Henry May Have Kidney Disease

I just used a spoon to smoosh it in there. It was messy and took a while, but it goes in there. It makes it a lot easier if using 15ml syringes though.

...and I'm sorry he vomited all over the bed. Is there any way to feed him a smaller amount more frequently? :cross:

LDG said:

I just used a spoon to smoosh it in there. It was messy and took a while, but it goes in there. It makes it a lot easier if using 15ml syringes though.

...and I'm sorry he vomited all over the bed. Is there any way to feed him a smaller amount more frequently?

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I don't think I'm coordinated enough for a spoon! That's some serious skill. I did make today's batch without water, just put it in a bowl and stirred to get a smooth consistency. I'll be able to do a morning feeding and at least one when I get home, so that'll be better, because although I did two feedings yesterday, they were both at night (I didn't have the food until lunchtime at work), so it probably wasn't enough space in between the two. Plus, there was water in that batch, and there isn't any in this one. Luckily, next week, I work every other day (albeit for long hours at a time), so I'll be able to do even more slower, smaller feedings on my off days!

I think this is a learning experience for everyone that has been through this with a kitty.  I am glad you have things figured out and now it's just a matter of continuing however long it takes.

You might want to try a blender. I don't remember the ratio of water to A/D but enough to make it a slurry. Then it is easier to pour into the syringe and easier to deliver it.  With the stomach tube, I remember it taking 20 minutes to do a feeding because of the barf issue.

I am starting to lose some hope with the situation. This morning, I fed Henry around 35 ML of A/D, which I thought was a safe amount. He seemed to hold it alright, only to vomit again hours later, before another feeding. Since he just vomited, I don't really want to feed him again, because his tummy seems upset, and I think it'll come right back up. Is there anything else I can do, besides taking the water out (which I have done) and feeding smaller portions? I'm going to call the vet tomorrow and ask if there's anything I can give him that will settle his stomach and help keep it down. Unfortunately, I can't really break it into much smaller meals, or else he'd never finish the required amount in a day. And that said, if he's vomiting with the syringe feeding, would a feeding tube even help? To my understanding, the feeding tube is just to aid in getting it down, not KEEPING it down.

I don't want to torture him for nothing, feed him only to have it come back up, and then it's like he never ate at all anyway. Maybe it's his time. I don't want it to be. And I still want to do everything I can to save him. But what I'm doing right this moment isn't working. Any additional suggestions?

thevegancuddler said:

 
I don't think I'm coordinated enough for a spoon! That's some serious skill. I did make today's batch without water, just put it in a bowl and stirred to get a smooth consistency. I'll be able to do a morning feeding and at least one when I get home, so that'll be better, because although I did two feedings yesterday, they were both at night (I didn't have the food until lunchtime at work), so it probably wasn't enough space in between the two. Plus, there was water in that batch, and there isn't any in this one. Luckily, next week, I work every other day (albeit for long hours at a time), so I'll be able to do even more slower, smaller feedings on my off days!

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I don't know how big your syringe is, but if the opening at the top is wide enough, you could use a [clean] popsicle stick or some other small utensil to get the food down in there. I actually had one of those small jam spreaders that fit.

thevegancuddler said:

 
I am starting to lose some hope with the situation. This morning, I fed Henry around 35 ML of A/D, which I thought was a safe amount. He seemed to hold it alright, only to vomit again hours later, before another feeding. Since he just vomited, I don't really want to feed him again, because his tummy seems upset, and I think it'll come right back up. Is there anything else I can do, besides taking the water out (which I have done) and feeding smaller portions? I'm going to call the vet tomorrow and ask if there's anything I can give him that will settle his stomach and help keep it down. Unfortunately, I can't really break it into much smaller meals, or else he'd never finish the required amount in a day. And that said, if he's vomiting with the syringe feeding, would a feeding tube even help? To my understanding, the feeding tube is just to aid in getting it down, not KEEPING it down.

I don't want to torture him for nothing, feed him only to have it come back up, and then it's like he never ate at all anyway. Maybe it's his time. I don't want it to be. And I still want to do everything I can to save him. But what I'm doing right this moment isn't working. Any additional suggestions?

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Oh no.     I'm sorry that Henry vomited again. Poor guy. You may want to ask your vet about Cerenia and/or Pepcid to help with nausea and vomiting. Is he already getting these?

GoHolistic said:

 
Oh no.  

  I'm sorry that Henry vomited again. Poor guy. You may want to ask your vet about Cerenia and/or Pepcid to help with nausea and vomiting. Is he already getting these?

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He isn't getting them, no. I'll call tomorrow and ask for sure.

