Savannah breeder - actual or scam?

predators heart · Mar 10, 2013

Hello, I am seeking help about a supposed F2 Savannah breeder.

The guy, is supposedly selling two F2 Savannah kittens (each for $450).

His ad is listed in Ohio, but he told me he's in Florida. He said that ad was listed to Ohio because that's where he used to live, and that he knows many people there have interest in this breed.

He claims the reason why he's looking to rehome the kittens is because him and his wife don't have enough time to stay home with them.

The kittens are named Helma (female) and Denzy (male). He claims they're registered with the cat clubs.

In our private conversation, he did email me the same thing twice though.

At first, he offered to ship them to me (I'm actually interested to adopt Helma, the female). I am in Canada, so shipping IS the best way for me to get her. However, I don't really trust him for some reason.

So I told him that I was actually coming next week in Florida for a one-week vacation (which is not true), and that I could come by at his house and take the female right on place. I made up this to see what he would say. His response surprised me, must I say. Here's what he told me:

``That will be great but i will need to know when you will be coming to Florida so that we can best prepare Helma for to meet her new family.``

I don't know what to think now. Usually, scammers will back out and stop replying if you ask them if you could come over at their house and pick up the animal yourself. But this guy seemed okay with the idea.

I obviously can't go all the way to Florida to take the kitten, it was something I made up to test him and see if he's actually a scammer or not. But now, I'd like your advice. Should I tell him that I ''can't go to Florida anymore for X reason'' and pay him $450 through Paypal for the kitten? What do y'all think? Personal experiences with him, if any of you had some, are greatly appreciated! I don't want to lose any more money, I've lost over $800 in the past 3 months because of some fake breeders.

Here are, attached, a few pictures of 'Helma' and 'Denzy'.

gussy14 · Mar 10, 2013

I'm no expert in breeding whatsoever, but if it sounds like a fish and smells like a fish .... then there's a good chance that it's fishy.

I find it hard to believe that someone bought these kittens and then discovered that they didn't have time for them. I mean, if that was truly the case, why didn't he take them back to the breeder? If it were me, I wouldn't do it, but only you know your tolerance for risk.

stealthkitty · Mar 10, 2013

Be very, very careful. A Google search of one of those images indicates that those kittens are up for adoption in Spain:

But they also show up on a Flicr account, which may perhaps belong to the real owner. PM me for the links.

stealthkitty · Mar 10, 2013

The more I investigate those photos, the more I see the kittens listed as living in places all over the world. I think it's pretty safe to say you are being scammed; why not email the "owner" some links to sites that contain these same photos, and ask him to explain?

Willowy · Mar 12, 2013

How his English? I see in the reply he said "for to meet her new family", and frequently the scammers are in China or somewhere and use really messed-up English (it's one good way to tell). Also listing in a different state. Also stealing pictures from actual breeders. This really does seem fishy. Ask him to scan her papers for you, and tell him you can be there next Wednesday at 2 pm (or whatever). See what he says to those (at this point I'd just be playing with him; I really do think it's a scam).

If you've been burned by scammers before, I think you should go through the breed club this time. At least you know they're really breeders if they belong to the club!

stealthkitty · Mar 12, 2013

By doing a Google image search on one of those images, I came across a page that clearly said those photos are being used for a scam and that they were taken in 2008 (actually, more than one page said they are from 2008, and I think one of the pages belongs to the actual owner/breeder). There's no doubt in my mind that someone's trying to make an easy buck. If it were me, I'd ask the guy to explain where he got the photos from; but only out of curiosity to see what kind of story he'd come up with.

orientalslave · Mar 13, 2013

I've not come across doing a Google search for images other than putting in text (for example 'bengal cats') and clicking the 'image' link. Is there some other smart way I don't know about?

stealthkitty · Mar 13, 2013

Right click on the image and select "Copy image location", then go to http://images.google.com/ click the little camera in the search bar, paste the image location, and search. Alternatively, you can open a second window and drag the image to the Google Images search bar. There's also a site called tineye.com that does the same thing, but I find that Google often turns up results when tineye doesn't.

duckdodgers · Mar 13, 2013

Since you're here asking the question, I think you already know what the answer is

I would certainly ask him how "his" pictures came up on someone else's site, but before that I would say that you will be there at Wednesday at 2 (like Willowy said) just to satisfy curiosity.

If you have been scammed through multiple "breeders" at a total of $800, I don't know why you would even consider taking the risk of going through anyone other than a well trusted and recommended breeder. It may take longer to find what you're looking for, but it's certainly easier than spending hundreds of dollars supporting scam artists and having nothing to show for it. Trust your instincts, and be aware that there are many people out there to exploit others for their own profit!! Find a breeder recommended through a trusted organization or word of mouth, and you will be a much happier camper.

