Unsure what to do

Hi, I am brand new to this forum. I have 2 feral cats in my home and am at my wits end about how to care for them. I had never been a cat person but three years ago, I rescued a kitten thrown out on the highway who was feral. I love her dearly and she still will bite and scratch me everyday but she has no fear of me coming up to me at will. I went on to rescue an abandoned kitten who is a sweetheart so when 2 little kittens lost their mother last Winter, I could not bear to let them starve so I took them in. I was told by others that, they would help me find them a home but now over a year later, they are still with me. I have tried everything to have some type of relationship to no avail. They will only let me touch them at food time and appear to want nothing to do with me. They have caused damage and are wild. They do get along with my other 2 cats and like the dogs. I am sure I am at fault here, something I could have done differently but I do not want to just let these cats out to starve or die an agonizing death but I cannot live with them like this. I even thought putting them down today and cried about it. I know people will think I am awful for that but I really do not know what to do. They have always been treated with kindness and never known hunger or cold since coming into my house. Can anybody give me advice.

What kind of damage are they causing? When they let you touch them at meal times, what kind of  touch, how much of it, how long?

Some cats never grow up to be cuddle bugs, but you can still come to certain "agreement" with them. The trick is to figure out what they prefer.

One more question; do you have a cat tree for them?

They have torn the wallpaper off the walls, scratched furniture and today knocked a picture off the wall causing drywall damage just to name a few things.  I have invested in cat trees, and lots of toys, and currently am making a 8 foot cat tree out of a real tree cut down to place in the sunroom so they can feel safe up to look out all the windows.   I got the idea from Martha Stewart.  I have a cat bench built along the front window in a bedroom where they can lounge and look out.  I admit I have always had dogs but I am willing to learn.

Desi and Issi will let me reach down and stroke them for a few seconds only.   They flee from me at all other times.  Sometimes they will sit at a distance and look at me but will never approach me unless I give them a treat which they take tentatively and then run.  They are worse than they have ever been as they grow older.  They used to seem to like me petting them for short periods when I could catch them but no more.  My other two cats even the mean one have never acted this way.  They approach me and get in my lap and sleep with me and want interaction and seem to love me.   Thank you

You know there is such a cat calming feromone, Feliway. In adapter or in spray.

It may be useful for you.  Say, spraying on your hands...

But. There is an even better feromone of the same type, Felifriend.  Used among other by vet, who sprays their hands before they must handle afraid cats.

Now, Felifriend is not sold in USA.  So you must find an online firm abroad, and buy it online or so.

I think this Felifriend is a useful bet for you.  If it gets too complicated, you can try with the Feliway spray, which is easier to get.

Good luck!

I have never heard of it. Thank you.

This may go without saying but are they all spayed or neutered? If not, get that done ASAP. It will calm them down, although it will not guarantee they will become cuddle bugs.

It does sound like you doing the right thing by providing them with vertical space.

That's great that you have a big cat tree; they will enjoy that. It will hopefully save your furniture's as well.

Keep in mind that your cats are still very young. As they get older and mellow out, they won't be so crazily destructive.

When they are looking at you from distance, you can talk to them while giving them "cat kisses" (slow blinking).

In fact, some cats-and dogs too-are really uncomfortable interacting with human, they like to be left alone much of the time. To them, being "ignored" and being able to observe you in safety is enough interaction. If you "ignore" them, they may be more inclined to be friends. I know, it's a paradox. So, start "ignoring" them more and see if that helps.

When I care for very shy kitties, I often have to make extra effort not to do anything, to them or with them-just sit and read, watch TV etc. gives them time to assess who I am. I have one client kitty who took several years to finally decide I'm not a bad person and start coming out while I'm in her house and even play with me.

You can try using a bamboo back scratcher to pet them. Often, feral or traumatized cats are not used to or very suspicious of human hands (the smell, look, feel of our hands) You can start by leaving a scratcher in plain sight, oh-so-nonchalantly, letting them investigate it. If you rub a bit of catnip on the end, it helps to attract attention. Then, when they are in the mood (perhaps right before meal time when they are likely put up with anything), pick up the scratcher and let them sniff at it, but don't scratch them with it yet. Try that a few times, then, if you think they are open to it, move the scratcher ever so slowly, tickling their faces. You want them to keep wanting more, so quitting time is way before they start to get antsy. Over time, you can expand the area you touch with he scratcher to the rest of the face, neck, then to the back. You can follow the scratcher session with a irresistible treat. (Kitty Kaviar works great.) They will connect "being petted" = "good things".

You probably already have a few wand type toys like "Da Bird" "Cat Dancer" or "Cat Charmer"; they are great, specially "Cat Charmer" because they don't have to come too close to you to play with you. Even if they look at you like "Are you kidding?" deep down, they want to.

Even the shyest kitties can't resist coming out to watch wand toy play session when their more friendly roommates and I are at it! They sometimes forget themselves and join in. The shyest of the shy might watch it from the distance, but they are still "interacting" that way. It gives them something to think about.

