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post #31 of 51
I heard it at 2AM yesterday morning(roughly) and I actually jumped out of bed and was just so happy! Finally they have caught the b*st*rd.

post #32 of 51
A medical exam is SOP. In addition to medical reasons, the look in the mouth WAS to look for concealed items and to take DNA swabs. You'll notice that the doc was looking through his hair, too. That was partially to check for lice and to look for concealed contraband. In addition, reports say that he bumped his head, during the capture so, I'm sure that the doc was checking that out. You can rest assured that there were parts of that exam, that WEREN'T shown on TV. The doc was wearing rubber gloves, for a good reason.

Saddam Hussein is going to be the best cared-for and protected prisoner, in history. Nobody wants anything to happen to him, before the Iraqi people can try him and dish out his just desserts.
post #33 of 51
Kudos to the US forces for pulling this! It's an amazing fit - liks finding that needle in the haystack That soldier who was smart enough to actually move away the pile of rubbish and check underneath it deservers a medal for being both smart and dedicated!

I must say though that I didn't like seeing those pictures of him humiliated like this. Yes, I know he's a brutal and cruel man and that's putting it mildly. Still, he was put on show like some animal. If this was a medical exam, I would think he deserves some privacy. Again, he may be the worst person on the face of the earth - I still think his captors should have adhered to basic medical ethics and kept his examination private. They could have release a different film snip - other than this medical exam. Don't get me wrong - I don't feel sorry for him. I just think this something us enlighntened people should respect even if he doesn't. Also, I think it may have made some people feel sorry for him - which he doesn't derseve.

And I agree with those that said he doesn't look good. I would think 3 months being stuck in a hole underground is enough to drive anyone insane. Many mental patients lose the need and/or ability to groom themselves. That's what I was thinking when I saw him. He not only had not shaved or had his hair cut (that's understandable under the circumstances) - it looks like he also hadn't brushed or combed his hair in ages.
post #34 of 51
Yeah he REALLY did look pathetic... I felt sorry for him for about one second then I got over it when I saw a clip of Kurdish residents of northern Iraq unearthing yet another mass grave of 3,000 civilians, including women and children. Watching the Kurds dig up their loved ones breaks my heart to this day. I don't think It is possible for me to feel sorry for Saddam ever again..not even for a sec...

post #35 of 51
Quote:
residents of northern Iraq unearthing yet another mass grave of 3,000 civilians
These are always so distressing and saddening. From all estimates Saddam has killed more people than all but the two greatest mass murderers in history: Hitler (~12 million) and Stalin (~20 million).

George
post #36 of 51
Heard on the radio this morning that Saddam will probably be tried for the death penalty by the tribunal DUH! If any person deserves it, he does, and by his own people. Sweet justice!

But they also said that while he was cooperative when captured, after rest and cleaning up he has returned to being arrogant and uncooperative.

I have to say, though, I love the reported dialogue that happened when he was captured.

Saddam reported said, in English, "My name is Saddam Hussein. I am the President of Iraq. I wish to negotiate."

To which one of the 4th Infantry Soldiers replied, "President Bush sends his regards."
post #37 of 51
I just saw on CNN that now all the politically correct Johny come latelies are running in to claim the UN or some mixed international tribunal should run the trial for Saddam, and Iraq shouldn't be in charge and the US shouldn't be involved at all. They're also saying that the death penalty should NOT be an option????!!!!!

George
post #38 of 51
In the wake of 911, I'm truly grateful that we have such a courageous president leading our country ....not to mention capturing the world's most horrifying dictator in our life time ....
post #39 of 51
Quote:
In the wake of 911, I'm truly grateful that we have such a courageous president leading our country ....not to mention capturing the world's most horrifying dictator in our life time ....
I couldn't agree more.

