Not sure if this is the right forum for this

[LTS3]

So I'm a member of another cat board (not sure if I can say the name since it might be viewed as promoting that board) and on the nutrition forum lately there has been a person who insists that Hills dry products are the best for all cats, that Catinfo.org is nothing but a bunch of false information, raw food kills, cats don't need high protein levels in the diet, grains are ok, etc etc. This person says that because she is a certified licensed vet tech she has the education and experience that no one else does so only she knows what proper nutrition is. Several members feel like

and have politely disagreed with the person and have posted their own views on nutrition and what has worked for their cats over the years.

I know everyone is entitled to their opinion but the information this person is spreading is just wrong

Nothing the person is posting is against the board's community rules so she can't be removed from the board.

If you saw someone posting similar things, how would you respond?

 

[bonepicker]

So I'm a member of another cat board (not sure if I can say the name since it might be viewed as promoting that board) and on the nutrition forum lately there has been a person who insists that Hills dry products are the best for all cats, that Catinfo.org is nothing but a bunch of false information, raw food kills, cats don't need high protein levels in the diet, grains are ok, etc etc. This person says that because she is a certified licensed vet tech she has the education and experience that no one else does so only she knows what proper nutrition is. Several members feel like:wife: and have politely disagreed with the person and have posted their own views on nutrition and what has worked for their cats over the years.

I know everyone is entitled to their opinion but the information this person is spreading is just wrong :uuh: Nothing the person is posting is against the board's community rules so she can't be removed from the board.


If you saw someone posting similar things, how would you respond?

I would say that is like a nurses aid giving advice on brain surgery!!

 

[pinkdagger]

Honestly, some people won't be persuaded and they've already decided that. To be fair, if I had a formal education, I would be very hesitant to sway from it just because some other sources say otherwise when they would be considered less scientific and less reliable than what trained professionals had taught me. I'm not saying their ideas are right, but I can completely empathize with being stuck in that mindset that what I was taught by credible people was correct.

With that said, there are people like that everywhere for all trains of thought. Specific foods have a time, a place, and a purpose for each individual cat, and NONE of us can claim that one way is the Holy Grail for every animal or that one way is a toxic death waiting to happen. What we know about cats and cat nutrition is still a world of grey. Very few can call themselves experts, and if someone kept linking the same old sites to me over and over again, I would doubt they're experts because they can only cite one or two (more or less anecdotal) sources. I think removing a user from the board because they disagree with the general consensus is the wrong way to go, even if it were possible. Everyone has input to offer, and whether you, your cousin, or your uncle agree is irrelevant.

If the overwhelming population is going against that user, other readers will get the idea that a lot of people will opt for higher meat-based protein, low grain, low carb foods or whatever other people are suggesting. In the end, owners should still be working with their own professionals, vets, nutritionists, and whomever else they see fit - not the internet. We're a starting point, but we shouldn't be the authoritative voice to anyone.

I deal with users like this on a daily basis on several communities, one that I moderate. If they're not going to be persuaded, if they're going to talk down on the way I care for my animals, if they're just regurgitating the same old same old as if it's perfect for every cat, I would ignore them. In time, other people will learn to ignore them and that user will either learn to be part of a civil and open-ended discussion or they'll fade away. If you can block users, block them. Get them out of your hair. They are not your problem, and you do not have to be theirs.

If you want to engage with them, cite more sources - not Google sources, not CatInfo over and over again. Someone with a formal and scientific background will appreciate scientific academic reports, not Google results. Don't get accusatory or defensive, ask them how they feel about legitimate studies and how their view has changed (if it has) based on what has been found.

 

[Winchester]

Honestly? I see that here in this forum. There are people here who think that dry food is evil and that people who feed dry food shouldn't have cats. And that catinfo.org is gospel. Do I believe that? No. Certainly not. But there are many people who don't realize that the best food is the ONE YOUR CAT WILL EAT. The best food on earth won't do a bit of good if your cat won't eat it. And that's part of the problem. 