You can give them an old sleep T-shirt of yours as part of bedding to get them used to you.

Have you also tried Comfort Zone? (Feliway) It seem to work with many cats.

Also helpful: Linda Tellington-Jones' "TTouch" for animals. You can watch videos of it on youtube. She has several books out on TTouch for cats also. What she calls "Chimp Touch" is specially good for cats because the back of our hands are cooler than the palm and thus less threatening.

Important thing to remember is that you can't force them to do things you want them to do, but you can make them look like something they won't mind doing, and they may eventually start to like them on their own. This takes time, but it may not be as long as you fear.

Ondine said:

This may go without saying but are they all spayed or neutered? If not, get that done ASAP. It will calm them down, although it will not guarantee they will become cuddle bugs.

It does sound like you doing the right thing by providing them with vertical space.

Click to expand...

C
Yes they both are fixed. Thank you

Chloespriestess, I will try your suggestions. Thank you!

Good, good. Like Chloespriestess said, it may also be them just being rambunctious kitties. In addition to the Feliway Stephan recommended, there are also essences you can put in their food and/or water. Bach's Remedies and some other available through Jackson Galaxy.

Ondine thank you.

You can also try flower essences.  I have had much success with Feral Cat Rehab from Spirit Essences.  You just add it to their food and/or spray it around the room.  The comfort zone plug ins are also great.  I also have used Feline Composure.  It's in a treat form and you can purchase from Amazon and some pet stores. 

Do you play with them?  Even though they don't like touch, they may love play time.  Feather wands, da bird,  other wand type toys are great.  Tire them out.  Jackson Galaxy from the Animal Planet show, "My Cat from Hell" says that you need to Eat, Play, Love. I like to play with them, give a treat and then some pets.  The feather wand toy is great for interactions and then also for getting them used to touch.  I used it on my first feral, Shadow.  I would rub the feather wand over his body and head.  He began to enjoy it.  I would even get it under his chin.  Eventually I pulled the wand closer to me so that it was my hand on him. 

Gerber Stage 1 Chicken or Turkey baby food, is often called "kitty crack".  Cats love it.  It's great for giving medicine, rewarding or getting them to come to you.  I used to smear it all over my hands and allow Shadow to approach and lick it off. 

Working with ferals takes so much time and patience.  I always feel it's a step forward and then some steps back.  Routine is also helpful.  Meal time at the same time each day, play time, pet time and just time to hang out together.  Soft music is also helpful.  I use some harp music and other calming classical music.

You are doing a wonderful thing by caring for these souls. 
 

Thank you Shadows Rescue. I do play with them and they seem to like that but they will not let me touch them or get near them unless it
Is mealtime. It is frustrating because I want to pet and love on them. I will try your suggestions!

It's like this: They are creatures from a culture completely different from ours. To some of them, being touched, hugged, cuddled, even just being in close proximity with a human is unthinkable.

They might be saying, "It's just so offensive that they even think to touch me! How scary, those human hands!" 

Some of them can change their mind and adopt to our ways of expressing love. (For example, your other cats have learned this already, from enough exposure to human environment.)

How fast they start adopting to our ways depends largely on how comfortable they become with the idea of our culture. It is just as if we went to a place where we are not very comfortable with the local custom; we usually learn to accept it once we understand it and see that it's not harmful. We may not like it, depending on what it is, but we may learn to appease the people around us in that particular culture. Or, we may even start to love the way things are done, however strange it may have been to us initially. In some ways, it is like that with felines as well.

But because we are human, we can learn about the dos/don'ts of different places before we go. We have the sense of reasoning. Cats have no such advantage...

Right now, they may be thinking "No Way!", but once they feel secure that you respect their boundaries, they will warm up to you. They already have changed their mind a little bit: "OK, I will make an exception and let her touch me during the meals. I think that's safe."

Playtime is also very helpful, because that's what they know and accept. Aren't they usually in better mood afterwards? That's actually a good time for a few pets with a back scratcher.

Pamela Johnson-Bennett talks about good ways to use playtime to bond, so do check out her books.

Good-luck!

Thank you chloespriestess! I appreciate your help.

Hi Leak, looks like you already have got lots of great advice.   My advice is meet them where they are at - play is the best interaction and don't force any physical contact.   My indoor feral Patches and I bonded through play for many months before she started to move closer to me and rub on my legs, allowing me to reach down to pet her back.    She now after seven years will let me pet her pretty thoroughly and brush her, but I can never pick her up and I can only pet her if she's standing on the floor or on my bed while I'm standing to the side.   We've worked this out after many years of an elaborate dance figuring out what works and what still sets off fear in her.   Without doubt though she's an affectionate cat and purrs - even drools at me.   With ferals I think it's important to accept that they may never interact like a normally socialized cat and that it's still possible to relate to them on their terms.    As for bad habits, they are no different than tame cats - you'll still need to use the same tactics to discourage scratching and you would with any cat.   Good luck!

Thank you Bastfriend!