Help with FIV cat with Ibd

pocho

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I have a FIV cat with Ibd. My other cats get fed raw but my FIV cat gets canned. He was a feral I brought in after his blood results came in positive. Truth be told he should have been brought in way before that considering he just wasn't able to thrive outside like other ferals. It has been a long hard road to hit upon a food that doesn't causes projectile vomiting or horrendous smelling diarrhea, let alone the incessant biting and scratching at paws and legs. It was when I switched to Nature's Variety rabbit canned that it stopped overnight. Interestingly when I tried Wild Callings rabbit canned his obsessive chewing on himself came back. I personally believe that the liver source is NOT rabbit but possibly a fowl source from his reaction. Or it is the brewers yeast. What else could it be? Also, if anyone knows, how long can I feed this one protein source to the poor baby? Won't he eventually develop an allergy? So hesitant to switch to raw and possibly cause more suffering. When I finally got him inside he had a deep wound on back of leg with no fur. His eyes were literally bleeding with swollen inner eyelids. His belly was bloated to the point he looked like he would burst with raw anus......just a mess. But he is safe now and given a very stress free environment to be the lap cat I guess he always wanted to be considering he is more affectionate than my original two inside kitties. So I would love some advice.
 

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Hi

So a couple thoughts.  Yes a cat on a novel protein diet can become allergic to it and then you have to switch.  My vet told me that OTC novel protein diets are cooked in the same vats as non-novel proteins and that DNA testing shows  that the novel diets are contaminated and that the only pure source are prescription novel diets that are only cooked in vats specifically for them.

IBD is a very tricky disease to manage and often requires a variety of treatments, medications and foods over time.  See http://www.thecatsite.com/a/inflammatory-bowel-disease-in-cats
 
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pocho

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Thankyou. I will try to find another novel protein source he can accept in his system and then start on homemade food eventually. I did try raw awhile back with him but it instigated an episode that lead to a vet visit. I never got a biopsy to confirm the IBD. The vet just assigned him that diagnosis from his symptoms...
 
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pocho

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I have yet to meet a cat that accepts venison. But lamb is what I will go for next considering when I switch to homemade that will be easier to find...He is a happy cat and most of the time not suffering. Although at first I really questioned myself after bringing him in. Last winter would have taken him out. I thought maybe it would have been for the best but now I see it was good to bring him in. Thankyou for suggestions.
 

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For the most part, I would do what has been working. As far as variety is concerned, you can try other novel protein foods, but if it doesn't work, you know what does. And if interested in raw, slowly incorporate and see how he does, but give it time. Get you some extra virgin coconut oil, unrefined. It's good for the gut and overall health of our pets. Balance and simplicity is the key, and with a holistic approach. Stay away from a lot of vaccines as well. U just have one of those cats. U must do that which works for you. 
 

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Thankyou. I will try to find another novel protein source he can accept in his system and then start on homemade food eventually. I did try raw awhile back with him but it instigated an episode that lead to a vet visit. I never got a biopsy to confirm the IBD. The vet just assigned him that diagnosis from his symptoms...
Hi, 2 more things to consider:  High quality commercial raw diets test their food for e-coli and salmonella, something you can't do at home.  Also, if your cat is loosing weight then it is likely his disease process is at a point that can't be controlled through diet alone.  Prednisilone is the usual next choice, but since it lowers the immune system this could be a concern in an FIV cat.  It could become a situation of poor choices, but worth discussing with your vet.

One doesn't usually biopsy to confirm mild to moderate IBD (no weight loss, but GI symptoms) but when there is trending weight loss there is also the possibility that it's small cell lymphoma, and distinguishing between those 2 diseases can only  be done by biopsy, and preferably before any steroid therapy is started. 
 
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pocho

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This all good to know. I myself am a big coconut oil person and Giuseppe, my inside feral, begs for it. I might start some slow feeding of raw....
 

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This all good to know. I myself am a big coconut oil person and Giuseppe, my inside feral, begs for it. I might start some slow feeding of raw....
It's very important to weigh him and track his weight.  If he's losing weight he will need more aggressive therapy
 
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pocho

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He was oddly overweight when he was a free roamer. His potbelly looked like a bowling ball. At first I thought of it as cute because the ferals where I live are fed by many and some kitties really learn to exploit this....then I notice all the diarrhea and other health issues. So he has lost weight but part is just that being inside he can't go from door to door begging. I will start keeping track though. One thing I have incorporated successfully and seems beneficial is raw goat milk. What do you think about that choice? I assume it is good but you never know with his health issues. ?
 

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He was oddly overweight when he was a free roamer. His potbelly looked like a bowling ball. At first I thought of it as cute because the ferals where I live are fed by many and some kitties really learn to exploit this....then I notice all the diarrhea and other health issues. So he has lost weight but part is just that being inside he can't go from door to door begging. I will start keeping track though. One thing I have incorporated successfully and seems beneficial is raw goat milk. What do you think about that choice? I assume it is good but you never know with his health issues. ?
I would make sure he has been wormed and for tapeworm also. Besides enlarged liver pot belly can be sign of tapeworms which also cause vomiting, there is specific meds for tapeworms.
 
