Nature's Variety Instinct canned food

reba

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When I told the vet I was only planning on feeding wet food they pooh poohed it - saying that if the cat was vulnerable to crystals the food wouldn't make much difference.  Then I wondered why it's now standard procedure for vets to ask about it if you call because your cat isn't feeling well.  And I can't recall one vet ever posing that question prior to 2000.  Dry food was certainly around before that - so I think it does beg the question of what has changed as far as what they are putting in cat food. 

Anyway I can't see myself making my own raw cat food, but I do wonder why there's not more discussion about the freeze dried raw.  I bring it up because I've been sprinkling it on their food and they love it.  I got some Stella and Chewy's turkey when my cat was first diagnosed with IBD.  It's impossible to get now, but Chewy sent me a bag of primal freeze dried raw turkey for free when they stopped selling S & C's.

I'm thinking about transitioning him to at least one raw meal a day (he gets 3) of the freeze dried turkey.  While he's 100% better than he was, there's still small specks of red blood on his stool.  He gets 1/2 tab of pred a day and slippery elm bark mixed into the other two meals.
 
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catwoman707

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I really wonder about this, too. I wonder about all the additives and fillers in foods. I also wonder partly if there's a difference in diagnoses now and if IBD is being recognized more and better now, at earlier stages, in part because of greater overall awareness of feline nutrition, both on the part of some vets and lots of cat parents.

As an example from the early 2000s: our previous cat most likely had IBD and then lymphoma but multiple vets at the practice we took her to didn't think her initial symptoms (occasional bloody stool, moderately regular hairballs, etc.) were anything to worry about. There wasn't much helpful information to find on the Internet back then, either, (and oh, did I try Googling everything!) and even when our cat's symptoms gradually got worse, the vets there didn't think it was much beyond an idiopathic and not-so-awful colitis. Until, of course, a couple years ago, when a newer, younger vet who was a bit more knowledgeable about cats realized what had gone wrong, when our cat was in her final months. Of course Brooksie's story is much more complicated because she did live a long life (she was at least 17) and had all sorts of other ailments -- mild thyroid problems, not-so-great kidney values, and a very scary arrhythmia that shocked every vet that listened to her heart -- that made her hard to diagnose, particularly for non-cat specialists. I'm pretty certain she was sensitive to a grain -- either corn or wheat -- because her symptoms lessened a lot in her last months after I started her on all grain-free foods.

Sorry, that's so TMI! I guess my point is that I think there might be something going on on the vet side, too, particularly since so many cat parents can now find so much more information on the Internet about IBD and other cat health issues. I wish that had been around when Brooksie was first sick. For our part, we take our new cats to a cat specialist who loves talking about diet!
Never TMI! I wonder the very same things.........I also think it is infact partly the vets who are more recently discovering how common IBD has become, but can't help but believe it has got to do with some of the "okay" and approved for pet food consumption by AAFCO ingredients added.

Manufacturer's main concern is money, which is why alot of the fillers are added in, and AAFCO's guidelines are extremely lienient (SP) with what's fine for pets, unfortunately.

Just think, look at what's happened with humans from consuming all of the antibiotics and steroids given to the animals prior to slaughter.......scary.

@Artiemom  I have a question for you.

Your very first post in this thread, you said you are feeding him NVI and a variety of different kinds, and wonder why your vet didn't tell you to feed a single novel protein due to his suspected IBD.
 

catwoman707

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When I told the vet I was only planning on feeding wet food they pooh poohed it - saying that if the cat was vulnerable to crystals the food wouldn't make much difference.  Then I wondered why it's now standard procedure for vets to ask about it if you call because your cat isn't feeling well.  And I can't recall one vet ever posing that question prior to 2000.  Dry food was certainly around before that - so I think it does beg the question of what has changed as far as what they are putting in cat food. 

Anyway I can't see myself making my own raw cat food, but I do wonder why there's not more discussion about the freeze dried raw.  I bring it up because I've been sprinkling it on their food and they love it.  I got some Stella and Chewy's turkey when my cat was first diagnosed with IBD.  It's impossible to get now, but Chewy sent me a bag of primal freeze dried raw turkey for free when they stopped selling S & C's.

I'm thinking about transitioning him to at least one raw meal a day (he gets 3) of the freeze dried turkey.  While he's 100% better than he was, there's still small specks of red blood on his stool.  He gets 1/2 tab of pred a day and slippery elm bark mixed into the other two meals.
Right.

Another great point.  How vets have become so much more aware of all dry diets for cats, and the issues it can cause, yet years ago it was common knowledge that canned food makes them fat and rotted teeth. 
 

reba

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Just had a friend's cat come down with allergies - that's another symptom I have no memory of before 2000. 

