Anal Sac Problems: PLEASE if anyone can help.

Hello,

On Saturday I noticed my 12 year old cat Basil eating very little and sleeping a lot.  I looked under his tail and noticed his left anal sac swollen.  He did have this problem once before (about 3 years ago).  I took him to the emergency vet Sunday morning.  They used a iso anaesthetic to temporarily put him to sleep while his sacs were expressed.  He was also given an injection of Torb (pain medication)  before going home.  Right now he is on clavomox twice a day.  I was told to use a warm compress on the area a few times a day.  He will not let me do this.  So I put a fleece blanket over a heating pad set to low and he sits on it a few times a day.  Ever since he has come home from the vet (it is now Monday evening), he has been acting strange.  He keeps walking around the house and stopping to look around.  He will only sleep for short periods and continue to walk around.  He has been drinking water but will not eat his dry food or the canned food I try to give him.  I gave him some tuna and he ate a couple of spoons.  

When he had this problem with his anal sacs 3 years ago, I took him to his regular vet.  They expressed them for him without using any anaesthetic.  He was fully awake during the procedure.  He was sent home with clavomox and was pretty much back to himself within a few hours.  

I called the emergency vet and they said they can't think of anything that they would have done to cause this and that the gas and Torb would have been out of his system after about 5 hours.  

I called his regular vet and they said I can monitor him tonight and if this behavior keeps up to bring him in so they can look at him.  I don't think it's the clavomox as he has been on that before and never showed side effects.  

I don't understand this behavior.  Even as I type this he is walking around.  It's very frustrating and upsetting to see him like this.  I'm worried sick about him.  I will definitely take him in to his regular vet if this keeps up, but I definitely will not take him back to that ER.  

Has anyone every experienced anything like this with their cat?

Any input would greatly be appreciated.

Thank you.

I'm sorry I can't help except to say I'd definitely take him to his regular vet in the morning, if only for piece of mind, because it does sound odd. Using gas can affect the brain but very rarely. Good luck.

Hi Tamu.Gas is the safest type of anesthetic there is .But agree it does take time to leave the body of an animal as well as can give some side effects.They did not give your kitty any injections right? Like Convenia?if you don't know you are privy to all documents of anything they gave your baby.Did you actually see the gas machine or did they tell you they used it?I have seen this before when they use injection only & have actually seen death.So you want to make sure no convenia & know of absolutely everything they gave your kitty.Did your kitty come home with any antibiotics? All pertinent info.HTH  C.

Thank you for the responses.  They told me they used only iso anesthetic gas.  They injected him with 2.0 ml Torb (aslo know as Butorphanol).  This is a pain medication.  I really think it has to do with the Butorphanol.

I lost a cat, Thomas, in June to heart failure.  He was 17 years old.  May his precious soul rest in peace.  He had to have his chest drained of fluid twice.  One time in January I took him to this same ER where they did the procedure.  I remembered he acted even worse than Basil after coming home.  It took him 3 days to get back to normal.  Just for the hell of it I went to look at his paperwork, and it turns out they injected him with the same Butorphanol  pain medication.  His was at a higher dose.  He acted even more bizarre than Basil is now.  It has to have something to do with it.  Basil is a smaller cat (12 pounds); he was injected at 2.0 mg.  Thomas was 17 pounds; he was injected at 10 mg.  Thomas was walking all around the house confused, looking at the ceiling and just all around like he didn't know where he was.  He would run and hide and just want to be alone.  He eventually calmed down after 3 days.  Basil's behavior is a less exaggerated version of what Thomas went through.  I will monitor him through the night.  If there is no improvement in the morning, I will definitely take him to his regular vet.

I just gave him his second dose of clavomox and he is resting.  I hope to God he wakes up all better.   

