Cat Introduction Woes

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losna

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Sinbad loves the new open layout as I rearrange the house to try and lure out Tempest. He's been a fiend all day, demanding TONS OF PLAY!!! This has made Tempest happier, too, because he's downstairs running around rather than bugging her. 




 

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  That photo strip is magic!!!   The first photo is hilarious with his little fingers all spread out there, and his face and tail markings make Sinbad look like a racoon!  
 

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Sinbad loves the new open layout as I rearrange the house to try and lure out Tempest. He's been a fiend all day, demanding TONS OF PLAY!!! This has made Tempest happier, too, because he's downstairs running around rather than bugging her. 


Ignore the ugly decor. We haven't painted or anything since we bought this house and the previous owners had hideous taste. You should see the curtains, omg can we say eye blinding.  


I know you're right, @cat nap  I just fuss whenever I see them looking sad. 

The first one makes me laugh!!! 
  It does show the way he spreads out his toes to use them like fingers!! 
...Yes, all these photos are causing me to stop, and go play with my own animals now. 

Problem is, they just want to sleep and nap at this moment.   So will try again, later. 


Umm...Losna...you mentioned "ugly decor"...I don't know about interior decor at all, and with a cat in the photos, playing, laying, jumping, sleeping....I doubt I would notice anything else.

(MServant is better, though, since she notices the details about cats, fur, markings etc.)  I'll notice things, if someone points them out, to me. 

The "looking sad part"...I confess, I do that too...when I "think" they look sad.  But more than likely, they are thinking..."I wish this girl would just stop with the 'staring and looking at me, already'...I just want to sleep, groom, relax, and pass the time in comfort...and does she have to watch television movies and end up with tears, sometimes.  Geesh, these humans are strange."

Thanks, for that "Butterfly Thread" that you created, I will go there now to look at it.

Thinking that this thread's name will have to be changed from "woes" to eventual "progress". 
  Sinbad and Tempest, will have to have a new exercise thread called "Cats that Exercise with their Humans". 
 
 
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losna

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@MServant  I will do my best to get a similar series for Tempest. It's harder for me to get action shots of her though, so it may take a few days. But here's one from a while ago, she's playing with my hubby. She likes 3D playtime and runs up and down that post to pounce from on high.


They would make an amazing hunting team if they could work together. I have no doubt that once she's coming out freely our house will be forever more free of insects. He has a higher perception than she does, but doesn't really know what to do once he's found prey. She has the hunting instinct, but isn't as good at actually finding things.

Seeing her out of her room with my hubby though, I am actually far more hopeful than I've ever been. If we can just get over this hurdle, she may very well be willing to snuggle with him eventually.
 

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@Losna   I might be wrong but this last couple of days I'm thinking there have been loads of signs of things going well here.  
    Tempest and Sinbad's liking for completely different 'terraine' is interesting and something else you could put to good use too if your home space allows for it.  If they each prefer a different kind of space then perhaps Sinbad will be less prone to chase Tempest for snuggles when he is racing about open spaces and she is up high in the middle of a forrest of furnishing.  

They both looks SO fit in your photographs: it's making me feel guilty about how Mouse's paunch has been growing lately.  
    I bought him a couple of new toys today and had him rolling and squirming about on the floor for a while and then up on his back paws trying to catch stuff so there is hope for him yet.  
 
 
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@Losna    What is "3D playtime" ??  Does it just mean "3 dimensional playing"....or is it some sort of new cat toy?

 
@Losna   I might be wrong but this last couple of days I'm thinking there have been loads of signs of things going well here.  
    Tempest and Sinbad's liking for completely different 'terraine' is interesting and something else you could put to good use too if your home space allows for it.  If they each prefer a different kind of space then perhaps Sinbad will be less prone to chase Tempest for snuggles when he is racing about open spaces and she is up high in the middle of a forrest of furnishing.  

