kittens fighting while nursing

I started feeding a stray cat about 6-7 weeks ago.  She snuck in a small opening in a dock door in a warehouse I have.  She is pretty social, and once she got to know me a bit, affectionate.  She came & went for a bit until I fixed the door, and seemed content to be an inside cat, the warehouse is about 50k square feet, but she settled into a spot, still roams at night and checks things out, but mostly likes to hang under my desk.  She was pregnant when she arrived, we didn't know at first but it became obvious.  I am not a cat guy, and only know what I have researched since adopting her.  She gave birth about 2 1/2  weeks ago.  2 were born on Saturday, both premature and died.  A third was born on Sunday, and is fine.  I took her & the kitten to a mobile vet our local animal shelter has, and had both checked out.  They are fine, and I did make an appointment to have her spayed, shots, etc. in about a month.  While I was there the shelter folks asked me if they could use my Momma cat as a foster mom. They had 2 kittens, about the same age, that they have been bottle feeding.

I agreed to take the 2 kittens, brought them back to the warehouse, and after Momma sniffed them up & down for about 5 minutes, she started to feed & groom the orphans.  Here is what I notice now after 3 days.  The bottle fed kittens didn't know how to feed at first but caught on, and the one I had is used to feeding wherever it wants.  They are brutal when feeding kicking and scratching each other off the nipple.  Kittens crying and rolling around.  Momma doesn't intervene at all, she just lays back.  The original is a bully, is bigger, and has reached the point of hurting the other kittens, but now they do it back.  There's plenty of room for all, but they don't get it.  Either that, or Momma isn't producing enough milk? They always seem to fight over the nipples on the bottom.  One of the orphans is a little smaller than the other, and it is the one that usually gets kicked off.  I have taken to putting it on while the others sleep, which Momma makes herself available for.

When they're not feeding they seem ok, and all sleep in a group, all balled up on each other.

My question is, will they learn to co-exist, or am I in for a long month of making sure they all get fed?

jimo said:

  They are brutal when feeding kicking and scratching each other off the nipple.  Kittens crying and rolling around.  Momma doesn't intervene at all, she just lays back.  The original is a bully, is bigger, and has reached the point of hurting the other kittens, but now they do it back.  There's plenty of room for all, but they don't get it.  Either that, or Momma isn't producing enough milk? They always seem to fight over the nipples on the bottom.  One of the orphans is a little smaller than the other, and it is the one that usually gets kicked off.  I have taken to putting it on while the others sleep, which Momma makes herself available for.
When they're not feeding they seem ok, and all sleep in a group, all balled up on each other.

My question is, will they learn to co-exist, or am I in for a long month of making sure they all get fed?

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They arent always peacefully coexisting.  Such fights arent unusual, although you do describe it extra accurately.  Or extra graphic, if you so wish.  What you did to put forwards the smallest while the others are sleeping is one of the tricks to try with.  You perhaps find other solutions too along the same ideas.

Yes, the nipplest down there seems to be the most popular.

If they get enough / mom produces enough?  The only way to know for sure is to weigh them every day, at the same time.  Use an electronical kitchen or mail scale, weigting in grammes.  They can be quite cheap.

Experienced rescuers dont always weigh, as being experienced, they notice with just looking and helding them some, if they gain properly or not.

But for all less experienced the weighing procedure helps much.

Till you have some reference points to compare with, make sure mom gets first class nourishments,  wet canned food or first rate kitten food, as much as she wishes and manage.   Some cheese or plain full fat youghurt  is useful too if she ates such.

And yes, be prepared they will be such small barbarians for some time more, at least what feeding is.   

It may be so they dont get enough.  In these cases the fighting becomes of course more violent.   So wise if you prepare gears to give supplemnt feeding.

Can you get home goat milk?    If they wont need it, you can take it instead of cream to your coffe or tea  (tea english -style).

Tx a lot for helping them all!

Good luck!

StefanZ said:

You perhaps find other solutions too along the same ideas.

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Our experienced rescuer Catwoman707 suggested an idea along these lines.   You prepare an extra, small bed, with a heating pad on low intensity being a part of it.  But place enough if it becomes too warm, the kitten may crawl aside.  You have the extra bed near moms bed, so mom dont gets anxious.   And when the biggest, strongest kitten has eaten and is pleased, you put it in there to sleep.  Having it nice and cozy, it will sleep there happily, no problems.   During the time, you have the weaker siblings calmly at moms breasts.   And you arent stressed the bigger kitter is freezing lying there alone.

Or you simply have half of them there, and the others here.  And swich them now and them, when their time for washing and milk has come.

If you got to supplement feed them, and one is really weak, one idea may be, the weakest is with mom the whole time and thus gets most of the moms care, and the strongest get the supplement feeding, but less of moms milk.

This trick is most useful if its a good mom who is caring much, but perhaps doesnt has milk enough.

If the mom isnt caring much, its better YOU do the most work.

But this your mom here seems to be a friendly and good mom.

Excellent advice from @StefanZ

A big reason this commonly happens is because believe it or not, by the end of the first week or so, kittens choose their favorite nipple and will nurse on that particular one throughout the entire time they are with mom.

So I would guess that one/both of the newcomers have chosen the first baby's choice spot and they definitely get to scrapping over it! 

Thanks for all the advice.

I will try the advice on what to feed Momma for sure, as a supplement or snack.  When I realized she was pregnant, I started feeding her canned kitten food, and dry kitten food.  When she was alone with the one kitten she ate 1 can a day, but now she is eating 2 cans a day and nibbling on the dry food.  I've only seen her feeding all 3 at the same time a few times, and its a tangle of bodies, they don't line up 1,2,3...have one laying sideways, one burrowed up under, the other in the middle somewhere and they still scratch & claw each other.   I have notice Momma feeding them 1 or 2 at a time more though.  The Momma cat looks real young, but she seems to be working it out.  Man, she bathes them a lot, she is constantly bathing one of them, wakes them up for a bath.  She rarely leaves them, even if she does go for a walk, she returns within 5 minutes.  It is also really warm here (Georgia) and that warehouse is like a sauna almost.

 I think they will be okay, I guess I was just freaked out a little, having no experience.  The 2 orphans are gray, and smaller, but still pretty feisty. They will still try and nurse on a finger, I guess from the bottle feeding. The original is dark with brown & white stripes,  a white belly and really chubby. Guess I will have to break down & name them, but have no idea if they are boys or girls.  The original is 3 weeks old this Sunday, and the other 2 are probably a few days younger, but all have their eyes open and kind of stumble around the box.  I'm glad the original kitten will have the others to play with when they start getting up and around in a couple of weeks.

Thanks again.