Pepcid can be used long term if its needed. If there is nausea (vomiting), Cerenia is basically a wonder drug, my cat was on it for over a year.
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Our cat's creatinine is 7.7 and rises fast. What can we do?
- Thread starter tommy2015
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Just found your "Dusty" posts, and wanted to get a lil info, but I'll expound without the answers to my questions for now, then tweak my info.
1. Has Dusty's T4, aka thyroxine, level been checked to ensure his hypertension and renal disease is not caused by hyperthyroidism? These are critically linked disease processes...
2. Is Dusty's blood urea nitrogen, or BUN, also elevated?
3. Was Dusty's Urine protein to creatinine ratio ever checked, or rechecked if so? This can tell us a lot about the efficacy of SQ fluid diuresis for the individualized patient, as well as excess dietary protein.
4. Does Dusty rotate through a variety of foods, to keep his appetite stimulated? If so, how long before you have to rotate out the current one, and start one of the alternatives?
5. How is Dusty's potassium level? If this is low, common in renal disease cats, he needs K supplementation, so he doesn't develop problems with edema, albumin levels, or poor intra-cellular transmission of energy, protein, and water.
6. What is Dusty's phosphorus level? If high, he needs binders started or he will persistently feel like crud as the phosphorus is increasingly pulled from his blood, filtered by the kidneys. Also, if not on low phosphorus diet, this is a good initial measure, to help control his blood/urine phosphorus.
The Pepcid helps when their stomach acid churns on the empty stomach caused by not wanting to eat, due to kidney pain and dehydration. Dehydration is very painful. Cerenia can prevent vomiting, and adds some visceral abdominal pain control as well, given once daily effectively. This is not OTC like Pepcid is, so your vet must prescribe it. Cerenia CAN be given long term, as opposed to many less-modern vets' understanding, as it was intially labeled for 4 day maximum duration of use, but many internal medicinists and oncologists use it daily for the rest of their patients' lives with no ill effect, and only positive beneficial reports on pain and appetite.
When uremic/azotemic, cats are prone to gastric and esophogeal ulcers. Your boy may need sucralfate providing a nice gel-like coating of the esophagus and stomach before he feels "low acid" enough, pain-free enough, to have an appetite. Some vets say give it with food. Success is achieved by making a small volume slurry with the prescribed dose in a syringe, giving by mouth 30 minutes before his pepcid/other meds, then 30 minute wait to feed, letting those good juju meds take effect before you ever put food in front of him.
If we constantly offer a diet to a cat that is refusing to eat, feeling nausea and/or pain chronically, they will associate that food with their discomfort and often temporarily, potentially permanently, refuse to eat that particular diet. We gotta love our feline behavior, man do they remember, even in a stupor of pain or dehydration, that smell they smelled when they felt oh so bad.
Always good to keep a variety of options in the pantry of a kidney cat. Both canned and dry, just in case the patient pulls a fast one on you, and says, no no no to anymore canned food. It's not ideal, but it happens. We prefer they eat a diet of low phosphorus and higher potassium, but it reaches a point when eating period is better than not, and whatever that lil kitty will eat is A okay with us veterinary folk, whatever they want, they get.
Good luck with Dusty, and I'll check back tomorrow early AM while working graves ;]
1. Has Dusty's T4, aka thyroxine, level been checked to ensure his hypertension and renal disease is not caused by hyperthyroidism? These are critically linked disease processes...
2. Is Dusty's blood urea nitrogen, or BUN, also elevated?
3. Was Dusty's Urine protein to creatinine ratio ever checked, or rechecked if so? This can tell us a lot about the efficacy of SQ fluid diuresis for the individualized patient, as well as excess dietary protein.
4. Does Dusty rotate through a variety of foods, to keep his appetite stimulated? If so, how long before you have to rotate out the current one, and start one of the alternatives?
5. How is Dusty's potassium level? If this is low, common in renal disease cats, he needs K supplementation, so he doesn't develop problems with edema, albumin levels, or poor intra-cellular transmission of energy, protein, and water.
