Major runt so many questions

I am new here. I read the forums often but I joined today because I really need some help. My cat had kittens may 24th and the first one born was very lethargic. She cleaned it and everything but then it just layer around and didn't try to nurse or anything. Even though physically it was ok (on the outside) I wondered if something wasn't internally wrong. So, I left it thinking nature would do it's thing but the next day it was still alive but very still.the mom had even moved the kittens to the other side of the room away from it. So,I warmed it up and got kitten formula and began manually feeding it with an eye dropper every two hours. I took it with me when I left for a trip on the 26 and it's a lot stronger now and is putting on weight. However, I would like to put it back with it's momma now that it can nurse. I got hone tonight and reintroduced it to it's mom and she seems OK and it's latching on, but I left long enough to go get the mom the food I had bought out of car and when I cane back the little one was out away from the other kittens. I don't know if it was just latched on so well that it was carried when she got up or if she moved it, but now I'm afraid to leave it alone with mom. Its about half the size of the other kittens and I don't know if cats are known to eat their young when they're this big. Should I keep on feeding the kitten supplemental formula and only leave it with mom when I can stay right there to watch how she is with it? Its only been 7 days since it's been born, but I have been carrying it around with me EVERYWHERE and I have grown a little attached and protective.

Wow that baby is very small! Are you able to weigh that kitten to make sure it's gaining properly each day? Scales are old $10 at Walmart. I would continue to supplement even though mama is letting it latch. Since it's so small it needs some help gaining. Let mama continue to bond, she obviously hasn't completely rejected the kitten, but her moving it so much could indicate an issue, since it's survived this long, it's probably just because she's a new mom and perhaps since she rejected to begin with, she doesn't really "want" this runt.
The advisors will be able to help out more but my advise it to continue supplementing, and leave the baby with mama when you are able to check on it every so often.

If it were me, I would keep it separate and raise it as an orphan, knowing that its quite possible there is something internally wrong with it and it may die.  Mama cats know things we don't know.  On the other hand, sometimes it's a deformity that in no way prevents the kitten from living if it is hand raised and cared for.  I had one like this who only grew to be about 4 lbs as an adult, and he had weird little feet with horny growths that grew from his paw pads towards his claws.  Both he and his brother had been left by the mama cat, who moved into the person's old mattress and had the rest of the litter there.  They had been trying to feed the little ones with no success, and when rescue (us) was finally called, the other kitten had just passed away when I got there.  I gave the remaining one some sugar water with a syringe to get his blood sugar up, stuck him in my shirt and took him home.  It took him 24 hours to stop that rhythmic screaming they dowhen they are starving but he came around and then continued to live.  He just never grew very big, peaking at 4 lbs.

You can go ahead and see if you can raise this little kitten if you are up to it.  It requires feeding every 2 hours for awhile, and providing a heat source since he is too young to maintain his own body heat even if wrapped up,   Not too long ago someone here had a whole litter that was lethargic like this and after a day, four of the five were gone.  She kept one alive for another day but he faded too.  The kittens looked normal but did not act normal.  A normal healthy kitten will struggle to nurse and fight his siblings for the nipple if he is pushed off.  The passive ones like yours don't usually make it in nature, but its hard for us humans to just let them die (I dont know how mother cats can do it!) so we try to save them, and sometimes we do.  You can go ahead and try to save him, but don't feel badly if he doesn't make it, or you can leave him with his mom and he will probably move away from the group and fade away quietly and go back to The Cat Goddess. 

If he's actively nursing, you can try making sure he gets to the nipple FIRST, keeping the others away until he eats his fill.  Here is a recent thread from someone who just raised five of them successfully although it was touch and go with a few for awhile.

http://www.thecatsite.com/t/317729/...abandoned-probably-1-week-old-kittens-help/60

newkitties said:

Wow that baby is very small! Are you able to weigh that kitten to make sure it's gaining properly each day? Scales are old $10 at Walmart. I would continue to supplement even though mama is letting it latch. Since it's so small it needs some help gaining. Let mama continue to bond, she obviously hasn't completely rejected the kitten, but her moving it so much could indicate an issue, since it's survived this long, it's probably just because she's a new mom and perhaps since she rejected to begin with, she doesn't really "want" this runt.
The advisors will be able to help out more but my advise it to continue supplementing, and leave the baby with mama when you are able to check on it every so often.

