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Oscar's a real jerk when he's hungry.  

post #1 of 25
Thread Starter 

And he demands to be fed about every 4 hours.

 

Recently, we've found out that Oscar has diabetes. The vet has told me to feed him twice daily before his shots. Each meal is about 66kcal. She's seen what I feed him and approved of it.

 

However, Oscar is very unhappy about this change in his diet. He bites at my hands, sometimes even jumping on furniture to reach them. He meows loudly to inform me of his displeasure. He gets so brave as to jump on my desk to steal my food as I'm eating it!

 

Even when I fend him off and go to bed, he jumps up on my bed and decides to throw a pissy fit. Yes, you read that right.

 

He'll usually urinate right where my legs are. Sometimes if he's really mean, he'll aim a little higher up.

 

I thought this was just spraying (he's not neutered yet) and thus got some anti-spray measures. Didn't work.

 

He's a 13 year old cat. I just picked him up from the streets barely a month ago. He's usually very good, otherwise.

 

Help? I'd like to go to bed without fear of waking up in the middle of the night covered in ammonia.


Edited by RionKatt - 1/8/16 at 5:27am
post #2 of 25

what a naughty boy, I have heard the Feliway diffusers are very effective in helping with some bad behaviours. I would check it out http://www.feliway.com/us/Feliway/Feliway-Diffuser

post #3 of 25

How big is he? That sounds like such a small amount of calories - 2 meals of 66 calories each? I'd be pissy too! Is there some reason for the huge restriction in calories? Carb restriction I would get, but not overall calorie restriction unless he's a very tiny cat.

 

PS - I also have an Oscar, so I laughed when I first saw this title :) Is that Oscar in your avatar? He's SUCH a cutie pie!

post #4 of 25

Please check out FelineDiabetes.com and the message board there. You'll get a lot of helpful information about how to best care for your diabetic cat there. Some vets just aren't familiar on how to treat diabetes or are too "old school" and don't bother to keep up with the newest information dontknow.gif

 

Unregulated diabetic cats should eat several small meals daily to keep their blood glucose levels steady and to keep their tummies happy while you try to control the diabetes with insulin and diet. Calories should not be restricted but you also don't want to feed too many calories and end up with an obese cat who will be harder to regulate.

 

Are you feeding canned or dry food? Brands? The FelineDiabetes.com board has members from all over the world so someone there can suggest a good low carb brand of food you can feed to your diabetic.

post #5 of 25
Thread Starter 

@Zed Xyzed I may just get a diffuser. It's worth a good night's rest. I have barely slept since we started the change.

 

@Donutte Oscar's a fairly big boned cat, but since I only picked him up off the streets recently, he weighs in at a very worrying 8lbs. I think my vet wants to keep his glucose levels down? To be honest, I've cheated a little and is feeding him about 80-90 kcal 3 times a day instead of the 66kcal twice a day. And yes! That is him. He's a very handsome cat, though his smirk shows how smug he is. He has broken teeth, thus the raised lip. He's had them before I got him.

 

@LTS3 What I'm feeding him currently is Nature's Recipe Grain Free wet food. They're about 2.75oz a tray and ~67kcal each. That's the average kcal for most of the flavors. I'll give it a read through and then better scour the board when I am rested so that everything makes sense.

 

I am going to call the vet later when the clinic opens because I do agree that it isn't enough. He's diabetic, yes. But he's also underweight. Whenever I feed him, he eats all of it within 5-10minutes, scarfing it down like he's been starved. It's a little heartbreaking.

post #6 of 25

@Donutte is correct in that it doesn't sound like a lot of food, I don't think starving a kitty because of diabetes is NOT  a good idea. From what I have read a very low carb diet is the key.  I have heard that a raw food diet is good for cats with diabetes. I would recommend that you look at feeding him a high quality commercial raw diet. Nature's Variety Instinct raw is a good food my guy loves it. Since the poor boy is hungry he might take to the raw easily. Sometimes changing their diet to raw is a struggle as they don't like change. 

