Need some help!

scootermac

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Backstory: During the cold snap (below-zero up here) around New Years, a small black cat (who we'd seen off and on in the neighborhood since last Spring) started to appear on our porch to eat.  We put out a box and towel for her, because of the temperatures, and once she let me, I sat outside with her while she nibbled and she eventually crawled into my lap and let me pet her.  The next night (NYE) we opened the door to feed her and she came trotting in like she owned the place. Long story short, we corralled her in a spare room away from the three resident cats while we tried to find her owner (unsuccessful).  We took her to the vet to see if she was chipped, and since she wasn't, we wormed her and got her vaccinated and scheduled for a spay. She is estimated to be 2-3 years of age, and we have no idea how long she was outside, but she was obviously someone's cat at some point in the past (she knows about litter boxes and scratching posts).  The vet told us (after she was de-wormed) that it was fine to let her meet the other cats, as she was desperately trying to get out of the room already and she was doing well interacting with my and hubster. 

Other cats are 8 (female), 4 (male), and 3 (female).  The 8-year-old is the head honcho (though the 4 year old gets a little uppity at times and has to be reminded of this), and she is very protective of "her" cats - just ask my parents' dog!  

We started by letting the cats see each other through a small crack in the door (we'd already done the towel-switching-scents and all that good stuff), and once we felt it was safe, we started letting the door open so she could investigate.  The 3-year-old is naturally skittish and hid, the 4-year-old was very curious (but she wanted nothing to do with him), and the 8-year-old was content to just watch.  They had a few scuffles (our poor 8-year-old got herself a bloody nose one night after stalking the newcomer into a corner), but nothing serious.  She was only allowed out with supervision, because we weren't sure how she'd react or how they'd react.  

A few weeks ago, it was time for her spay surgery.  Apparently, she was in heat (though she acted no different than she had the entire time she'd been inside - was she in heat the entire time?) and the surgery was more complicated than they anticipated, complete with sutures and 10 days in a cone of shame.  She handled herself more gracefully than I would've, though she swatted at us a few times during the recovery process which I chalked up to a combination of pain/cone/sudden movements startling her due to lack of peripheral vision.  The whole time she was coned, she was still trying to get out around the other cats.  Once she was de-sutured and de-coned, we let her back out, but she and the other cats are still struggling to acclimate with each other.  If one of the other cats walks across the floor, or the back of a couch, she wants to chase it. If she's sitting still being good, the other cats want to sniff her, and get whapped once she realizes they're there.  Occasionally, the 8-year-old will take a swing at her, but usually the new girl is the aggressor.  The new girl has even started to nip/swat at hubster and myself again since being back allowed out of "her room".  She is still only allowed out with supervision, because I worry something will happen when we're not there to break it up.

So, all of that to ask this question: How can I achieve some sort of normalcy in my house again?  How do I get the new girl to quit chasing and/or attacking the other cats? How do I get my resident cats to be comfortable around the new girl?  All of my other cats I've had since they were very young, and integrating has never really been an issue as we've added critters, but none of them have had the new girl's "baggage".  Mostly, I just don't want anyone getting hurt. Is it possible to integrate an older stray into a multi-cat household, or are we out of our minds?

Any help is appreciated!!
 

StefanZ

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Backstory: During the cold snap (below-zero up here) around New Years, a small black cat (who we'd seen off and on in the neighborhood since last Spring) started to appear on our porch to eat.  We put out a box and towel for her, because of the temperatures, and once she let me, I sat outside with her while she nibbled and she eventually crawled into my lap and let me pet her.  The next night (NYE) we opened the door to feed her and she came trotting in like she owned the place. Long story short, we corralled her in a spare room away from the three resident cats while we tried to find her owner (unsuccessful).  We took her to the vet to see if she was chipped, and since she wasn't, we wormed her and got her vaccinated and scheduled for a spay. She is estimated to be 2-3 years of age, and we have no idea how long she was outside, but she was obviously someone's cat at some point in the past (she knows about litter boxes and scratching posts).  The vet told us (after she was de-wormed) that it was fine to let her meet the other cats, as she was desperately trying to get out of the room already and she was doing well interacting with my and hubster. 

Other cats are 8 (female), 4 (male), and 3 (female).  The 8-year-old is the head honcho (though the 4 year old gets a little uppity at times and has to be reminded of this), and she is very protective of "her" cats - just ask my parents' dog!  

