Desexing pro's & cons & how long does a heat cycle last?

Well my girl banshee finally has gone into her first heat at all most a year old (I heard for some breeds this is normal) and I'm wondering how long a heat cycle lasts (I heard from a week to 2 weeks) and how often they happen (I heard every 14-21 days) is what I heard correct?

Also what are the pros & cons of desexing a cat? and I mean pros & cons that are backed up with real medical information. And please reframe from trying to "guilt trip" people into desexing I have seen it before and I'm not impressed when people do that. This maybe a pro desexing form but people should not be put off asking questions here as there is loads of helpful people here.

I would talk to the breeder I was suggested to talk to but I can't seem to get ahold of them at all lately. Plus I can't find my cat books so I'm asking the wonderfully helpful non judgemental people of the cat sit.

P.s Hope your holloween was a wonderful & safe one!

As much as you may feel it is a guilt trip, this site is pro spay & neuter and you will have a hard time finding anyone here that will support you not getting your cats spayed and neutered unless you are in a registered breeding program. It's one of the rules that needs to be read and agreed to upon signing up:

3. This is a pro-spay-and-neuter website. Please make sure to spay and neuter your cats. Unless you are a professional breeder and your cat is part of a professional breeding program, please educate yourself to the importance of spaying and neutering by the time your cat is 4-6 months old. If you take care of a feral colony, please make sure to do so responsibly by practicing TNR (Trap, Neuter, Release) protocols within the colony

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Here is an article outlining to the pros of spaying and neutering:

http://www.thecatsite.com/a/spay-and-neuter-your-cats

The only pro for keeping a cat intact is that it's a stellar specimen free of genetic disorders and does not display any behavior disorders. And that the owner of that cat is willing and able to either find homes or be able to support all and any accidental breeding's. That includes the owners of females and toms. Notice I don't believe the cat has to be a grand champion purebred with the kittens worth hundreds or thousands. I'm sure at some point we're going to want another kitten. I'd be fine with an adult cat but I suspect my one feral born kitten is not going to readily accept a grown cat into our home. I'd like to think there will always be the common DHC available to those that love them without the horrible excessive kittens born each year lingering in cages.

Medically, you cat will be more content at home. Less likely to roam if they do get out and even less likely to be injured during breeding or complications from birthing. It lessens the chance of different cancers later on. It modifies most of their undesirable behaviors in your home like marking and spraying. From my point of view spaying did not ' de-sex ' my female cats. They still display may characteristics of the female cat. True little divas . Your cat does not have a preference or choice to have babies. Nor will she feel incomplete if she never has a litter.

AbbysMom yes while it is a pro desex site it does not state in the rules that I can see that people MUST  have their cat fixed  in order to use the site and ask questions for the most part people are willing give answers without trying to shove their view point down ones throat. I will thank you for sharing the link tho as I'm sure it will come in handy.

Here are my list of cons:

Cats are not like dogs who will have about 2 heat cycles per year.  Cats will go into heat CONTINUOUSLY until the cat is impregnated or spayed. 

The world is already overpopulated with cats (& dogs) that are unwanted, ill cared for, or not cared for at all and are ultimately euthanized or die inhumane deaths on the streets.

Pyometra is common in unspayed female cats and can cause death if not treated.

Females can and will spray and mark their territory if left unspayed.

The incidence of escaping is much higher for unspayed cats because they want it and their hormones are raging continually.

It's uncomfortable for the cat.  Imagine raging hormones in a toddler and that's pretty much what you have in a cat.

The pros are that you have a cat with a more consistent personality and whose hormones are level.  There are no unwanted litters and the overpopulation problem is lessened. Overall, I think it's the most responsible thing I can do for my kitties.

The thing that worries me with intact cats, especially female cats is that if they are not regularly bred they can develop pyometra. There is a another poster on this site now that was giving cat birth control injections which failed and the cat now has pyometra. The only known cure is spaying and its more risky than a normal spay. Also the longer a cat stays intact the higher the risk of the cat developing mammary tumors. With them once its there treatment is difficult if at all since most kitty keepers only discover it once it is pretty far along. I'll see if I can find a link to the poster.

Of course the main point is birth control. What would you do if she got pregnant? Cats can be very hard to keep indoors when they really want to get out, and it only takes a few minutes for a female in heat and a tom to find each other and do the deed. Toms may take to hanging around your house,too---it depends how many free-roaming toms are in your area.