I believe that everybody should be allowed to feed their cat the best food they can afford to feed. It doesn't have to be raw, it doesn't have to be homemade. It doesn't have to be all dry or all canned. What matters is that it's the best food we can afford and that it's something our cats will enjoy eating. And nobody should be made to feel that they're bad cat parents if they feed what others think isn't any good. We all do what we can. And that's what really matters.

 

[fhicat]

If you saw someone posting similar things, how would you respond?

The same way I've always responded. That we, pet owners, have to balance the fact that we want what's best and what works for our kids, and the fact that we don't know much about nutrition. No one opinion is correct, just because there are so few, if any, scientific lifetime studies done on animal feeding.

Repeating what I read on the internet does not make me an expert, it just meant that I'm repeating what someone else said. There are so, so many factors that play a role in food and health that it is impossible to say with any certainty that it was X that made my cat sick, or Y that let him live to 24 years old. You need lifetime studies for that to determine a strong correlation, if any.

Feed what you can afford, feed what works for you and feed what your cat likes. Do as much research as you can to make educated decisions, but don't subscribe to the fallacy that there is only one correct way to feed our kids.

 

[padfootandmoony]

I will say, for a thread that started on a negative note, this thread has made me feel much better about what my cat will and will not eat!

 

[LTS3]

 
I believe that everybody should be allowed to feed their cat the best food they can afford to feed. It doesn't have to be raw, it doesn't have to be homemade. It doesn't have to be all dry or all canned. What matters is that it's the best food we can afford and that it's something our cats will enjoy eating. And nobody should be made to feel that they're bad cat parents if they feed what others think isn't any good. We all do what we can. And that's what really matters.

I agree. No one should be made to feel bad about what they fed their cats. We can try to educate people but ultmately what they decide to feed is their decision.

but don't subscribe to the fallacy that there is only one correct way to feed our kids.

According to that person, there is only one way to feed cats - her way which is only Hills products. All other brands are "nutritionally inadequate" (her exact wrods). The person basically slams every post that does not share her opinion. She cites her background and experience as a vet tech as making her an authority over what a cat should be fed and not be fed.

I have seen disagreements and strong opinions on the dry vs canned food debate here on TCS but never to the same extreme as on ths particular board.

 

[padfootandmoony]

 
I agree. No one should be made to feel bad about what they fed their cats. We can try to educate people but ultmately what they decide to feed is their decision.

According to that person, there is only one way to feed cats - her way which is only Hills products. All other brands are "nutritionally inadequate" (her exact wrods). The person basically slams every post that does not share her opinion. She cites her background and experience as a vet tech as making her an authority over what a cat should be fed and not be fed.

I have seen disagreements and strong opinions on the dry vs canned food debate here on TCS but never to the same extreme as on ths particular board.

Why don't you see if a mod can message them? I mean they have a right to their opinion but its also can easily be taken too far. Or you could message them if its really getting to you and explain your site of the situation. 

 

[MoochNNoodles]

The "my way or the highway" approach is wrong no matter what feeding method you are promoting.  You can be sure that attitude turns a lot of people off and any good advice you have to offer; even on other subjects, will be over looked.  It's a shame people don't see that.

I'm one who has struggled with getting my girls to eat what I think is better.  But at the end of the day; I've done the best I can.  My research helps me have educated discussions with the vets who treat my girls; but I also respect their opinions as professionals.  In my reading; I've found I take what is right for us and leave the rest.  I do that with my children, my marriage and my own self.  It's left me a much happier and less anxious person.  I'm not so bothered by people who disagree with me anymore.  I used to be and sometimes that's still a work in progress.  But now I make choices based on what is best for us and try to make that the end of it.  It's not been easy with my 2 lately.  I've shed some tears.  I've reflected and speculated and all that.  And yes I've wondered if my decisions were always right.  I've had to remind myself that at the end of the day; I've done the best I could with what I knew and some things are truly out of my hands. 

