Debating trying raw feeding...not sure where to start

I've been thinking about raw feeding Asha since I rescued her a month ago (dumped at a farm as a kitten, only showed herself a month ago. Approx 9-10 months old). I'm confused, anxious and have lots of questions.

The biggest anxiety is that I tried partial raw feeding with my dogs 4 years ago (commercially frozen tripe and the odd fresh lamb bone from the butcher as a supplement to a good quality kibble - just to see what they made of it). Both dogs ended up with raging diarrhoea, one was vomiting too, and it really freaked me out.

That aside, I'm finding it hard to know where to start. It seems sensible to start out with a ready made complete raw food to see if Asha likes it. Unfortunately, I'm in the uk and the choice of ready made raw is very limited - made more so by my desire to avoid fish and large animals (trying to stay closer to what a cat would naturally eat...also Asha reacts badly to beef, which makes me wary of lamb too). Most of the ready made foods are chicken based (often chicken and...), with some duck, turkey and rabbit available too. I read somewhere that chicken isn't ideal due to lower taurine levels than other meats - does that actually matter in a 'complete' food? The easiest brand to get is nature's menu (can buy locally), with purrform and nutriment being the other brands I can find online. Does anyone have any knowledge/experience of these brands? Freeze dried raw is non existent except for treats.

I can find a wide variety of high quality made for pet food ground meats (ground with the bone and pretty much any poultry or game bird you can name,as well as rabbit and hare...both with and without organ meat), frozen raw chunks of poultry, hearts and liver, and supplements are easy to get hold of. I can also source a frankenprey type diet but I'm definitely not ready to go that far (committed veggie with vegan tendencies )

I suppose I'm just saying I don't know where to start!

Currently, Asha is fed 100% wet (she doesn't recognise kibble as food ), and the food is all grain free, and typically 89-95% meat, so raw shouldn't be too big a shock to her.

Thanks for reading. I'm sorry if this isn't very clear..it probably reflects my state of mind

Columbine,

That's so nice of you to have rescued Asha and that you are now so concerned about taking another step with her diet.

I agree raw feeding can be a bit confusing, I spent two months researching info before I gradually switched over to mostly commercial raw. 

I viewed the three companies available to you in the UK. All seem fine as far as commercial raw products. Although I have not had any experience using any of those brands (since I live in the US), if I were in your situation, I would consider Nature's Menu or Purrform.  The latter seems to offer single protein rabbit, if you are concerned about chicken, however, I have not read anything to suggest that chicken contains less taurine.  These companies are supplementing anyway.  The concern about chicken is that some cats are allergic to the protein.  But both companies seem fine, I wouldn't have any hesitation with either.  Maybe begin with Nature's Menu since it's available from your local retailer.   It looks like this site (TCS) has some reviews based on this Google search (reviews, NM):

https://www.google.com/search?q=reviews+nature's+menu&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

And Purrform is listed on the feline-nutrition.org site:

https://www.google.com/search?q=reviews+purrform&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

The Nutriment site looks fine although I agree, I stay away from fish and beef as well.

If it were me (and not having cats that were allergic to chicken), I would start with  NM since since it's already complete and balanced, see how Asha likes it, then maybe try Purrform.  See how that goes for a bit and then you could go onto the ground meats and get the necessary supplements. Or maybe others will tell you to just jump into the pool with the ground meats / supps.  

I'm sure you'll do fine. I would not have any reservations with either NM or PF. Good luck, keep us posted.

Hi Columbine, we own a HUGE black and white cat (Bootsy). He has reluctantly been shipped with us from our farm in New Zealand to the sweltering heat of Queensland Australia. Due to the bad judgement of a vet and different climates, he developed a rodent ulcer and we have had to change his diet. My new vet told ne to keep him off fish of any sort forever,so we now give him raw chopped chicken for breakfast and raw chopped topside beef for dinner. In between meals he has more of the same! He is not overweight, just a large animal, but he weighs nearly 9 kilos. He was so used to running all over a farm and catching rabbits and mice that I think he was used to the raw food. However we have notice that since eating only raw food and no dry or biscuit type foods, his coat is glossy, his teeth are strong nad he purrs constantly. He is now 11 years old and looks great. I only buy fresh chicken breasts from the butcher for him as they are not only organic but very cheap here. The beef costs me roughly $6 for 6 meals of 100grams each which I chop up and freeze til needed. Hope this helps!