Behavior can be an issue too. Can you tolerate the way she's acting now, every couple of weeks? My first cat howled for 3 months straight when she went into heat, LOL. Most cats aren't quite that bad but it can still be unpleasant. Cats also communicate through urine scenting, especially when communicating sexual availability. She may not spray outside of the litterbox, but it's not uncommon so be prepared.

Health is another factor. Female cats who cycle repeatedly have a much higher chance for reproductive problems. Familiarize yourself with the symptoms of pyometra or other uterine diseases, and keep an eye out for lumps in mammary area as they'll have to be removed quickly to keep from spreading.

Just remember there's a reason people invented spay/neuter for pets! Birth control is important.

There is a cat birth control?

stephanietx I can under stand the population thing but it's not just limited to cats and dogs it's also humans and other animals.

I would like to say I'm debating on breeding my girl or having her desexed (spayed) and have been for months! (even tho I have about 4 people that want kittens from me).

My cats have never tried getting out and my girl had the chance today when my husband left the door open (almost had a heart attack) but she waited by the door for him to come back and fuss over here. Thankfully I'm in day 3 of het heat cycle and no toms outside of our house thankfully. Howling it sounds like a baby crying for a nappy change and crying momma at the same time lol. Have had no problems with my cats spraying yet thankfully and hope I wont (knocks on wood). If I breed her she will have maybe 1-2 litters after that she will be spayed. I know many will think I'm awful for saying this but I wish a spay/neuter option was more widely pushed for humans. Maybe I think that way cuz I see so many females that dont want kids and have them but I have lost all my pregnancys and want one.

I also believe everything has a choice and a preferance even if we can't hear what that thing is saying. It's like saying plants are not alive even tho there is proof that they are.

Morganalefae said:

 
There is a cat birth control?

stephanietx I can under stand the population thing but it's not just limited to cats and dogs it's also humans and other animals.

I would like to say I'm debating on breeding my girl or having her desexed (spayed) and have been for months! (even tho I have about 4 people that want kittens from me).

My cats have never tried getting out and my girl had the chance today when my husband left the door open (almost had a heart attack) but she waited by the door for him to come back and fuss over here. Thankfully I'm in day 3 of het heat cycle and no toms outside of our house thankfully. Howling it sounds like a baby crying for a nappy change and crying momma at the same time lol. Have had no problems with my cats spraying yet thankfully and hope I wont (knocks on wood). If I breed her she will have maybe 1-2 litters after that she will be spayed. I know many will think I'm awful for saying this but I wish a spay/neuter option was more widely pushed for humans. Maybe I think that way cuz I see so many females that dont want kids and have them but I have lost all my pregnancys and want one.

I also believe everything has a choice and a preferance even if we can't hear what that thing is saying. It's like saying plants are not alive even tho there is proof that they are.

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Is she any specific breed or do you just want kittens? I'm trying to understand your purpose in breeding her. I have many female cats and males that have both been TNR'd they are more barncat like than feral and they all spray, it just doesn't smell as bad since they've been fixed. I find there are not nearly as many fights and if there are, its very mild. I will warn you, all the kittens may not make it and its heartbreaking, please prepare yourself for that and all the issues that could ensue if you do breed her.

Do you think you can find GOOD homes for all the kittens? I'll warn that it's not easy---many people who say they want kittens will back out at the last minute, and some people you thought would be good owners will dump the kitty when he/she isn't cute anymore. You could end up having to keep all the kittens. Are you prepared for that?

As far as population goes, 50% of female cats could have 1 litter and that wouldn't cause an overpopulation (assuming an average of 4 kittens per litter), so since there is an overpopulation in most places that means either more than 50% of cats are having 1 litter or a lot of cats are having more than 1 litter. Try to figure out just how much of an overpopulation exists in your area---it's important to know the demand before you add more kittens to that number.

Also make sure you have money put away in case she needs an emergency c-section. That's not cheap!

Currently in the US, spay/neuter is the only available birth control for pets. Other countries have other options, though they all have their risks. Since you call it "desexing" you might be in the UK? If so, your vet may offer hormonal birth control, but I don't know the details; you'd have to ask your vet about it. Remember that people drowned an awful lot of kittens and puppies before spaying became readily available---so overpopulation isn't a new problem!