I am sorry.  Unfortunately this is part of the deal with this.  You said he vomited hours after he ate.  Did he vomit a lot of food or was it mostly just bile.  If it's mostly bile then Pepcid may definitely help, it could be nausea from excess acid when his stomach is empty or close to empty.  The cerenia will also definitely help him feel better and may help him get started eating on his own again.

If you do get some Pepcid make sure you get the regular 10 mg Pepcid not the complete or the extra strenghth.  The last time I got it I got a store brand to save some money.  I would split the pills and give him a half pill twice a day.

Denice said:

 
I am sorry.  Unfortunately this is part of the deal with this.  You said he vomited hours after he ate.  Did he vomit a lot of food or was it mostly just bile.  If it's mostly bile then Pepcid may definitely help, it could be nausea from excess acid when his stomach is empty or close to empty.  The cerenia will also definitely help him feel better and may help him get started eating on his own again.

If you do get some Pepcid make sure you get the regular 10 mg Pepcid not the complete or the extra strenghth.  The last time I got it I got a store brand to save some money.  I would split the pills and give him a half pill twice a day.

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It wasn't bile. It was food. And a lot of it. Not as much as the other times, but then, I didn't feed him as much as the other times. It was weird, because I assumed he had digested it if it was hours later, but I guess not. Maybe he was just resting and so still at first that that kept it down, and then sudden movement brought it back up? Will the pepcid or cerenia help with that? Do I give him human pepcid? Is cerenia a pet med specifically?

I'm currently riding some kind of emotional roller coaster, so I thought I would vent a little here. As a member of this forum for some time, I've seen others do the same, and I am so thankful to have a place to come to talk about this, with people who love kitties and understand.

I guess, with Henry repeatedly throwing up, I've come closer and closer to a decision to let him go. He is becoming more lethargic, and he can barely jump up and down from the bed. It's all just very sad to watch. I wanted to do everything I could reasonably do for him, without needlessly prolonging any suffering for results that will never come. I feel I'm getting closer to that place where there's less and less I can do, and even if I had a lot of money, he's fading so fast that I wonder what good it's doing him to live like this. Although he's the sweetest, calmest baby I ever did know, he obviously doesn't like the syringe feedings, and the vomiting can't be fun for him, either. I don't want him to suffer. I'm going to see if I can try giving him the meds to keep the food down, but that's going to be my final recourse, I think. If it doesn't work, I think it'll be time to euthanize him. I was advised by a friend that I need to ask about private cremations if I want his ashes back, with assurances that they are actually his. I work a 10.5 hour shift tomorrow, so I need to gather all of this info on my breaks.

I have so many conflicting emotions, it's hard to describe all at once. I feel grief for this baby who was mine for such a short time; I have only had him since August, but he has crawled into my heart and will always have a place there. I adopted him because he was almost eleven at that time and was going to be returned to a shelter. I knew I wouldn't have long with him, not compared to my kitties who are around a year old, but I couldn't bear the thought of him living out his senior years in a cold shelter, if he was even so lucky as to get a no-kill shelter. Still, I thought I would have a few years left with him, as eleven isn't exactly ancient, either. I also did not have animals in my childhood (I'm 22 now), except for a few failed attempts that ended in animal return when my whole family was allergic. So I've never dealt with the passing of an animal. In fact, I've never really dealt with the passing of HUMANS close to me - just two older relatives that I never knew very well. Frankly, I'm closer to Henry than I was to them. So this kind of grief is very foreign to me, and VERY new.

And I'm a little bit in shock, because, like I said, I expected more time with him. I feel guilt because I wish I had gotten him into a vet when he FIRST stopped eating, instead of about a week later. It didn't occur to me to syringe feed him or to try OTHER vets for payment plans, not until it was too late. I'll probably never know what caused him to stop eating in the first place, but I'll always wonder if I could have figured it out if I had at least prevented the HL from starting. Part of the problem is that I am Bipolar, and a lot of times, it's hard for me to focus, my mind wanders, etc. So although I am tenacious about coming up with a plan for him (adversity breeding ingenuity and all of that), it took me too long. I feel, on some level, that I failed him.

I also feel some relief, which makes me feel guilty. I feel relief at the finality of it, at the conclusiveness of it. And I feel relief to know he will no longer be suffering, if I go through with the euthanasia. It's hard to watch him so lethargic, so disinterested in everything. But then I feel bad for feeling that way at all. It's all very confusing.

And this is the part that I know only other animals lovers will understand: I am having sort of a weird religious crisis. I have, for many years, been an agonstic atheist, though I was raised in a loosely Christian home. I don't really believe in an "after", or at the very least, while an "after" might be possible, I don't presume to know what that would look like. But now that Henry is about to cross the Rainbow Bridge, I'm confronted with the thought of really never seeing him again. So in my grief, I'm having a hard time with that, with the prospect of never seeing him again.