6. What is Dusty's phosphorus level? If high, he needs binders started or he will persistently feel like crud as the phosphorus is increasingly pulled from his blood, filtered by the kidneys. Also, if not on low phosphorus diet, this is a good initial measure, to help control his blood/urine phosphorus.
The Pepcid helps when their stomach acid churns on the empty stomach caused by not wanting to eat, due to kidney pain and dehydration. Dehydration is very painful. Cerenia can prevent vomiting, and adds some visceral abdominal pain control as well, given once daily effectively. This is not OTC like Pepcid is, so your vet must prescribe it. Cerenia CAN be given long term, as opposed to many less-modern vets' understanding, as it was intially labeled for 4 day maximum duration of use, but many internal medicinists and oncologists use it daily for the rest of their patients' lives with no ill effect, and only positive beneficial reports on pain and appetite.
When uremic/azotemic, cats are prone to gastric and esophogeal ulcers. Your boy may need sucralfate providing a nice gel-like coating of the esophagus and stomach before he feels "low acid" enough, pain-free enough, to have an appetite. Some vets say give it with food. Success is achieved by making a small volume slurry with the prescribed dose in a syringe, giving by mouth 30 minutes before his pepcid/other meds, then 30 minute wait to feed, letting those good juju meds take effect before you ever put food in front of him.
If we constantly offer a diet to a cat that is refusing to eat, feeling nausea and/or pain chronically, they will associate that food with their discomfort and often temporarily, potentially permanently, refuse to eat that particular diet. We gotta love our feline behavior, man do they remember, even in a stupor of pain or dehydration, that smell they smelled when they felt oh so bad.
Always good to keep a variety of options in the pantry of a kidney cat. Both canned and dry, just in case the patient pulls a fast one on you, and says, no no no to anymore canned food. It's not ideal, but it happens. We prefer they eat a diet of low phosphorus and higher potassium, but it reaches a point when eating period is better than not, and whatever that lil kitty will eat is A okay with us veterinary folk, whatever they want, they get.
Good luck with Dusty, and I'll check back tomorrow early AM while working graves ;]
Just thought I'd pipe in here to say that I also have a 15 1/2 year old female with kidney disease who is declining rapidly
. She is on mirtzapine also, which used to work, but seems to have stopped for some reason. She doesn't appear nauseated (no licking of the lips, that sort of thing when presented with food), she just doesn't want to eat
. We are very lucky if we can get 2 ounces of wet food into her per day anymore, although she still comes to us in the middle of the night for treats, which she gets, just to try to keep something on her tummy. What I do is offer her many very small meals throughout the day. She seems to do better if I don't overload her. So I only put perhaps .5 of an ounce in her bowl at any one time. Then I put a little bit of water around it because no matter how many fluids we give her (sub-q), she's always thirsty, so sometimes she'll go for the liquid in the food dish and "accidentally" get some of the food
If she doesn't lick at what's in the bowl that I present her, then I switch it out for another food...again, just a tiny amount. Usually she'll eat maybe .35 ounce of one of the 2 or 3 choices I give her....sometimes ALL of them
(THOSE are the good days!!!!) Now I try to do this up to 5 times a day, depending on my schedule) (I only do this for her, 'cause she's sick, the other cats get offered whatever is on the menu, and either they eat it, or they wait until the next meal
)
OH, I forgot, I also add Digestive Enzymes to her food, because that way it ensures that whatever she eats she at least gets ALL the nutrients out of it. But she is so picky that I can't add anything else, like any form of kidney supplements, or she'll refuse the food entirely. Luckily I've been adding Digestive Enzymes for a few years now, even before she got sick, so she's used to them.
You could try adding toppers (like tuna water, crushed treats, things like that) to your old girl's food, along with the Pepcid you got. Did you talk to your Vet about a different appetite enhancer? I think the other one has to be given daily vs every 3 days. And the Pepcid you got is for stomach acidity, it's not really an anti-emetic for nausea. Although it's a fine line as to what causes the nausea. If the Pepcid doesn't work, just know that Cerenia works differently. My last kidney cat was on the Pepcid A/C (OTC) twice a day, every day for a long time, then towards the end we added an anti-emetic.
