Reintroducing a protein after a reaction?

lemondrop · Feb 9, 2016

Mosey and Mendel can't tolerate a lot of protein sources. Beef, lamb, and venison have been off the table since the first time they tried them. Recently, rabbit and pork have ceased to be options. Birds and fish are still fine, but I would really like to get them more variety. Also, I'm worried the allergies won't stop at rabbit and pork and I'll have nothing left to feed them. (Meilyr, of course, never throws up anything, but is the only one inclined to walk away from an unfinished meal.

)

Is there a way to reintroduce a protein source so that it can go back into the rotation?

missmimz · Feb 10, 2016

How did you eliminate all those protein sources? Did you feed a single protein to make sure it was actually the protein and not something else in the food like a filler? Are you feeding raw or homecooked? because i can't see you being able to narrow it down to allergies with that many protein sources unless you feed raw or homecooked with nothing else added (but the proper supplements, of course).

I'd be very wary about feeding a lot of fish, as fish is not healthy for cats as a regular part of their diet.

Sometimes allergies are really IBD, or something else in the food not the actual protein source, or just the way the protein is sourced.

What brands of food have you tried?

lemondrop · Feb 10, 2016

missmimz said:
How did you eliminate all those protein sources? Did you feed a single protein to make sure it was actually the protein and not something else in the food like a filler? Are you feeding raw or homecooked? because i can't see you being able to narrow it down to allergies with that many protein sources unless you feed raw or homecooked with nothing else added (but the proper supplements, of course).

I'd be very wary about feeding a lot of fish, as fish is not healthy for cats as a regular part of their diet.

Sometimes allergies are really IBD, or something else in the food not the actual protein source, or just the way the protein is sourced.

What brands of food have you tried?

They ate the food and vomited it back up shortly thereafter. Beef, lamb, and venison were all immediate reactions, like within half an hour of the first time they ever tried those proteins. Rabbit was fine for a while (it was one of their favorites, actually), but then Mendel started throwing up whenever they had it; he threw it up four times before I stopped feeding it. They'd had Hounds and Gatos pork cans with no trouble, but then I moved and couldn't easily get those anymore. We tried Primal frozen pork yesterday and and Mosey and Mendel threw that up. I gave all three of them a little piece of a freeze dried pork nugget I got as a sample and they threw that up, too.

I didn't do any elimination trials because I feed such a huge variety that I can't believe there's something other than the protein that they've only ever eaten in those foods. For canned, everything from Friskies and Fancy Feast to Weruva and Wild Calling. For their once-or-twice-weekly raw, usually Primal, but they've had Nature's Variety and Rad Cat, too.

As far as specifically what they've thrown up:

Beef: Fancy Feast, I think (it was a long time ago, I've just avoided beef since)

Lamb: Rad Cat

Venison: EVO 95%

Rabbit: Nature's Variety Instinct frozen raw, Wild Calling cans

Pork: Primal frozen and freeze-dried

I know there are problems with feeding fish regularly, which is another reason I'm concerned about all these other proteins that don't agree with them.

missmimz · Feb 10, 2016

lemondrop said:
They ate the food and vomited it back up shortly thereafter. Beef, lamb, and venison were all immediate reactions, like within half an hour of the first time they ever tried those proteins. Rabbit was fine for a while (it was one of their favorites, actually), but then Mendel started throwing up whenever they had it; he threw it up four times before I stopped feeding it. They'd had Hounds and Gatos pork cans with no trouble, but then I moved and couldn't easily get those anymore. We tried Primal frozen pork yesterday and and Mosey and Mendel threw that up. I gave all three of them a little piece of a freeze dried pork nugget I got as a sample and they threw that up, too.

I didn't do any elimination trials because I feed such a huge variety that I can't believe there's something other than the protein that they've only ever eaten in those foods. For canned, everything from Friskies and Fancy Feast to Weruva and Wild Calling. For their once-or-twice-weekly raw, usually Primal, but they've had Nature's Variety and Rad Cat, too.

As far as specifically what they've thrown up:

Beef: Fancy Feast, I think (it was a long time ago, I've just avoided beef since)

Lamb: Rad Cat

Venison: EVO 95%

Rabbit: Nature's Variety Instinct frozen raw, Wild Calling cans

Pork: Primal frozen and freeze-dried

I know there are problems with feeding fish regularly, which is another reason I'm concerned about all these other proteins that don't agree with them.

It seems very odd that both of them are having the same reactions to all the same foods. Are they litter mates? Have they been checked by a vet for other medical problems? How old are they? Allergies or IBD can be very complicated. Sometimes introducing a new food too fast, switching between foods too quickly, or going too long between meals will cause a reaction. Have you tried the other Rad Cat like the turkey, chicken or venison?

