Freeze dried raw, plus a question about using powdered raw organ products

otto

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My cats enjoy several types of freeze dried raw products. They get one meal (10 nuggets, re-hydrated) of Stella&Chewy's freeze dried complete meals four or five times a week. I rotate the chicken and the duck&goose proteins.

One cat, Jennie, enjoys a small meal of Dr. Harvey's freeze dried tripe once or twice a week. Though the tripe doesn't absorb water, and isn't meant to, she gets half a puck broken up into a little water, I usually add a little bit of fd heart or chicken breast to round it out. She is the only one who will eat the tripe. I guess the other cats don't like the smell of cow poop :lol3:

They all go crazy over freeze dried chicken breast. I use two brands. The Whole Life is convenient for using as a topper because it crumbles into dust well, but it cost quite a lot more than the PureBites. So I use the PureBites more for treats and Chase The Prey Game. I also use it to help settle tummies, if they have gone longer than normal between meals.

I've been experimenting with freeze dried heart brands. Only one cat, Jennie again, likes the Fresh-Is-Best duck hearts.

They all go nuts for Bravo brand freeze dried turkey hearts. This time I bought the Fresh-Is-Best turkey hearts. I'll be opening those today. I hope they like them as well as the Bravo, because they were considerably less expensive.

There is one more thing I would like to find, if there is such a thing, and that is freeze dried kidney. I've found powders and capsules, but I'm not sure that would be beneficial to the cats? Or would it?

In fact, would the powders of other secreting organs/glands be useful to the cats too, since I have no fresh source?



It was searching for freeze dried kidney that led me to this site, for example:

http://www.drrons.com/organ-and-glandular-supplements/kidney-new-zealand.html

http://www.drrons.com/organ-and-glandular-supplements/index.html
 

ldg

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FD kidney, like FD liver or freeze dried food like S&C, retains the nutritional profile.

When I can afford it, I use freeze dried organs, because I have no source for some of them fresh.

I think Carolina priced out the Dr. Ron's - I'm pretty sure that's the one she found. I didn't find it, but found the Immoplex Nutricology stuff. My cats LOVE the beef brain, spleen, and pancreas. They eat the thymus. :lol3: Those that hate fresh kidney don't like the FD kidney though. (I thought that might work, because the four that don't like or can't keep down fresh liver like and can keep down freeze dried liver).

I just found that My Pet Carnivore carries all kinds of fresh organs, so when I can afford it, I'll be trying some. But in the meantime, when I can afford it, I buy freeze dried beef brain, pancreas, spleen, and thymus. I didn't bother figuring out the "right" amount - I remember doing the math on it when I was first thinking about it, and it would cost an arm and a leg to feed 8 cats these as 5%. But I sprinkle a capsule of something on every late night meal (when I have them).

http://www.nutricology.com/Glandulars-p-1-c-267.html

The last time I bought them, it was from Amazon, but they're sold a lot of places.
 
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otto

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A capsule per cat, every night, or one capsule split between all 8 cats?

So, would it be beneficial for me to use something like those FD powders, to supplement their diet as it is currently? Mazy and Queen Eva are getting a half ounce a day of PMR, with liver as the only organ (.05 oz) Jennie gets one ounce daily of PMR with .1 liver.

The rest of their raw is commercially balanced, and of course they still get about 50% of their diet in canned food. But I still fret a little about what they may be missing out on with liver as the only organ.
 
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ldg

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I don't know if the cost is worth the benefit. :dk: But when I have the money, they get the variety of freeze dried organs. :lol3: And I give one capsule per cat, not split between them.
 

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I'm going with LDG on this one.....going to order some organs for the freezer in my next MPC order.  I'm thinking pancreas, kidney, and liver.  Spleen, I think, is meat...not secreting organ....but correct me if I'm wrong.
 
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otto

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I just can't manage ordering fresh frozen organs. I haven't got the money for it or the space to put it. So it looks like it's freeze dried powder in capsules, or nothing.

I wish I could find freeze dried kidney "treats". Geez, they make it in hearts, livers, tripe, and other muscle meats, why is there no freeze dried kidney?
 

harleydiva

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I just can't manage ordering fresh frozen organs. I haven't got the money for it or the space to put it. So it looks like it's freeze dried powder in capsules, or nothing.