Anyway as much as AAFCO wants to look like a duck and quack like a duck, it's not a regulator and I do wonder where it gets it's funding.   I suppose it's better than nothing and frankly I'm relieved they are giving out grants for toxicity or similar research when it comes to pet foods.

There is a huge source of data out there, pet owners themselves, but you need someone with time, willingness and most importantly funding to collect it.  And there's no need to do the traditional treatment/control group experiments; in fact the reason they made so much progress on childhood cancer was by collecting masses of data on what worked and didn't. 
 
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lisahe

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When I told the vet I was only planning on feeding wet food they pooh poohed it - saying that if the cat was vulnerable to crystals the food wouldn't make much difference.  Then I wondered why it's now standard procedure for vets to ask about it if you call because your cat isn't feeling well.  And I can't recall one vet ever posing that question prior to 2000.  Dry food was certainly around before that - so I think it does beg the question of what has changed as far as what they are putting in cat food. 

Anyway I can't see myself making my own raw cat food, but I do wonder why there's not more discussion about the freeze dried raw.  I bring it up because I've been sprinkling it on their food and they love it.  I got some Stella and Chewy's turkey when my cat was first diagnosed with IBD.  It's impossible to get now, but Chewy sent me a bag of primal freeze dried raw turkey for free when they stopped selling S & C's.
Your first point, Reba, reminds me of how frustrated my mother, who used to work as a dietitian, used to get at doctors who didn't understand much about diet! It's often the same thing with vets. I couldn't believe it when I called our current vet's office to set up our cats' first appointment and they asked what we were planning to feed the cats!

As for freeze-dried raw, I'm not sure if you want to start a new thread about this so I'll just say for now that our cats love it and eat Primal, with S&C garnish 
twice a day.
 
Never TMI! I wonder the very same things.........I also think it is infact partly the vets who are more recently discovering how common IBD has become, but can't help but believe it has got to do with some of the "okay" and approved for pet food consumption by AAFCO ingredients added.

Manufacturer's main concern is money, which is why alot of the fillers are added in, and AAFCO's guidelines are extremely lienient (SP) with what's fine for pets, unfortunately.

Just think, look at what's happened with humans from consuming all of the antibiotics and steroids given to the animals prior to slaughter.......scary.

@Artiemom  I have a question for you.

Your very first post in this thread, you said you are feeding him NVI and a variety of different kinds, and wonder why your vet didn't tell you to feed a single novel protein due to his suspected IBD.
Yes, it's really hard to know about the (potential) side-effects of some of those ingredients.

And to get back to the original questions of this thread, I had wondered, too, about the same question you asked @Artiemom! Meaning that I also would have expected that the vet would have suggested a single novel protein. Or is this because chicken seemed like such a likely culprit?
 
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artiemom

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Never TMI! I wonder the very same things.........I also think it is infact partly the vets who are more recently discovering how common IBD has become, but can't help but believe it has got to do with some of the "okay" and approved for pet food consumption by AAFCO ingredients added.

Manufacturer's main concern is money, which is why alot of the fillers are added in, and AAFCO's guidelines are extremely lienient (SP) with what's fine for pets, unfortunately.

Just think, look at what's happened with humans from consuming all of the antibiotics and steroids given to the animals prior to slaughter.......scary.

@Artiemom  I have a question for you.

Your very first post in this thread, you said you are feeding him NVI and a variety of different kinds, and wonder why your vet didn't tell you to feed a single novel protein due to his suspected IBD.
Catwoman, I cannot read the Vet's mind as to why she did not specify just one novel protein, but I can guess. We know Artie is a very fussy cat. She even labeled him as high maintenance. Or is it me?  We do know he is so fussy with food. She has been his Vet for 3 years now. We have gone thru a lot. 

I decided on a variety of foods, because he gets tired of the same one. She suggested novel proteins. I really did not pick up on asking more. She did mention, duck, pork, lamb, rabbit~~~whatever he would take to...

I talked with her yesterday, I told he how good he was doing. I also told her I suspected chicken as a culprit. She said that is very common along with turkey and beef. I took a chance and gave him a can of NV turkey last night. Well, guess what?? He vomited this morning!! first time since starting this thread....so now I know. The culprits are poultry of all kinds! No wonder why he did not care much for chicken or turkey. He walks away from duck also....so that is it...He knows! and now I know.....

I feel progress!!!!

Don't know why he does not care for rabbit..........

The Vet also said I can cut back on the pepcid to just once a day. As long as he is doing well..

