Vets Don't Know What's Going On

missbliss

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My cat has been experiencing shaking head, tremors and increasing hunger for the past few years and every test she's done - blood, urynalisis and CT of abdomen came back negative - i.e. nothing out of the very ordinary. Some indication of allergy with basophils. Thing is her tremors are getting much more frequent - she startles and she is hungry - ALL - THE - TIME - to the point of driving me crazy. She murmers and then she starts demanding food - 24/7. Throughtout the day and night and she's pooping much more as well. As you can imagine. It's a nightmare. She may have lost a bit of weight but not a lot - her skin seems looser. She's 14 years old, has been spayed, she's been with me for 13 years - it's only the last 3 years she's been this way - I've spent thousands of dollars trying to figure out what is going on. She eats a variety of food - but literally I can't keep up with her demands. She eats Fancy Feast, Merricks, and cooked fish and chicken. She's also rubbing her mouth - on every surface - I had a look at her teeth - they seem to be falling out - she had one removed due to a calcium buildup - the calcium buildup didn't go away - it's still there - a hard bony bump under her gum - minus the canine tooth that was removed. So she's got a few things going on.

I don't know where to begin to help her. She had her thyroid checked - that came back negative i.e. no pathology 3 times. 

What rare condition am I and countless vets missing?

Thanks,

Joy
 

quiet

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Hi;

I am so sorry your little girl is so ill. I know how frustrating it can be when nobody seems to know what is going on.

I would assume that you have been to a specialist. You would want to see a Veterinarian with the initials DACVIM after their name. That would be the place to start if you haven't been to one already. You can waste so much time and money on regular veterinarians when sometimes the specialists have more knowledge about the areas that they are certified in. Not that all of them are great either. The sad thing is there are good and bad in all walks of life.

From what you are describing it sounds like there is obviously something very serious going on, yet it has been going on three years is kind of surprising. You would think it would have resolved one way or another by now. I feel sorry for your cat.

I don't know what area you are in but you might want to see if there is Cryptococcus in your region and find out if she has been tested for it. It is a fungal infection that they can pick up from dirt or bird droppings. It can progress slowly and eventually lead to neurologic signs. It is treatable. The test for it is a titer which is done with a blood sample sent to the lab. It takes 4 days or so for the results.

The teethe roots can cause sinus and ear problems as well as eye problems. I think what you are saying is that there was calculus buildup on the teethe. That will look kind of brown and it is basically advanced plaque that continues to get larger and larger because it is porous and every time they eat more is added to it. It forms on the surface of the tooth and if left untreated will cause discomfort and eventually tooth loss. How long ago were her teethe cleaned? Did they extract any teethe then?

The head shaking can be caused by a number of things. Is it a shake like there is something in the ear or like a seizure type of activity?

Does your kitty go outside? Do you use any flea products on her or on any other animal you may have?

I assume they have tested for all the viral diseases such as FELV and FIV?

When was the last time she saw a veterinarian and when was the last blood work done?

The loose skin may be severe dehydration. If she hasn't been in to see a vet since you have noticed the loose skin I would get her in ASAP as dehydration is serious for cats. And other animals but very serious for cats. She may need to have some fluids.

Hope she is feeling better by the time you read this.
 
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quiet

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 I see that you mentioned one extraction already.
 
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missbliss

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Hi,

Thanks so much for replying. I am checking the Cryptococcus incidence in our neck of the woods. Two of my beloved cats (I had 4, now 2) Jesse and Jordan both died within a few years of each other of unspecified reasons - Jesse had what the vets thought was pancreatitis - Jordan of acute kidney failure. We lived in a very polluted agricultural area with spraying of pesticides - also many farm animals in the area, including birds of all sorts. Anything is possible.

My 2 females who have survived - we have since moved - Chi and Mati - both have the head shaking but Chi has much more symptoms including the startling, mouth rubbing and bone growth in the gums. Both are scratching a lot - even though no fleas. Chi was just taken to the vet a month ago. I can post the results of her tests if that would help. The vet didn't seem concerned at all - none of them were - it's like if they can't see the symptoms I see - and the lab tests are ok - they just don't worry. The tooth thing is called - Feline tooth resorption.

