Obi keeps throwing up hairballs.. : (

myrnafaye said:

 
Thank you so much!  I think we can probably stop the metaclopramide, although there is a script waiting for me...

two questions:

1.  please tell me how you administer the slippery elm, where you get it, and how you dose it, do you put it on his food?

2.  What if he is overgrooming because of allergies?  are you saying that the hairballs should still pass?  but, if he has an allergy, what on earth do I do about that?? getting to the bottom of allergies seems like an exercise in futility...

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1. If you look back at my response in your other thread (http://www.thecatsite.com/t/277801/another-egg-yolk-lecithin-question), you will find instructions there for working with Slippery Elm.

2. Allergies and hairballs are two different issues. In order to determine if Obi has an allergy related to food, you would need to do a food trial of a novel protein and feed nothing but this for 4-6 weeks, minimum. If you see an improvement in the symptoms, then you know that the allergy is food-related. Environmental allergies are more challenging as the allergen could be anything from fleas, to household products used, to something in the air. This requires some trial and error and removing different things that may be triggers.

The over-grooming can also be psychological. As this took place before the introduction of the medications, you need to do a little thinking about what changes you made, or took place in your home before March, that may have/be contributing to the over-grooming. Even though Obi may not be exhibiting obvious signs of stress, over-grooming is typically a compulsive behavior as the result of some change when there are no medical reasons for it such as fleas, diet or a skin condition. Here is an interesting article at Mercola Pets that discusses psychogenic alopecia, or over-grooming in pets : http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/09/10/cats-excessive-grooming.aspx

EDIT : If you plan to discontinue the Metaclopramide and introduce the Slippery Elm, please discuss this before hand with your vet so that he/she can be in the loop.

OK, so I can get slippery elm up the street, w/o magnesium stearate.  So do I continue with the EYL and the metameucil?  what about the pepcid?

Honestly, I dont think anything else has changed that is stressing Obi - I understand what you are saying about it being a kind of OCD behavior, but he is really a laid back cat - except when it comes to his food!  I thought, as did one vet, that the abdominal licking might be related to GI discomfort...so its all a sort o f hamster wheel.

I introduced the Nature's Variety rabbit diet last week.  Both my cats LOVE it.  Its like Christmas for them every day. Its a novel protein, and the canned food (I only give canned) has no grains, carageenan, agar agar or guar gum.  As you said, I really dont want to change the food again; although the hairball/vomiting has continued, somehow I think this food is a good choice, mainly because he loves it so much.  My vet has been talking about one of those hydrolyzed protein foods made by Royal Canin and Hills makes one also, I think, but what evidence do we have that that doing this to food is beneficial for a cat with GI issues?  or, for  that matter, allergy issues?

I do plan to communicate with my vet about stopping t he metaclopramide and introducing slippery elm.  Thank you again.  Everyone here is great.  Special t hanks to you, Oneandahalfcats.

myrnafaye said:

 
OK, so I can get slippery elm up the street, w/o magnesium stearate.  So do I continue with the EYL and the metameucil?  what about the pepcid?

Honestly, I dont think anything else has changed that is stressing Obi - I understand what you are saying about it being a kind of OCD behavior, but he is really a laid back cat - except when it comes to his food!  I thought, as did one vet, that the abdominal licking might be related to GI discomfort...so its all a sort o f hamster wheel.

I introduced the Nature's Variety rabbit diet last week.  Both my cats LOVE it.  Its like Christmas for them every day. Its a novel protein, and the canned food (I only give canned) has no grains, carageenan, agar agar or guar gum.  As you said, I really dont want to change the food again; although the hairball/vomiting has continued, somehow I think this food is a good choice, mainly because he loves it so much.  My vet has been talking about one of those hydrolyzed protein foods made by Royal Canin and Hills makes one also, I think, but what evidence do we have that that doing this to food is beneficial for a cat with GI issues?  or, for  that matter, allergy issues?

I do plan to communicate with my vet about stopping t he metaclopramide and introducing slippery elm.  Thank you again.  Everyone here is great.  Special t hanks to you, Oneandahalfcats.

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You're welcome .. In my experience, if you are doing the SEB, then you could stop the psyllium for now as SEB is a source of fiber in itself. It's your choice to continue the EYL but again, you may not need this or the pepcid when doing the SEB.