Gotta get going...it is Easter weekend. I want to get to the cemetery today. It is going to be rainy off and on, so I want to avoid the rain. Bad enough I have to wear my boots!!!

Then home, take boots off and go back to Pet Life to pick up some more food....then I can relax!!
 

riley1

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I really don't think a lot of vets know any thing about nutrition.  Cat Woman is right!  If canned food is made from byproducts of people food they are getting the same antibiotics as we are.  My vet also said my boy could be allergic to chicken but he never had any.  She said chicken was in most products even if the name was different.  I just don't think he got enough chicken to be allergic.  My vet said to stay away from raw rabbit as most comes from China. I do worry about all the preservatives that are added to canned food but also about bacteria in raw.  Not sure what is best at this point.  My new cat is young but I don't want her to have problems because of what I fed her early in life.  Reading the Crossing the Bridge posts there certainly a lot of cats dying from IBD turned cancer.
 

catwoman707

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  My new cat is young but I don't want her to have problems because of what I fed her early in life.  Reading the Crossing the Bridge posts there certainly a lot of cats dying from IBD turned cancer.
Exactly what I worry about.........

What ideally I'd like to do if my girls would cooperate! is home cooked. I cooked some ground turkey and added U-stew, which is everything they need for nutrition, one ate some, the other didn't even try it!

I do plan to do this again, but slip it in their food, a tiny bit at a time, sloowly get them used to this.

Then I KNOW exactly what they're consuming!
 

lisahe

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Originally Posted by Artiemom  

-She even labeled him as high maintenance.

-I took a chance and gave him a can of NV turkey last night. Well, guess what?? He vomited this morning!! first time since starting this thread....so now I know. The culprits are poultry of all kinds! No wonder why he did not care much for chicken or turkey. He walks away from duck also....so that is it...He knows! and now I know.....

I feel progress!!!!

Gotta get going...it is Easter weekend. I want to get to the cemetery today. It is going to be rainy off and on, so I want to avoid the rain. Bad enough I have to wear my boots!!!

Then home, take boots off and go back to Pet Life to pick up some more food....then I can relax!!
Artiemom, I took a few of your points! Our vet called our cats high maintenance, too, because they're Siamese mixes! (Apparently Siamese mixes are prone to stomach issues (check!), tooth issues (check!), and an array of other things... but they are the sweetest cats ever!) And how great that you were able to figure out the turkey so quickly. (Always looking on the positive side with this stuff...) I hope your trips to the cemetery and Pet Life went well. Enjoy your soggy Easter!
 
I do worry about all the preservatives that are added to canned food but also about bacteria in raw.  Not sure what is best at this point.  My new cat is young but I don't want her to have problems because of what I fed her early in life.  Reading the Crossing the Bridge posts there certainly a lot of cats dying from IBD turned cancer.
This is the problem: nobody really knows what will be the best thing! Our cat vet advised us to feed high-protein, low-carb, grain-free, and the like... which we were going to do anyway, but who knows what the cats might become allergic to, particularly given their overwhelming preference for chicken. I kind of consider them "pre-IBD" since they definitely have sensitive stomachs, though they seem to be under control. I think the best thing any of us can do is feed healthy foods that seem to agree with out cats and then get help and change their diets if they start to have problems. As for bacteria, we feed commercial raw foods: Primal, Stella & Chewy's, and Rad Cat. Primal and Stella & Chewy's are treated for bacteria and Rad Cat tests each batch before sending it out. I'm pretty good with that. And the cats love all those foods.
Originally Posted by catwoman707  

I cooked some ground turkey and added U-stew, which is everything they need for nutrition, one ate some, the other didn't even try it!

I do plan to do this again, but slip it in their food, a tiny bit at a time, sloowly get them used to this.

Then I KNOW exactly what they're consuming!
Good for you, catwoman! Sometimes I wish I had the gumption for homemade food... I made Dr. Pierson's recipe once, for our previous cat, when she was very, very sick and not eating: she actually ate some (it turned out to be her last meal) and I froze the rest for whatever new cats we might get. They absolutely loved it, it was a great treat for them. I think about making it as an occasional treat so I don't have to worry so much about balancing the nutrients. For now, though, my mind is so cluttered with all my work that I don't think there's room for cat food ingredients!

Happy Friday to all of you! Even with lots of snow still on the ground, it's finally starting to feel like spring here now that we have a morning without building wood fires!
 

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@Artiemom -- i haven't read through the entire thread yet, but have jumped to the most recent postings and read them. i'm wondering if you've tried serving artie venison. my two cats love venison, though it does depend on the brand how much they like/love it.
 