Hi Tamu.It is highly likely are action to that med.It came in pdf from and unfortunately i don't know how to post it to you.You can Dr.google it.Butorphanal in cats & you will see the side effects.You also will see the risks etc.What you want to try to find is there an antidote if he is not better.With convenia which is why I asked you about it convenia,it stays in the body for 65 days.There is not antidote & yes cats have died from it.I don't know why they didn't give you buprenorphine which is highly used in cats or put a fentanyl patch on.My Trixie was critical though and had a fentanyl patch.Very strong.But saved her life.This is a different situation where your kitty did not have a tumor the size of a racquetball removed from its gut.Buprenorphine is what I am used to using.Yes your drug is also an opiate like bup.Also look for drug interactions as I see you are using clavamox too right.Drugs.com has a drug interacter link.HTH Honey & hoping your baby is better soon.Pay attention to respiration & if you have a stethoscope  check heartrate.It should be at read about 160-180 bpm.Open mouth breathing is an emergency right now.I personally would say NO to that drug ever again.Hugs C.

Basil continued not eating and was just weak and laying around most of the day.  I took him to see his regular vet Tuesday.  They did blood work and X-rays.  Thyroid and kidneys are normal.  He doesn't have any blood sugar issues.  But his WBC came back VERY high.  The normal range is between 2.87-17.02 (thousand), and his came back at 53.18.  The vet said this is something she definitely not expecting.  She expected he had an infection, but nothing like this.  They hydrated him and put him on Baytril 22.7 mg Tablets.  I'm supposed to give him one a day, starting Wednesday night (the vet gave him a 24 hour injection of Baytril).  When we got home from the vet, he ate a few pieces of food FINALLY and was slightly more perky.  The vet said he will be on the Baytril until it runs out.  I didn't check how many pills they gave him.  I would think he would be on it for 7-10 day.  I read about the side effects of Baytril, but he seems to be on a good dose that will not cause anything negative.  After he is done with the antibiotic, I'm to take him back to be retested.  If the infection is still there, there will have to run more tests as the vet said certain cancers can cause a high WBC count. 

His chest x-ray looked good.  The vet did see what she said was a small urinary stone, but she said this was definitely not causing his current problems as he is urinating fine.  They were not able to get a urine sample to test for a urinary tract infection.  But they will have to keep monitoring this.  Right now her main concern is the infection.

I just don't understand how an infection this great could have happened.  Could all  this have been caused by the anal sac infection?  The vet said it was possible but rare. 

I hate seeing him sick.  I hope he eats more today.  My brother is watching him today until he goes to work at 1.  I will be home after 5.  I keep thinking about him.

This morning he jumped on my lap and sat purring.  This is always a habit of his, but since he got sick he had stopped doing it.  I'm hoping this is a positive sign that maybe he is getting better. 

I keep praying that this will pass and he will be back to normal.  I miss him running around and attacking my feet. 

Hi Tamu.Good you had your boy tested.I have had many kitties with lots of cancer & never did any bloodwork show anything.I wish.Nothing.As for the stone.It will likely be an oxalate stone.Which you can goggle.but is of concern with me but not in the case of high WBC.But ehya re very complex in dealing with.there is no diet to braek it down in other words.He is fighting something.Did they take his temp? Do you have copies of all test they ran?.Stool can enter the penus & go up the urethra in a cat.Or for a female the vulva area.It can cause infections big time like Ecoli.I know a member of the Flutd group who had a kitty who had very high WBC and associated leaking at the bowel.Many uit's in her 18 yrs an almost became resistant to most.I'd like you to talk to her.Her name is Mary.If you don't have any test results pls call your vet & see if they can email them to you.She will want to see all of what was done.Her kitties WBC went right through the roof.But Mary is well aware of infections etc & is a wealth.Please join & talk to here just like you have now.Make it att;Mary Kitty with high WBC with stone seen in bladder I'm worried pls help.Something like that.Which you are worried.Vet says stone has nothing to do with WBC which I believe it won't but anal sac problem you  have had and NO urinalysis done.You will have to have an account for yahoo.It is free Just google making an account with yahoo & follow the prompts..This is her link:https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FLUTD/info

The reason I mention this is his badder can have an infection from stool.With no urine test to see they have nothing to go on.WBC would elevate & I am curious if his immune system is working and he had an elevated temperature.Baytril is used highly& Mary will know all about it.But without a urinalysis there is no knowing if it is in there.it may not be.But the urethra is right there &???But has the anal sac all healed now?Or is something still brewing in there.I believe your vet is on the right track although am hesitant to think any of this has to do with cancer.Pls join Hugs to your Boy C. Just my two bits worth......

