Are feral cats with shelters and food OK in winter? I worry too much on cold Canadian winter nights!

Thanks for the update!  You are on the right track with Patience.  They do easily get the idea that humans are there only for providing food.

If Ginger Tom is mom's friend, you'll be doing them both a big favor by neutering him as well.  That way, there is no chance some other Tom will try to fight him and he won't be tempted to spray and mark his territory.

Plus if he's neutered, the kittens won't seem to be a challenge to him if they encounter him before they are neutered.  When they're small, the Toms often seem to understand that they're babies.  But once the boys begin to develop, I wouldn't want to take the chance that Ginger Tom (or any other Tom) would see him as competition.

Ondine said:

 
Plus if he's neutered, the kittens won't seem to be a challenge to him if they encounter him before they are neutered.  When they're small, the Toms often seem to understand that they're babies.  But once the boys begin to develop, I wouldn't want to take the chance that Ginger Tom (or any other Tom) would see him as competition.

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Yes, thrue.  Even friendly toms will prob chase away  unneutered young male adults, even if they being friendly toms wont harm kittens, own or others.

thanks all for the advice. I was working up to catch Ginger Tom and he was starting to tolerate me near him, but a week or so ago he disappeared!  Hope he is ok, but have to say I was elieved not to have to worry about him around the kittens and Mama Patience.

We now permanently have all 3 kittens, about 6 months old now and all spayed/neutered and doing great.  We have  Mr. Patches, our first adoptee and a mellow guy who loves to eat and sleep;  Picassa a crazy painted calico, "I'm beautiful so pay me attention", and Little Grey aka Pandora, the runt of the litter and the hardest to tame - she is still a little feral and also a dilute calico so she has that independent streak, but she has become very affectionate and cuddly, when she wants to be!  We had a bad scare with a bacterial infection causing awful diarrhea, but after expensive vet trips and meds all is well again. 

Just before the diarrhea I had a potential home for one kitten, but my husband who "doesn't like cats" had an interesting reaction.  "Who are you going to get rid of"  (darling not "get rid of", find a nice home for).  well he says not Mr. Patches.  No I assured him, not Mr. Patches, he has a home for life.  "Because Mr. Patches is disabled" (he is partly blind in one eye due to a bad infection as a kitten that left scar tissue, but happily his eye has grown and the scarring hasn't and he seems fine).  No I told him, one of the girls.  "Well not Little Grey, she really likes me now" (yes she's a daddy's girl for sure).  So ok, the lady will probably take Picassa, she's so beautiful and friendly and loves to love.  "But Mr. Patches is very attached to Picassa, he would miss her if she went".  Hmm. well.  Anyway the diarrhea put an end to that adoption business,  we couldn't very well give someone a sick kitten could we?!  btw I had good success post antibiotics with grain-free food and some pumpkin mixed in, which they like.

Success also with Mama Patience.   I winterized her house - an old cat carrier on our front porch she had been sleeping in - with some spare batt insulation taped around the outside and top (paper side in) then wrapped in an old shower curtain and heavy duty black garbage bag --- not exactly designer appearance but it works, especially with a nice 'porch' overhang and a piece of two-by-four for an entrance step, and an old rubber-backed thick doormat under the whole thing.  I filled it with straw as suggested.  It took a few days for her to use it but now she spends lots of time in there, I was surprised how much she settled the straw (will have to add some more).  She has gradually been coming inside to eat, and has been exploring the house, though freaks out at the slightest disturbance.  My tactic has been to ignore her when she's in and leave the front door open for an escape route.  The only issue is that she hisses and bats at Mr. Patches if he comes near her, but as far as I can see no claws and he holds his own. I would not want to leave her in unsupervised, but am happy to know she will come in at least to warm up and eat if the weather turns nasty.  Also she allows me to pet her if she comes to me, and I was able to give her a Revolution flea treatment along with the kittens.

Will try to get some photos up of our lovely family, can't imagine life without them now!

thanks everyone.

How nice!!!!

I am super happy to read how tou managed things. I am looking forward to seeing the photos!!

Thanks for the update!  I, too, have a darling husband who wasn't sure about the first two kittens I brought home (they were three weeks old).  Pretty soon, he was the one who saw our momma cat and her two kittens.  The two kittens came inside soon after.  This was before I ever even heard the term "feral", so I had no idea what to do with Mamma cat.  She ended up going to the shelter, where she was put down.  I still regret that but I did not know better.

I am always grateful for my dear husband, who turned out to be such a cat lover.  He won't get to know our fosters because he's afraid he'll be upset when they leave.  Love that man!