 

[marian100]

Gosh wouldn't life be easy if there was only one diet to live by. My cat gets raw meat, steamed fish a few dry bits, chicken necks and apparently frozen peas (actually frozen) are on the menu. He is healthy happy glossy and has me totally wrapped around his paws. Not bad for a flea ridden lost kitten who had been living under the house stealing the old cat's dinner.

 

[Anne]

 
If you saw someone posting similar things, how would you respond?

By recommending a different nutrition forum? 

 Sorry! Couldn't resist!

I will say that when people feel passionately about a topic, it can be a real challenge to curb their enthusiasm in a forum environment. There's a lot that goes on behind the scenes here when we get the occasional proponent of declawing, for example. It's not always easy to tell a troll apart from a legitimate cat owner with an opinion. I hope that the team at that forum does something about it. Had I been a member, I would definitely reach out to ask.

 

[LTS3]

 
By recommending a different nutrition forum? 

 Sorry! Couldn't resist!

Lol

I'm sure this person means well and wants people to feed their cats what is best but the way she is doing is just alienates people with all her Hills promoting and the way she words her posts. I dont think she realizes that there are members who live outside the US and HIlls may not be available in that country. Some countries may not even have any commercial cat food available so the only option is homecooked or raw.

 
Why don't you see if a mod can message them? I mean they have a right to their opinion but its also can easily be taken too far. Or you could message them if its really getting to you and explain your site of the situation. 

Other members have PMd the person and have gotten pretty nasty responses. I'll see if a mod can do something besides closing the current thread.

 

[AbbysMom]

 


I agree. No one should be made to feel bad about what they fed their cats. We can try to educate people but ultmately what they decide to feed is their decision.



According to that person, there is only one way to feed cats - her way which is only Hills products. All other brands are "nutritionally inadequate" (her exact wrods). The person basically slams every post that does not share her opinion. She cites her background and experience as a vet tech as making her an authority over what a cat should be fed and not be fed.

I have seen disagreements and strong opinions on the dry vs canned food debate here on TCS but never to the same extreme as on ths particular board.

Why don't you see if a mod can message them? I mean they have a right to their opinion but its also can easily be taken too far. Or you could message them if its really getting to you and explain your site of the situation. 

This is a good idea. We really appreciate it when someone gives us a heads up. At times it may not look like we are doing anything, but it puts the person on our radar and we know to keep an eye on them.

As mentioned above, I see what you are describing here at times, without the benefit of being able to say they are a vet tech. Over the years I have seen far too many members driven away from this particular forum and the board because they are made to feel inadequate because of what they are feeding their cats.

We don't know the person, their cats, their lifestyle, their budget, etc. I've had people here suggest foods for my cat, telling me they were the only solution. They would kill her. :dk:

There really is no one perfect food for a cat. Sure, we see people post and cringe about what they are feeding. I have seen some members come in and be fairly harsh to them. I've also seen some members come in and in a very gentle manner suggest reasonable, easily obtained, affordable alternatives. That's what we need to do. :nod: Just because you would never feed something to your cat doesn't mean it is wrong for another member to feed it to theirs. :nod:

My grandfather had barn cats that were never spayed or neutered, and were often fed white bread soaked in milk. I won't even get into what happened to the kittens that were born.

My childhood cat was declawed, wore a flea collar, ate dry food filled with dyes and that was basically junk, never went to the vet and regularly went outside.

My first adult cat ate cheap canned along with dry that was filled with dyes and junk and occasionally went outside.

At the end of that cat's life I found TCS. I did a lot of reading on here to try to figure out what was wrong with her. We ultimately lost her without knowing what was wrong.

I finally joined here after adopting Abby, when she started having some issues. To say I am better educated now is an understatement. Abby is indoors, only going out occasionally on a leash. She eats a whole let better, although probably not up to some members' standards.

When I joined in 2005 the Nutrition forum was a little bit kinder and gentler than it is now. I really wish we could return to that so we don't scare away members that would be able to benefit as much as I have over the last ten years.