She is a blue oriental and the male I would breed her to would be my own lilac point siamese male ( I heard this is allowed in th cat breeding world) both cats are pure bred but no papers.they are not mutts, mutts would mean mix bred these are pure bred just no papers. So far the 4 people that have asked for kittens I personally know them they all have stable lifes and all have offered to put a deposit down so they know they will get a kitten if I do bred. Have you heard a oriental or even siamese queen yowl lol it really is something. We are already willing to keep every single kitten from a litter (heck I just might keep them for myself no selling them) I have not heard of a over population issue in my area but that is not saying there is not one. We have also talked to our vet about c-sections cost & the cost of a FeLV, and FIV, and have almost all the money for it set aside except for maybe 100. Yes I'm in the UK I use to live in the USA and think desexing is way easyier to say/type as it's one word lol. I would also like to state that I have also asked our vet the complete cost of first shots,flea and worm treatment, microchipping and desexing as I'm not letting the kittens leave with out any of that. I'm also keeping the kittens til they are 14-16 weeks, I got both of my cats at maybe 8-10 weeks old and don't fancy their babies leaving any earlier. I'm well prepared for any extras or any kitten that may need hand feedings (have done this with both kittens and dogs of friends and family).

bottom line all kittens will leave me desexed at 14-16 weeks old have their shots,flea and worm treatment, & microchip. they will also get a kitten pack with a bed & the food they were raised (both dry & wet).

Shelters in the UK are just as overstretched as those in the US, and there are just as many issues with ferals, strays and unwanted cats.

It sounds like you'd be taking a sensible approach on the whole, but I think it's lunacy to breed from non papered cats. Sure, you say they're not 'mutts', but they'll be viewed as no better than that by the breed societies. My personal opinion is that you'd be far better off spaying/neutering now. I know the allure of breeding - its something I've struggled with myself - but I honestly think the best option is to spay/neuter without breeding.

I'm curious about your use of the term "de-sexed"...and I don't mean that in any negative way, I've just never heard the term before. Is that common where you live?

Full disclosure, I am 100% in favor of spaying and neutering for all the reasons given above (and more). Using terms like "intact" and "de-sex" seem like attempts to put a negative spin on a healthy, safe, routine procedure. I don't mean that you are trying to put a negative spin on that personally....just however that term came about seems like it means to favor breeding.

I can only say that I tolerate responsible, ethical breeding. And I say I tolerate it because I know that ethical breeders exist, but there are so so so so many who are not responsible, not ethical, and lead to the suffering of so many animals (many of whom end up on the streets where rescuers try and scoop them up before they die). So my gut reaction to your question is an overwhelming YES in favor of spaying your cat.

Heat cycles vary by cat. My most recent female rescue, Cookie, went through a number of heat cycles before I could get her spayed. You can't spay them while they're in heat, the procedure is too risky. Her heat cycles ran 10-12 days and repeated every 10 days. So basically I had 10 days of nightmarish yowling, distressed and deranged behavior (resulting in very little sleep for me) followed by 10 days of relative peace, followed by more nightmarish yowling. I finally managed to get her spayed and she is a much happier, more peaceful (and more loving) cat today.

Your kitty may have heat cycles less....*ahem*....extreme...than mine. If so, count yourself lucky. I've yet to meet a furrent who would describe their girl cat's heat cycle as only mildly annoying.

A few other things to consider:

1) Cats who are not spayed have more health problems, including a higher risk of cancer.

2) Unspayed females can and do engage in "marking" behavior, particularly during heat cycles. So you may have unintended consequences in your home.

3) Estrus cycles are incredibly stressful for your cat. They may eat less and certainly won't sleep as much. Hormonal levels are absolutely unbearable.

While Cookie was in heat, as much as she was making me crazy (deranged, more like......the lack of sleep alone), she had it so much worse. I could feel the stress radiating off of her. It was awful.

From what you describe you want to mate your cat, so she wouldn't necessarily be going through a full cycle with all the torment. It's not what I would do, but you have committed to getting the offspring vaccinated, spayed / neutered, etc. and I do commend you for that.

Would you have her spayed after the one litter then? My fear is that one litter is hard enough to fully place....lots of people make big promises that they will love and cherish their little darling forever, then the cat or dog ends up at the pound on the list for euthanasia. You seem like a responsible individual, I just hope all the people adopting the offspring are equally responsible and committed to their new kitty for the duration of its life. One of the reasons I say I only tolerate ethical breeders is because I know that so many purebreds end up in shelters when the new families can't handle them (or don't even try).

