was pretty dirty and thin.  He got into the carrier and after keeping him in a huge dog crate for the next night, I took him to the vet a day later.  Felv positive.  His lymph nodes are swollen- you can feel them.  He got an antibiotic shot and I wanted to see how it plays out- at least give him some love and care, so I took him home.

I have a few cats in, so I set him up in my detached garage, bought a new window air conditioner, so it's nice and cool.  3 days later, his eyes are still running/discharging, some redness, still congested and his fur is not great. He's eating, drinking and using the litter box but I can't tell if it hurts to swallow.  What doesn't help is that it's a detached garage and there is dust and who knows what else...he's got a bed downstairs and I put another one up in the plywood covered rafters under a blanket to keep the dust down.  I'm getting eye drops and pain medication today.  

Has anyone dealt with something like this?  It's only been 3 days since he got the antibiotic shot, so I'd like to give it some more time.  I also don't think the garage is the best, so yes- I'm considering quarantining him in one of my spare bedrooms...clean, quiet and cool.  Change out clothes when in and out of room, lysol, etc.  I'm also considering letting him outside with me on a harness and long leash.  If he's that bad, I at least want to let him enjoy the grass and trees and everything he hasn't had in the projects.  I have 1.5 acres of nice property.  

I know this post goes all over, so excuse that.

Good for you for taking in this friendly guy.  I completely understand.  I have done the same thing before.  You will be relieved to know that FeLV is NOT airborne and not highly contagious.  It's most often spread by bite wounds.  If he has a place with his own litter box and own food dishes, he should pose no danger to your other cats.  Also, in a male that is not neutered and has been fighting, it is not unusual to get a FeLV positive result.  If he is also FIV positive, that's worse because it means he has a compromised immune system.  FeLV positive does not mean he has active leukemia.  The lymph nodes could be swollen from the infection.  A blood count will tell you more, but if you just want to keep him comfortable and see what happens when the antibiotics kick in, go ahead and make him a wonderful comfy room to be in.  To avoid paws under the door, if there is a space paws could reachthrough, block it off with something like a baby gate.  hat will keep your cats safe from FeLV.  However, his upper respiratory infection could be contagious and airborne.

Also, if he got an antibiotic SHOT which is long acting and not antibiotics to take home, he may have been given Convenia, which isn't the ideal antibiotic for upper respiratory infections. It was developed for skin infections on dogs.   It can also kill all his intestinal bacteria, so you should be adding a prebiotic/probiotic combo to his food.  It stays in their systems a very long time.  Personally I much prefer Clavamox for cats in his condition. 

As for when to put to sleep, that's always a judgment call.  If an animal is suffering and there is no good ending in sight, then I err on the side of sparing him suffering and put to sleep earlier rather than wait for the bad stuff (in the case of FIP for instance, which is always fatal in the end).  On the other hand, if the swelling in the nodes goes down and the respiratory infection clears up and he's feeling pretty good, he can live a long and comfy life if you neuter him and keep him inside and safe.  I rescued one like that once.  He was such a battled up old boy that his abscesses even had abscesses inside them.  He too was FeLV positive.  He healed up and got over his infections and  lived with no sign of leukemia for 8 years and then he developed it, and that's when I put him to sleep.  But he had eight good years.  I did get my other cats leukemia vaccine boosters before I finally merged him with the other cats, and none of them ever got leukemia.

So between quality of life and quantity of life, personally I will choose QUALITY every time. 

anonxyz said:

 
I'm getting eye drops and pain medication today.

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Hi anonxyz and welcome to the forum !

Just a quick 'heads-up' about pain meds......two points

1. You need to know that the use of NSAIDs - non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs - is becoming more and more common in veterinary medicine....despite the fact that felines lack the necessary liver enzymes to metabolize these substances. The result is some degree of kidney damage.....only over time does this become apparent, when there are no longer any 'spare' kidney nephrons 'waiting in the wings' to step in and take over. There are safer alternatives - those being opiate meds. (Just from what you've described, I don't see any need for any pain med.....'simple' discomfort from congestion doesn't translate into pain.)
2. As Red Top Rescue said, the antibiotic injection was certainly a drug called "Convenia"......NO NSAID should be given to a cat concurrently with Convenia. It's contraindicated and has caused severe adverse effects including death. Convenia itself is a highly controversial drug in feline medicine, is known to cause adverse reactions.....and, personally I would have concerns using it with a FeLV+ cat.