 

BTW he is super cute, and you are awesome for saving the poor guy from a life on the streets.

 

(I had a typo I corrected above see bold text)


Edited by Zed Xyzed - 1/8/16 at 8:44am
post #7 of 25
Thread Starter 

I finally got to bed at 8.45am After watching him all night. I sleep for half an hour and then get woken up by the warm, warm feeling of piss on me.

post #8 of 25

I think he is hungry, poor guy needs to eat more. What if you did a short-term experiment and feed him more for a week to see if this addresses the behaviour ?

post #9 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by RionKatt View Post

 

@LTS3 What I'm feeding him currently is Nature's Recipe Grain Free wet food. They're about 2.75oz a tray and ~67kcal each. That's the average kcal for most of the flavors. I'll give it a read through and then better scour the board when I am rested so that everything makes sense.

 

I am going to call the vet later when the clinic opens because I do agree that it isn't enough. He's diabetic, yes. But he's also underweight. Whenever I feed him, he eats all of it within 5-10minutes, scarfing it down like he's been starved. It's a little heartbreaking.

 

 

I'm not familiar with Nature's Recipe but the canned should be ok as long as it is grain free and under 10% carbs. You do need to feed more to both satisfy your cat's tummy and gain some weight and maintain the weight. Unregulated diabetics are often underweight because their bodies can't fully use nutrients in food. Getting less than 150 calories daily isn't helping with the weight or diabetes either. How much is your cat supposed to weigh? 250 calories daily is a typical amount needed for most cats. The general rule is 20 to 25 calories per pound of ideal body weight.

 

Here's a list to find out carb and calorie content for many canned foods: http://catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf

 

I found some FDMB posts that discuss Nature's Recipie:

 

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/low-carb-non-pate-wet-food-are-any-of-these-good.150101/

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/natures-recipe-grain-free-wet.112284/

 

When the diabetes becomes more regulated (that takes time with both insulin and the right diet) and your cat is getting enough food to meet his needs, the constant begging for food and the inappropriate urination will stop. You don't need the vet's permission to feed your cat more food. Cats who don't get enough calories daily are at risk for fatty liver disease.

post #10 of 25
Thread Starter 

The vet insists that in order to get the insulin to be effective, we have to stick with the diet she recommended. I did not buy the food from the clinic, mind.

post #11 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by RionKatt View Post
 

The vet insists that in order to get the insulin to be effective, we have to stick with the diet she recommended. I did not buy the food from the clinic, mind.

Is there any way you can get a 2nd opinion from another vet on how many calories your cat should be eating daily?  I find it kind of scary that the vet is just completely fixed such a low calorie count and does not seem willing to discuss any other options with you.

 

The scarfing down food so quickly is sign that your cat is still hungry and eating that quickly all the time could eventually give him a stomach ache.

 

I also think issue with him peeing on you is directly related to him being hungry.   

 

This cat being under weight is not good for him either.

post #12 of 25

No offense intended but many vets are ignorant when it come to dealing with Diabetes. I really would get a second opinion, restricting cat food doesn't make sense, reducing carb intake does and they are not mutually exclusive.

 

http://pets.webmd.com/cats/guide/feeding-tips-for-a-cat-with-diabetes?page=2  You have to be an advocate for you kitty. You are getting a lot of good advice here from some very knowledgeable people are telling you that what your current vet is doing is suspect.    


Edited by Zed Xyzed - 1/8/16 at 9:52am
post #13 of 25

@catwoman707 your thoughts would be appreciated 

post #14 of 25

I don't think he's being a jerk. He's been taken in the house at 13 ( Thank You!) And been prescribed a near starvation diet.  Considering his background and medical history you would think the stress would be worse than extra food as long as it fit the diet plan wouldn't be the worst thing. After all he can't go hunt now or rummage. You are his food source. I might pee on your feet too.

post #15 of 25

Honestly, that is not enough calories for even a small cat, so my guess would be that he is trying to get your attention and needs to eat more volume.