Ondine said:

 
Thanks for the update!  I, too, have a darling husband who wasn't sure about the first two kittens I brought home (they were three weeks old).  Pretty soon, he was the one who saw our momma cat and her two kittens.  The two kittens came inside soon after.  This was before I ever even heard the term "feral", so I had no idea what to do with Mamma cat.  She ended up going to the shelter, where she was put down.  I still regret that but I did not know better.

I am always grateful for my dear husband, who turned out to be such a cat lover.  He won't get to know our fosters because he's afraid he'll be upset when they leave.  Love that man!

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I can totally relate.  My DH was not a cat lover at all.  When DS and I started volunteering at the Humane Society we fell in love with a darling 10 week old kitten.  DH agreed to come look and then agreed to us bringing him home.  Yet, he told us he did not want to have anything to do with the cat.  DH works part time from home when he is not traveling and this cat (Jake) loves to spend the day with him.  DH just loves this cat.  Then of course there are the 4 outdoor boys.  At first he kept his distance, but quickly realized how special they each are.  He has built feeding stations, shelters and most of all given up over half of the deck he built so the cats have a place to live.  He goes out to visit them.  Marvin the stray I brought inside just loves my DH.  They have special play time each night.  When the last cat showed up in June, I was at my wits end and did not want any more cats.  This cat was sneaking onto the deck at dinner time and eating Shadow's food.  I just did not want to feed or take care of or find a home for any more cats.  My DH and DS were out of town when this cat started crying on the deck.  I called DH in tears and he told me that there was nothing left to do, but accept the cat and start to feed it.  He knew we had room for one more.  What a smart man.  This sweet sweet boy is just the best.  I was able to TNR him in July and now he is the biggest lap kitty.  He definitely was a stray.  He and Shadow are the best of buds. 

So my dog only loving DH has now turned into a total cat lover too.  His cellphone has more pictures of the cats than humans!!  He still loves our dog, but the cats have won a special place in his heart.  I don't know what I would do without him when I need something built and something fixed. 

Lrosewiles, it is so wonderful that things have gone so well.  I am happy that all of the babies are staying and have such a loving home. 

Good advice, Djoe

Yes it is a great thing to have converted my DH into a cat lover.  He is semi-disabled and spends a lot of time alone at home while I am working, and goes through periods of mild depression as a result, so having the kittens has proved great company and stimulation for him.  When I get home from work now there is a joyous cry of "Momma's home" and they all come rushing out to greet me - and often the first talk of the evening is the cute things they got up to during the day.  This is an unexpected benefit I am truly grateful for and blessed to have.

So another breakthrough with Patience tonight.  My husband was out when I got home and Patience came out of her house on the porch and greeted me with rubbing my ankles and asking for petting.  So I sat out with her on the step just talking to her and stroking her, asking how her day was and other silly things, and not only did she rub her head against my hand for more pets but for the first time ever I heard her purr!  Not much of a purr compared to the kits who purr like sewing machines, but definitely a purr!  When I finally disarmed the alarm system and opened the front door she came inside with me and of course the kits came rushing out to greet me, but there was no hissing at all, she even sniffed noses with Little Grey, the smallest one of her daughters.  When I fed them inside - in two separate bowls as is our custom - they all went to same bowl and ate together peacefully just like they did when the kittens were small. When Patience had finished eating she went slowly back outside instead of bolting, accompanied by all 3 kits, and they watched me add more straw to the house, which Little Grey promptly explored and then Patience went back into it, still no hissing. 

I 'm not sure what caused this change but I was very happy to see it as I would love to have Patience come in more when it is cold. I doubt I will ever find her another home, she is large and sometimes cranky and has battle scars on her face (plus a clipped ear) and is not what you'd call a beauty, but she has been through so much my heart goes out to her. In retrospect I realize she must have been little more than a kitten herself when she bore her litter and managed to raise them.  How glad I am now that she found my garbage bin to scrounge.  I can't presume to judge the person who abandoned her, maybe he/she had difficult circumstances, but I can't help but feel that for every one like Patience who finds at least somewhat safe harbor, how many don't.

This is such good news!  I guess Patience just asked for a little "patience" and has rewarded you with affection.  I hope she will decide to come inside herself.  How wonderful that your husband as the kitties to enjoy.  They are certainly entertaining and loads of fun.

Thanks so much for the update.

