Another kitten diarrhea conundrum.

I'm sorry for posting another diarrhea question, there seem to be so many, but I'm not sure what my next step should be.

I found Mikey as an 8-9 week old out by some woods. At her first vet appointment she was given a broad deworming, advantage multi, and some magical flea-killing medicine. I later found she had ear mites, which have been treated, and I've given her an additional month of advantage multi just in case. at the ear mite appointment she was given a second round of what I was told was a not-so-broad deworming treatment. All the while, she has had very runny poop. She has gained about two pounds since I've had her, and she's otherwise a lovely, active and fun kitten...with disturbingly runny poop! I took her in for an examination specifically for the poop about two weeks ago (where of course, she didn't cooperate with a stool sample, but I gave the vet one this past Tuesday and they said it was clear on their parasite screening.) Anyway, prior to the most recent poop-specific vet appointment, I changed her diet to chicken breast and baby rice cereal, with a probiotic and maybe once/day pumpkin that I kept in ice cube trays. After about 4-5 days of this diet I witnessed a perfectly normal bowel movement! For this reason I'm not sure if it's a bacterial or worm-related issue. For the past two weeks she's been eating evo kitten wet food with a probiotic, and about a week ago I added blue buffalo dry kitten to the mix.

After all that rambling, I guess my question is, should I just continue w/ her current food and see how it plays out? Should I add pumpkin for added fiber..if so, should that be at every meal? My vet recommended like, metamucil and said pumpkin was fine if the kitten was okay with eating it, which she is. When I called today for the results from the stool sample, they said the next line of action would be to wait and see, or another deworming treatment. Should I just do that? or can that be hazardous if there are no worms in her system?


Thanks in advance from me and Mikey!

How are her stools on the Evo/Wilderness diet? Did she only have the 1 "normal" stool?

They are still quite runny. I feel like I get impatient with the food changes, but she has been on the evo since her last vet appt. about two weeks ago, and I added the kitten wilderness dry this past weekend...no change in her stool.  Yeah, I only saw one or two "normal" poos when I was feeding her the chicken/rice diet, after that, I went back to wet only, and her poop immediately got runny again.

I would go back to the chicken/rice diet for a few more days. If that resolves the runny stool problem, she most likely has a food intolerance. If that is the case, you can either provide a home-prepared balanced cooked or raw diet OR you will need to do some food trials to find out which ingredient (s) is the culprit.

You certainly CAN try adding back in the pumpkin also, since she likes it.   I would do that vs the metamucel, personally.  Your choice if you want to feed it at every meal or not...how many times per day are you feeding her?  I would probably give it to her at least twice a day,maybe 3 times and probably a teaspoon per meal?  (I know it seems like I'm guessing, that's because with a kitten, I am .  With an adult cat I would definitely say feed a total of 1 Tablespoon per day, broken down however you want, but I always think spread out is better, if that makes sense)

Definitely keep up the probiotic!  Are you giving her a Pet one, or a human one.  Lots of us are advocates of giving our furkids HUMAN probiotics.

So you only started the Evo after your last Vet appt?  What was she on before that?  Can you identify any common ingredients in the before and after food.  I'm sure chicken is one of them, but anything else?  'Course, it may still be a "bug", that the common tests don't test for, and those additional panels can get a little pricey depending on where you are located and who ends up doing the tests. 

Here's hoping the pumpkin does the trick

I was feeding her and my other cat friskies and/or fancy feast for awhile. When I decided to get a handle on this poop thing, about a month ago, I did the chicken/rice thing, then blue buffalo wet (grain-free.) I tend to feed her 3-4x/day, usually three, and I do give her a capsule of probiotic/ day, split between "breakfast" and "dinner." I'm going to stick this chicken/rice pumpkin diet for the next five days. I get so impatient! She's a bit over 4 lbs, so two tsp of pumpkin should be cool I imagine.

Hi Maniacmaddy,  I hope things get better quick!  I have just been through 3 months of trying to overcome kitten tummy troubles.  I won't go all the way into it, as each case is different.  But to get her the last bit to better, we are currently in food trials.  The thing that scared me into patience was that my vet (feline specialist) said that when a tummy has had an upset for some time, this can often be the trigger for developing food intolerances.  Anyway, we are now winning.  

