Recently bought Kitten

wrighty1216

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Hey!

First off I'd like to apologise if I'm posting this thread in the wrong place. I've recently put a deposit on a persian kitten and have been to see him twice at the breeders house as he's not due to leave his mother until next week. After getting in touch with the owners to arrange a pick up time and date she has said he's changed colour from black and white to a smoked chocolate tri colour. I'm wondering is this even possible or are we being sold another cat?

Thanks!
 

Sarthur2

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Sometimes a cat's markings become more defined as they mature, but the basic color scheme usually stays about the same. Siamese cats are born all white, and later develop their darker points. Tabby cat markings - such as spots and stripes - generally will stand out more as the kitten grows. When did you last see the kitten you picked out? You'll need to go visit again to see what the breeder means. Sight unseen, I would not assume anything before looking at the litter again. A verbal description is one person's way of seeing things. And breeders have particular ways of describing colors based on genetics. If she won't let you come look then that might be a tip-off. But even if she traded kittens on you, would you still want one? And are you getting papers for this kitten? Let us know what happens.
 
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feralvr

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How old was the kitten when you first saw him? I can't imagine within a few weeks time that the kitten's color would change that drastically from black/white to chocolate tri :dk: although, in all honesty I am not the one to ask and hope that someone with Persian kitten coat experience comes along! I know that kittens colors can change as they age - the purebreds mostly. My Siamese was pure white when he was a kitten and then his flame points and coloring was in full bloom by the time he was two. But it took many months for the pure, true color to come out. So, I am curious to know what other's think of your question. Did you happen to get a picture of your kitten when you first went to visit?
 

StefanZ

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I think  SArthur said what here is to say..    I agree, sounds fishy, but lets not deem anyone too early.

But lets ask one I KNOW has knowledge on persians and colors  @posiepurrs    and we add also  @Biancavd   for good measure.   :)

ps.   If anyone else has knowledge or advice, all others are of course also welcome to answer and help.
 
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emmalovesmak

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It is possible, but just before you pick up the kitten look at the others to see if you recognize the cat your supposed to get, if not then just take the kitten and give it a great home. 
 

GoldyCat

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If it's tricolor it has to be a female (genetics). Did you take pictures when you visited? If so, I would take those pictures with you to pick up the kitten.
 

biancavd

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Okay, this does sound odd to me. Are you sure they said tricolor and not bicolor? Bicolor is a white marking. If they said bicolor, the story sounds more plausible.

Anyway, is the breeder new or has she been around for a longer time? Kittens can be difficult to decide the color of specially if you are a new breeder, and chocolate can be quite dark looking blackish. Smoke can also be rather hard on certain kittens. (Tho, it'd be more logical if they went from chocolate and white to black smoke, seeing that chocolate is lighter than black, and smoke also makes it lighter.)

The tricolor however are normally female cats, so this is where it really gets weird. Its not impossible, but tricolor should have been obvious a lot earlier in the kitten's life. Hoping they meant bicolor :)

When going to pick up, look at your kitten carefully to make sure its the same cat. The white markings should help a lot. Good luck!
 
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wrighty1216

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Thanks alot for all your answers. In all honesty I'd give the other kitten a home if it's the case, I just don't like being lied to and also paid more as she was asking more for the litter. She has definelty said tri colour. Her exact words are "his colour has changed, he's now now a chocolate smoke tri colour and stunning, very rare.". All just sounds a little strange to me.
 
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wrighty1216

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Here's a picture of him from a few weeks back. He'll also be 12 weeks old when we are supposed to be picking him up on Saturday.

Sorry to double post, I couldn't find the edit button.
 

Sarthur2

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Hmm. The kitten in the picture looks black and white to me. Very cute!

Are you able to see the kitten before Saturday when she may still have the full litter?

Ask her to send you a picture of the cat right away. Then post it for us to see.
 
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feralvr

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Thanks for the picture! Very adorable kitten! I enlarged and it does appear that there may be some lighter shading on the face mixed in with the black/brown. The kitten color could be a very dark chocolate, black smoke and not true black BUT wouldn't the breeder have great experience in deciphering kitten colors? :dk: GoldyCat did say that Tricolor's are all female and you speak of a male? Will be very interested in hearing what you find out now from the breeder- male or female?
 