There's a superb specialized online community of FeLV caregivers that's been active since the late 90's - and they have a website.

The group's here: http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org

I'd advise getting a new separate email addy for them - email is their operating platform and that will help you manage the info flow from a very busy group.

The website's here: http://felineleukemia.org/    although my advice would be to not get lost in the site, but rather deal directly with the group who have oodles and years of experience with FeLV.

(btw, I'd be asking those people about the use of Convenia when FeLV is involved....I wouldn't "wait and see")

Here's a very useful tip for managing a cat's respiratory congestion: http://www.harpsie.com/cat_flu.htm#steaming

  - steaming.  You can scroll up and down on that page for other reliable information on dealing with 'cat colds'.

Hope something there helps.

Thanks for the replies.  

So I came home today and went into the garage and he didn't look any better.  Lethargic, his poor eyes were just discharging, runny and reddish.  I gave him some food with a prednisone crushed  

Red Top Rescue said:

 
Good for you for taking in this friendly guy.  I completely understand.  I have done the same thing before.  

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Red Top Rescue said:

 
Good for you for taking in this friendly guy.  I completely understand.  I have done the same thing before.  You will be relieved to know that FeLV is NOT airborne and not highly contagious.  It's most often spread by bite wounds.  If he has a place with his own litter box and own food dishes, he should pose no danger to your other cats.  Also, in a male that is not neutered and has been fighting, it is not unusual to get a FeLV positive result.  If he is also FIV positive, that's worse because it means he has a compromised immune system.  FeLV positive does not mean he has active leukemia.  The lymph nodes could be swollen from the infection.  A blood count will tell you more, but if you just want to keep him comfortable and see what happens when the antibiotics kick in, go ahead and make him a wonderful comfy room to be in.  To avoid paws under the door, if there is a space paws could reach through, block it off with something like a baby gate.  hat will keep your cats safe from FeLV.  However, his upper respiratory infection could be contagious and airborne.

Also, if he got an antibiotic SHOT which is long acting and not antibiotics to take home, he may have been given Convenia, which isn't the ideal antibiotic for upper respiratory infections. It was developed for skin infections on dogs.   It can also kill all his intestinal bacteria, so you should be adding a prebiotic/probiotic combo to his food.  It stays in their systems a very long time.  Personally I much prefer Clavamox for cats in his condition. 

As for when to put to sleep, that's always a judgment call.  If an animal is suffering and there is no good ending in sight, then I err on the side of sparing him suffering and put to sleep earlier rather than wait for the bad stuff (in the case of FIP for instance, which is always fatal in the end).  On the other hand, if the swelling in the nodes goes down and the respiratory infection clears up and he's feeling pretty good, he can live a long and comfy life if you neuter him and keep him inside and safe.  I rescued one like that once.  He was such a battled up old boy that his abscesses even had abscesses inside them.  He too was FeLV positive.  He healed up and got over his infections and  lived with no sign of leukemia for 8 years and then he developed it, and that's when I put him to sleep.  But he had eight good years.  I did get my other cats leukemia vaccine boosters before I finally merged him with the other cats, and none of them ever got leukemia.

So between quality of life and quantity of life, personally I will choose QUALITY every time. 

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Hope something there helps.

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Thank you very much for the replies.  Update and continued struggle with right thing to do.....

I kept him in the garage and he was going up and down in condition.  I want to say Tuesday night, I got him prednisone and eye drops.  His eyes were just really really bad, labored breathing, etc.  Came down from attic of garage and ate.  Got into his downstairs bed/tent and my parents stopped by that night.  He looked awful.  I swear I though he was on his way out then.  Jut lethargic, eyes completely messed up, severe congestion and super skinny like how I found him.  Gave him the prednisone and laid with him a bit.

Wednesday

5:30 am went out and he was sitting at the door.  He looked better and more energetic.  I fed him and put a little leash on him and took him for a walk around my 1.5 acres and he seemed to really enjoy it.  Went to work and had my Dad stop by to check in.  He called me at 12 and said to come home he needed to be put to rest becasue he looked like he was going to fall over right there and all of the URI symptoms.  By time I got there, Dad said he was speechless because all of a sudden he got energy, ate a whole can of food and then some, and looked better.  I started calling vets that could be able to do an in-home euthanasia and at same time I put a harness on him and decided to let him enjoy the nature .  He made a b-line for a humongous bush on my property with an inner "cave system and just wanted to lay down and hang in there.  Again- he looked weak and my Dad and I were just tryingto make the right decision.  My Dad said he just looked like he was running out of steam and I thought he wanted to go into the bush because...you know why.  Decided that I had to get him in before dark so when I went in bush, he got up, came right over to me rubbed me etc. and was hungry.  Got him in carrier and decided to put him in my room since I hadn't even heard back from any vets for an in-home.  