They both looks SO fit in your photographs: it's making me feel guilty about how Mouse's paunch has been growing lately.  
    I bought him a couple of new toys today and had him rolling and squirming about on the floor for a while and then up on his back paws trying to catch stuff so there is hope for him yet.  
 
I have to agree.  Allowing Sinbad the lowlands, and giving Tempest the high "forests" spaces...is such an excellent idea.    
 
 
 
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losna

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@MServant   The vet is always delighted with Sinbad and Tempest's weight. She says they are the ideal weight! Yay!

@cat nap   I just meant 3 dimensional. Sinbad likes to run around on the floor. There are only 3 times when he climbs: when he wants daddy's praises for climbing his cat post, when he's chasing Tempest and she runs up onto something, or when I'm playing video games and he really  wants my attention. He'll struggle up onto my desk, slipping and sliding all the way. Tempest, on the other hand, has never met an object that isn't worthy of climbing. Up on my desk, up the bookshelves, piles of boxes; she loves vertical space. I've seen her jump 5 feet into the air! She's like super gymnast!

In that box tower shot above, what she's staring so intently at are the bookshelves that have never been in reach before. Shortly after I put my cell phone down, we got to watch her gauging the distance in an attempt to see if she could jump to it. It was very fascinating! She reached out with one paw, and did a series of lean/swipes - it looked very much like the preliminary movements that I've seen freerunners do when about to try something new.

That's why I am re-arranging the house. It's taking me a while due to injuries and health, but once I finish we'll have room for more cat trees for Tempest to climb and hide on. 

That box shot actually illustrates the difference between their climb/jumping. She looked at it, stood on her hind legs to investigate, then jumped straight up into the air and landed in that little box on top in one smooth leap. Sinbad couldn't get up at all. He could climb on top if that little box was there, but that little box completely blocked him.
 
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.....

@cat nap   I just meant 3 dimensional. Sinbad likes to run around on the floor. There are only 3 times when he climbs: when he wants daddy's praises for climbing his cat post, when he's chasing Tempest and she runs up onto something, or when I'm playing video games and he really  wants my attention. He'll struggle up onto my desk, slipping and sliding all the way. Tempest, on the other hand, has never met an object that isn't worthy of climbing. Up on my desk, up the bookshelves, piles of boxes; she loves vertical space. I've seen her jump 5 feet into the air! She's like super gymnast!

In that box tower shot above, what she's staring so intently at are the bookshelves that have never been in reach before. Shortly after I put my cell phone down, we got to watch her gauging the distance in an attempt to see if she could jump to it. It was very fascinating! She reached out with one paw, and did a series of lean/swipes - it looked very much like the preliminary movements that I've seen freerunners do when about to try something new.

That's why I am re-arranging the house. It's taking me a while due to injuries and health, but once I finish we'll have room for more cat trees for Tempest to climb and hide on. 

That box shot actually illustrates the difference between their climb/jumping. She looked at it, stood on her hind legs to investigate, then jumped straight up into the air and landed in that little box on top in one smooth leap. Sinbad couldn't get up at all. He could climb on top if that little box was there, but that little box completely blocked him.
Lol...I thought it was some new cat toy, that I never heard of, because before joining this Site, I did not even know what "Da Bird' was.
  thanks for the explanation.


I find it very interesting how some cats love heights, while others stay low.  (My cat Spotty was like this when younger....until the age of 8...(he will be 15 in june).  He liked to just "perch" on anywhere higher than 5 or 6 feet and sleep. Top of bookshelves, dressers, etc.  He still will jump now, but only up to 3 feet vertical...which is fine by me.

Does Sinbad not like boxes...if they are on the floor?
 
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losna

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He loves floor boxes. I've got a box on the floor in the bedroom, the hall, 3 in the living room and 1 in the dining room for him. Anything on the ground and cavelike is good enough for him! That little box is too small and high for him though - The only reason he wanted into it is because she'd rubbed her cheeks all over the flaps and he could smell her on it. 
 