 

He also desperately needs to be neutered, ASAP.

He is high risk of issues otherwise.

Living on the streets he should also be tested.

 

I would say if your vet disagrees with adding more food I would find another vet who specializes in either nutrition or diabetes.

post #16 of 25

In reading stories of obese cats that are going through weight-loss programs, THOSE cats ate more calories than yours is being told to eat by your vet. The "rule" I've seen is 20 calories / lb of body weight they should be at. If he should be bigger than 8 lbs, then he should be at more than 160 calories per day. 

 

I agree about getting a 2nd opinion. 

post #17 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by RionKatt View Post
 

The vet insists that in order to get the insulin to be effective, we have to stick with the diet she recommended. I did not buy the food from the clinic, mind.

 

 

It sounds like the vet doesn't really know much about treating feline diabetes, which is unfortunately common. You have to go against the vet about this. The vet may not like it but it's YOUR CAT and you make the decisions on treatment. Vets recommend and suggest many things but you don't always have to agree with everything. Your cat depends on you to make the right decisions and sometimes that means going against the vet and seeking out the opinions and advice from others who were once in similar situations.

 

The right diet for a diabetic cat is low carb food, preferably canned. The insulin will work best if the cat gets enough food daily to keep the tummy happy and the weight up and blood glucose levels from crashing too low. What insulin did the vet prescribe and the starting dose?

 

Seek out the opinion from another vet. Some vets sepcialize in internal medicine and treating diseases like diabetes. The FelineDiabetes board has members all over the world so there is bound to be someone who can suggest a good vet in your area.

post #18 of 25

Any updates on Oscar? I hope he is doing better

post #19 of 25
Thread Starter 

I've come down with bronchitis and so while I recover, he's being boarded at the vet's.

post #20 of 25

oh no, I hope you feel better soon

post #21 of 25
Thread Starter 
post #22 of 25

OK, Oscar's hunger comes from his being diabetic, and his body is not capable of extracting what his body needs from the food you are feeding.

Yes, you are likely feeding enough for a healthy cat, but until Oscar is regulated on his insulin, you will need to be fed more than usual.

 

What insulin are you giving Oscar, and what dose? Also, what are his blood glucose numbers at shot times? I know many vets don't mention home testing, but it's something you need to be doing because cats are type 2 diabetics, so it is possible for Oscar's pancreas to heal and he may go off insulin. Without home testing, how will you know if you are giving him insulin when his numbers are non-diabetic? 

Cats who go low on insulin are ravenous and will definitely look for food and so it's important to leave some food out so that the cat can self-regulate their numbers.

 

I don't know what food you are feeding Oscar, but you want to be feeding low carb wet food and no dry at all - you can read about diet on Dr. Lisa Pierson's site catinfo.org. 

She also has spent hundreds of hours obtaining data on foods, in North America, which tell you how much protein, fat, carbs, and calories are in each.

Now, for home testing, you can use an ordinary human blood glucose meter from any pharmacy, and no, you do not need to buy any expensive pet meter... they offer nothing special except for the fancy costs!

 

Now, to get to the urinating.... yes, the peeing has been Oscar's BIG hint to you that he needs help, so now that he has been diagnosed, you can worry less because with a low carb diet, home testing, and adequate dose of insulin, you will soon see less of the hunger, less urine, and less drinking of water.

 

You can look for Feline Diabetic Support Group on Facebook as another location for help with treating Oscar.

 

Gayle

post #23 of 25
@Gayle C, if you see the link in the post above yours, you will see that Oscar died a couple weeks back. He had a lot more problems than just diabetes.
post #24 of 25
When a cat passes we close the thread out of respect. rbheart.gif I'm very sorry for your loss. hearthrob.gif Please visit Oscar's bridge thread -

http://www.thecatsite.com/t/313576/my-sweet-sweet-oscar
post #25 of 25
I shall close this thread now, out of respect. Oscar already has his own Bridge thread.
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