Wed Night

Got the humidifier set up, fed him (he ate) and let him get comfy.  He was on my bed resting.  But still had the sever congestion, labored breathing (to me) and of course thin.  Gave him daily dose of prednison, then slept next to him.  I can see his breathing is labored and he's still very congested.  At one point he got up and seemed to hiss in his sleep then went back to bed.  The another point, noticed his lower jaw started moving up and down quickly in his sleep. Got p and hour later then curled up against me and we slept until morning.  Got up, he was still sleeping/just weak looking.  Got him some food and he ate almost 2 cans of food.  

I just dont know what the heck to do.  I'm getting him clavamox but it's like idk....is it too much?  He's fairly weak, still having trouble with the congestion and breathing...his eyes look a ton better because he doesn't have the dirty dusty garage and I think being with him was important.

I'm quality over quantity any time but it's like do I just pts or try the clavamox and prednisone?  I mean I'll feel like total s--t if I prolong it, but he seems fairly happy...weak and congested....but fairly happy.  Gets up and rubs you, purrs, etc.    

Please understand that a URI is like a common cold in us.  It needs to run it's course and can take up to 2-3 weeks to completely clear up but first, it can really knock a kitty on it's tush!  Keep loving him, keep feeding him, keep a supply of fresh, clean water for him and keep him out of the draft.  A warm garage is fine - like 85 degrees warm.  Cats like warm, draft-free areas to snuggle in to.  That walk may have wiped him out so do these sparingly and for no more than 10 minutes at a time.  He needs to regain his strength and who knows how long he has been foraging for any kind of food before you found him.  His immune system is certainly compromised.  Let him rest and regenerate his natural well being.  I agree with Top Red Rescue, FevL is not a death sentence and certainly not transferable except by a deep bite so keep him away from your house cats for the time being.  There is tons of information about adult to adult cat introductions out there to ease the integration process.

 I think your choices with this guy need to be one day at a time.  He has his weak moments, but he has his feeling better moments also.  He likes sleeping with you so he is knowing love and comfort while still sick.  As long as he is eating, that is a VERY good sign, because appetite is often the first thing to go when they are sick.  His jaw moving while he was sleeping was probably in a dream.  Cats often chirp at things they are hunting (insects, birds) and he may have been having a hunting dream.  I've seen my cats do that too.

Your vet may not give you Clavamox if he already gave him Convenia, but there are some bugs that Clavamox kills that Convenia does not touch.  You do need to know what he was given because some things don't go together, as @White Shadow mentioned above.  The two commonly prescribed pain meds for cats are NSAIDS (Onsior and Metacam) and they should not be used in conjunction with Convenia, and it seems a lot of vets don't know this.

You do need to know that lethargy is a common side effect of Convenia. It passes after a couple of weeks. They can also become anemic, so any blood counts done after Convenia may not reflect the cat's actual condition.  We suspect he got Convenia because usually if a vet gives them a shot of the long acting penicillin, they will also give you pills or liquid antibiotics to take home to continue. 

I have used Clavamox on a cat who had been given a Convenia shot (for a bladder infection) and she did fine with the combo.  I also used probiotics for 65 days and convinced her to double her fluid intake by offering goats milk and tuna juice in addition to watering down her food a little. 

Yeah...one day at a time.  I ended up taking him last night at 12 am because he was so weak and his breathing sounded so bad.  Got him there (different vet) and they were saying it seemed much more URI and the breathing was congestion not fluid like I was suspecting.  Gave him a shot of a different antibiotic along with take-home pills, a probiotic, some pain meds and a fluid sack.  Looks better today, but I'll continue to monitor.

Thanks for the input and advice.   

You are doing wonders for this cat - whether he makes it or not he has been loved and cared for and obviously knows it. You have been given good advice on the FELV and the medications by Red Top Rescue. To make his breathing easier you could try putting a bowl of hot hater in his room with some essential oils like mint or lavender in it. I was advised by a vet to pu t a badly congested cat into a carrier, put a towel over it right to the floor and a baby inhaler under the towel. Do that for 30 minutes twice a day. It did help with the breathing.