Thanks so much for your responses. I know I might be asking questions that have obvious answers, but I just want to do things as safely as possible and get it right. Mum says I'm acting like a mother with her first child when it comes to Asha

L lisamarie12 Thanks for those links - reviews cam help so much in making decisions...especially when jumping into the unknown.

luluwantsastone I'm glad Bootsy is doing so well. It certainly helps me relax a little about raw being safe. Just a point...from what I've read, plain raw meat needs supplementation to create a properly balanced diet. I'm sure others know far better than me, but I wouldn't feel right not saying anything.

Columbine said:

Thanks so much for your responses. I know I might be asking questions that have obvious answers, but I just want to do things as safely as possible and get it right. Mum says I'm acting like a mother with her first child when it comes to Asha

@LisaMarie12 Thanks for those links - reviews cam help so much in making decisions...especially when jumping into the unknown.

@Luluwantsastone I'm glad Bootsy is doing so well. It certainly helps me relax a little about raw being safe. Just a point...from what I've read, plain raw meat needs supplementation to create a properly balanced diet. I'm sure others know far better than me, but I wouldn't feel right not saying anything.

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Sure Columbine, but of course you would have lots of questions and no questions are too obvious or can be asked too many times, especially when delving into new dietary territory.

Definitely any raw, other than commercially supplemented raw or whole prey diets, must be properly supplemented otherwise the diet is nutritionally deficient and not complete and balanced.

No doubt others with more experience can chime in on this point.

If or when you do transition, the key will be to introduce the new food gradually, so as not to cause digestive upset.  Even the best of new foods can cause digestive problems -- too much too soon. Maybe 7-10 days ideally.  The first few days, just a few bites of raw, then e.g., 25% of the new food with 75% of the canned food Asha is currently eating for another couple of days, then 50% / 50%, etc.  You know your cats' digestive habits best, however, err on the side of less is more to transition rather than making an abrupt switch. 

Thank you Asha got the ok for spaying today - the op is next wed. I think I'll start transitioning once she's recovered (don't want to take any chances until she's spayed, especially as digestive issues have been one block in getting to this point). I'll go with nature's menu complete nuggets to start with. They recommend just offering one nugget alongside the regular wet food until the cat happily eats the raw, and then do a gradual switch over a couple of weeks. I'm hopeful that it won't be too big a shock to her system - I think I feed the next best to raw now - high quality, low carb, high meat etc etc. :cross: that I'm right.

Columbine said:

I'll go with nature's menu complete nuggets to start with. They recommend just offering one nugget alongside the regular wet food until the cat happily eats the raw, and then do a gradual switch over a couple of weeks. I'm hopeful that it won't be too big a shock to her system - I think I feed the next best to raw now - high quality, low carb, high meat etc etc.

that I'm right.

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NM recommends starting with one nugget alongside the canned food and then a gradual transition? I personally would be a bit hesitant to begin with one entire nugget as that seems too much, in my humble opinion. I would start with maybe a slice of a nugget, equivalent to one teaspoon. I would do that for several days and then gradually increase to one nugget and thereafter continue with a slow addition.  That's great you've been feeding a  meat based, grain-free, low carb diet. You can always do a combo as well, it doesn't have to be all or nothing - I still feed about 25% canned although the goal is to decrease the canned. But there are others who do combos. See what works best, it can take time, months even - to figure it out. There is no deadline.

Duly noted That's what's so great here - people can pick up on problems before I create them

I suppose it's possible NM nuggets are smaller than some US brands...For an 8lb cat, they recommend 34 nuggets a day. No idea if that's more, less or average than other brands. Haven't seen them myself yet so no idea about size.

Oh sorry, yes definitely those NM nuggets must be much smaller than the nuggets we get here. One brand of commercial raw nuggets is about 5 per day for a 10 lb cat, I think. I use raw "bites" so I measure per cup.

That makes sense now.

Hi Columbine,

I agree with your comment about supplements and forgot to add in my thread that my strange cat also loves vegetables that are lightly steamed - I dont think I have found a food that he does not like yet! I just try to get the balance right and feed him little and often as he is getting older.