We started by letting the cats see each other through a small crack in the door (we'd already done the towel-switching-scents and all that good stuff), and once we felt it was safe, we started letting the door open so she could investigate.  The 3-year-old is naturally skittish and hid, the 4-year-old was very curious (but she wanted nothing to do with him), and the 8-year-old was content to just watch.  They had a few scuffles (our poor 8-year-old got herself a bloody nose one night after stalking the newcomer into a corner), but nothing serious.  She was only allowed out with supervision, because we weren't sure how she'd react or how they'd react.  

A few weeks ago, it was time for her spay surgery.  Apparently, she was in heat (though she acted no different than she had the entire time she'd been inside - was she in heat the entire time?) and the surgery was more complicated than they anticipated, complete with sutures and 10 days in a cone of shame.  She handled herself more gracefully than I would've, though she swatted at us a few times during the recovery process which I chalked up to a combination of pain/cone/sudden movements startling her due to lack of peripheral vision.  The whole time she was coned, she was still trying to get out around the other cats.  Once she was de-sutured and de-coned, we let her back out, but she and the other cats are still struggling to acclimate with each other.  If one of the other cats walks across the floor, or the back of a couch, she wants to chase it. If she's sitting still being good, the other cats want to sniff her, and get whapped once she realizes they're there.  Occasionally, the 8-year-old will take a swing at her, but usually the new girl is the aggressor.  The new girl has even started to nip/swat at hubster and myself again since being back allowed out of "her room".  She is still only allowed out with supervision, because I worry something will happen when we're not there to break it up.

So, all of that to ask this question: How can I achieve some sort of normalcy in my house again?  How do I get the new girl to quit chasing and/or attacking the other cats? How do I get my resident cats to be comfortable around the new girl?  All of my other cats I've had since they were very young, and integrating has never really been an issue as we've added critters, but none of them have had the new girl's "baggage".  Mostly, I just don't want anyone getting hurt. Is it possible to integrate an older stray into a multi-cat household, or are we out of our minds?

Any help is appreciated!!
How is she swating?  claws out or hard swatch but soft paw?

Soft paw is sign she essentially accepts them, this is how they teach these belonging in the family group.

A little unusual situation.   Rescued shy homeless usually adapt to the residents.  No ironclad rule, but on average, compared with an average bought adult cat.

She perhaps was a matriark of her earlier pack.  Or by any reason, forced to high defensive preparedness...

I shall reread your post and ponder a little longer.

OK, I see she wasnt really shy, although homeless some time...

I think I would suggest a Feliway diffuser for now, to make everyone feel more at ease, more harmonious.  This may be the trick...

She was apparently one of those who had silent heats, almost unnoticeable for humans, but a tom knows for sure...
 
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scootermac

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She is definitely swatting with her claws out, lots of noise.  When the other cats walk around, she makes a chittering noise I've heard the 3-year-old resident girl use when watching squirrels.  I tell her no, and she (usually) listens, but you can tell she wants more than anything to pounce.

We have a feliway diffuser in her room, as well as the kitchen and living room (the other two rooms she's in when she's out, and where the other cats are most of the time).  I was hoping it would help, but I'm not convinced it's doing much for anyone.  She's had hers for about a month, the others about 2 weeks.

She was very loving and attention-seeking before her surgery, from pretty much the day she came inside, with us humans (not so much with the other cats).  I'm guessing that was her being in heat, because she definitely doesn't like to be handled or petted much since the surgery.  If you get two or three pets in before she swats (claws out) or tries to nip, it's a good petting session.
 

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I would suspect there is something which hadnt healed yet properly. Cats in pains doesnt has the same patience as otherwise, and thus teaching lessons either they are needed or asked for, or not.
 
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scootermac

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I get that, though her surgery was 3 weeks ago. My concern is that she was stalking/attacking the other cats before the surgery as well, and she continues to even with no provocation (or even being on the same side of the room).
 

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I agree that some females want to be the top of the heap, she may be trying to establish her number one level. I also agree that cats DEFINITELY get real 'touchy' and grouchy when they are hurting, and I would bet she is experiencing some pain yet, that was no minor surgery. The other cats have no idea who she was when she came back from the vets, she smelled totally different, so anything that was before the surgery is most likely lost, you have to start all over again with introductions. My Chrissy did a lot of that 'charging' and swatting, she settled down when I made her a place on top of the fridge to escape to. I truly think all you need is patience and time, they will all settle in. As long as she is just swatting and retreating, not actively attacking and rolling around, tearing holes in the others, I think they will all settle down. Mine took a year, and the males started giving her a wide berth and everything was OK! :)
 
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scootermac

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Sometimes she swats and retreats,and other times I catch up and find huge chunks of the other cat's fur on the floor (and on two occasions, a bloody cat - both before surgery).  That's the reason the new one can't be out unsupervised. I feel like time will help, but in the meantime I worry about the others, and about whether the new girl is happy.