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Thank you for your response. Yes, I am able to weigh it. I got a digital scale on the 26th and it weighed 3.1 oz and is now up to 3.8 oz.
I do not trust leaving it alone with mom at moment so I am going to take it out when I go to bed and put him back when I can watch.

I think you can try to let momma help out, with supervising, but also, do intensive supplementing.  Ie, YOU take the major charge of feeding it, so you are sure she gets enough.

Weak sucklers often seem to nurse from momma, but arent...   Get a scale, so you know she gains. Being mini, she wont gain as much as siblings, but 6g a day is absolute minimum.

If you dont manage with this tight  cooperation momma - you, you must handraise her yourself to 100%

Feeding at last every 2 hours, possibly even more often.

Red Top Rescue said:

If it were me, I would keep it separate and raise it as an orphan, knowing that its quite possible there is something internally wrong with it and it may die.  Mama cats know things we don't know.  On the other hand, sometimes it's a deformity that in no way prevents the kitten from living if it is hand raised and cared for.  I had one like this who only grew to be about 4 lbs as an adult, and he had weird little feet with horny growths that grew from his paw pads towards his claws.  Both he and his brother had been left by the mama cat, who moved into the person's old mattress and had the rest of the litter there.  They had been trying to feed the little ones with no success, and when rescue (us) was finally called, the other kitten had just passed away when I got there.  I gave the remaining one some sugar water with a syringe to get his blood sugar up, stuck him in my shirt and took him home.  It took him 24 hours to stop that rhythmic screaming they dowhen they are starving but he came around and then continued to live.  He just never grew very big, peaking at 4 lbs.

You can go ahead and see if you can raise this little kitten if you are up to it.  It requires feeding every 2 hours for awhile, and providing a heat source since he is too young to maintain his own body heat even if wrapped up,   Not too long ago someone here had a whole litter that was lethargic like this and after a day, four of the five were gone.  She kept one alive for another day but he faded too.  The kittens looked normal but did not act normal.  A normal healthy kitten will struggle to nurse and fight his siblings for the nipple if he is pushed off.  The passive ones like yours don't usually make it in nature, but its hard for us humans to just let them die (I dont know how mother cats can do it!) so we try to save them, and sometimes we do.  You can go ahead and try to save him, but don't feel badly if he doesn't make it, or you can leave him with his mom and he will probably move away from the group and fade away quietly and go back to The Cat Goddess. 

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Thank you for taking the time to reply. I have a water bottle that I keep warm water in and that's what's keeping little bit warm. I have been feeding it every 2-3 hours and it's so much stronger. Like I said, I went on a trip..I went to Iowa for a memorial (from Missouri) and I took little bit with me. I carried it around in an open insulated lunch bag with the water bottle and wash rags. Its been to Walmart, target, McDonald's, etc. With me lol. Tonight was the fist chance I had to see if it could nurse now and it's doing well. It found a nipple on it's own once and then hung on for dear life. A couple times he lost it and I had to help show him where it was..I think hand feeding it has made it kind of lazy when it comes to searching. The others are so much bigger and stronger, but little bit can almost hold his own against them. I guess if nothing else I can continue to feed him formula and then put him with the others to socialize.

iamoph said:

Thank you for taking the time to reply. I have a water bottle that I keep warm water in and that's what's keeping little bit warm. I have been feeding it every 2-3 hours and it's so much stronger. Like I said, I went on a trip..I went to Iowa for a memorial (from Missouri) and I took little bit with me. I carried it around in an open insulated lunch bag with the water bottle and wash rags. Its been to Walmart, target, McDonald's, etc. With me lol. Tonight was the fist chance I had to see if it could nurse now and it's doing well. It found a nipple on it's own once and then hung on for dear life. A couple times he lost it and I had to help show him where it was..I think hand feeding it has made it kind of lazy when it comes to searching. The others are so much bigger and stronger, but little bit can almost hold his own against them. I guess if nothing else I can continue to feed him formula and then put him with the others to socialize.