I wish I could find freeze dried kidney "treats". Geez, they make it in hearts, livers, tripe, and other muscle meats, why is there no freeze dried kidney?
The organ stuff from MPC is very cheap....but I am lucky in that I can get them in a monthly delivery at a location only 20 miles from me.....so don't have to pay the shipping fees.  There is a $10 delivery fee.....but still no where near the shipping charges if I order several items.
 
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I don't know what MPC is, but anything shipped frozen is going to be beyond my means.
 

harleydiva

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I don't know what MPC is, but anything shipped frozen is going to be beyond my means.
I don't know what MPC is, but anything shipped frozen is going to be beyond my means.
MPC = My Pet Carnivore.  They based in Indianapolis, but do monthly deliveries all over the Midwest.  I can pick up orders in South Bend, Indiana once a month.  I'm balancing now between MPC, and Raw Paws...a coop also based in Indianapolis, who also does monthly deliveries.
 
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Thanks. :) I've just recently found a place relatively local that can order in the Rad Cat for me, after driving 200 miles (round trip, still cheaper than shipping especially because I can order so much more at once) for the past 9 months to get it. Now I'll only have to drive 40 miles round trip, so it will be a good savings for me. If it works out. Supposedly my first order with them will be coming in this week. They have limited freezer space and I have to pick it up on the day it comes in, and they aren't sure yet which day that will be.

But I still need another organ meat for my girls' PMR portions. Sigh....
 
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What is this Hydroxypropyl methylcellulose, under the "other ingredients" in the Nutricology products?
 

harleydiva

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Thanks.
I've just recently found a place relatively local that can order in the Rad Cat for me, after driving 200 miles (round trip, still cheaper than shipping especially because I can order so much more at once) for the past 9 months to get it. Now I'll only have to drive 40 miles round trip, so it will be a good savings for me. If it works out. Supposedly my first order with them will be coming in this week. They have limited freezer space and I have to pick it up on the day it comes in, and they aren't sure yet which day that will be.

But I still need another organ meat for my girls' PMR portions. Sigh....
I'm not sure where you are located....but have you checked for coops or suppliers that deliver anywhere close to you??  The Rad Cat stuff looks good.........but 3-5 times more expensive than making your own with the pre-ground products and supplements!!!!
 
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otto

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I am very happy with the Rad Cat, I chose it for their commercial frozen portions specifically because it does not contain bone. :) My cats get a combination of home made prey model along with the Rad Cat and other freeze dried things mentioned earlier, plus canned food.

All I want is a flimmin flammin freeze dried kidney, :lol3::lol3:! Why is there no such thing? LOL.

I might be interested in the powdered capsules, for occasional use for three cats it wouldn't cost that much for me, but I don't like the sound of that Hydroxypropyl methylcellulose.
 

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:lol3: Yes, very scary sounding stuff, hydroxypropyl methylcellulose, also known as HPMC, because the full name is quite a mouthful. No worries, that's the capsule. Any time you see "veg cap" or "vegetarian capsules," they're made with HPMC instead of gelatin. It wouldn't sound so scary if they just said "vegetarian capsules." Of course, if all the companies that used veg caps listed the ingredients used to make them, you'd probably already know what hydroxypropyl methylcellulose is. !!
 
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otto

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Thanks Laurie. I wondered if it was the capsule. Good grief why don't they just say so? I did read up on it but I still couldn't figure out what it was, because what I read was not encouraging, even the part about it being used as a binder or coating in tablets
 
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ldg

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It's like bentonite clay. It's one of those "natural" things that comes in varying purities: bentonite clay is sold for humans to drink as part of a health detox program; it's used for beautifying "masks" - but also has a million industrial uses, and is also used for cat litter. The "danger" in bentonite clay is in the grade of clay, the mine where it is mined. HPMC comes from wood pulp. Because of its properties, it has a lot of industrial uses, but also has "food grade" uses.

IMO, just because something has both industrial and food-related uses doesn't "by definition" make it dangerous - but it sure can sound scary, and it can be really difficult to tell whether or not it IS ok. A great example of that is Miralax. It's made from an iteration of the same stuff anti-freeze is. It supposedly doesn't break down into the toxic stuff.... but it's actually only approved for use 7 days at a time, not long term use. That's one of those things I'd rather not mess with, because of the potential link to kidney failure. But HPMC, even though it has industrial uses, doesn't have toxic properties/potential side-effects (that I've found).
 
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otto

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Well, I wouldn't be giving the capsule anyway, just the contents.
 
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