Thank you for the information.  His temperature is back to normal, I believe 101.8.  They checked his anal sacs and said they looked good.  I just hope the Baytril clears up the infection.  He is very difficult to medicate.  The vet said I can bring his medication and one of the technicians can give it to him if I have trouble.

Hi Tamu.

Yes I do believe this med is NOT a good one as you will agree.I hate it when they just go ahead without us knowing injecting our kitties with things that like this med you already had experience with and I'm sure you would have said to use something else.Does he seem a little more oriented now this evening?A temperature at least shows his immunity system is working.low temp is of major concern with infection.i have seen very low temp's with feral kittesn infested with worms have a temp of lower than 37 degrees celcius.They usually after intervention some will pass away.It is ugly.But your boy's system kicked in which is great.I also have dealt with kitties whose WBC was 100,000 & lived to tell about it.Is the baytril a pill form or a compounded liquid you syringe? I see in your post tablets.Is he syringe able? If so a compounding pharmacy may be able to take those pills,crush them & add a solution flavored that you would draw up in a syringe.this you would ask your vet.But they don't normally do it.Human compounding pharmacies are the ones that do.They also make flavored tabs.But if that was easier for you to medicate him & the compounding pharmacy can make it into liquid form you may want to go that route.Just depends on the kitty.Some don't pill well but syringe ok.Some don't like neither etc.Do you wrap him up in a burrito(towel) to hold him while pilling or?? I never had to restrain any of mine but i was lucky and was told not to a very long time  ago.Although every kitty is so different from the next.If you are managing to pill him you should always after take a 3 or 5ml syringe of room temp water & slowly syringe that after pilling.the esophagus of a cat is roughly 5-7 " long and pills will lie in there eroding the esophagus.Never dry pill a cat in other words.Some people kitties have treats they love say temptations etc.Even if giving a few of those after the pill will help it work down into the tummy.From what I have been reading normal baytril tablets are bitter.When i was giving Maxwell pepcid which is also very bitter I used to pickup pill pockets made by greenies.Petstore.The are like brown dough.I never used the whole pill pocket but would rip off a chunk of the dough & wrap the pill up in the dough like a small ball.Then pill right down the throat.Then proceed with a water chaser carefully..Also reading on Tanya's which is a wealth of a site I'll give you the link about Baytril & dosing & when to dose which sounds to me on an empty stomach.I don't know if your vet specified but here is the link.You can always call/him /her & ask empty stomach or not.Helen's site is pretty top notch.She knows her stuff.So if she says empty I personally would go empty.But always run everything by your veterinarian.Some times these small tidbits of info which end up being huge are missed by Doctor's in not telling you ALL about it.We pay to be told ALL about it.here is the link & if your boy doesn't start to eat soon pls try to introduce something.Do you have canned there?If so an no appetite maybe try gerbers stage 2 babyfood chicken(no onions or garlic) my boy took to it right away.Some hate it.It holds over 100 calories per little jar.It is not designed forever but your boy needs some food.You don't wait, you have to intervene.Been there many times & know the feeling of scared too.I'll never forget it.Do you know how long that pain med is supposed to work or stay in the body?Pain which that would be painful will make a cat not eat as well.Here is Tanya's link on baytril.HTH Hugs to you & your Boy C

http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A86....lers.htm/RK=0/RS=eAzj2gBaD5gvV7CRpuickuR1l1I- 

If this sends you into cyberspace which i tend to do LOL just  google www.felinecrf.org & go into the index looking for antibiotics.

Basil is much more active this morning.  He's still not 100%, but there is definitely improvement.  He's also eating a little more.  And he's using the litter box. 