You're still giving the daily sub-q's right? That should really help. Are you giving any kidney supplements? Plus all of the things Puck mentioned are valid points.
OH, I forgot, I also add Digestive Enzymes to her food, because that way it ensures that whatever she eats she at least gets ALL the nutrients out of it. But she is so picky that I can't add anything else, like any form of kidney supplements, or she'll refuse the food entirely. Luckily I've been adding Digestive Enzymes for a few years now, even before she got sick, so she's used to them.
You could try adding toppers (like tuna water, crushed treats, things like that) to your old girl's food, along with the Pepcid you got. Did you talk to your Vet about a different appetite enhancer? I think the other one has to be given daily vs every 3 days. And the Pepcid you got is for stomach acidity, it's not really an anti-emetic for nausea. Although it's a fine line as to what causes the nausea. If the Pepcid doesn't work, just know that Cerenia works differently. My last kidney cat was on the Pepcid A/C (OTC) twice a day, every day for a long time, then towards the end we added an anti-emetic.
You're still giving the daily sub-q's right? That should really help. Are you giving any kidney supplements? Plus all of the things Puck mentioned are valid points.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #24
We have given Dusty pepcid 2.5mg/per day in the past four days. Looks there was no significant improvement in her appetite. Today we increased the dose to twice a day, and tomorrow we will get the SQ fluids with anti-nausea meds. Will keep you updated about how it goes.
OK. Sub Q fluids can do wonders.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #26
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #27
Thanks! I tried your trick of "small meal and water around it", it looks she eats a little bit more.
Just thought I'd pipe in here to say that I also have a 15 1/2 year old female with kidney disease who is declining rapidly. She is on mirtzapine also, which used to work, but seems to have stopped for some reason. She doesn't appear nauseated (no licking of the lips, that sort of thing when presented with food), she just doesn't want to eat. We are very lucky if we can get 2 ounces of wet food into her per day anymore, although she still comes to us in the middle of the night for treats, which she gets, just to try to keep something on her tummy. What I do is offer her many very small meals throughout the day. She seems to do better if I don't overload her. So I only put perhaps .5 of an ounce in her bowl at any one time. Then I put a little bit of water around it because no matter how many fluids we give her (sub-q), she's always thirsty, so sometimes she'll go for the liquid in the food dish and "accidentally" get some of the foodIf she doesn't lick at what's in the bowl that I present her, then I switch it out for another food...again, just a tiny amount. Usually she'll eat maybe .35 ounce of one of the 2 or 3 choices I give her....sometimes ALL of them(THOSE are the good days!!!!) Now I try to do this up to 5 times a day, depending on my schedule) (I only do this for her, 'cause she's sick, the other cats get offered whatever is on the menu, and either they eat it, or they wait until the next meal)
OH, I forgot, I also add Digestive Enzymes to her food, because that way it ensures that whatever she eats she at least gets ALL the nutrients out of it. But she is so picky that I can't add anything else, like any form of kidney supplements, or she'll refuse the food entirely. Luckily I've been adding Digestive Enzymes for a few years now, even before she got sick, so she's used to them.
You could try adding toppers (like tuna water, crushed treats, things like that) to your old girl's food, along with the Pepcid you got. Did you talk to your Vet about a different appetite enhancer? I think the other one has to be given daily vs every 3 days. And the Pepcid you got is for stomach acidity, it's not really an anti-emetic for nausea. Although it's a fine line as to what causes the nausea. If the Pepcid doesn't work, just know that Cerenia works differently. My last kidney cat was on the Pepcid A/C (OTC) twice a day, every day for a long time, then towards the end we added an anti-emetic.
You're still giving the daily sub-q's right? That should really help. Are you giving any kidney supplements? Plus all of the things Puck mentioned are valid points.
What kind of Digestive Enzymes are you using? Do you have a brand to recommend?
Also, would you recommend a brand of kidney supplements? Are these something to enhance their kidney function?
I actually weigh everything I feed Callie, so I KNOW exactly how much she eats every meal, that way I can keep track of how much she's taking in. Honestly, I don't know why, because what does it matter? On good days I can cheer
As to Digestive Enzymes, I use Prozyme.