OK, off my soapbox. :soap:


LTS3 I bet you didn't realize the can of worms you were opening here. :lol3:

 

[padfootandmoony]

The only other thing I will say is that I originally did not want to join here because of the raw food is the only way to go crowd. I don't have the money, time, or cat to do raw and that's okay. She gets a decent diet, probably better than my own honestly! I pride myself in giving the best I can under the circumstances with all my pets. I just wanted to mention that it is intimidating. 

 

[pinkdagger]

It's true, and because of that mindset, there are many people who, even though they are members, are afraid to admit things like feeding a dry diet, or feeding a brand of food that's available in grocery stories, or a food that is any less than $2/5.5oz can, has byproducts, or even a miniscule amount of grain. The internet is the perfect place to feel like you're an expert because you read through 5 pages of Google results, or a friend of a friend told you this and that, and it's unfortunate that people think of themselves as an authority in telling what others should feed their cats when they know nothing about others' circumstances, and as if any other way is a death sentence.

We should all strive to do our best for our cats. If other people have differing opinions, great - we shouldn't stifle people for making the choices they do, nor should we feel stifled for making the choices we do. The food you feed your cat isn't a bragging right. Whether you can afford to feed 25 fancy "premium" brands or one decent brand your cat will readily eat, good for you.

Is your cat healthy? Is your cat happy? Are you giving them a good standard of life? That's all we can do, and that should be the emphasis - educating people who are willing to learn, not berating those who wanted earnest input.

 

[Willowy]

Is this person actually interacting with other posters? I ask because he/she was going around to all the forums for a while and never answered questions or interacted in any way. Maybe that forum was what they were looking for. Anyway, it would be fun to argue with them if they were willing to engage.

 

[mservant]

 
The only other thing I will say is that I originally did not want to join here because of the raw food is the only way to go crowd. I don't have the money, time, or cat to do raw and that's okay. She gets a decent diet, probably better than my own honestly! I pride myself in giving the best I can under the circumstances with all my pets. I just wanted to mention that it is intimidating. 

I think it is important to remember how intimidating people expressing strong opionions can be, whether they are right, wrong, same or different to those who are reading.  It can be very difficult to enter in to a conversation where views are strong, and if you are not doing what is being proposed as the 'right' thing it can feel scary, alienating, and probably cause anyone who does not like to be that dogmatic to turn away and go elsewhere.  Probably feeling very badly about what they are doing and loosing out on any learning from the information because of how it was presented.  Such direct and rigid opinions rarely attract anything other than people who agree and follow or those of oposing views of equally fixed nature who want an argument - not condusive to open discussion and learning.  How refreshing to be able to discuss things without fear if there is any disagreement or lack of certainty about what may be 'best'.

Not all forums have systems in place like moderators as far as I know so it may fall to others posting to either challenge, or to avoid giving people as asked about by @LTS3  a voice.  Worth considering whether openly arguing, or joining in and agreeing does anything other than adding to this person's convictions and power over others.

 

[LTS3]

@LTS3 I bet you didn't realize the can of worms you were opening here.

Um, no

 

[denice]

 
The only other thing I will say is that I originally did not want to join here because of the raw food is the only way to go crowd. I don't have the money, time, or cat to do raw and that's okay. She gets a decent diet, probably better than my own honestly! I pride myself in giving the best I can under the circumstances with all my pets. I just wanted to mention that it is intimidating. 

There is no reason to feel intimidated by people who feed raw.  Feeding raw is, when it is a complete diet, simply one more option.  The same is true of people who regularly feed $3 a can food, nothing wrong with doing that but not everyone can afford it and not all cats like the foods that are expensive.

 

[mschauer]

 
This person says that because she is a certified licensed vet tech she has the education and experience that no one else does so only she knows what proper nutrition is. 

In my experience this is a fairly common trait of medical technicians in general. Because of their close association with doctors and veterinarians they collect information much in the same way as people who mine the Internet for information do. But, also as with people who get their information from the Internet, they frequently lack a deep enough understanding of the information to make practical use of it.