Why physical discipline is shunned so much?

Hey guys, new here. I just had to make an account to ask, because I looked online and on this forum, and couldn't really find an answer that is thoroughly explained.

When it comes to physical discipline, it is always shunned. Because the cat becomes fearful of humans.

As to how kittens learn not to do certain things from their mother. Why can't we humans do the same as a mother would do to a kitten that is regarded as unwanted behavior.

For example like these videos:



How come when cats discipline each other its fine, but when it comes to human physical discipline, it should never be even fantasized.

Yes I do know, about positive reinforcements, or how we have a more conscious brain.

This is not to say, I would try to do this for ever behavior i dislike.

If for example, the cat jumps on the kitchen table, then yes I would try a stern no or shake a can of coins. Or if they did something I liked, I'll give him a treat.

But for a cat that scratches or bites out of nowhere, like this thread:  http://www.thecatsite.com/t/289184/i-beat-my-cat

And everything is ruled out to see what's causing the behavior, why is it still shunned not to hit a cat, like a light tap on a head or pin them down for 5-10 seconds and let them go.

P.S. 

I don't have a cat, so I'm not physically abusing a cat, at this moment. I'm doing tons of research before I do make a commitment and make the right decisions on certain things.

Cats cant associate that you are hitting them because they scratched your couch or pee on the floor or what ever.

Because cats communicate in the same language and have a mutual understanding on why they are acting a select way. 

Just don't hit or be aggressive to animals.

If you 'discipline' a cat or kitten it will almost certainly be several seconds after the event, probably longer, and the cat will not understand what it is for. When mother cats do it, or cats to each other if they are playing too rough, it is instantaneous, and the kitten associates the tap with the unwanted behaviour. I admit that I have tapped a kitten on the nose if it is on my lap and overdoes something, but only if my action can become almost a part of what the kitten has done. It is the same with training any animal - I learnt that when horse riding, that any 'bad' action must corrected literally at once, or it is useless to try. It is another reason why water sprays and coin shakers do not often work - by the time you have picked one up, it is too late and all it does is make the kitten afraid without any lasting effect on behaviour. I find that kittens very quickly associate your tone of voice with displeasure or with praise, and if you have a good relationship with them and they feel you are their mother, then they will respond to a loud '(cat name), no!' My cats all understand the words 'no', 'down', 'off', and 'leave it'. But they also know lots of praise words too.

As other posters have said, cats can't understand that they are being punished for scratching the furniture of peeing somewhere they shouldn't. All they know is that you are attacking them and they will either learn to fear you or try to defend themselves. Nearly all behaviour problems can be changed without having to punish the cat. The only time I'd retaliate and act like another cat would is if I'm being bitten or scratched and then the best thing to do is squeal in pain. They don't want to hurt you, they just don't realise they are hurting you sometimes.

Punishing a cat with a slap or a spray bottle just makes the cat scared of people and can result in them scratching or biting seriously because they think you are going to hurt them. Pinning them down is a big no-no. This is what dominant males do and the cat will fight back if you try to do this. But if you're gentle with the cat when he or she is a kitten they'll learn to trust you and never hurt you when they get older.

There's also the fact that we are so much bigger than a cat, that it would be far too easy to really hurt or scare them, even if the intent is just a mild punishment.

Also, while mother cats do punish their kittens, I don't think that's what is happening in the videos you posted. As far as I can see those cats are playing.It's all pretend "attacks", play hunting.

Thanks everyone who replied. They really helped put things into perspective. So much info online on how to do this and that. That its difficult to choose which choice to take.

In my job, as a veterinary nurse, I restrain cats. Some are already fearful during the ride in a weird big rumbling machine (car) in a wee box, into a large strange building that smells like thousands of cats and dogs, cleansers, inhalent gas, drugs, people, waste, blood, and variety of foods. Cats for the most part have a limited experience and environment, limited to the house or apartment for an indoor only cat, limited to a set amount of acreage for an outdoor or in/outdoor cat. Coming to a new place, or heck, any place other than home, is scarey, exhilerating, and places All cats on the defensive. Some handle it differently than others.

All cats I entice or pull from their carrier, upon meeting them, should, in all rights, swat and scratch me. But, ya know, over 90% choose not to. Out of fear and freezing rather than react. Out of trust. Out of distraction with taking in this strange environment and stimuli, my touch is, at the moment and initially, ignored or tolerated.

The rare cat that enjoys a stranger's touch, enjoys having a nurse hold or restrain them, is just unnaturally trusting and desensitized to stimuli. Surprisingly, many brand new patients respond this way, and I'm pleasantly shocked, for without talking them through the invasion of their personal space with logic and explanation, like a pediatrician would to a child, or a doctor to a rape victim, without this cajoling and communication, a cat that not only allows me to hold it, but enjoys it, is an exceptional animal indeed.