Anyway, this has been a lengthy outpouring, but no one will understand these feelings like you guys will. Being able to talk to all of you and get advice has made it a little easier to bear. 

The decision to euthanize a beloved pet is always difficult and it's a very personal decision.  If that is your decision don't beat yourself up with all the what ifs.  All of us can only do what we know to do and are able to do.  The simple truth is there may very well have been nothing else you could have done.  I would give the cerenia a try, it's a vet med.

Denice said:

 
The decision to euthanize a beloved pet is always difficult and it's a very personal decision.  If that is your decision don't beat yourself up with all the what ifs.  All of us can only do what we know to do and are able to do.  The simple truth is there may very well have been nothing else you could have done.  I would give the cerenia a try, it's a vet med.

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I will definitely do so, yeah. I'll call tomorrow and ask about it. I do have a question about that, though.

So tomorrow, I work from 1:30 PM to midnight, and have about an hour commute each way. I probably wouldn't be able to get him the meds before work. I don't want him to throw up after I leave, because the other cats will eat it (what they say about A/D being appetizing is apparently true, even after it's been partially digested...). Plus, there's always the chance he could choke on the vomit if I'm not there, and while he may be dying anyway, I certainly wouldn't want it to happen that way. Or maybe I'm over-thinking it. Should I just feed him when I get home with the cerenia? What would you do?

I'm so sorry, @thevegancuddler, that you have to think about making this decision.     It really is a difficult decision that only you can make based on what you think is best for Henry.    Your "vent" post really made me tear up because I understand so much how this hurts. 

Talk to the vet and see what they say.

My thoughts are with you and Henry. 

Oh so sorry. It's hard. And when they are especially dear friends, it makes it even more difficult.

Just wondering if you had a chance to discuss all this with the Vet and what they had to say.  It's quite a dilemma, that's for sure, and none of us will fault you, whatever happens.    At this point, you are trying your hardest to save him, and if that's not working, then you may have to let him go.  

Thinking of you, too.....  

The very night I brought him in, the vet said that it would be reasonable to decide to let  him go. I get the impression this is a very good vet, so I don't think he'd have said it without thought. It was my idea to syringe feed, but as he is now vomiting that up, I dunno what to do anymore. I don't know if I should even try with the anti-nausea medication (I'll be getting a call about that tomorrow), or if I should just... let him go. It's so much harder when I have to actively make a choice, you know? And I know no one can tell me what I should do in this situation. But I keep thinking, at night, when I'm alone, that I have made my decision, that I am resolved in this matter. But every morning, when I wake up, and he's still there, and still very much alive, I falter, and I don't know if I can do this. But I also know I can't be selfish, and I don't want him to just starve to death. I just want one more day, and one more, and one more...

Well, talk to the Vet about the fact that he is throwing up several hours after you feed him and see what they think is causing it.  If they think the Cerenia can help, and that it's a normal part of the HL, then maybe that will help with your decision.  On the other hand, maybe it's something else causing it (that underlying condition that caused him to stop eating in the first place), and between the two of you, you may come to the conclusion that you should let him go.  Yes, you have to make the decision in the end, but utilize the experts (Vet's) opinions to help you . 

This is one of the toughest parts of adopting a furkid

 The question is what made him stop eating in the first place?

It wasn't the hepatic lipidosis as that doesn't develop until the cat has stopped eating for some period of time.

How are his bowel movements? Is he having any?  You mention he is spending a lot of time in the litter box. I would have the vet palpate his belly as they can feel constipation. If he is severely constipated he is not going to be able to eat and is going to throw up.

I would check for constipation first.  A second thing to try is treat this like inflammatory bowel disease and try giving prednisolone. If he has inflammation in his stomach the food is going to come back up.

A problem with raw food is that it does get contaminated with all sorts of bacteria. He could have a bacterial infection in his GI tract causing abdominal pain and vomiting. I don't know why people think raw meat is safe.  If I were to go out and kill a chicken and feed it directly to my cat, than it would probably be safe.  Range free chicken would also be relatively safe. Any chicken kept in confinement and processed is probably not safe for anyone without cooking.  Are you familiar with how factory farms work?

Maybe the food has nothing to do with it, maybe it does.  If he does have a bacterial infection in the GI tract he will need antibiotics, and prednisolone will make him worse.

What were the results of his bloodwork?  Is he negative for kidney disease?

Pushing food is not going to change the fact that something made him stop eating. The only way he is going to get better is if you find out what is preventing him from eating.

For the 10 weeks he was on raw, you did supplement with taurine, correct?