Chi has had chronic otitis - I got Zymox was using that - it didn't seem to have much of an effect on the head shaking/scratching. Took care of the fungus which would come and go throughout the years.

She was never tested for FIP for FELV - any time I would mention it to a vet they'd say they're not 100% accurate and a waste of money.

Re the loose skin it's more like wasting - she's not dehydrated. I will try to get some video footage and post it on YT. This would make things a bit easier to understand. Just need to recharge batteries.

Yes, 3 years going on - progressingly worse. Just as a side note - this was one of the healthiest cats ever - hence her name. Thanks again.

Joy
 
 
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missbliss

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Yes, she would go outside - and my others too. Now they are both indoors since we moved. They also were *visited* by strays. I couldn't help it. They wanted to go out - I would always check on them to know where they were - and made sure they'd come back in - but I couldn't control the strays. Once the word got out that I was feeding my own - we'd get a line of hungry homeless cats who would occasionally mess with mine. That's how it was.
 

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@missbliss Hi and welcome to TCS although I'm very sorry for the circumstances.

I'm so sorry you and your cat has been going through this for so long.  Regarding your vet's comment "She was never tested for FIP for FELV - any time I would mention it to a vet they'd say they're not 100% accurate and a waste of money."  MY EDIT: Correction - Your vet is correct about the FIP test, there is no test for it and nothing about which you describe even suggests FIP, but it is not correct that the FIV/FeLV test is a waste of money.

So was your cat ever tested for FIV/FeLV?  Did you type "FIP" by mistake?   Please let us know so we can further assist you if possible.  And while FIV/FeLV tests can have discrepancies, especially the Elisa test,  between the Elisa test and the IFA (western blot) test, if you have both come back positive and then you retest later with positive results,  then the cat is either FIV or FeLV positive and there is no longer room for debate.  So if your vet said an FIP test is a waste he is correct, but it is simply not true that FIV/FeLV tests are a waste, and positive results lead to correct diagnoses time and time again.

Also since appetite seems to be a big thing that you're discussing, her weight (gain or loss) is important but you haven't said exactly that she has lost weight, but that you think she might have.  Your vet must be tracking her weight so when was she last at the vet and has her weight changed?

How much and what are you feeding her?  What would happen if you just gave her more food?

Have you discussed with your vet that she may have age related digestive difficulty that is causing her to be very hungry because she isn't absorbing enough nutrition?

FIV

http://www.vet.cornell.edu/FHC/health_resources/brochure_fiv.cfm

http://www.catchat.org/fiv.html#labs

FeLV

http://www.vet.cornell.edu/FHC/health_resources/brochure_felv.cfm

http://www.aspca.org/pet-care/cat-care/feline-leukemia-virus

Please respond to this post and let us know your thoughts.  We want to offer all the support we can.
 
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quiet

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Hi;

Honestly it sounds like it is time for a new vet. You have a rite to copies of all your veterinary records and you can take them with you and get your kitty in with someone else, hopefully a specialist if you can. If you need a list of specialists in your area let me know. Or you can go to the AHAA website and find one yourself. They need to have a DACVIM after their name.

There is a blood titer test for FIP that is controversial with some vets as it just shows if there has been exposure to a corona virus not if the cat is actually infected with the virus. The only way I know of they can test for FIP is with a necropsy after the cat has died. But there are certain signs that could lead vets to believe they have it if the symptoms, which are varied, and certain elevations in blood could lead you to believe the cat to be positive, But no definitive test.

I am not saying your cat has FIP, I was just explaining a virus they might have said that about.

FIV and FELV are easily tested for and there is no reason that your cat should not have been tested first thing.

Really I know it is a pain but if after 3 years you aren't getting any results it is time to change.