Kidney Supplements...Azodyl is one that is commonly used, but it comes in a large tablet that could be difficult to give unless you're really good at pilling. Plus Vitamin B is a big one, your Vet can give her a shot of this, and Vitamin E...we give just one drop into Callie's food once a day, however, she doesn't always eat the food it's in
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #30
Thanks, puck. We will ask the vet to check Dusty's T4 level in our next visit.
So far she's been on pepcid for about one week, and anti-nausea med in SQ fluids for two days. It has yet to make much difference. Dusty may eat a little bit more (at most) with our persuasion.
Is Rx sucralfate slurry an OTC med that we can buy without prescription? We did talk to the vet about possible esophageal or gastric bleeding, as Dusty's anemia has been fluctuating. The vet said it is unlikely according to one of the items in the blood work (she pointed it to my wife and I wasn't present, so I don't know which item)。 In this situation, can we still try sucralfate?
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- #31
Thanks. Will try what you recommended. Dusty is on SQ everyday, that is what keeps her carry on.
I actually weigh everything I feed Callie, so I KNOW exactly how much she eats every meal, that way I can keep track of how much she's taking in. Honestly, I don't know why, because what does it matter? On good days I can cheerand on bad days I can sulkand worry, but to what end? (rhetorical question) I have a list of how much she's eaten for the past two years. Boy, I must be OCD. anyway, I'm glad it appears Dusty is eating a little more. And I think the Sub Q's with anti-emetics will really help. I still don't think you've said if you're giving sub-q's regularly or not?
As to Digestive Enzymes, I use Prozyme.
Kidney Supplements...Azodyl is one that is commonly used, but it comes in a large tablet that could be difficult to give unless you're really good at pilling. Plus Vitamin B is a big one, your Vet can give her a shot of this, and Vitamin E...we give just one drop into Callie's food once a day, however, she doesn't always eat the food it's in. Our Vet actually discussed Azodyl with us, however, Callie is impossible for us to pill, so that's not viable for her.
Used pepcid and anti-nausea med. But not very helpful to improve her appetite.
I just read yesterday that Pepcid can cause anemia in HUMANS, and since in your BELOW quote you mentioned Dusty's anemia (don't know how I missed that previously!), perhaps Pepcid isn't the best for her? Maybe Ranitudine would be better, or maybe she doesn't have an issue with over acidity after all, if her appetite isn't improving with what you've done over the last 4 days
I'm thinking maybe she needs a DIFFERENT appetite enhancer, since the mirtazipine didn't work, then possibly the sucralfate slurry rather than the acid blocker or in addition to the slurry, but I think the slurry has to be given at a different time than the acid blockers and without food. Here's a great explanation of what MIGHT be going on and what you might discuss with your Vet to try: http://www.felinecrf.org/nausea_vomiting_stomach_acid.htm#causes BTW, as far as I know, the sucralfate is prescription. But you should just be able to discuss a lot of these items via the phone with your Vet rather than have to take Dusty in all the time. That's what we do with OUR Vet. Of course we have to take Callie in for any blood tests or exam issues, but otherwise we do a lot of phone consults (free of charge
Which anti-nausea med? Was it Cerenia?
There is an interesting study published in 2013. It found that that the issue with nausea and cats with kidney insufficiency is typically related to a central nausea, rather than over-acidity:
http://www.winnfelinefoundation.org...c-changes-in-cats-with-chronic-kidney-disease
The implication, of course, is that something like cerenia is a better bet for helping kitty than an antacid.
There is an interesting study published in 2013. It found that that the issue with nausea and cats with kidney insufficiency is typically related to a central nausea, rather than over-acidity:
http://www.winnfelinefoundation.org...c-changes-in-cats-with-chronic-kidney-disease
The implication, of course, is that something like cerenia is a better bet for helping kitty than an antacid.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #34
Thanks. Will call the vet next week for more options. We also try not to take Dusty to the vet as she will get so stressed.