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He loves floor boxes. I've got a box on the floor in the bedroom, the hall, 3 in the living room and 1 in the dining room for him. Anything on the ground and cavelike is good enough for him! That little box is too small and high for him though - The only reason he wanted into it is because she'd rubbed her cheeks all over the flaps and he could smell her on it. 
You know, I know I am not supposed to be laughing, but all those boxes, and boxes...and Sinbad...still chooses the one, that Tempest was in. 
 


Was he named after the sailor guy??  Because I don't remember that sailor being so lovey?
 
 
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Well, he likes to explore, so Sinbad seemed an apt name. When we were visiting with him at the shelter before we adopted him, he was trying to peek into every nook and cranny in the room. Though in retrospect, I am recalling that it was all floor exploration. 
 

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We're not sure if she likes the texture, that we gave it to her, that it smells like both of us (because I made it, and the husband sleeps on it quite often), but whatever the reason, we'll take it. I wouldn't call them friends, but it's now 1:30 and we haven't heard a single growl or hiss since their fight yesterday. 
Beautiful kitty!
 
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Tempest is now trying new tactics!

He was up at the gate bugging her, and instead of hiding the way she has been since their fights, she crept up to the gate, all stealthy/stalky like. Only she was in plain view, not trying to actually hide. She laid herself down, completely flat with her little paws out front like she was prepping a pounce, and just stared  at him. Every now and again, her butt would do the twitch-wiggle as though she prepping a pounce. And she just kept staring  at him.

He didn't know what to do. After a minute or two he sort of rolled backward, and floundered away downstairs, making whiny little confused sounds. At which point she simply sat up and began grooming daintily.

It was brilliant, like she was saying, "How does it feel to be stared at, you little punk?". 
 
 

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Tempest is now trying new tactics!

He was up at the gate bugging her, and instead of hiding the way she has been since their fights, she crept up to the gate, all stealthy/stalky like. Only she was in plain view, not trying to actually hide. She laid herself down, completely flat with her little paws out front like she was prepping a pounce, and just stared  at him. Every now and again, her butt would do the twitch-wiggle as though she prepping a pounce. And she just kept staring  at him.

He didn't know what to do. After a minute or two he sort of rolled backward, and floundered away downstairs, making whiny little confused sounds. At which point she simply sat up and began grooming daintily.

It was brilliant, like she was saying, "How does it feel to be stared at, you little punk?". 
 
   I love these updates!  
 
 

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   Way to go Tempest!  
    It sounds like she has been practicing her cat communication skills and remembered how to assert her self.   As long as Sinbad doesn't end up anxious and brow-beaten by his up and coming boss this sounds like progress.  Much better than them scrapping.   Hopefully once Tempest feels more confident she can hold Sinbad back from his big cuddles she will start to venture in to shared spaces with him.  Paws crossed.  
 
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Two updates in one day!! I am completely and utterly blown away by what just happened.

I was sitting here at the computer when Sinbad came up and started whining. The really insistent kind where he is climbing on my computer case and pawing at me. I figured he wanted more play time, because he's been an absolute play fiend since that room was cleared out - but no. He led me ... to Tempest's room!  

And not because she was sick, he wanted me to spend time with her!!!

I gave them treats, and got some cuddle time in with her. It wasn't long. Good intentions aside, he is still emotionally needy so after about 10 minutes he started pawing at the gate and I thought I wouldn't push it any longer than that. I gave them both more treats, and more praises and curled up with Sinbad by his post until he fell asleep.

But 10 minutes of being away from me at his instigation is an absolutely amazing amount of progress for him. 

Hopefully she realized that he was the one leading me to spend time with her. I think she did, because she jumped into my lap rather than ran away from me the way she usually does when he's there.

Things are really looking good for the two of them today.
 

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@Losna
I love those wiggly bottom things. My blighty does it when he goes to attack a toy. So sweet.
 
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losna

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Sinbad and Tempest really do have such a complex relationship.

Yesterday they ran the full gamut - he zoomed up to greet her excitedly the moment he woke up as usual. And as usual she hissed and swatted at him. She is really cranky in the mornings, and he's a super excited loon. 