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biancavd

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Thanks for the picture! Very adorable kitten! I enlarged and it does appear that there may be some lighter shading on the face mixed in with the black/brown. The kitten color could be a very dark chocolate, black smoke and not true black BUT wouldn't the breeder have great experience in deciphering kitten colors?
GoldyCat did say that Tricolor's are all female and you speak of a male? Will be very interested in hearing what you find out now from the breeder- male or female?
Not all tricolor cats are female. However, male tricolors have a genetic error that makes they show two colors (and white would make the tricolor, but white can show on every kitten). 

To get more into the explanation, female cats get XX as chromosomes, where males get XY. The X chromosome is the one carrying the color. That's why females can get black and red (from both parents) while males only get a color from their mother (either black or red). It does occur that a male gets XXY, and thus can show 2 colors (black and red, combined with white, will make him a tricolor), but these males usually can't reproduce as it is a genetic error. So it does happen, but it happens rarely.

However, on the picture, I see a black smoke and white kitten. It doesn't seem chocolate to me, and I don't see any red. Red could be hidden of course, but I would ask where it is if I were you :)
 
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colleen haynes

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This is the first time I have heard the term tricolor. Torties with white are 3 colors and are 99.9% female. I am guessing that the breeder is referring to the 3 colors as chocolate, silver (called smoke in a cat that does not have tabby markings) and white. She may have thought he was black and now sees him as chocolate. Also, sometimes it takes time for the silver to be noticeable. Silver/smoke means that the base of the hair shaft is white. Sometimes they show through and give the cat a lighter appearance. I can see the white running through the dark area of his head. So I would say that he has the silver. On the picture he looks black smoke with white (3 colors) but maybe the black was an honest mistake and he is chocolate. The white marking is distinct. Just bring a pic of him to ensure you get the right kitty. Very sweet. :)
 

nansiludie

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To me, I see him as a black and white kitty. With the traditional tuxedo face. I'm not seeing any brown or any other color, can you get a recent picture and we can see if he's changed color?
 

kkoerner

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I see the smoke in that picture for sure! He does look like a black smoke, but as his hair has gotten longer it may be more apparently chocolate. Would need a picture in good lighting to know.

However, unless he has some red spots on his backside, he is not a tri-color. Though the silver/white undercolor (smoke) does seem like a third color, it is not counted as such and he'd still be labeled as a black (or chocolate) smoke bi-color. Or, and white. Tri-color always means black (or a varient-blue, chocolate, seal in pointed cats), red (or cream) and white.

Regardless, he is adorable in the picture and sounds stunning from the description!
 

kkoerner

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This is the first time I have heard the term tricolor. Torties with white are 3 colors and are 99.9% female. I am guessing that the breeder is referring to the 3 colors as chocolate, silver (called smoke in a cat that does not have tabby markings) and white. She may have thought he was black and now sees him as chocolate. Also, sometimes it takes time for the silver to be noticeable. Silver/smoke means that the base of the hair shaft is white. Sometimes they show through and give the cat a lighter appearance. I can see the white running through the dark area of his head. So I would say that he has the silver. On the picture he looks black smoke with white (3 colors) but maybe the black was an honest mistake and he is chocolate. The white marking is distinct. Just bring a pic of him to ensure you get the right kitty. Very sweet. :)
While tri-color isn't used in cats so much, it is what a "calico" rabbit is called! LOL I raised rabbits for so long I almost catch myself referring to bi-color cats as "broken" whatever color and tortie and white or calico as tri-color. :-D
 

posiepurrs

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I contacted a breeder friend of mine who also has a PHD in evolutionary genetics and asked her. I gave her the color of the parents that you gave me in the PM. She said chocolate would be possible IF both parents had Himalayan behind them, but the chances of a male calico (Tri color)is extremely rare because in this case it would be the sperm that was messed up and not the egg. It would carry twice as many chromosones so would be heavier than other sperm and therefore not as likely to reach the egg to fertilize it. Whatever, just love your kitten - color is not important unless you want to show.
 

tsukiyomi

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So what happened with the little guy? Did you pick him up and find out what the breeder was talking about?
 
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