But to give you an idea of what has been recommended time-wise for each new introduction of protein, it is 4-6 weeks for the first, then 3-4weeks for each new one SO LONG as there are no symptoms.  Our first stage was to feed one type of grainfree, carageenan free canned (Artemis turkey) and raw rabbit - some cubed, and one meal of a large chunk complete with bone.  Then we added some goat to this; she hasn't really gone for it after 2weeks, but I discovered she loved steak, so that will be our new 'in addition' protein for the next 3 weeks.  After that, I'm aiming to add some, so that I head toward a balanced Frankenprey diet, slowly but surely....

Best wishes

Oops - the last sentence was supposed to be 'add some LIVER'!

Thank you so much Tammyp! The timeline is so helpful, I definitely wouldn't have given her enough time w/ each protein.

I guess I'll add an update.

The diarrhea was still happening with the various grain free food I was feeding her, with pumpkin. I called the vet in early November to see if I could drop off another stool sample, but they told me not to waste my money, and they prescribed me tylan powder and Prednisolone. The tylan powder was 1/16 tsp 2x/day for a month, and the steroid was .3ml (i think, the bottle is upstairs) 2x/day for two weeks, then once/day for two weeks, and then every other day. I didn't see any improvement with this treatment. I just so happened to see my boss's veterinarian at our office, and talked to him about what we were going through, and he was really concerned that I didn't see an improvement in her stools within the first two weeks of treatment, and he said I should call my vet to let them know. He didn't seem too enthused with her being on antibiotics either, he's more of a probiotic kind of guy. I called my vet to have her come in later in the week, but my little brat cat wouldn't poop for me in the afternoon, so I cancelled the appointment.

I have discontinued the antibiotics and bought a new bottle of powdered probiotic, which I am SO excited about because I hated breaking those little capsules and reserving half the powder for a later meal! I'm still stepping down from the Prednisolone, so she's getting that every other day for one more week. I've purchased three cases of a limited ingredient grain-free food to seriously start food trials with her. I haven't been adding the pumpkin to her meals yet, because the last bowel movement I witnessed had a bit more form and was less watery than usual. I really hope things work out, though it does seem like she has food sensitivities rather than bacterial issues since she's had multiple antibiotic treatments with no improvement.

I'll probably end up taking her to my boss's vet for checkups since he's really easy to talk to and seems very well-versed in digestive issues. It's a little out of the way, but he's also extremely affordable (small office, low overhead.)

The food Mikey's getting currently:
I know a raw diet is possibly going to be my next option, and I'll discuss it with the vet, but I'd like to exhaust canned food options first  -- at least till I get a deep freezer.

My middle kitty, Tumbles, can not tolerate an all grain-free diet.  As much as I wanted him to be completely grain-free, his little system just can't handle it and it results in runny poops.  We tried all kinds of anti-diarrhea things and nothing worked.  The vet finally gave us a sample of Royal Canin Gastrointestinal HE and that did the trick!  After about 2 weeks on the Rx food, no more runny poops.  It's been 3 years now and he's still unable to tolerate the completely grain-free diet, so he still gets about 1/8 C of the RC Gastro dry daily.  Keeps him in fine form.

Do you feed Tumbles wet food in addition to the 1/8 C of the rx food?

I pretty much have this figured out, what caused it, and just to let you know, metimucile is given for constipation, not for diarea. 

Do you possibly give her anything else, other than just her food? Treaties, people food, milk, anything other than her food?

What, exactly, medications and flea treatment and wormers was she given? It would be on your check out paper, if its not, you need to ask. You should always keep tract of what medications are given. 

Ask your vet about Pepcid AC. Its more for the occassional/upset tummy/diarea, than for a chronic issue. It has to be the original strength, and 10 mgs tablet. You give 1/4 tablet, every 24 hrs. Always ask your vet first, before giving any over the counter medications.