George
post #40 of 51
Thread Starter 
And I hope that the capture of Bin Laden isn't too far behind. That is one person I will have absolutely no sympathy for.
post #41 of 51
BUT- even the Bush administration has been forced to admit that there is no proven connection between the 9/11 attacks and Saddam Hussein, Fox news notwithstanding. While everybody can rejoice that a ruthless dictator will finally be brought to justice, it's silly to expect that Saddam will have to atone for the destruction of the WTC. Mission unaccomplished.
post #42 of 51
I can't help but notice that whatever ANYONE says here, some people here aren't particularly rejoicing in Saddams capture.

I agree that his capture doesn't solve all of our problems, particularly the Bin Laden issue, but good God people, the American Military just found one of the worlds most brutal and malicious dictators of all time!!

I'm getting so annoyed reading how he isn't connected to 9/11 etc. So what??? He tortured and murdered Thousands of his own people, gassed the Kurds....he deserves everything he gets!!!!
post #43 of 51
Quote:
Originally posted by dtolle
I can't help but notice that whatever ANYONE says here, some people here aren't particularly rejoicing in Saddams capture.

I agree that his capture doesn't solve all of our problems, particularly the Bin Laden issue, but good God people, the American Military just found one of the worlds most brutal and malicious dictators of all time!!

I'm getting so annoyed reading how he isn't connected to 9/11 etc. So what??? He tortured and murdered Thousands of his own people, gassed the Kurds....he deserves everything he gets!!!!
Not trying to be a holy roller or anything but...AMEN SISTER!! I hear you!
post #44 of 51
ANY time, that a bad guy is brought down, it is a cause for rejoicing.

As for who should try him - obviously the people against whom he committed his crimes. June 30 is the scheduled date, to hand off the governing of Iraq, to the Iraqi Governing Council. They have already stated that they WILL hold a public trial and Saddam WILL be executed, on July 1.

The provisional government has suspended the death penalty but, the Iraqis can reinstate it, at their pleasure. Saddam will soon join his predecessors - Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, Idi Amin and "Papa Doc" Duvalier - in Hell!
post #45 of 51
IMO, the Iraqis should try him, but with some support/advice/guidance from the US, Britain and their allies. I don't believe there was anything that could be described as an independent justice system under his dictatorship, so I wonder how experienced the Iraqis trying him will be. I don't want him to be turned over to the international tribunal in The Hague, because the death penalty isn't an option there. And what's going on with Milosevic? That is taking forever, and he deserves pretty much the same fate Saddam does. My husband still says Ceaucescu (sp?) got off too easy when the Romanians lined him and his wife up against a wall and shot them - he thinks they should have rotted in a Romanian prison. He has a point there.
I'm not in the least bit unhappy about Saddam being toppled and then captured, but it really disturbs me that some people still seem to believe that he was in some way connected with 9/11. He should be held accountable for his own crimes, not bin Laden's, i.e., he's not the latter's whipping boy.
post #46 of 51
Quote:
Originally posted by dtolle
I can't help but notice that whatever ANYONE says here, some people here aren't particularly rejoicing in Saddams capture.

I thought that I had posted in this thread last night, but I guess I hit the wrong button.

I have not seen a single example of what you are talking about. I don't think anyone here is unpleased that Hussein was captured. Any 'negative' posts relate to what his capture as well as the whole Iraq adventure has meant, and what his capture will mean in the future.

Going into Iraq to remove Hussein because he was a brutal dictator would have been IMO a worthy goal all by itself. But some people are forgetting that we invaded Iraq initially to save the world from weapons of mass destruction, and in an implied way, continue the pursuit of the people responsible for 9-11. The removal of this brutal thug only became mission #1 when the other items didn't pan out.