I feed Nature's Variety so I would agree that it is a good food. I just meant that if a food allergy is suspected, it would require doing a food trial, but at this point, start with the SEB and see if this can make a difference. Also, you should really start a journal as previously suggested to make notes about the amount and kind of food you are feeding, how much and when, any new introductions such as the Slippery Elm, the amount and times that you are giving this, and of course any changes good or bad in your cat, so you can keep track and see what is working, what isn't. Any change you make should be gradual and you should give changes a good amount of time to see results.

Many people have had success with the foods that have  hydrolyzed proteins but I would rather figure out which proteins cause issues and avoid them.  The hydrolyzed proteins are broken down to the amino acids so the kitty's immune system doesn't recognize them so doesn't react to them.  Pepcid is really a pretty neutral thing to give so I would continue with it for now just in case it is helping.  You will need to continue with the new food for awhile to know if it is helping or not.  For allergies a trial of 4 to 6 weeks is necessary.

Thank you, Denise, I will do that too.  Thank you also for your thoughts on the hydrolyzed protein.

Oneandahalfcats, I just spoke with my vet about slippery elm., he was supportive  We also decided to give Obi his pred once a day and at night, as apparently that is when the cat is best able to metabolize it.  He agreed to discontinue the reglan. ( I had read the side effects - scared the heck out of me!)  Could be producing the effects we are treating!  Yikes!

So, slippery elm in his morning meal.  Stop the metameucil,  you say?  and the SEB only in the AM with his morning meal?

Vet still thinks he has an allergy.  I think it is very possible, but I am way less concerned about that - unless it is a food allergy - than I am about the vomiting of hair.  Does anyone have any experience with allergy testing, was it helpful?  pricey?

I haven't had it done but from what I have read allergy tests aren't very reliable for kitties especially if it's a food allergy.  I wouldn't pay to have it done.  If you don't begin to see some improvement with the hairball issue I would, if it's something you can do financially, get an ultrasound done.  The testing that vets can do now with the costs that come with it means that most of us have to pick and choose what we have done.

myrnafaye said:

 
Oneandahalfcats, I just spoke with my vet about slippery elm., he was supportive  We also decided to give Obi his pred once a day and at night, as apparently that is when the cat is best able to metabolize it.  He agreed to discontinue the reglan. ( I had read the side effects - scared the heck out of me!)  Could be producing the effects we are treating!  Yikes!

So, slippery elm in his morning meal.  Stop the metameucil,  you say?  and the SEB only in the AM with his morning meal?

Vet still thinks he has an allergy.  I think it is very possible, but I am way less concerned about that - unless it is a food allergy - than I am about the vomiting of hair.  Does anyone have any experience with allergy testing, was it helpful?  pricey?

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Oh good. Glad to read that your vet is on board with the SEB. Fingers crossed that it can be helpful

Yes to the SEB in the morning meal, and yes to stopping the metamucil. You want to give the SEB a bit of time to get working and to see if the SEB is effective without the Metamucil. You can do a 1/4 tsp twice a day, or 1/2 tsp once in the morning in wet food, as you wish.

I too have heard that allergy testing can be very expensive. It would depend on the clinic. I agree that the ultrasound would be the next best step if the hairball situation doesn't improve.

Do you think I should stop the metameucil when I start the slippery elm?  Since I will be giving pred in the evening, maybe will give slippery elm in AM.  But, I was going to get some SLB this afternoon and cook it up; maybe I will give him some this evening, and give him pred before bed...but today also, I am giving him several small meals because he threw up yesterday...and I would like to continue to do this for a while....so....I will have to work out the timing of all this.

and I think I said I had added a probiotic yesterday. 

myrnafaye said:

 
Do you think I should stop the metameucil when I start the slippery elm?  Since I will be giving pred in the evening, maybe will give slippery elm in AM.  But, I was going to get some SLB this afternoon and cook it up; maybe I will give him some this evening, and give him pred before bed...but today also, I am giving him several small meals because he threw up yesterday...and I would like to continue to do this for a while....so....I will have to work out the timing of all this.

and I think I said I had added a probiotic yesterday. 

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Yes, to stopping the Metamucil while on SEB. You can start the SEB most anytime, but if planning on doing some tonight, just start with 1/4 tsp in wet food and decide whether to do two doses, or one starting with AM feeding.

The main thing is at least 2 hours between the SEB and medication.  The SEB coats the digestive tract so it affects absorption of medicine.  It is best when giving one dose of steroid to give it in the evening.  I would give either or with the SEB  or metamucil.   You can create issues with too much fiber as well.