There is what is called, or rather what we refer to as, the "diarea test".  I don't know exactly what kind of test it is, but its pretty simple, I never had to go that route, mine was too many baby foodie treaties at a show, diarea the next morn, called my vet, she said give the pepcid, it cleared up by his first ring, so its more so for an isolated issue.  Ask the new cat vet about the diarea test.

I do know Revolution, can be given for internal parasites, which is what she might have, had a good show friend that went that route, when nothing else worked for diarea. I did go that route, when they could not find, even a specialist, what was wrong with his ears, vet gave him and the other kitties, Revolution, whatever it was, went away. 

I do know, with horses, there are many different wormer classes. I had a yearling that had diarea, the vet had me give her a different class of all the wormers, for several days, in her case, it worked, internal parasites. Kitties I don't know if it works the same. 

Just some things I thought of, hope the new vet can find out what is wrong with her.     

@maniacmaddy, yes he eats grain-free wet food 2x a day.  That's where he gets most of his nutrition. The dry food is just served as "snack" 3 times a day.

Sort of side bar question, but how long does canned pumpkin last in the fridge?  I have been getting it for my boys but of course you don't give them mass quantities of it at a time .. so I put it in the fridge to store it.  But I was wondering how long does it last in there?

I wouldn't leave it in there for more than a week.  You can take some out and freeze it.

Thanks!  And duh, that is a good idea.

OK, I know your Vet said it wasn't worth "wasting your money" an another stool sample, but have they checked for T. Foetus?  It takes a special test, usually has to be sent out someplace else to be tested, and may be pretty pricey.  BUT, there have been a few cases lately here on TCS where cats have been tested and HAVE had it.  Once diagnosed, the remedy is fairly simple, I believe. 

Anyway, here is just one thread you can read and compare to see if this sounds like what is happening with your girl:  http://www.thecatsite.com/t/264288/sick-kitten-tips-or-advice-please

Here's my advice:  I suggest picking a food that is not poultry or beef, and sticking to it for at least 2 weeks before fussing with any other food types. Probiotic is good, although we haven't given Hobbes any after the first month of the food switch. 

Here's why:

I had the exact same problem with my baby Hobbes. He wasn't growing, and his stool was so loose: when trying to cover it up he'd step in it and then fling it all around the house. Reeking poop was on ceilings. It was horrible. We took him to the vet and he said it was probably allergies, gave us some antibiotics too, and also probiotic powder formula. The vet said that allergy testing was very expensive and not 100%, so he suggested putting him on a low-ingredient diet; one that does NOT have chicken or beef, or any protein that has is raised in mass production. Many humans are also developing allergies to these types of protein. 

We talked with the rescue agency that we got Hobbes from, she also operates a local pet store and has a wealth of knowledge. She recommended Dick VanPatten's Natural Balance. they have 2 flavors that we've had GREAT success with: Venison with Green Pea and Salmon with Green Pea. I've seen it on Amazon.

So what happened to Hobbes? It did take about 10 days for his poop to firm up and stop reeking. We added the probiotic to his limited ingredient food and like magic he is a neat pooper! Then he gained about 5 pounds in 2 months. From 12 to 17 lbs. He's a Maine Coon so that should have been happening, but we suspect that his allergy was stunting his growth, and now that its fixed, he's a roly-poly monster! 

Go (frozen) raw. Both of my cats were having similar issues - over 3 years of it. Stools negative for parasites, multiple rounds of either metronidazole or dewormers. Found myself impatient like you in my desperation to try a different food to see if that would help. Nothing did until I bought some frozen raw patties at Petco - (comes in medallions & kibble-size too, same thing) - Nature's Variety is what I got, but there are other brands out there. I feed my cats the 'rabbit' flavor, at least for now - I may try other flavors in the future, but for now I want to enjoy some solid poop! One meal of frozen raw and their poop turned and remains normal! I feel like a commercial for them, but it really has made all the difference in their poop. I now only need one bag of cat litter instead of two, as there's both less poop and less pee as my one cat was drinking half the bowl of water just to compensate for the resulting fluid loss from diarrhea.