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Good idea to carry it with you.  If you can carry in a sack at your chest, its another idea.

Re putting her to momma.  Try to do it when the others are asleep, or something, so it doesnt need to wrestle with the others.   some system of rotating is common when helping runts, or having many kittens.

So there are several solutions with the same idea.

Continuing.  A common problem with the runt whom perhaps gets weaker and weaker and dies, is not its the runt nor weak, but he doesnt manage to wrestle succesfully against  the siblings...  Catwoman707 hammers this in.

StefanZ said:

I think you can try to let momma help out, with supervising, but also, do intensive supplementing.  Ie, YOU take the major charge of feeding it, so you are sure she gets enough.

Weak sucklers often seem to nurse from momma, but arent...   Get a scale, so you know she gains. Being mini, she wont gain as much as siblings, but 6g a day is absolute minimum.

If you dont manage with this tight  cooperation momma - you, you must handraise her yourself to 100%


Feeding at last every 2 hours, possibly even more often.

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Thank you for replying. I will do more research on how much weight gain is enough to make sure I'm feeding it enough. I usually clean him and empty the bladder then I feed him an eyedropper full (bulb and tube all full) which measures out to 1/2 tsp and by that time he's kind of tired so I will try to get him to pee or poo again and I let him walk around his box for about 10 minutes and then he's ready for another dropper full which equals a tsp and the formula says a tsp per 4oz of weight. Sometimes he eats a little less than that and I don't force him. I put a tiny bit of pressure on the dropper and then he suckles himself.
His stools were not toothpaste consistency.. more like playdoh or worked over clay. So, I switched to the liquid formula (I was using powder) and I am adding 4 drops of olive oil per 2ml of formula to try to soften them so he doesn't strain and cry when he poos.

StefanZ said:

Continuing.  A common problem with the runt whom perhaps gets weaker and weaker and dies, is not its the runt nor weak, but he doesnt manage to wrestle succesfully against  the siblings...  Catwoman707 hammers this in.

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He is so much smaller And weaker than the others even though he's so much stronger than he was. Its almost like he's a week behind all of them...and he was the first one born! He's now acting like they all did when they were first born.

I think he's still too small and behind to leave with the other babies. I agree that leaving him with mom while the others are sleeping could be helpful. He might catch up more in a few weeks.

People do tend to report less problems with the powdered formula over the premixed in terms of constipation, so you might want to try it again.

It sounds like you're doing a great job!

Are you able to keep mom 100% inside and away from intact males until babies are weaned?

iamoph

The baby ideally should gain 6-10 grams minimum per day. At 3.8 ounces rounded to 4, it needs 8 mLs of formula per ounce of weight in each 24-hour period, so 32mLs divided by say, 12 feedings (every 2 hours through the night too), comes to 2.6 mLs at each feeding. If the kitten will drink more, that's even better.

Powdered formula is preferable.

You're doing a wonderful job! Thank you for caring for this baby! [emoji]128522[/emoji]

talkingpeanut, Yes, i am able to keep the mom away from intact males at this time. I then plan to get her spayed. The little one seems to be having belly cramps since I started the liquid formula so I have went back to the powdered and am adding 5 drops of olive oil per 2 1/3 tablespoons of milk.

Thank you for that math!!!

It is eating approximately 2.5ml at each feeding which is every two hours and if I take him out or pet him in between he will have a little "snack"

That's great! I advise powdered formula because kittens seem to have digestive issues with the liquid, so it's good you switched back. [emoji]128522[/emoji]

I am afraid I did more harm than good today. I let the little tiny "hang out" with his siblings most of the day and when it was time to eat I would help him latch on to mom along with one other kitten that is considerably smaller than the others, but still larger than little tiny. Then I would allow the others to eat. Little tiny seems like he has way less energy now. I am hoping that it is just because the others are so much bigger and he got wore out from being wallered (SP?)

