siamese or balinese?

pookalali

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These are not my pictures, and I couldn't get much but what the person had. The mother is a black domestic short hair and they think the father was Siamese but after reading how fluffy they were and being listed as medium hair I'm thinking blue point Balinese? The black kitten is her brother, so fluffy! I assume he's the same.
 

StefanZ

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Balinese and siamese, stricly speaking, arent exact descriptions of looks, but they are breeds.    Although they are often used for helping to a quick description, and should be read as "look alike".

Whom exactly you refer to by "reading how fluffy they were" - the father or the kittens??

If it is the kittens, the answer will be: we really cant know for sure.   Small kittens arent reliable witnesses to their looks as adults.  They are often more fluffy then later on.  So this cute fluffiness may be just kitten fluffiness, its not at all sure its the beginning of being medium haired.

If it is the father; this would be a heavy indicium he is not at all purebred, but a look alike:  if even the owners dont have a clue, thinking he is a siamese while he is a balinese / balinese look alike, so the probablility he is purebred is almost nil.   Folks usually KNOW if they do own a purebred at home, even if they dont have all the paperwork (which they should have to be sure. - Compare with your pass or your birth certificate.  Without them you arent much better than an illegal immigrant no?  Note, Im not saying nothing bad about illegal immigrants.  Most of them are nice decent people, and not so few becomes good american citizens with time and a lot of hard, honest work.   I just  say the facts).

Also, their faces of the kittens.  They are rather flattish.  Far from the rather prolonged muzzles of old type siamese, and the even more prolonged muzzle and sleek body of the modern siamese...

I dont see the mom clearly.  Although the little what I see hints she must be rather pretty.  And I dont get impression of flat muzzle on her..

So I wonder what the look alike the father really was...  He was perhaps  more of a Himalayan (pointed persian - often "old type persian" - ie with the face not so fully flat as in a typical modern persian)

Balineses usually dont have the prolonged muzzle of modern siamese, sooner more of the muzzle of old type siamese.   But still...

And Himalayns persians are often not so fully flat faced as modern persians.

So.   Much talk, and I cant give really good answers.  I have too little hard facts stand on.  Not even good pics of dad and mom.  Its only good pics of the kittens.

If you want to have a balinese / siamese for real - this is not the way.  Try instead perhaps, there is an organisation for rescuing and rehoming of siameses and balineses.  They do also admit some looks alikes.

If you want  a  pointed kitten, who with some imagination can be said to be a look alike - sure.  Go on.     :)

But forgive me for saying this.  I myself would probably try with buying out this mom - she seems to be a quiet beauty.    :)

Good luck!
 
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pookalali

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StefanZ StefanZ
I should have been more specific. Sorry.
The kittens, including the mother are rescues. They have no clue who the father is but assume he was Siamese.
I don't care for a specific breed, just ended up falling in love with that little cutie and helped out by adopting him :)
I'm just curious to find out what breed he must be.
 

StefanZ

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@StefanZ
I should have been more specific. Sorry.
The kittens, including the mother are rescues. They have no clue who the father is but assume he was Siamese.
I don't care for a specific breed, just ended up falling in love with that little cutie and helped out by adopting him

I'm just curious to find out what breed he must be.
Ah, in that case he wasnt necessary a point himself.   He can also have  been a carrier of the point gene, exactly like the mom is.

Btw, is the mom herself a medium/long haired, or is she shorthaired?   In usure cases look at the tail - a bushy tail reveals the truth.

IF she is shorthaired, then we do know the kittens are just fluffy.  
 

StefanZ

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IF she is shorthaired, then we do know the kittens are just fluffy.  
Wait, here I was thinking too fast.    Sorry!

Nay, the probability increases, but its not at all sure. 

She can be a carrier of the longhair gene, exactlhy as we know she is a carrier of the point gene.

Both genes are recessive, so if the other gene in that gene pair is other, the kitten gets the other looks.

What was I thinking on? 

Probably I though  if BOTH kittens being longhaired from a shorthair mom is not very probable - but the statistics arent ironclad.

Sorry, I suspect we cant know for sure before they had grown up some.  
 
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StefanZ

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Also, their faces of the kittens.  They are rather flattish.  Far from the rather prolonged muzzles of old type siamese, and the even more prolonged muzzle and sleek body of the modern siamese...
 
To speak the truth, not even these flattish face is very much saying at this age.  Its in much a feature of  kittens, alike fluffy hair may be.

So, as for the real hair type, you must wait several weeks to know more sure the muzzle type too...   It probably wont be so prolonged as in modern siamese, but it may still be triangularish.

We will see, I hope you will report at this time.    :)
 
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pookalali

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I will definitely post updated pictures as he grows :)
 
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pookalali

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So, I have updated pictures. He, turned out to be a she, for one :p
And she definitely has long hair. I thought seal point when looking at her but noticed her paws are more of a blue tint and her ears have blue in them as well.
Maybe because she's still so small?
Updated photos anyway :)

PS. I have medicine for her eye. Just wanted that to be cleared for questions haha.


 

Willowy

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Eee, what a cutie!

The pointed gene is fairly common among moggies. It originated only from true Siamese brought over from Thailand, but there's no telling how far back the actual Siamese was in their heritage. Could be a grandparent, could be a hundred generations ago! But both parents have to carry the pointed gene for a kitten to inherit it. She'll probably darken a lot as she gets older---non-purebreds rarely keep the very light body with dark points like the purebred enthusiasts strive to breed for. In non-show-quality kitties the dark points tend to spread.
 

jbejara11

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What does she look like now? She is sooo cute here in these baby pics! I say maybe a siamese mic maybe with ragdoll even! Or himy
 
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