We are doing well.  Patience has been coming inside regularly to eat and hang out a bit, and the past few evenings that have been very cold and icy rain she has stayed inside for a few hours happily grooming and sleeping on the kitchen mat (a place she seems to have adopted as "hers") before asking to go outside and going to her straw-filled  house".  I had a scare this morning when I opened the door to let her in and found that her "house" had been upturned  by the high wind and was worried she would have been freaked out (I doubt it happened with her inside, she is at least 10 pounds) but later today she came in to eat as usual.  (yes, need to tie down/weigh down her house).  My only worry is that she still tends to hiss at her kittens if they are in her way or at the food bowl.  Maybe this a a hangover from a "make your kittens independent" behavior or maybe she feels jealous or threatened (she is a great eater) but I don't want her upsetting our three rescues, her kittens.  To date my response has been to send her back outside if she hisses, she seems to get that and goes peacefully and the behavior is diminishing slowly, but as it gets colder I'd like to have her inside more without this worry.   Any suggestions?  I've tried separate feeding bowls but they all tend to go for the same one and eat together.  She doesn't hurt the kits, just hisses, and they seem to ignore that, so maybe no reason to worry?

thanks for any thoughts

As long as she doesn't attack them, it should be OK.  I think you might be right - she may just be saying "Get out of my hair, kids!  I already raised you!"

Patience update:  last night was super cold with freezing rain and snow, and Patience spent her first full night indoors, surprisingly very peaceful.  She asked to go out several times but did not go beyond the front steps.  I think she was scared if she went out she would be left out  until morning when she usually comes in for breakfast. I stayed by the open front door to reassure that going out didn't mean staying out, but each time she turned around and came right back in, ignoring the shelter she usually stays in when it's cold, maybe because there was an unusual wind that was blowing snow and icy rain against the front.  It was a lazy night in front of the TV for us and the kittens, and she seemed to be relaxed, played a bit with a catnip mouse toy and rolled over with it like a kitten, and also she came up and rubbed against my leg a few times while I was in the kitchen and even talked to me a little (she is usually pretty much silent).  She eventually found a nice sleeping place in a plush bed that is under a small table, nice safe spot which the kittens often sleep in too - she even shared it briefly with Picassa!  Later the three kittens (well, young cats now) were chasing and playing and generally being rambunctious and she just looked at them like "you kids" and pretty much ignored them just giving them a sleepy eye, although I'm hoping she might eventually join in the play.  Not a single hiss!

Tonight it warmed up a bit and she just went back outside after visiting for a while, but she stayed for some petting and conversation after eating and even came to check out where I was a few times before asking to go out (she's developed a procedure for that - approaches me, gives a little miaow and then goes to the door with her tail up), but I am so pleased to know that she will overnight when the weather is awful..  Only downside is a lack of litter box training - she pooped in the basement last night or this morning, but it was a sincere attempt to find a suitable spot (a small pile of wood shavings and debris left from a wood cutting project) so I moved a temporary litter box next to it to get the message across for next time.  Hopefully that will do the trick.  In anticipation of more sleep overs, I  ordered a large dome shaped multi-cat litter box (our regular rectangular one with a lid is not really big enough for her) and a nice big (dog-sized) bed.  I'm thinking I might get her a collar and tag like the kittens have, but even though they are the quick release kind (which have "released" several times already though luckily been found again) she might get hung up as she is very large.  This "habituation" project has been 5 months in the making so quite slow, but the progress from "run or hiss when approached" is very rewarding.  It's taken much longer than I anticipated but now I'm almost regretting getting her ear tipped when TNR'd.  Still, thinking of a post of taking half a poor cat's ear, it's quite subtle and not too terribly noticeable. 

Great update on Patience.  So glad she is coming inside for visits and had her first overnight!!  For the litter box you might want to mix in a bit of soil since she is used to going outside.  Another trick is to get some Dr. Elseys Cat Attract litter.  You can mix it in with current litter or just use it .  THe stray I brought into my house in May had a hard time with the litter box.  He didn't like the dirt, but as soon as I purchased the Cat Attract he had no problems.

I've been caring for a male feral cat for over two years. I cannot trap him and he will not come into my home, even though he brought two of his offspring to me to take care of which I've taken into my home. Muffin is quite fat this year--so I predicted an especially harsh winter, and so far I'm right. I have a cedar pet house on my porch which is insulated, with a piece of carpet and towel on the floor with a mylar sheet and plenty of straw over it. The house has an entrance and an exit so he can escape if needed, but in very cold weather I put a blanket over it allowing only about 2 inches to show thru the doors. He knows to push through it to escape. He gets fed VERY well. I give him warm chicken breast and broth with fancy feast and he has access to good quality dry food all day. However, I still worry about him! We're having several nights of weather in the low teens, and frequent snow falls. I am hoping that the body fat and thickened fur will protect him, and that if he was REALLY suffering, he'd just come inside, so I guess I need reassurance, too. I would give ANYTHING if he would just come inside my house. I think part of the reason why he won't is because I have 4 other cats inside (they all know each other through the windows and door, and two are his offspring) and he respects their space. Also, I did manage to trap him a year ago (and he will not go into a trap again) and he went completely nuts for 3 days, climbing the walls and crying. He is a true feral. I envy people who are able to get a well-beloved feral to come into their homes