I have decided that I am going to continue doing what I was doing while on my trip with no mom cat or sibling kittens around...if he makes it. I could see his progress then and now that I am comparing him to his siblings it seems so hopeless and it upsets me so much that I feel that way.

I read somewhere a long time ago that a cats eggs can be fertilized at different times..is it possible that this little tiny was concieved later than the rest of them? His cord hasn't even fallen off yet and there is only one other kitten that has a tiny remnant of a cord left.

I am going to take little tiny to work with me tomorrow and see if I can have the vet look at him after work. I was so worried that he wasnt eating enough but  thanks to @sarthur2 i see that he is getting what he needs. However, the size of his belly makes me so nervous. its so very round. This may sound stupid, but what if I rupture his belly?? its not hard and He is pooping more than 2x a day but it was kind of hard and would break off. Now it is kind of thick but not hard...not really diarrhea, more like thick mucus. You can tell by the things I way I am going back and forth that my rational and irrational side are dueling lol.

It is so scary caring for something so small and fragile.

I am posting some pics so you can see how round his belly is and so you can see just how cute he is sleeping on his ice pack turned hot water bottle on my lap as I write this. You will have to excuse the way his fur looks. after his last BM he kind of made a mess and I tried to clean him and now his fur is kind of crunchy. I will fix that later

Are you adding drops of olive oil to his formula? That will keep the poop soft and moving. Ideally, kitten poop should be toothpaste-like consistency.

I agree that you need to keep the kitten with you at all times. It's too much of a struggle for him to be with his litter mates right now. Are you able to feed every 2-3 hours during the night? This is critical right now. As he gains weight the amount of formula increases as well.

He does not look premature. He may lose his cord later, open his eyes later, wean later, etc., but he can thrive. Right now you are his lifeline until he gets bigger. Do not compare him to the others and assume he won't make it because he's smaller. Keep doing what you are doing. It's his only chance, scary as that is for you - and caring for a tiny newborn kitten is daunting, and lots of work, not to mention exhausting!

The round tummy is good! He needs it to grow on!

You are doing a great job! Hang in there! [emoji]128522[/emoji]

sarthur2 said:

Are you adding drops of olive oil to his formula? That will keep the poop soft and moving. Ideally, kitten poop should be toothpaste-like consistency.

I agree that you need to keep the kitten with you at all times. It's too much of a struggle for him to be with his litter mates right now. Are you able to feed every 2-3 hours during the night? This is critical right now. As he gains weight the amount of formula increases as well.

He does not look premature. He may lose his cord later, open his eyes later, wean later, etc., but he can thrive. Right now you are his lifeline until he gets bigger. Do not compare him to the others and assume he won't make it because he's smaller. Keep doing what you are doing. It's his only chance, scary as that is for you - and caring for a tiny newborn kitten is daunting, and lots of work, not to mention exhausting!

The round tummy is good! He needs it to grow on!

You are doing a great job! Hang in there! [emoji]128522[/emoji]

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Yes, I am adding 5 drops per 2 1/3 Tablespoon of formula. I am feeding him all through the day and night. I try for every two hours but he usually gets a little snack in between as well. I was just reading some other posts on here and saw where I am supposed to be burping it!! I have not been doing that! I have a lot of cats and they are all superbly taken care of, but I have never had to fully care for one this small. I know to stimulate the peri region to make him go potty. I know to have him lay like he would when he nurses on mom when I feed him to reduce the risk of pneumonia. Feed every two hours and weigh every day. Now I know about how much he should be gaining. anything else?

Everything sounds good!

Keep us posted!

MOD NOTE: merged thread


First let me say that there is no vet open near me or in would be there. The closest emergency vet is 2 hours away.
I have a kitten that was born on the 24th and I have been bottle feeding it because it's too small and weak to nurse. It had gotten stronger so I let it "hang out" with it's much bigger and stronger siblings today and I still fed it. Anyways..now it's very lethargic and not acting right. I haven't been able to feed it since about 730 and I'm posting pics to show how it's laying now. I'm thinking it'd hypoglycemia. I gave it a few drops of sugar water and that didn't work so I put pancake syrup on it's gums about 40 minutes ago and still nothing. What do I do??