I have the Baytril in pill form.  He is very difficult to medicate.  I tried crushing the pill and mixing it with some water as the vet instructed and using an oral syring.  I got the medication in him, but he started foaming at the mouth.  I don't know if by doing this he spit the medication out.  There was a lot of foaming.  I have used this method for my other cats when they needed medicine, and it always worked.  Basil is just very difficult.  It looks like I am going to have to take him to the vet and have a technician give him the pills in the evening.  This will be for 9 days. 

Have you ever used pill guns to administer medication?  Is there a chance the pill will get into their windpipe.  I will also look into the pill pockets. 

Hi Tamu.

That is so great to hear your boy is on the mend.i have never had to use a pill gun ever.But I'm sure there are members out there who have.If that pill is bitter adding it to water & syringing is a nightmare to happen.If I did that with pepcid which is terribly bitter Maxwell would have foamed completely.To me that is a ridiculous way of telling you to do it.if it is bitter.When you crush it taste it.You'll soon know.A pce of a pill pocket worked for me.Not the whole pill pocket.I don't know the size the baytril pills are.But have pilled what I call Horse pills to my cats with a pce of pill pocket and never a problem.Left hand grabs the kitty by the scruff.Which most cats become submissive just like when Momma is holding them.in my right had an as I am write handed I take the pill(wrapped in a pce of Pill pocket) hang onto the pill with my thumb & another finger while I take another finger to pry open their mouths.And yes sometimes it is prying.,Once at the back of the mouth I take my finger & push it down into the throat.Don't be afraid to put your fingers in there or should I say "A finger" to push it down unless your kitty is a biter.Some people will right after clamp the mouth closed and wait for kitty to stick their tongue out.Swallowed.Yes i know it sounds easy.I have done 100's.So yes back in the day pills did go flinging here & there.But have mastered it and you will too.But if that baytril is bitter crushing it up is worse than leaving it whole & wrapping  it in pce of pill pocket.Your are basically syringing your boy something that tastes absolutely terrible.No reasoning behind that information.IMO.When the pill has no taste but the cat is hard to pill but will take to syringing,different story.The foaming is the taste.I have also used empty gel caps purchased from www.thrivingpets.com where to take the pill & put it in a capsule or sometimes it is a pce of a pill.they come in all different sizes,cheap.You can get vegetarian if you want.Good to keep on hand.

Hereis a video of pilling .You should have asked for flavored pills although they should already know they are bitter & probably do not carry flavored ones.They will pill him down the hatch.No syringing.All this info you have paid for but have gotten none.It just kills me.thus the reason for these groups to help when we have paid & gotten nothing.

http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrT...-a-pill//RK=0/RS=NLuj9yEsPJETbAWn9NgGtHPkTkA-

This may be helpful to you.I had other videos bookmarks somewhere here but have over 100 bookmarks.You can also google pilling a cat.OK? When you go to the vet ask why they didn't tell you this Baytril is bitter.In fact just get the vet to eat a baytril, chew it while you watch.LOL

Here is a link to pill pockets.they come in different sizes & last a long time.Just a pce of the dough.I never used the whole thing.HTH.hugs to Babe C.

http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrT...ats.aspx/RK=0/RS=8aA9FF.Px1klJxvXu0S74jsEBq8-

Also wanted to say now that he is eating more pay attention to the litterbox.having any problem down there is extremely painful.Any human that has experienced piles or whatever down there knows well how much pain can occur having a BM.Please if you can observe your boy.Hugs

Thank you for all the information.  I'm going to try to coat the pill with butter and pill him myself.  If it doesn't work, I'm going to just take him to the vet's office and have them do it.  He's not going to be happy either way, but he has to get all the antibiotic.

Here's another picture of Basil.

Wow what a beauty!!! Just lovely.I love blk cats and have had a few in my life.You must be such a proud Mom.!!!

Thank you for sharing....C.