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mickNsnicks2mom,

Funny you would suggest venison! I picked up a couple of cans yesterday!  I opened one this morning. I do not think Artie is caring much for this food.

He woke me up early because he was hungry. I opened the venison, gave it to him and he walked away. He did go back to it. All he did was lick some of the water I add to his food...

I will leave it down, as usual, and see if he eats anymore of it later. 

I may sprinkle some forth-flora on it. I do not want to use much of that stuff because I do not want him to get spoiled with that on all his food.

I mentioned Forti Flora to the Vet. She said she was about to suggest that to me. She said she just loves it! She said it is a miracle powder for fussy cats.....

I am going to start a new thread to see if anyone has had any dealing with ordering from PetfoodsDirect.com 

I can order all his food on that web site. Chewy does not have the Hound and Gatos....
 

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mickNsnicks2mom,

Funny you would suggest venison! I picked up a couple of cans yesterday!  I opened one this morning. I do not think Artie is caring much for this food.

He woke me up early because he was hungry. I opened the venison, gave it to him and he walked away. He did go back to it. All he did was lick some of the water I add to his food...

I will leave it down, as usual, and see if he eats anymore of it later. 

I may sprinkle some forth-flora on it. I do not want to use much of that stuff because I do not want him to get spoiled with that on all his food.

I mentioned Forti Flora to the Vet. She said she was about to suggest that to me. She said she just loves it! She said it is a miracle powder for fussy cats.....

I am going to start a new thread to see if anyone has had any dealing with ordering from PetfoodsDirect.com 

I can order all his food on that web site. Chewy does not have the Hound and Gatos....
I have ordered from Pet Food Direct. No problems at all. Amazon sells H&G also. 
 
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artiemom

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I was gone for most of the day. Artie did not eat any venison...sigh.

I just put down some NV pork. He is not eating it....right now he is curled up in his 'tent'..that is not unusual. He goes there every day...

sigh...hope he is ok....

I gave him some pepcid this morning. I got the fish flavor for a change. He was shocked at the taste! 

I hope he kept it down because I saw some spots on my floor....I hope I spilled something, instead of him.....sigh.....\

always something with this boy....
 

catwoman707

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You might seriously want to consider one single protein. There is no way in hell my girl would be able to settle down inside and not react to different proteins.

I know you said earlier when asked that you can't read your vet's mind, so why not give a call and ask if this is best?

I honestly have never heard of recommending novel protein food in variety like that, almost like changing a cat's diet, gives them upset intestines until they can adjust to it, so when there is IBD involved it makes it even worse to switch it up.

Just suggesting!
 
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artiemom

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You might seriously want to consider one single protein. There is no way in hell my girl would be able to settle down inside and not react to different proteins.

I know you said earlier when asked that you can't read your vet's mind, so why not give a call and ask if this is best?  I hope you do not think I was fresh or snarkey with that remark.. I just said I don't know what she would be thinking. 

I honestly have never heard of recommending novel protein food in variety like that, almost like changing a cat's diet, gives them upset intestines until they can adjust to it, so when there is IBD involved it makes it even worse to switch it up.

Just suggesting!
Thanks, I really do not know what is best....but you do make sense.. I just thought changing it up would be good for him. I mean, I always rotated flavors on his FF...and he waited for the variety and really liked it....

I will keep it to one.....

The Vet did not mention anything about switching it up, as I am doing.. The office is closed today. I will see how does tonight with the pork...and tomorrow with more pork...

Any suggestions are worthwhile to me.

I am open to all...

sigh..

sometimes I need a good kick in the butt.....

I am overtired right now...got to bed late, did not sleep well and Artie woke me up early... I was out most of the day....whining now....I gotta go....thanks..
 

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I ordered about a 3 month supply of Instinct from Chewy's so I guess I will use it.  Strongly considering raw.  Instinct fat content just seems too high to me.  They say their food is 95% animal products but the protein is only 35% of the calories.  thanks for the links!
 

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I ordered about a 3 month supply of Instinct from Chewy's so I guess I will use it.  Strongly considering raw.  Instinct fat content just seems too high to me.  They say their food is 95% animal products but the protein is only 35% of the calories.  thanks for the links!
Our cats do very well on about half raw food (morning and evening) and half canned food (mid-day and night)... and they get canned foods with a broad range of fat calories. I was just looking at the food chart on catinfo.org: I hadn't realized until you mentioned it how heavy in fat calories the Instinct foods are. I wonder if that's why the consistency is so heavy? Our cats just never took to those foods.
 
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