Not all that long ago, when Clinton & Blair convinced NATO to go after Milosevic, as he was pursuing a policy of removing anyone from the former Jugoslavia who was not Serbian, the UN would not sanction it and Republicans in congress as well as the talking heads pi$$ed and moaned that Milosevic was not a thread to the US, and therefore, did not require our involvement. IMO, Milosevic was a greater threat than Hussein ever was, because he was a) very intelligent and probably crazy b) had his people behind him and c) was a white European on a continent that has historically tended to look the other way when their brethren have gotten frisky.(See the 1930's.)
The evidence presented by the World Court has certainly shown him guilty of great atrocities, as do the mass graves they are digging up still in the Balkans. And in that case, NATO, even without actuak jurisdiction decided to attack because of what was happening to the victimes there, not for an assortment of reasons yet to proven a la Iraq.

As a New Yorker, who saw the Towers burn and one collapse while looking through a window, not watching CNN, I believe that OBL and his number 2 guy who remain at large still represent the greatest threat to the US. OBL is not only smart & extremely wealthy, but he is committed to an insane world vision that does not include the American way. I don't think that Hussein in a million years could have pulled off the attacks of 9-11; his main goal was to be the shark in his own pond, live as well as possible and have as many mistresses as possible. Compared to OBL, Hussein couldn't organize a 1 car wedding.

I'm very glad for the Iraqis and the Middle East that Hussein was captured and even gladder that his 2 sociopathic sons are dead.But I don't feel a bit safer and will not, until Bin Laden and his cohort are killed or captured.As jcat said, 'mission unaccomplished".

And I also have to comment on the remarks that we were so lucky to have GWB as president when 9-11 occurred. What the heck do you think anyone else as president (Jimmy Carter being the sole exception)would have done? When terrorists bombed those two US embassies in Africa, tragically killing so many local citizens, & Clinton responded by bombing an Al Qaeda training base in Afghanistan, and 2 other sites in countries known to support terrorism, all he received was criticism from the Republicans. When Reagan decided to bomb Libya during his administration and hit Khaddafi's home, I didn't criticize that: it certainly seemed to change Mr. Khaddafi's mind about future activities.

Post Pearl Harbor, FDR addressed the American people within 24 hours of the attack; it took Bush more than a week (other than I believe a 2 minute statement made after the attacks that said nothing) to deliver his address. I think that Bush did as best as his could post-9-11, but he didn't act as a miracle worker. The fact that Afghanistan is now falling prey to its warlords & the Taliban once again, because we diverted our military interests to Iraq, is proof of that alone.
post #47 of 51
Thread Starter 
Lucia, you have made a very good statement and a lot of good points there. And I totally agree with you. I love reading your posts, they are so intelligent and well thought out.
post #48 of 51
PLEASE don't tell me that you actually consider Clinton to have been a model military leader! After terrorist attacks on US interests abroad, he ordered mere token bombing runs which obviously did NOTHING to dissuade OBL and Al Quaeda from attacking Americans on our own soil. In fact, Clinton was offered OBL on a platter - he was in custody in another country (forgive me, I forget which one), but he didn't consider him a thread to the United States, even though it was known that he was the leader of Al Quaeda and that his group was responsible for terror attacks on US interests.

The difference is that Bush took the terror attacks seriously enough to put his butt, and our military on the line and really GO AFTER the terrorists where they hid. That is why I am thankful, like Kim, that we had someone strong enough to do something beyond a token bomb run.

I heard the sound bite this morning from Kofi Annan, leading of the UN, saying that he opposes any possibility of the death penalty for Saddam Hussein.

BTW, the London Telegraph published a document found by the new Iraq Officials which, if authenticated, does in fact tie Saddam to Al Quaeda and 9/11. Hmmm, for some reason it isn't being reported at all here in the US, as even a possibility of being authentic.
post #49 of 51
Quote:
Originally posted by dtolle
I can't help but notice that whatever ANYONE says here, some people here aren't particularly rejoicing in Saddams capture.

I agree that his capture doesn't solve all of our problems, particularly the Bin Laden issue, but good God people, the American Military just found one of the worlds most brutal and malicious dictators of all time!!