To the person who suggests that getting near or petting a feral cat will disease a person or their pets--I think this is nonsense. You only need to fear rabies, and if a cat is rabid, he will not approach you, or will approach you with hostility. As long as the cat is fed and active, he is fine. I treat Muffin as one of my own, and do not turn my back on him or any of my kitties when they get sick.

My fosters stay on thr balcony and now its cold.... between 9 and 15 degrees C. I havr made an isolated warm house for them with a heat disc inside.
At night whrn I go to bed I take thrm with me, otherwise I can't sleep thinking they might be cokd... but the rest of the evening I get worried will they get dehydrated if they lay on the disc for so long? They have access to water all the time but I still think its not too healthy.... I know for humans its not!

Any tips?

MsAimee said:

 I would give ANYTHING if he would just come inside my house.

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Hi MsAimee

I am so sorry if my post upset you, I totally understand your desire to have your feral come inside. First, I think we had an advantage in that I'm pretty sure Patience wasn't born feral, but rather is an abandoned and probably abused stray with some memory of being a house cat and underneath her fear of people really wanted a home again. It's been a long journey (since the summer) but she seemed always to want to come inside, was just tremendously scared..  And second, our existing inside cats are her kittens who we adopted and not strangers.

Even so, those feral "I have my own agenda" tendencies remain, and sometimes she goes missing for a day or more.  She scared me today - 20 degrees and freezing/blowing snow, and she asked to go out this morning and did not return. I kept checking the door and her insulated house, no sign of her.  Finally with darkness approaching I scoured the neighborhood calling for her and finally located her under a neighbor's porch.  She answered my calls by crying to me (luckily when I was close enough to hear) but was not willing to brave the piled up snow to come out,  and of course did not understand my offer to carry her home.  Finally when the snow slowed I was able to coax her out and home to much rejoicing, but to be honest she probably would have been ok where she was until morning and I made her wade through the snow because of my anxiety more than her need. In other words, if a well cared for feral knows he/she has a place to come  it's his/her choice to come there, whether inside or out.   I think cats know when someone cares, and that's really the main thing we can do

good luck.

Hi, your post didn't upset me. I always lament that Muffin won't come inside! I actually have two of his kittens (Harry is 8 months old now and Mia is 14 months) and he knows they're inside, but still has no interest in coming in. He's very stubborn and set in his ways. I get very worried when he goes missing for a day or two, but I suspect he may have another caregiver somewhere, or another cat family. When I search for him, I never find him. His "other" life is a mystery to me! It would be more convenient and much less stressful for me if I could care for him inside with my other cats instead of outside, but this is his choice. Ferals are very stubborn! 

Hi ShadowsResuce

thanks for the advice.  I mixed a bit of soil in an old litter box downstairs and although I've not actually seen Patience using it, I'm sure she is -- a few large size poops evident (and one that missed the box but a legitimate effort) and no stray poops in the house.  The multiple cat litter box in the kitchen is a great success too, though can't wait for the warm spell we are having to melt the snow so we go back to outside bathroom use. 

Patience is now more or less resident, she is in more than out and finally seems to be integrated with her 3 kittens, sharing food, even sleeping with Picassa and only very occasional hissing (like when she wants to go out and someone is in her way).  She asks to go out when she wants to, and finally seems to have got the message that going out doesn't mean being evicted.  I am so very happy that we have the family together and Patience is no longer an outsider.  Next mission, get her weight down, she is very fat.  I got Blue Buffalo Longevity ideal weight canned for her and am trying to feed her separately, but they do tend to pile into each other's food (rather skinny Picassa likes the diet food and fat Patience and Patches like her urinary health food, go figure).  But it's such a pleasure to see them eat peacefully together after the initial spats, and having Patience gradually become a real member of our cat family.  Pretty amazing for a cat who totally freaked out being inside in September and couldn't be touched.  Now she is relaxed and seems happy, even rolls over for belly rubs and purrs. 

One last question: the kits are about 8 months old now, and had their shots at about 3 months.  When are their booster shots due, at 12 months or 12 months after the first lot?

thanks again for the support and advice, it's really helpful.