Good luck
 

stephenq

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There is a blood titer test for FIP that is controversial with some vets as it just shows if there has been exposure to a corona virus not if the cat is actually infected with the virus. The only way I know of they can test for FIP is with a necropsy after the cat has died. But there are certain signs that could lead vets to believe they have it if the symptoms, which are varied, and certain elevations in blood could lead you to believe the cat to be positive, But no definitive test.
I would just add that while it is true there is no test for FIP (Feline infectious Peritonitis) and while it does cause mysterious symptoms, most cats, perhaps all would have passed away long before 3 years had passed.
 

denice

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This is the first time I have heard of a vet that doesn't test for FIV/FeLV.  I know in my area all kittens are checked.  Of course there are instances where the tests are wrong but from my understanding they are very reliable.  I know a cat that has been vaccinated for FIV will test positive on the initial test there is further testing that will differentiate between having been vaccinated or having the virus.  I know with FeLV it is possible for a small kitten to test negative and have it but they will test positive later.  My indoor kitty was checked again when he had a mystery illness because his first test was done as a very young kitten.  His symptoms were different than your kitty's but these viruses attack the immune system so they will show with different symptoms.

I don't know that your kitties have either of these diseases but they should be checked for them.  Whatever is going on has to either be a contagious illness or a toxin that they have gotten into.  
 
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missbliss

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So was your cat ever tested for FIV/FeLV?  Did you type "FIP" by mistake?

No never. I was too afraid to know the results. I couldn't bear to know anything bad about her. So we've been hedging around. As a very important note here - we've been traveling extensively for the past few years from place to place - 3 then 4 now 2 and have changed vets more times than I care to remember. We live overseas - geographics really isn't that important - what is, is finding someone with expertise both in diagnoses and care. Because of moving so frequently we've missed out on good quality and consistent care from one particular vet who was able to help Jesse when he fell ill long time ago - when others hadn't a clue. Now we're in a completely different region and again we're searching for someone good. Last month just took her to someone recommended to us. All the tests were done in house - even though I requested for them to be sent out. Well..in the end I just conceded due to time constraints.

 

Also since appetite seems to be a big thing that you're discussing, her weight (gain or loss) is important but you haven't said exactly that she has lost weight, but that you think she might have.  Your vet must be tracking her weight so when was she last at the vet and has her weight changed?

She has lost approximately one pound give or take in a year. She weighs now approximately 9 pounds. She's a calico tortie. No protuding bones
 

How much and what are you feeding her?  What would happen if you just gave her more food?

2-3 cans of FF with supplementation of Merrick's, the odd piece of chicken or fish. She eats it all - like she MUST or else. It seems to be some kind of craving.
 

Have you discussed with your vet that she may have age related digestive difficulty that is causing her to be very hungry because she isn't absorbing enough nutritio

It was brought up - again not taken seriously by any of the vets. I'd most definitely want to know how I can help her in every which way. ASAP. Her suffering is my suffering.
 
Please respond to this post and let us know your thoughts.  We want to offer all the support we can.
Thank you very much! We are in receiving mode.

:)

Joy
 
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missbliss

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This is the first time I have heard of a vet that doesn't test for FIV/FeLV.  I know in my area all kittens are checked.  Of course there are instances where the tests are wrong but from my understanding they are very reliable.  I know a cat that has been vaccinated for FIV will test positive on the initial test there is further testing that will differentiate between having been vaccinated or having the virus.  I know with FeLV it is possible for a small kitten to test negative and have it but they will test positive later.  My indoor kitty was checked again when he had a mystery illness because his first test was done as a very young kitten.  His symptoms were different than your kitty's but these viruses attack the immune system so they will show with different symptoms.

I don't know that your kitties have either of these diseases but they should be checked for them.  Whatever is going on has to either be a contagious illness or a toxin that they have gotten into.  
 

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@missbliss Hi again Joy,

I'll underline all my questions so they're easier to see ok

I understand you're not wanting to know the results of FIV/FeLV tests but knowing could prove helpful for your cat, at the least you could rule it out which is helpful, and cats with FIV can live full lives.  Even adults with FeLV can live a long time too.  But what you describe is not typical for FIV/FeLV.

Polyphagia is the name for a condition when a cat has a ravenous appetite that is never satisfied.  There are different causes.  One possible cause is diabetes.  Has she been checked for this?  Another cause which you've already discussed with your vet is poor food absorption, which itself can have multiple causes.  She was checked for inflammatory bowel?  How are her stools? History of repeat vomiting?