Then around snack time they become a team, working in tandem to get treats. Sometimes they will manage enough camaraderie that I'll give them extras. They didn't work together well enough yesterday, but I did give them extras anyway because she mischievously pounced his tail. I really do love that expression she gets right before she does it! One of these days I'll have a camera handy. You can just see  the mischief being planned as she eyes him.  


Even without a surfeit of camaraderie, I am still happy because at least they are sitting within touching distance and getting along. 

Later in the day she was in the office - I will happily note that her time out of her room has indeed been giving her increased confidence. She used to cling to my hubby in fear until they were in the office and the door was closed. Yesterday she was so excited to be out that she climbed up his shoulder and leaped off in the hall and trotted happily to the office on her own with her tail high in the air.

She ran around making mischief and exploring, until Sinbad became aware that she was in the office and pressed his face right up to the crack under the door. Then she hissed, swatted and retreated to the very far end of the room. And that's where she stayed until my hubby  brought her back up to her room.

But we're not done yet...

More of usual behavior for most of the evening. Sinbad parked outside her room 'singing' at her trying to get her to come out and play. She alternates between hiding and hissing, except for one moment when she crept up to the gate and pressed noses with him. This of course excited him so much he aggravated her by pouncing at the gate trying to get more attention until she hissed and swatted and retreated again.

Sinbad and I share respiratory problems. Last night there was something in the air that got both of us, so I curled up with tea, and he slunk around the house crying in distress. When he does this, Tempest runs up to the gate and .. well, the best I can describe it really is stands vigil. She sits at attention, looking worried, head and ears following the movement of Sinbad's cries as he moves around the house.

It's just such a dizzying array. She's terrified of him - but she's not? If she was truly afraid of him she wouldn't mischievously pounce his tail, right? And it's definitely mischief not malice that prompts the pouncing. There's no aggression in her body language at all when she does it, and her expression just prior is the same expression she makes just before she pounces my husband's hair (she actually bites his hair and tugs playfully on it. Hahaha so cute.). She cares about him - she must if she worries when he makes distressed cries? 

I am more and more convinced that all that needs to happen now is for her to get the confidence to swat him when they are face to face rather than flee.
 

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@Losna   this does sound like big progress, even though they seem to go through just about every emotion / response in the book within a day.   I suspect you are right in thinking Tempest just needs to build up her confidence, and the signs are there that she is now doing this.  Sinbad has to figure out how to approach Tempest as well which will be equally hard, if not more so!

It sounds very cute how she pounces his tail.  I can imagine that cheeky looks she gets in her eye before she does it too.  Poor Sinbad having to work out what kind of a reception he's going to get each time they are in the same space.  
 
 

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I am more and more convinced that all that needs to happen now is for her to get the confidence to swat him when they are face to face rather than flee.
It's interesting...this last line, you wrote about Tempest.

It is possibly about "Fight or Flight" in a cat. 

Would you want a cat to stand up and fight, to establish its territory, or show its boundary of annoyance. Or would you want a cat to run and flee.

(I guess with my own cats, I would want them to flee, and escape possible injury....BUT then, if they don't stand up and fight,... (have the confidence to "swat, hiss, wrestle"...and take a risk (of being injured or painful encounter)...will they learn that an encounter, is not always as painful, or dangerous.)

I'm glad that I don't have to make any of these decisions for my cats...but rather let them decide, or react to their own "fight or flight" responses.  (Of course, this response it probably wired in to them from birth, and just learned how to deal with it, as they grow (though, I think, my cats were runners and fighters...just depending upon the day). It would be so difficult for me to just sit and watch while a potential real cat fight can happen.  So yes, I would want to try and prevent or de-escalate my cats' "fight" response.)

I hope that your Tempest does get more and more confidence, everyday...and that Sinbad learns what she likes and doesn't...and hopefully they will get so used to each other's ways, that the "getting along" aspect...will just progress from here.
 
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