I just read yesterday that Pepcid can cause anemia in HUMANS, and since in your BELOW quote you mentioned Dusty's anemia (don't know how I missed that previously!), perhaps Pepcid isn't the best for her? Maybe Ranitudine would be better, or maybe she doesn't have an issue with over acidity after all, if her appetite isn't improving with what you've done over the last 4 days
I'm thinking maybe she needs a DIFFERENT appetite enhancer, since the mirtazipine didn't work, then possibly the sucralfate slurry rather than the acid blocker or in addition to the slurry, but I think the slurry has to be given at a different time than the acid blockers and without food. Here's a great explanation of what MIGHT be going on and what you might discuss with your Vet to try: http://www.felinecrf.org/nausea_vomiting_stomach_acid.htm#causes BTW, as far as I know, the sucralfate is prescription. But you should just be able to discuss a lot of these items via the phone with your Vet rather than have to take Dusty in all the time. That's what we do with OUR Vet. Of course we have to take Callie in for any blood tests or exam issues, but otherwise we do a lot of phone consults (free of charge)
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #35
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #36
The situation is getting worse. Dusty ate much less in the past two day. We’ve started syringe feeding. The Pepcid and anti-nausea med didn’t help to improve her appetite. Also, she’s started a new round of antibiotics for the infection.
In the past few day, her urine decreased significantly.
She sometimes went to see the bowl with food, then walked away. A sign that she may still want to eat.
[if !supportLists]1) 1）Can syringe feeding be used in long term? Any possible side effects?
[if !supportLists]2) 2）[endif]Should we try sucralfate slurry for possible esophagus or stomach pain， even though the doctor didn't recommend?
[if !supportLists]3) 3）Is the decrease of urea a dangerous sign of kidney dysfunction?
[if !supportLists]4) 4）Should we send Dusty to vet asap for some intensive treatment, and does that help?
Dusty’s latest blood work results are in this thread. Any suggestions are highly appreciated. We are quite stressed and a little depressed. But will try most to save our kitten.
In the past few day, her urine decreased significantly.
She sometimes went to see the bowl with food, then walked away. A sign that she may still want to eat.
[if !supportLists]1) 1）Can syringe feeding be used in long term? Any possible side effects?
[if !supportLists]2) 2）[endif]Should we try sucralfate slurry for possible esophagus or stomach pain， even though the doctor didn't recommend?
[if !supportLists]3) 3）Is the decrease of urea a dangerous sign of kidney dysfunction?
[if !supportLists]4) 4）Should we send Dusty to vet asap for some intensive treatment, and does that help?
Dusty’s latest blood work results are in this thread. Any suggestions are highly appreciated. We are quite stressed and a little depressed. But will try most to save our kitten.
I'm not sure I can be a lot of specific help, but it's hard to ready a kidney-related thread like this and not chime in. I'm sorry to hear what you are going through with Dusty. When I went through similar things with Amber a couple years ago, it was one of the most stressful and draining things I can remember. Amber was with me for all of her 17 years.
After Amber was diagnosed with kidney disease we went through rounds of various things after she didn't respond well to others. Sub-q fluids of course. Then cyproheptadine for appetite stimulant. Then Pepcid I. I don't rememeber the order of them all. We went to mirtazapine as well and Cerenia closer to the end. None of it had a super huge effect and we were syringe feeding.
A complication in Amber's case was congestive heart failure. We discovered this after she didn't seem to feel better with sub-q. This became a balancing issue and she was on lasix to help remove that fluid at the same time we were putting in extra fluid every couple days. I don't know if it's possible this is a complication in Dusty's case, but the CHF affects breathing, and any trouble breathing is a quick way to see a cat not eat on her own.
You can syringe feed for a fair amount of time I'd think. We did it for a few weeks or more I think, with some periods in between of her eating a little on her own. But looking back, I tend to think we maybe did it too long. The quality of life otherwise probably wasn't there in the last couple weeks.
So unfortunately I wonder if you are at an evaluation point here. Syringe feeding is typically done as a temporary measure to get through a crisis. Amber did not tolerate it well so all those days were days fighting to get food in her and a lot of the rest of the day spent practically hiding. Not good quality days. I just put that out here as indication of what you might want to look for in terms of making decisions. You never want to give up too soon but neither do you want to keep doing these things with no hope of better days ahead.