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bonepicker

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My vomiter has done really well on Merrick pates, weruva and tiki cat puka luau and prides rockstar rabbit. I wormed her multiple times and added vets best hairball relief tabs it has slippery elm and psyllium in it. She was feral. No longer does she vomit or need vets best. I also stopped feeding dry
 
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stephenq

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He was oddly overweight when he was a free roamer. His potbelly looked like a bowling ball. At first I thought of it as cute because the ferals where I live are fed by many and some kitties really learn to exploit this....then I notice all the diarrhea and other health issues. So he has lost weight but part is just that being inside he can't go from door to door begging. I will start keeping track though. One thing I have incorporated successfully and seems beneficial is raw goat milk. What do you think about that choice? I assume it is good but you never know with his health issues. ?
I would be cautious explaining his weight loss due to coincidental reasons (like being an indoor cat).  Indoor cats are more likely to gain  weight in comparison to outdoor cats, and weight loss is weight loss and with IBD the first suspect is and must be the disease itself.  My vet says this "One weight loss measurement is an event, twice is a trend and the third time clearly indicates an illness or problem"  I would weigh my cat once a week and if you had three losses in a row, even a one ounce loss is "loss", and I would treat accordingly.  The time to get ahead of IBD is now, and is easier earlier not later.
 
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pocho

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Yes I am weighing now. He is a very muscular think cat. He weighs 12pounds. I got a fecal flotation done. By any chance do you know if that tests for tapeworms? Eitherway it has stopped with the rabbit as protein but I am very concerned for his FIV and IBD.
 

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Yes I am weighing now. He is a very muscular think cat. He weighs 12pounds. I got a fecal flotation done. By any chance do you know if that tests for tapeworms? Eitherway it has stopped with the rabbit as protein but I am very concerned for his FIV and IBD.
TRhe eggs can show up in a flotation test but my understanding is it isn't guaranteed.  A PCR test will give you a definitive answer, but so would seeing worms in the stool.  I understand your concern re: IBD and FIV.
 

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Pocho, I have an FIV+ boy. I feed him raw along with the other cats. If you're concerned about pathogens, if you're in the U.S. perhaps consider the commercial raw foods treated with High Pressure Pasturization? Nature's Variety has stuff other than chicken (though I don't know that any of it is single-source protein).

The problem for many IBD kitties - apart from the need for single-source proteins - is stuff that is added to the food. Thickeners, for example, can be a real problem. That could easily be the difference between Wild Calling and Nature's Variety. NV only uses montmorillonite clay - no carrageenan, no xanthan gum, no guar gum. Check out this thread - perhaps the work @GoHolistic has put into identifying foods and her rotation would work for you and your FIV boy? (Canned foods and some home cooked). Because it really is best to have a rotation for so many reasons, and tolerance to the protein is a main one. http://www.thecatsite.com/t/274500/best-rotation-to-prevent-food-allergies

But I also take steps to help is body manage the FIV - and it's not immune boosting stuff. I picked out the potentially most-effective steps that are easy to do from this site: http://www.fivtherapy.com/bdltimetherapy.htm

Every-other-month I give Chumley Jarrow Lactoferrin. It is a 250mg capsule split into two doses, half capsule AM and PM sprinkled on his food. I also give him a thymus glandular (Nutricology). I can't afford the thymus peptides. I give him 1 capsule daily every-other month.

With the weight loss, it could easily be malabsorption due to the IBD. Obviously you want to avoid using pred to treat the inflammation. Many are having great success using a combination of digestive enzymes (Prozyme Plus or Animal Essentials Probiotic & Enzymes), probiotics (I rotate between Nexabiotic, 1/2 capsule 2x a day; Renew Life Ultimate Flora, 15 billion CFU, 1/2 capsule 2x a day; and Natural Factors double-strength acidophilus and bifidus, 1/2 capsule 2x a day), and a yeast-based probiotic, S boulardii. http://www.thecatsite.com/t/283161/saccharomyces-boulardii-use-for-diarrhea-and-gi-disease-incl-ibd

I also use curcumin, one month on, one month off. This post has information on curcumin in IBD, but there is also discussion of the use of curcumin in "treatment" of FIV on the FIVtherapy website. http://www.thecatsite.com/t/282828/curcumin-in-treatment-of-ibd
 
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pocho

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Thankyou so much. I will be reading all the links. I was directed to a FIV website months and months ago possibly by you. ? I started adding an array of supplements...it was over load. The lactoferrin is still in my fridge. That in particular made him puke violently immediately. He foamed at the mouth puked food up and didn't stop till bile came up. When I switched him to raw it inspired a IBD episode. I went with Primal raw and thought maybe one of the added herds caused it. So I backed off and found this one simple canned food that is working. I do add pumpkin and a probiotic plus raw goat milk as treat. The one thing I do need to put in perspective is he came from a colony of ferals that literally are being over fed. I probably need to take pics for people to believe but some of the ferals are actually overweight to a disturbing level. And lots of it is extremely unhealthy like hotdogs, ham, pizza and generic toxic kibble. He was on that communal diet his whole life. I feel for all the years of eating that crap I have to give him equal time to adjust to healthy eating. Slow and steady with endless reassurance and love. Thankyou so much. This site is beyond helpful and my boy Giuseppe is totally benefiting.
 
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pocho

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I have just been watching YouTube videos by Dr. Karen Becker associated with Mercola site. She says there is a blood test for IBD that checks for two different B vit levels. She also thinks most IBD is initiated by missed parasite presence and mentioned two parasites not treatable by broad spectrum dewormers. Any opinions on her perspective?
 
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