I don't know that i would rule out a protein entirely based on the trail of that protein from one specific brand. Lamb is very fatty so sometimes cats don't react to that well.

catpack · Feb 10, 2016

If they are truly allergic to the protein, I am unsure that there would be away to feed this.

However, with both cats reacting to the same proteins, I am less inclined to think that is the sole culprit.

I have cats who obvious protein allergies.
Max is allergic to both beef and rabbit. He breaks out in hives and his ears turn bright red. He has 5 litter mate brothers and not one of them has an issue with beef or rabbit. One brother is allergic to duck (he vomits.)

On the flipside, I have multiple cats who are intolerant of fruits in canned food and who do not tolerate gums/thickeners.

If you *really* want to narrow down the true cause, you will need to do an elimination diet. Feed one single protein from one single brand. If they do ok for several weeks (vets will tell you 6-8 weeks, I don't tend to follow that rule...) then either add another protein from the same brand or try the original protein in a different brand.

I know this sounds tedious, but, it really is what is needed to know for sure.

As a note...
I do have a few cats that do not tolerate freeze-dried raw or raw foods of any kind. I personally was surprised by this.

lemondrop · Feb 11, 2016

None of them are litter mates. Mosey and Mendel are both two. Mendel is the most sensitive (he also gets skin/paw pad issues in the summer; he's all around delicate, I guess) and throws up everything on the list. Mosey did not have issues with venison or rabbit.

We tried the Rad Cat chicken and turkey and those were just fine, though they didn't seem very enthusiastic about them. They do just fine on other formulas of all the brands they threw up.

Also, in case this was unclear, the reactions to beef, lamb, and venison happened the first time they ever had them. <-- Food intolerance, rather than actual allergy?

Rabbit was fine for a few months and then Mendel started having trouble. <-- Allergy?

Pork was fine, but there was a gap where I couldn't get any pork foods and when we tried it again, they threw up. <-- I don't know what to make of this, but I dislike cleaning up vomit, so...

catpack · Feb 11, 2016

I have been told on both the human and vet medical side that a person/animal must be exposed to something first before an allergy can occur. I am one to believe the is an exception to every rule. But, if 2 cats reacted, I think an intolerance is much more likely.

My Max had an allergic reaction the rabbit the second time he ate it. The first time was absolutely fine. I fed it to him the next day and within minutes his ears were bright red. He had only eaten a few bites.

lemondrop · Feb 11, 2016

This all brings me back to my original question. Is there a way to reintroduce a protein so that they could eat it without reacting?

catpack · Feb 11, 2016

Ultimately, I believe if they are truly allergic to the protein, no, there is no way to except it to be an actual part of the diet.

I know for people that there is a protocol for those that are highly allergic to peanuts to try and lessen the severity of the reaction (starting with EXTREMELY small amounts first...like a piece smaller than a grain of sand) and slowly increasing the amount eaten...eventually to where a full peanut of two is eaten.

However, the point with this is to reduce the risk of anaphylaxis from accidental ingestion. NOT for the person to be able to sit down and eat a peanut butter sandwich every few weeks.

For the foods they appear intolerant of, I suppose you could try the same thing. Very small quantity added to a food they regularly eat. However, there is always the real chance that their allergy/intolerance would get worse and they could have a more serious reaction.

missmimz · Feb 11, 2016

lemondrop said:
None of them are litter mates. Mosey and Mendel are both two. Mendel is the most sensitive (he also gets skin/paw pad issues in the summer; he's all around delicate, I guess) and throws up everything on the list. Mosey did not have issues with venison or rabbit.

We tried the Rad Cat chicken and turkey and those were just fine, though they didn't seem very enthusiastic about them. They do just fine on other formulas of all the brands they threw up.

Also, in case this was unclear, the reactions to beef, lamb, and venison happened the first time they ever had them. <-- Food intolerance, rather than actual allergy?

Rabbit was fine for a few months and then Mendel started having trouble. <-- Allergy?

Pork was fine, but there was a gap where I couldn't get any pork foods and when we tried it again, they threw up. <-- I don't know what to make of this, but I dislike cleaning up vomit, so...

It does sound like an intolerance issue rather than a total allergy. You might try the RC chicken and turkey again but doctor them up with either treats on top or mixed in with a food they love. I'm a big fan of RC I think it's good quality food thats easily digestible, especially for sensitive kitties.

I have a cat with some IBD/vomiting issues. My best suggestion to re-introducing proteins they've reacted to before is to try a food that's high quality and simple that doesn't have a lot of fillers and to mix a small amount of the new food with other foods they tolerate well, then slowly add more of the new food until they've fully adjusted.

lemondrop · Feb 11, 2016

Thanks for the suggestions!

Reintroducing a protein after a reaction?

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