We syringe fed all those days because we still had hope of better days ahead. I thought that if we just turned some corner of the kidney disease she could have more good months. I knew my friend had a cat on sub-q for 3-4 years. But I wasn't counting on the congestive heart failure. My father is still living with CHF some 10+ years after his initial diagnosis, so I didn't realize how quick it would be to take Amber's life (about 3 months after initial kidney diagnosis). Amber had also had hyperthyroid for a few years so despite her treatment for that it probably contributed to the heart condition.
I wish I knew whether intensive treatment at a vet would help at this point. The real key would be trying to figure out why she is not eating. It may not be because of nausea/stomach upset. Another thing you mentioned is that her urine output slowed. If you are doing sub-q at the same rates this is surely indicative of something but I don't know what off the top of my head. Amber was retaining fluid and we diagnosed the CHF after just a week or two of sub-q. While this is maybe possible in Dusty's case too, there are likely other potential reasons this could happen.
It's a really tough time and I wish you all the best in getting through it.
After Amber was diagnosed with kidney disease we went through rounds of various things after she didn't respond well to others. Sub-q fluids of course. Then cyproheptadine for appetite stimulant. Then Pepcid I. I don't rememeber the order of them all. We went to mirtazapine as well and Cerenia closer to the end. None of it had a super huge effect and we were syringe feeding.
A complication in Amber's case was congestive heart failure. We discovered this after she didn't seem to feel better with sub-q. This became a balancing issue and she was on lasix to help remove that fluid at the same time we were putting in extra fluid every couple days. I don't know if it's possible this is a complication in Dusty's case, but the CHF affects breathing, and any trouble breathing is a quick way to see a cat not eat on her own.
You can syringe feed for a fair amount of time I'd think. We did it for a few weeks or more I think, with some periods in between of her eating a little on her own. But looking back, I tend to think we maybe did it too long. The quality of life otherwise probably wasn't there in the last couple weeks.
So unfortunately I wonder if you are at an evaluation point here. Syringe feeding is typically done as a temporary measure to get through a crisis. Amber did not tolerate it well so all those days were days fighting to get food in her and a lot of the rest of the day spent practically hiding. Not good quality days. I just put that out here as indication of what you might want to look for in terms of making decisions. You never want to give up too soon but neither do you want to keep doing these things with no hope of better days ahead.
We syringe fed all those days because we still had hope of better days ahead. I thought that if we just turned some corner of the kidney disease she could have more good months. I knew my friend had a cat on sub-q for 3-4 years. But I wasn't counting on the congestive heart failure. My father is still living with CHF some 10+ years after his initial diagnosis, so I didn't realize how quick it would be to take Amber's life (about 3 months after initial kidney diagnosis). Amber had also had hyperthyroid for a few years so despite her treatment for that it probably contributed to the heart condition.
I wish I knew whether intensive treatment at a vet would help at this point. The real key would be trying to figure out why she is not eating. It may not be because of nausea/stomach upset. Another thing you mentioned is that her urine output slowed. If you are doing sub-q at the same rates this is surely indicative of something but I don't know what off the top of my head. Amber was retaining fluid and we diagnosed the CHF after just a week or two of sub-q. While this is maybe possible in Dusty's case too, there are likely other potential reasons this could happen.
It's a really tough time and I wish you all the best in getting through it.
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I would have to agree with 2bcat that syringe feeding is really normally just for short term to get over a "hump". There is no reason that it cannot be used long term (we had a cat on a feeding tube for four months when he had Hepatic Lipidosis), but, again, that was not a permanent situation, we knew once he got well, the feeding tube would be removed. But quality of life IS something to think of. Is Dusty withdrawing from the family? If not, that's a good sign.
At this point, I think I would definitely discuss all options with the Vet, including the slurry. But I'm more concerned now with the urine output, or lack thereof. So is Dusty no longer drinking water either? But she's still getting her sub-q's, right? Something is definitely amiss there. She is urinating some though, correct? If not, she needs a Vet visit NOW. If she's urinating SOME, it could be a UTI, common in kidney cats.