Can you call 800 numbers (toll free) in the US?  If yes, the Cornell School of Vet Medicine has a phone consultation service M-W-F with highly skilled vets who will go over your cat's condition for $55 USD.  Here is the link:

http://www.vet.cornell.edu/FHC/health_resources/camuti_service.cfm

If you can't call an 800 number from overseas but want to try this service I can call the for you and see if they have a regular area code option.  Would you like me to help with this?

Below are some links on Polyphagia, perhaps reading them will spark some new discussion with your current vet.

http://www.petmd.com/cat/conditions/digestive/c_ct_polyphagia

http://pets.thenest.com/cats-appetite-insatiable-7343.html
 
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missbliss

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Polyphagia is the name for a condition when a cat has a ravenous appetite that is never satisfied.  There are different causes.  One possible cause is diabetes.  Has she been checked for this?  Another cause which you've already discussed with your vet is poor food absorption, which itself can have multiple causes.  She was checked for inflammatory bowel?  How are her stools? History of repeat vomiting?

She had blood and urine taken a month ago - no indication of diabetes.  She was NOT checked for irritable bowl. Her stools are numerous *understatement* normal looking. No repeat vomiting -   just rarely.

Can you call 800 numbers (toll free) in the US?  If yes, the Cornell School of Vet Medicine has a phone consultation service M-W-F with highly skilled vets who will go over your cat's condition for $55 USD.  Here is the link:

http://www.vet.cornell.edu/FHC/health_resources/camuti_service.cfm

If you can't call an 800 number from overseas but want to try this service I can call the for you and see if they have a regular area code option.  Would you like me to help with this?

It's an option to consider - but what would they be able to help with without actually seeing her? I know they have a pretty good reputation and I have done consultations with a few sources in the States and Canada since this all began - from homeopathics to vets - all were very well-meaning but nothing has ever been concluded. Because of her chronic otitis and the neurological symptoms - this could be all related to the appetite control in her brain. I did take her to a neurologist here when it all began - the head of the department of a vet medical hospital said *even if there was something in her brain - we don't perform brain surgery on cats* - and that was that. If something has migrated to her brain she would need a Cat scan or MRI - that's major bucks right now - to be honest after all the tests and vets and traveling we are pretty much tapped out for the moment. This could run into a few hundred dollars - and then finding someone here with the right equipment - and we are now moving once again. I will have to weigh everything very carefully - see if I can't maintain and support her nutritionally at least for the meantime - and pray nothing worse develops till we settle again.

Below are some links on Polyphagia, perhaps reading them will spark some new discussion with your current vet.

http://www.petmd.com/cat/conditions/digestive/c_ct_polyphagia

http://pets.thenest.com/cats-appetite-insatiable-7343.html

Over the course of time she was tested for toxsplasmosis, giardia, thyroid, blood pressure, kidney, liver, neuro, urine, CT of abdomen and x-ray of head (that was in iffy one - I asked for the x-ray and *they couldn't find it*. Honestly she's been tested, pricked, prodded and given way too many sedatives and anesthetics then any cat should ever need to.

Bless,

Joy
 
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missbliss

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StephenQ - I just put together a detailed reply in response to your questions. After I hit reply I got a message that links are not allowed - but they were part of your response to me. I don't know where the reply to you is now. Was it deleted? Contacted the moderators - hopefully it wasn't deleted.
 

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quiet

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Hi;

Are her third eyelids up? Are her pupils the same size? Are they dilated or constricted?

Thank you
 
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missbliss

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Hi Quiet,

Excellent question, the eyelids seem to be ok. The pupils - *may* differ in size. She's so jumpy now she doesn't let me examine her for a second so I'm grabbing the odd moment when she's actually looking/peering at me so I can get a better look. I'd say based on what I've managed to gauge that there might be one pupil ever so slightly smaller and narrower than the other. They also appear to somewhat bulging, a bit glassy as well. Nothing huge - but noticeable.

Joy
 
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