Basil continues to improve.  I was not able to pill him yesterday and ended up taking him to the vet.  The technician showed me how to do it.  I'm confident I can give him the medication tonight.  The vet would charge $9 per visit for me to have to bring him in to be medicated.  They waived the fee yesterday.  He is eating more and has perked up.  He went to the litter box this morning.  I did notice that his stool is not as solid as it should be.  It's not diarrhea is either, just on the soft side.  The vet said having a solid stool will help him to express his anal glands on his own.  Right now he's eating Nutro Max Senior dry food in roasted chicken.  I have tried the grain free foods in the past, but the cats didn't like them.  I'm going to look into other more high fiber foods that can help him.  I was also reading about IBD in cats and got paranoid that he may have this.

I will take him for a follow up to the vet next Friday.  I hope his WBC will be back to normal and will be good.

I just CANNOT pill a cat, it is something that I hate to do. I have to give my 14 year old daily Lasix, but found an easy way. I bought Greenies Pill pockets and tear off a tiny piece. Just enough to 'cement' it to a treat. (or bacon, which is really hard to resist). The cat gobbles it up, not even realizing there is a treat in it! It really works. Some of my cats will even just eat a pill pocket with the med inside, they like the taste.  With liquid medications I mix it in tuna juice, the strong smell masks the medication. I hope it helps!

HI Tamu.

That is good they showed you & have confidence.Did they tell you to syringe a water chaser after pilling? I hope so as it is a must.At least 3mls of room temp bottled water is what I used very carefully syringed.Using Dr.Google we can send ourselves into a frenzy reading all these ailments our kitties could have.please don't let that do that to you.As per having a normal soft log yes his anal glands will express properly over diarrhea.but i'm sure at this time he is feeling some discomfort back there & me personally would want him a little soft even just for two bm's.Can i ask & you may have posted this in the very beginning here.How did this all come about with your beauty?

Did you notice constipation or do you work and it is almost impossible to notice what you were receiving as per BM's daily/Did he have a bout of diarrhea that went unsolved? Just wondering how this all came about & may have some insight as to how to help you further that this doesn't happen again.When you sit back & google all the symptoms and what they could be right up to cancer those feelings of anxiety know they go right to your beautiful boy.

They are extremely sensitive creatures.So stress is huge for them although most of us think they are so independent animals compared to dog's but doesn't mean they don't notice change.Notice when their Momma is worried etc.You & Your Boy have been through alot & i understand not to be worried.And I know you just want him back to his normal self.Happy,Healthy & enjoying life with you.We all want that.Not everything has to be a terrible thing Tamu.One day at a time.

After I hear more of how this all began I may be able to offer you some advice.For now enjoy the Day.Enjoy your Boy.He is healing which is great!!! Take nothing for granted.But also don't let yourself get sucked into the google nightmare of worry that will only bring your Boy down.He truly is gorgeous!! Hugs C.Live for today.Tomorrow is a whole other day.  

MomofMaxwell said:

 
HI Tamu.

That is good they showed you & have confidence.Did they tell you to syringe a water chaser after pilling? I hope so as it is a must.At least 3mls of room temp bottled water is what I used very carefully syringed.Using Dr.Google we can send ourselves into a frenzy reading all these ailments our kitties could have.please don't let that do that to you.As per having a normal soft log yes his anal glands will express properly over diarrhea.but i'm sure at this time he is feeling some discomfort back there & me personally would want him a little soft even just for two bm's.Can i ask & you may have posted this in the very beginning here.How did this all come about with your beauty?

Did you notice constipation or do you work and it is almost impossible to notice what you were receiving as per BM's daily/Did he have a bout of diarrhea that went unsolved? Just wondering how this all came about & may have some insight as to how to help you further that this doesn't happen again.When you sit back & google all the symptoms and what they could be right up to cancer those feelings of anxiety know they go right to your beautiful boy.

They are extremely sensitive creatures.So stress is huge for them although most of us think they are so independent animals compared to dog's but doesn't mean they don't notice change.Notice when their Momma is worried etc.You & Your Boy have been through alot & i understand not to be worried.And I know you just want him back to his normal self.Happy,Healthy & enjoying life with you.We all want that.Not everything has to be a terrible thing Tamu.One day at a time.