Well...Nature's Menu do a freeze dried version of their frozen raw. Ridiculously expensive, but the company say they can be rehydrated and fed like the frozen raw, and that they are a complete food. (I started another thread about them whilst waiting to hear back from the manufacturer).

They only come in 40g bags (roughly 1.5oz), so definitely not a long term option. Anyway I got 1 bag of chicken and rabbit and 1 bag of chicken and duck. Asha loves them No digestive upsets either. I went a bit too quickly (bad mummy) and just fed as one of her meals to see what she thought. So pleased they went down (and came out again) well.

Now I just have to convince dad that raw feeding isn't going to poison anyone (namely him ). I haven't told him about the freeze dried being raw...

That's wonderful Columbine. I'm sorry the FD is so expensive, however, I think in some cases it can be a terrific way to begin raw feeding. At some point maybe you will be trying different types of raw feeding that are more cost effective, maybe you will have a little FD as a backup. Whatever you decide to do, there is no rush or deadline to hurry up and get Asha on your ideal raw diet. Very happy to hear she finds the FD palatable. Practicing safe handling guidelines when dealing with raw meat, whether for your kitty or human consumption is the best way to reduce any risk of harmful pathogen contamination, which I'm sure others have already pointed out. Good luck.

I know there's no safety issues with raw so long as you respect the product. Dad's just a bit of a germaphobe (if thats even a word ).
I do most of the cooking, and I swear to god that he lives in fear of me giving him food poisoning
I'm a long time veggie and am paranoid about safe practice when handling raw meat, so I can't actually see it being a problem.

Freeze dried raw really hasn't caught on over here, for cats or dogs. Don't know why. For my situation it would be the ideal solution, but the cost difference is crazy - £3.25 for 40g freeze dried vs £2.45 for 400 frozen.

Found a uk company making freeze dried raw cat food It's not available yet - they're going through the final stages of DEFRA testing (regulatory body), but should be on the market in a few weeks. They're emailing me when it's on sale. Only one flavour as yet - chicken and turkey - but it's still great to have that option.

Freeze dried commercial raw food is definitely an easy and convenient way to try out raw feeding.  Has worked out well at our house so far whereas a couple experiments with frozen commercial raw weren't so appealing to the cats at this point.  I'm not moving beyond commercial foods right now but may in the future.

Keep in mind in comparing frozen to freeze dried weights that with the frozen you're paying for the weight of the water, whereas with the freeze dried you are not (but will instead provide your own water).  That doesn't erase the dramatic difference you noted a couple of posts up, but once you have a UK-produced freeze dried food option the price difference shouldn't be very big.

It's the convenience of freeze dried that appeals to me. I just know I'll have trouble remembering to get frozen out to defrost at some point (my memory is hopeless these days). Cost isn't a huge object - I'm more concerned about giving quality and species appropriate food. I also think my germaphobe dad will be more easily talked round to freeze dried than frozen (I will probably feed a version of what I think is best anyway...I'd just prefer not to make him uncomfortable in the process). Plus, I already know Asha likes freeze dried raw.

@Columbine  Have you read catinfo.org? I learned from there how to make cat food for my cat who never could tolerate any cat food, canned/dry/ anything. Only raw or cooked meats. I bought a little grinder and all the supplements on amazon and he has done incredibly well. I make mine with either chicken or turkey. I follow the recipe exactly as written, its under making cat food. It is cheaper than buying other raw food but mostly its because my cat could never handle actual cat food. The recipe and the whole site is written by Dr. Pierson.

Yes, I've referred to that site a lot I'm really not up for grinding my own meat (long time veggie and hate handling raw meat). Even if I move on to making my own, I'll use ready ground and chunked meat sold specifically for raw feeding (over here, all meat sold for raw pet food has to be regularly tested free of salmonella and other major bugs. The same cannot be said for meat sold for cooking -butcher's etc). At the moment, all I can cope with is pre made - frozen is relatively easy to get round here...its just freeze dried that's harder. Let's just say I'm going into this with baby steps

Quick question - I just fed Asha the last of the freeze dried treats/complete food. I misjudged the quantity and she left some. Is it safe to refrigerate and feed the rest later on? I rehydrated with hot water, and it was in the fridge within 30mins of making.