As I said...I am biased. I have a house full of rescues cast off by people chasing a pure breed....so I have my prejudices.

Morganalefae said:

 
She is a blue oriental and the male I would breed her to would be my own lilac point siamese male ( I heard this is allowed in th cat breeding world) both cats are pure bred but no papers.they are not mutts, mutts would mean mix bred these are pure bred just no papers. So far the 4 people that have asked for kittens I personally know them they all have stable lifes and all have offered to put a deposit down so they know they will get a kitten if I do bred. Have you heard a oriental or even siamese queen yowl lol it really is something. We are already willing to keep every single kitten from a litter (heck I just might keep them for myself no selling them) I have not heard of a over population issue in my area but that is not saying there is not one. We have also talked to our vet about c-sections cost & the cost of a FeLV, and FIV, and have almost all the money for it set aside except for maybe 100. Yes I'm in the UK I use to live in the USA and think desexing is way easyier to say/type as it's one word lol. I would also like to state that I have also asked our vet the complete cost of first shots,flea and worm treatment, microchipping and desexing as I'm not letting the kittens leave with out any of that. I'm also keeping the kittens til they are 14-16 weeks, I got both of my cats at maybe 8-10 weeks old and don't fancy their babies leaving any earlier. I'm well prepared for any extras or any kitten that may need hand feedings (have done this with both kittens and dogs of friends and family).

bottom line all kittens will leave me desexed at 14-16 weeks old have their shots,flea and worm treatment, & microchip. they will also get a kitten pack with a bed & the food they were raised (both dry & wet).

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Is this because you desire a kitten from your own cat. I haven't seen that addressed here. While I agree with the posters here cats should for the most part be spayed and neutered again I don't believe any animal bred has to be a purebred. My own shelter experience and the ensuing mess that shelter tried to cover up and then ended up having to destroy every cat there for a contagious disease means as long as I have a resident cat I will never adopt from one again. As much as I despise people who breed litter after litter in the attempt to make new breeds some of which I find appalling both in the cat and dog world. I have real bones to pick with shelters and the unique messes they create in the pet population. The one or two kittens I might purchase privately doesn't make a lick of difference in the unwanted cat population. Now as long as each of us likely have someone like my neighbor around who thinks nothing of letting their cats out unaltered to breed and then those that survive breed and make dozens if not hundreds of more unwanted souls. Our AC laws out here are pretty much mute on the subject of cats. Which not only allows my neighbors to continue to let them propagate in misery but for anyone who gets sick of them to dispose of them in any manner they choose. In some sense spay and neuter shame should be heaped on them long before a person who wants to breed her pet and has thought out the fate of the kittens.

People like my direct neighbors are the ones that fuel the feral colonies and the spread of cat disease making half the population in shelters unfit to bring home to a house with healthy pets in it. The sickly babies that know only misery from the time they're born due to hunger, fleas, parasites and animal and human predators. The ones that shelters and charity spend millions on each year treated preventable disease and injury.

I have 40 years of some pretty hardcore horse rescue under my belt. I haven't seen anything really get better. Even when there are laws judges regularly dismiss fines for judgment proof tools like animal abusers next door. It's not that I think anyone really needs to breed. Just that the finger pointing tends to go in the wrong direction.

Columbine: I looked all over the UK for 2 years to find a siamese or a oriental that has papers from a registered breeder so no longer wanted to breed, others had waiting lists that were years long or others said I was a time waster, did not qaulify to have one of their pet quailty cats for unknown reasons, or was just stright up ignored. the non-papered pure breds are only slightly cheaper then papered. my 2 cats mothers were not registered. Now I dont know if they bred a pet cat or they just never got the papers from the breeder for the breeder cat I will not ever know.

juleska: I came across the term desex in a few of my cat books and some of the older people I know here in the UK use that term. I'm originally from the USA and use to saying spay or neuture but I have a bit of a issue at times remember how to spell the later so just find desex much easier. I dont think it makes it sound like breeding is better but that is my personal view. Oh she drove me up the wall over the last 2-3 days with yowling I was wondering when someone was going to call the police and say it sounded like we were trying to kill a baby or something (she sounded like a baby wailing bloody murder) but she is a sweetie and she has become more affectionate since coming into heat (she already is but its like in over drive). Chances are that yes after one litter I would get her fixed as well as the male even tho is he very pretty for a traditonal lilac point.