Personally, I hate not knowing, especially if I've been fighting something like this for so long. An ultrasound may give you some answers (no guarantees), but I understand they are expensive. Another test to discuss with your vet is the "GI Panel" blood test offered by Idexx, which may provide some insight into Obi's GI function (no guarantees with that either).

What food was Obi on prior to the NV Rabbit?

Reglan acts as a prokinetic and is sometimes prescribed to aid in passing food more quickly through the digestive tract. If Reglan was not helping with motility alone, then that also leads me to believe there is "something else in the way", so to speak. As far as the pred goes, it doesn't mean it's forever. If there is inflammation, sometimes the body needs a little help, and the pred can always be lowered or slowly tapered off later once the GI tract starts to heal and normalize again.

Metamucil is a bulking fiber, so it will add volume to anything with moisture. I would think that you do not want bulk right now, IMO. I think the probiotic is fine, and starting the SEB would be fine to see how it works. I'm not sure about the EYL. I did try that for Sebastian when he was having the hairball issue, and it did not help. @LDG already mentioned digestive enzymes. These might help break everything up. I like Fresh Digest. A concentrated fish oil that is high in omega-3s (EPA and DHA) has anti-inflammatory properties.

Just keep in mind that you might get 20 different suggestions thrown your way.     Don't do everything at once. Write everything down, keep a list and a journal, note what and when something was started and stopped, and if it helped. Keep your vet in the loop.

Side note suggestion: Try not to start another thread on Obi and his hairballs. Keep this one going. When new threads are started on the same issue, we lose a lot of the history on what was already asked and discussed. 

GoHolistic said:

Just keep in mind that you might get 20 different suggestions thrown your way.     Don't do everything at once. Write everything down, keep a list and a journal, note what and when something was started and stopped, and if it helped. Keep your vet in the loop.

Side note suggestion: Try not to start another thread on Obi and his hairballs. Keep this one going. When new threads are started on the same issue, we lose a lot of the history on what was already asked and discussed. 

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to both. :lol3:

As to the EYL... I think it helps in otherwise healthy cats that need some support during increased shedding. It seems like Obi's problems come back around to inflammation and motility. The EYL may help - or may be the cause of the loose stools you're sometimes seeing. Whether or not to keep it in the mix is really up to you. It does have some choline (acetylcholine) in it, which does help with motility. Whatever you decide to do, journal it. This will help you know whether it was the source of the loose stools or not.

Hi, All,  I got confused at the local coop and bought more of the actual slippery elm BARK as opposed to the powder.  Am I SOL on the bark, or can I still use it for the SLB syrup?  anyone know??

Well,since Obi threw up yesterday, I am giving him small meals today, several.  So he just had about half his evening meal with nothing in it.  I havent given him  his EYL today, and only a very small amount of probiotic.

My husband observes that he thinks part of the problem is that Obi eats too fast.  And he does, he is a scarfer.  Other than feeding him more often, does anyone have any suggestions for slowing down a cat's chowing down?  would this help?

myrnafaye said:

 
Hi, All,  I got confused at the local coop and bought more of the actual slippery elm BARK as opposed to the powder.  Am I SOL on the bark, or can I still use it for the SLB syrup?  anyone know??

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You should get the powder which will be easier to work with. The coarse bark is used more for infusions and poultices. Can you return what you purchased and get the bulk powder form?

myrnafaye said:

 
Well,since Obi threw up yesterday, I am giving him small meals today, several.  So he just had about half his evening meal with nothing in it.  I havent given him  his EYL today, and only a very small amount of probiotic.

My husband observes that he thinks part of the problem is that Obi eats too fast.  And he does, he is a scarfer.  Other than feeding him more often, does anyone have any suggestions for slowing down a cat's chowing down?  would this help?

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You could try spreading the food around making like a thin layer just to slow him down a little.   Feeding smaller meals will help because it would cut down on the amount of food he could eat at one time.  Kind of get a chance for a little food to settle then give some more.

No, but it was cheap.  All it means is that Ill have to go back for more powder soon..

I know its better to give him small meals and that is what I will do for now, although I have another cat and it means separating them when they eat, because she does not need to eat small meals, and I always feel that eating together is good for  heir relationship. I hope at some point we can go back to feeding twice a day only (with a small bedtime snack!)

:dk: No reason not to feed your other kitty smaller meals at the same time so they can eat together.

In fact - three meals a day is ideal for all kitties. Instead of two meals and a snack before bed, just turn that into the third meal.