She has tons of places to hide, and so do the other cats....she just likes to hunt them if they come out of those places (which is rarer and rarer when she's out, because they don't want to get attacked)
 

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Just saw this thread...we went through a very similar thing with a foster kitten (older -about 8 mo) that we had!! Although we had 5 resident cats at the time & swore we weren't going to add more due to space/costs, but this Foster was so special, sweet, and had been through so much (he'd been born without proper eyelids -although you really couldn't tell just to look at him - so couldn't fully close his eyes & was in constant pain, so our shelter did a kickstarter & raised the money to do a pretty intense surgery -the corners of his mouth were grafted onto his eyelids-as rough as it sounds). So we decided to integrate him & adopt him. Unfortunately the gentle sweetness he'd had before & during his recovery changed quite a bit once he was fully recovered! He was still a riot - a total card with a hoot of a personality we loved- but he changed into an intensely dominant cat who wanted nothing more than to try to rip out guys apart. Even if our 19 year old girl was curled into a ball sleeping, if he spotted her, he'd attack in a full flying leap - all claws fully extended. And it would take both me & my husband to pry him off of ours! And we'd also done a slow introduction.

Long story not too short :) we ended up deciding he'd be best in a single cat household. I'm not saying it's your only option by any means as I certainly know #1, how attached you are by this time & #2, how hard it is to find a new home. I'm just saying that you're definitely not crazy---heat (as well as pain, etc) can alter & soften a kitty's "true" personality. Heat in particular will often cause a cat to be much more loving, not only to other cats, but to humans. That's also not to say she Won't eventually "soften"...towards you & the other kitties.

How long did you work at the "slow intro"? Most people rush that a bit since (understandably) they want the new kitty out with them & integrated into the household as quickly as possible. Sometimes going back & doing it slowly can make a big difference in the long run. And, a certain amount of hierarchical jockeying is going to happen, particularly with a kitty who's had to tough it out on the streets for awhile.

Hopefully this all calms down eventually ----keep us posted!
 
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scootermac

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We introduced them slowly over the course of 3-4 weeks.

I'm not sure what changed, but she's been out with the others since we got home from work Friday. They're still not super thrilled with each other, but they'll all sleep in the same room without attacking/being attacked. New girl has chased them a few times, but no knock-down drag-out brawls like we'd been having. We fell asleep on the couches before putting her to bed Friday night, and we woke around 3am to find her snoozing contentedly on a pillow in front of the fireplace...where she still was the next morning when I woke up! She spent last night out too, since everyone seemed to survive.

So, things aren't perfect, but they seem to be trending in the right direction! *crosses fingers*
 
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scootermac

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Also, I've noticed that she finally understands "no" - she'll look at whoever she was plotting to pounce, and when I tell her no, she looks at me for a second, yawns, and then toddles off to do something else or looks away from her intended target. I'd say she listens about 8 out of 10 times we say it.
 

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Also, I've noticed that she finally understands "no" - she'll look at whoever she was plotting to pounce, and when I tell her no, she looks at me for a second, yawns, and then toddles off to do something else or looks away from her intended target. I'd say she listens about 8 out of 10 times we say it.
Im glad and happy and relieved to hear its going forwards into positive direction, not least, because I although I did gave sympathetic and reasonable answers, I was really stuck, not having any really helping advices.   Which Im supposed to do and to have.   :)

This yawn you mention is interesting.   It can be interpreted here as a sort of "ah, I dont care with that swatting for now, I can as well do something else", but yawn is often used as a token of friendship to their human or a cat pal.  So the lazy cat postures, like yawn and streching on oneself, are often really friendship gestures.
 
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kittychick

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SOOOOO happy to hear that things are headed in the right direction!! And it really sounds like they are - - in a big way!!!!

ANd I'd be THRILLED to get a cat to actually do what I ask 8 out of 10 times :) I think you're making - all of you - huge strides! Kitties often seem to have their own time frame for doing things, no matter how much we work at predicting/manipulating it :) Yeah for you guys!
 
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scootermac

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I think this critter is pretty smart - Lord knows the other three don't listen like that!!  

She spent the weekend out and about, except when we were carrying in groceries, or during breakfast (she still doesn't recognize that other cats have to eat too, so we give the other three a half hour or so to eat undisturbed in the morning).  She's done pretty well, less scuffles each day, and she's decided that a specific layer on the cat tree as well as the pillow in front of the fireplace are "hers".  We also got a birdfeeder to put outside her window, so she has something else to watch and stalk other than the cats :)  

Today is the first day she'll be out when we're at work - here's hoping we come home to 4 live and not-mentally-anguished cats in a few hours!
 
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