Kittens mom: I would not mind a kitten from my own cats as both are very sweet lazy cats, I think even most breeders have that intention as well wither they keep the animal for their breeding or for showing (I have no intention of breeding any kitten from any of my litters even if it is just the one litter). I have also had many wild cats as personal pets who turned out to be some of the greatest pets I have ever had I had a female called me kitty she was wild as wild could be and she lived to be 15 and was never spayed because the vet she was taken to refused to do it I was 8 at the time so the whole vet thing did not fall down to me plus i dont know why a vet refused to do that either. I dont like recuse places personal experiance with both dogs and cats on that one thats why I'm doing a kitten contract so I can do all possible to make sure the kitten comes back to me for whatever reason. I don't  people that breed for money wither its dog or cat but I will admit I often find myself going what would this and that look like if you crossed it but I dont fancy doing it myself.

I have every intention of having only 1-2 litters if I do breed plus any kitten from the litters would be desex asap. Both my male and female will be desexed as well. If any major health issue pops up before breeding that would cause issues with the next gen  my male or female cat would both be desexed on the spot. If life threating issues in reguards to mating pop up then they will both be desexed as I believe these can be more intense in cats who have a family history. kinda like breeding issues in humans.

Morganalefae said:

 
juleska: I came across the term desex in a few of my cat books and some of the older people I know here in the UK use that term. I'm originally from the USA and use to saying spay or neuture but I have a bit of a issue at times remember how to spell the later so just find desex much easier. I dont think it makes it sound like breeding is better but that is my personal view. Oh she drove me up the wall over the last 2-3 days with yowling I was wondering when someone was going to call the police and say it sounded like we were trying to kill a baby or something (she sounded like a baby wailing bloody murder) but she is a sweetie and she has become more affectionate since coming into heat (she already is but its like in over drive). Chances are that yes after one litter I would get her fixed as well as the male even tho is he very pretty for a traditonal lilac point.

I have every intention of having only 1-2 litters if I do breed plus any kitten from the litters would be desex asap. Both my male and female will be desexed as well. If any major health issue pops up before breeding that would cause issues with the next gen  my male or female cat would both be desexed on the spot. If life threating issues in reguards to mating pop up then they will both be desexed as I believe these can be more intense in cats who have a family history. kinda like breeding issues in humans.

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I figured it was a more common term in your area. I just hadn't heard it before. Learn something new every day!

As for your decision to breed: Fair enough. It sounds to me like you have a reasonable plan. It wouldn't be my choice but it's obviously your call. Thank you for committing to having the kittens vaccinated and desexed before adopting them out. That makes SUCH a big difference.

Would you post some pictures of them? I'm really curious about their look from what you've described. They sound like beautiful cats.

Male is a lilac point applehead siamese (top pic)

Female is a blue oriental female (bottom pic).

excuse the "mess" the cats got into the mail box on our coffe table lol

Morganalefae said:

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• morganalefae
• Nov 2, 2015

Male is a lilac point applehead siamese (top pic)

Female is a blue oriental female (bottom pic).

excuse the "mess" the cats got into the mail box on our coffe table lol

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Beautiful cats. You are planning to have them tested for being carriers of certain genetic issues right? I am thinking they both are breeds that can be prone to heart issues and also liver issues. 

I am getting them tested for what I can I'm mostly worried about FeLV and FIV. From what I have read on the saimese and the oriental  are quite hardy but are prone to Respiratory Problems, Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder, Vestibular Disease also Siamese cats tend to have a more difficult time with anesthesia than other cats or so it says in my books and on a few net pages I visited as well as some heart and liver issues.

I have been talking to another vet closer to me bout other tests I could do  the vet said the only thing I could do is DNA testing of both of my cats but I was told it would cost a small fortune but I'm looking around to see if that is true. the vet  said even if they carry a genetic marker for a type of issue does not mean 100%  that cat will develop that issue or it's off spring would develop that issue. the vet went on to say that pure breds have more health issues then mix breeds and even breeders can't stamp their cats as 100% free from anything other then FeLV FIV as a cat can develop breed related issues.

I am trying my best to make sure any kitten that may be born from my cats are as healthy as possible with that said there is also only so much I can do to make sure to reduce the chance of health issues.