After I hear more of how this all began I may be able to offer you some advice.For now enjoy the Day.Enjoy your Boy.He is healing which is great!!! Take nothing for granted.But also don't let yourself get sucked into the google nightmare of worry that will only bring your Boy down.He truly is gorgeous!! Hugs C.Live for today.Tomorrow is a whole other day.

 

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I bought the pill pockets to try, but Basil had no interest in it at all.  I was able to pill him on my own Friday night and today, Saturday.  I chased it down with 3 ml of water like you said.  He was difficult today.  He spit the pill out twice, but I eventually got it in him.  I noticed today that he's sneezing a bit and sort of sniffling.  I don't know if he now has a cold.  He did eat a little less today.  Maybe his WBC count was high because he had a cold that was beginning and also because of the anal sacs becoming infected?  Other than that, his activity level is normal.  

Basil's anal sacs became impacted 3 years ago.  He went to his vet back then and had them expressed and placed on clavamox.  Every since then, I will look under his tail from time to time to make sure it looks ok.  I noticed this time when he started sleeping a lot and not eating; that's when I looked back there and saw that his left sac was swelling.  It seems like when this happened three years ago, things went much more smoother for him.  

He has 7 more days of Baytril to go.

Hi Tamu.

The pill pockets if you bought the brown dough ones do not expect your baby to eat it.One bite into the baytril & puke.Dog's are always easier to pill putting in something like that & just handing it to them & they eat the whole thing..This was not why I used them.I took a pce of the dough,literally ripping it off the pocket and wrapped the pill or pce of a pill around it.Making it like a ball.Pill inside ball.Making the ball as small as I could but was still covered in dough.That ball was put at the back of the throat and pushed down.Not handed to kitty to eat.Do you understand?.Even if i was pilling a pill that had no taste, I found it easier to hang onto the "Ball" & place at the back of kitties throat and push down with my finger.And yes water chaser after great job.So no this was never designed for your cat to take it & eat it.Your baby will bite it and it is over, foaming at the mouth.They don't have to be interested in eating the dough.It is all about wrapping the pill in dough as little as possible so it is NOT  a lge ball then shoving it down the throat like you did with a bare pill.Practice makes perfect.You'll get it.Sorry If i didn't explain it more thoroughly.I'd keep an eye out on the upper respiratory symptoms.If they get worse take your baby back to the vets.If they have no answers ask them if you can give him L-Lysine.It is excellent for upper respiratory ,sneezing,runny eye symptoms.Available at most vets.I used the gel form.But cat's are supposed to lick the gel.Maxwell DID NOT so I had to draw it up in a syringe & syringe it to him.It comes in powder form also and there are lysine chews available.Thank you for telling me about his anal sac problem.usual long term constipation or diarrhea where they are not getting expressed can cause anal sac problems .that's why I asked basically if your kitty has bouts of diarrhea or bouts of rocks.

HTH C I'm still looking in my bookmarks as I have an excellent video showing pilling as well as syringing kitties.Give me some time.

Hi Tamu.I finally found the videos of how to pill/syringe etc animals from Cornell university.You may find this helpful Also i will send you a link to a pill gun that i see  a lot of people using.I have NOT ever personally used one.I do not know if you can find one that looks like the one I am sending you.Looks like it has rubber tips.They do make one that has a water reservoir to pill and inject water with the pill.I DO  NOT recommend them.I have seen Cat's choke.When you click on the Cornell Videos it will open and to the right side you will see a list.Pill a cat.Syringe a cat plus a whole lost more things Temperature and other animal of course.If you click on pill a cat another screen opens up.To the left hand side of the black box where the video is going to play you will see a list.Preview, blah, blah.You have to click on the first one at the top & watch the videK? They are good.IMO

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Hope that helps Honey.You can do this!!!Also if your kitty like any treats afterwards, that is when you want to give them.Your baby will associate pilling with treats so not to have a bad experience.Temptations or whatever your baby may like.HTH Hugs to the Babe.C.I only treated my Boy after doing something like subq fluid. He had a very small bowl ready for him.LOL.No other time did he get treats during the day.He was on subq fluid therapy every night for 6 yrs.So I needed him to think this was "treat" time. He was a good Boy