Yet, there are new owners, pet sitters, veterinary professionals, and visiting family/friends that expect any and every cat to capitulate, to allow this, to tolerate a touch or hold, to tolerate invading their space, or tolerate being forced into a new home or indoor only environment when they once roamed wherever their instincts took them.

I wouldn't want a giant cat, a tiger, to spank me as a child, just because my father is allowed or may deem it good discipline. I wouldn't want a tiger to feed me what it eats, or even try to groom/lick me either, as a child that doesn't know them, or one that trusts and knows them well. Why should a cat tolerate a human touching it, let alone swatting it, spanking it, running after and grabbing it? The demands we place on animal species we domesticate and condition to our ways of living can be excessive. We ask too much sometimes; hell, let's be honest, as a species, we demand and expect and destroy too much too often.

Don't spank a cat. Don't swat a cat. Don't grab at or lunge towards a cat. Learn about coexisting with animals first, the mentality and observational skills needed, to pay attention to the environment, to the cat, and to your own actions, being self-aware of your place in that space, how you are conveyed to a cat, or to other people, for starters, since you've lived with people, but haven't owned a cat before.

Are you calm? Are you worked up and anxious? Are you paying attention, or did you just almost step on the cat, or invade their "laying space" or bed, things that justify a swat or scratch out of their own surprise and defense?

It's our job, as humans, to understand what we are first conveying and telling others in our environment. How and when we move or when we're still, how we verbally communicate as well as bodily communicate, and everything we do is communicating to the pets we live with ALL the time. When we are scratched at or swatted, we, the humans, set that behavior somehow. We initiated it, then solidified it, and many months to years are invested to change it once it is a habitual defense or response.

When choosing a first cat, visit the cat rooms of your local rescue multiple times, with a volunteer present who can explain their different personalities, who and what each cat is comfortable with versus wary of, and Take Your Time finding a cat that will be good for a first-time cat owner. Volunteers and staff of animal rescue organizations or cat rescues love answering and helping prospective new cat owners find a good match. They can help teach you the best methods for providing for, caring for, and handling your cat.

Watch them first, how they interact in the cat room, the cats they approach, versus the ones they wait to have approach them, and the cats that stay in their house/cubby or on the chair or counter or window seat, without showing initial interest in someone they know, let alone you, a stranger, entering the room. Waiting, watching, and listening can teach you more than those You Tube videos you've "researched" thus far. Observe.

Then, process what you would expect of a cat, what kind of home you would bring them to, a house, versus an apartment, versus a closed bedroom in a shared space with roommates, and what stimuli they would have to accustom themselves to, be it a kid visiting, neighborhood cats outside, loud local noises like barking dogs or a nearby landing strip, etc. You don't want an outgoing cat if it has to be confined to a small space with just you for company, Borrrring. You don't want a scaredy cat if it must live in a large house within a loud neighborhood near the airport.

How's that for clinical research?

I very rarely use any kind of physical discipline on my cats. As jennyr does, if Asha is on my lap and oversteps the mark (in her case it's usually threatening the dogs ) I will very occasionally give her a light tap on the nose, usually accompanied by a firm 'no'. The other thing I might do is calmly and gently put her off my lap and ignore her for a minute. This gives her time to decompress, but also gives a clear message that nice things stop if she makes the wrong choice. With all the cats I've had, I find calm but firm vocal reprimands to be discipline enough. Often a pointed 'excuse me' or 'ahem' accompanied by a stern look is all it takes.

If a cat is determinedly going somewhere forbidden (ie, kitchen counter) I just gently remove them. If I can't reach to pick them up properly, I will carefully scruff them until I can move them more comfortably. I honestly find that gentle, calm persistence is the best and most effective way to teach cats the house rules. You just have to be very clear in your own mind what is and isn't ok, and to be very 'black and white' when teaching the rules. Cats can't learn if the boundaries keep changing.

My area of education is animal behavior. Physical discipline is NEVER going to work. In order for a cat to begin to understand the discipline is linked to a behavior the discipline would have to occur instantly upon the behavior. Say you are in the kitchen , the cat jumps on the counter, you call her name, she turns and you 'tap' her on the nose. What does she link that discipline with? She links it with turning toward you when you call her name.

Physical discipline is counter productive and cane lead to a cat who is afraid of you etc. it can lead to a cat feeling threatened who will bite scratch or just hide. Cats are VERY prone to stress related disease.

Please read books about cat behavior . If you have a cat with behavior problems I rec. a book called 'Starting from Scratch'  by Pamela Johnson- Bennet. There are many others.

Physical discipline is abusive. Important to remember that unlike dogs , cats are not finally tuned to please humans( it is also not ok the use physical 'discipline against a dog).Cats have a huge survival instinct and hurting them will result in a fearful cat. Please be patient and learn about feline behavior . That will give you the understanding of why cats engage in behaviors. Once you have an understanding of that you can work on behaviors in a positive way that will build the bond between you