Also, what infection is she taking antibiotics for (sorry if I missed that. I've even gone back and re-read this thread a couple of times and can't seem to find it
) It's quite possible that the antibiotic is affecting her appetite. My kidney cat often goes up to her bowl when I bring in her food, then walks away. When she does that, I think she's hungry and just doesn't want what I am offering, so i offer her something else. Usually by the 2nd or 3rd choice I find something she will eat.
At this point, I think I would definitely discuss all options with the Vet, including the slurry. But I'm more concerned now with the urine output, or lack thereof. So is Dusty no longer drinking water either? But she's still getting her sub-q's, right? Something is definitely amiss there. She is urinating some though, correct? If not, she needs a Vet visit NOW. If she's urinating SOME, it could be a UTI, common in kidney cats.
Also, what infection is she taking antibiotics for (sorry if I missed that. I've even gone back and re-read this thread a couple of times and can't seem to find it
I didn't find something conclusive to point to but you probably do need to key on the urine decrease. That is meaningful particularly combined with continued not eating and would likely benefit from vet discussion at least if not exam. The main reasons urine output decreases seem to be: infection (maybe this is what you're already going through, because you mentioned one), fluid retention (as mentioned above), blockage (females can't completely block but possibly they can have some kind of obstruction issue that could cause this), or kidneys are just no longer going to function (the worst case end-stage scenario).
The first three have potential of improvement. Let's hope it's one of those, even if it means more things to do. If your vet is not receptive to more discussion of such things, you may wish to get another opinion. If you have a house call vet available in your area, this may ease the stresses of the vet visit, but it seems like she could benefit from an exam to figure out what is the latest complication. I don't know if a house call vet can do an x-ray, though, which would be needed for some of those diagnoses. Just be aware, though, that one possibility is you've done all you could and this is it. Hang in there.
The first three have potential of improvement. Let's hope it's one of those, even if it means more things to do. If your vet is not receptive to more discussion of such things, you may wish to get another opinion. If you have a house call vet available in your area, this may ease the stresses of the vet visit, but it seems like she could benefit from an exam to figure out what is the latest complication. I don't know if a house call vet can do an x-ray, though, which would be needed for some of those diagnoses. Just be aware, though, that one possibility is you've done all you could and this is it. Hang in there.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #40
Thanks. Dusty is not withdrawing from the family. She is still happy with us and only a little more inactive than before. She's urinating SOME, but much less than before. Sometimes she went to the litter box then walked away. She still drinks normally and is on SQ fluids. She occasionally urinated outside the litter box, that's why we found the infection. But the vet has never definitely diagnosed where the infection is. It could be in the kidney, or a UTI. We started this new round of antibiotics because Dusty's blood results still show infection. In the past couple of days we tried to get her urine sample to examine the culture, but not succeeded.
I would have to agree with 2bcat that syringe feeding is really normally just for short term to get over a "hump". There is no reason that it cannot be used long term (we had a cat on a feeding tube for four months when he had Hepatic Lipidosis), but, again, that was not a permanent situation, we knew once he got well, the feeding tube would be removed. But quality of life IS something to think of. Is Dusty withdrawing from the family? If not, that's a good sign.
At this point, I think I would definitely discuss all options with the Vet, including the slurry. But I'm more concerned now with the urine output, or lack thereof. So is Dusty no longer drinking water either? But she's still getting her sub-q's, right? Something is definitely amiss there. She is urinating some though, correct? If not, she needs a Vet visit NOW. If she's urinating SOME, it could be a UTI, common in kidney cats.
Also, what infection is she taking antibiotics for (sorry if I missed that. I've even gone back and re-read this thread a couple of times and can't seem to find it) It's quite possible that the antibiotic is affecting her appetite. My kidney cat often goes up to her bowl when I bring in her food, then walks away. When she does that, I think she's hungry and just doesn't want what I am offering, so i offer her something else. Usually by the 2nd or 3rd choice I find something she will eat.
Will call the vet Monday to discuss all options.
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