I'm getting so annoyed reading how he isn't connected to 9/11 etc. So what??? He tortured and murdered Thousands of his own people, gassed the Kurds....he deserves everything he gets!!!!
Sorry, but I have to agree with some of Lucia's sentiments. I say that yes, it's a good thing he got captured. That's as far as I will go. I'm not going to go dancing the streets because his capture is a further symbolic and significant show that his dictatorship is over and that he is indeed vulnerable to the people of Iraq. Hopefully this act will mean something more to them than the conflict. And I'll leave dancing and rejoicing for the Iraqis. They're the only people in my opinion who can truly appreciate the removal of Saddam Hussein. I can individually breathe a small sigh of relief and be happy that some good, (hopefully), has been done.

Quote:
Originally posted by valanhb
BTW, the London Telegraph published a document found by the new Iraq Officials which, if authenticated, does in fact tie Saddam to Al Quaeda and 9/11. Hmmm, for some reason it isn't being reported at all here in the US, as even a possibility of being authentic.
So far in the latest Gulf Conflict, British Intelligence does not have a good reputation. They've had an inquiry into the articles of intelligence and it was found that details had been exaggerated. One particular man was made the scapegoat, (I can't remember his name), and was blamed for most or all of it and felt that his career had been ruined beyond repair and committed suicide.

I do hope that for the reputation of the British Intelligence that these new pieces of information are true. I'm sorry if I seem to be ignoring the tragedy of 9/11 but the whole aim of this Gulf Conflict was to remove Weapons of Mass Destruction. So far, none had been found. And even if, Saddam Hussein is linked to 9/11 then so be it. That will not change the aim of the conflict. That will not change what USA, Britain and Australia all argued for to the UN.
post #50 of 51
Quote:
Originally posted by valanhb
The difference is that Bush took the terror attacks seriously enough to put his butt, and our military on the line and really GO AFTER the terrorists where they hid. That is why I am thankful, like Kim, that we had someone strong enough to do something beyond a token bomb run.
With all due respect, if 9-11 had happened on Clinton's watch, he would have responded as strongly if not more. It's ludicrous for anyone to assume that he would have done nothing in response to a direct attack on America, which had not occured since Pearl Harbor. Al Gore was even more conservative than Clinton on military matters. How did Bush put his butt on the line in Afghanistan? The only negative consequence to him would have been if he had done nothing at all. The current declining state of affairs in afghanistan is diminishing quite a bit of that success and may well lead to the resurgence of the Taliban. The only guy with his butt really on the line in Afghanistan right now is its President, Hamid Karzhid, who keeps begging the US for the assistance it promised to him & the Afghan people. I'm curious as to which country had OBL in custody, offering him to the Americans. The Saudis would not have given him up to us, the Taliban would not. There were reports that I read that his location had been identified at one point (somewhere in Afghanistan) but before military action could be taken, he was already tipped off and was gone.

Quote:
Originally posted by valanhb

BTW, the London Telegraph published a document found by the new Iraq Officials which, if authenticated, does in fact tie Saddam to Al Quaeda and 9/11. Hmmm, for some reason it isn't being reported at all here in the US, as even a possibility of being authentic. .
I'm not sure if you are referring to the reports that a single Al Qaeda agent met with Iraqis, which doesnt prove much of anything to me. OBL viewed Hussein as a cancer on Islam. He would have killed him
where he stood had he pulled him out of a hole, not embraced him as a kindred soul.
post #51 of 51
Saddam's capture is paying off: documents found with him are leading US troops to insurgents and major round-ups are taking place.

Saddam himself remains defiant. Last night, on 60 Minutes a member of the Iraqi Governing Council was interviewed. He and several others had a session, with Saddam and questioned him about the thousands of deaths that he ordered. Saddam's response was that they were all "thieves and deserters". When asked about gassing that Kurdish village, he blamed it on Iran.

According to Paul Bremer, one wall of Saddam's room features a poster of all of the top-and high-ranking officials, killed or captured. This includes his own spawn, Qusay and Uday. On another wall, is a large portrait of President Bush. Psy-ops, at its best!
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