Scam artists make me glad that I won't likely ever be looking for anything fancier than the stray cat special. What you see is generally what you get!

brandy-neka · Mar 13, 2013

Real F2 Savannahs, or real Savannah's in general are NEVER that cheap. It costs around 300.00 dollars just to ship them by plane and that's within the United States, not even considering crossing boarders into Canada. Most likely this guy would send you a cat that is just a common breed of cat. If you're looking for credible Savannah sellers I went to A1Savannahs. However my first cat with them Neka, got lymphoma when she was just a year and a half. They replaced the kitten for free and I got Sabriel... Long story there but they are good breeders and good people. I also know a site where a lot of other savannah owners go to talk about savannah cats only that talk about real breeders and scams to look out for. Pm me if you're interested in the link.

StefanZ · Mar 14, 2013

Good and useful thread, as scams arent that unusual. And of course, buyers and breeders=sellers of purebred cats do risk them extra much.

TS isnt participating. He knows the thread is here and he got answers as I did send him a PM and told the thread was moved from Pregnant and Kittens where he started, to Breeding. Lets suppose he forgot his code and thus cant log in, but is closely following the thread.

There exists also other scam variations in the cat world, but here is an example aimed against purebred fanciers.

bigperm20 · Mar 14, 2013

If I were in your shoes, I'd avoid anything other than reputable breeders like the plague. Licensed breeders not only produce beautiful kittens, they help to lessen or eliminate genetic diseases.

Have you considered an Highland Lynx or Ocicat instead of a Savannah? They have the wild look but no wild blood. I haven't priced Ocicats, but I'm pretty sure you can buy a highland lynx for $500-$800.

cat person · Mar 17, 2013

Brandy-Neka said:
Real F2 Savannahs, or real Savannah's in general are NEVER that cheap. It costs around 300.00 dollars just to ship them by plane and that's within the United States, not even considering crossing boarders into Canada. Most likely this guy would send you a cat that is just a common breed of cat. If you're looking for credible Savannah sellers I went to A1Savannahs. However my first cat with them Neka, got lymphoma when she was just a year and a half. They replaced the kitten for free and I got Sabriel... Long story there but they are good breeders and good people. I also know a site where a lot of other savannah owners go to talk about savannah cats only that talk about real breeders and scams to look out for. Pm me if you're interested in the link.

and

great post!

The photo's are clearly stolen. The kitten, on, the white sheet/towel was bred by Avalon Savannahs. The breeder is Julia Dent, at least, that, is what I believe

. Anyway, here is her website: http://www.savannah-cats.net/. The second set of photo's show a F1 Savannah, not, an F2 Savannah.I am not sure, where, those photo's came from. But, I doubt, that the person you spoke with, is, selling an F1 Savannah for that price!

maewkaew · Mar 17, 2013

Cat Person, can you let the people know the photos were stolen for yet another scam? And if anyone knows where this ad was listed, and it is still there, can someone report it to the website or hosting company ? I don't know if the OP will come back but for anyone reading this thread , there are a LOT of Savannah scams. so many that it's a whole forum section on savannah cat chat. It is terrible the OP got ripped off already and them almost again. People need to STOP trying to get bargain basement Savannahs. Either ( in many cases) you get NO kitten at all. Or you get a domestic spotted tabby that you could have adopted from a shelter for $100 or less. Or you might get a Savannah but a sick , unsocialized one from an idiotic/ unethical / greedy breeder. Then you spend thousands trying to get the cat healthy, instead of just going to a reputable breeder in the first place.

cat person · Mar 17, 2013

maewkaew said:
Cat Person, can you let the people know the photos were stolen for yet another scam?

maewkaew · Mar 18, 2013

@Cat Person It seems like it makes no sense to tell people if you don't know what the site was but Stealth Kitty was describing how to do a search for the images and sounds like SK found the same images on multiple sites, so it might be possible to track down places where they are currently being used in a scam.
Otherwise my hope was that either the OP might have been in touch with someone via PM and said where the ad was.

I seldom hear of scams with Chausies or Safaris but I think it's that Savannah has had much more publicity. There are Bengal kitten scams though. and there are scams claiming to offer Servals and other wildcats. Speaking of publicity, I bet there are definitely scams offering "Asheras" which is ironic because that was a scam in the first place.

I am very sorry you lost your F3 so young.

cat person · Mar 19, 2013

Originally Posted by maewkaew

@Cat Person It seems like it makes no sense to tell people if you don't know what the site

That, is, what I was thinking. But, I figured, I should ask, since, I can be rather umm.. "ditsy"

.

was but Stealth Kitty was describing how to do a search for the images and sounds like SK found the same images on multiple sites, so it might be possible to track down places where they are currently being used in a scam.

I hate to admit it, but, I really have no idea, what, Stealth Kitty is talking about in this case

. So, I really could not pass on, any, coherent information to Avalon Savannahs.

Otherwise my hope was that either the OP might have been in touch with someone via PM and said where the ad was.

Me too

.

I seldom hear of scams with Chausies or Safaris but I think it's that Savannah has had much more publicity.

You are correct, there, I am sure too. Plus, the Chausie, doesn't have the spotted pelt so coveted by people. Personally, I do not like the spots. I prefer the ticked coat of the Chausie or the Bengal cats rosettes.

There are Bengal kitten scams though.

That is disheartening. Though, I should not be surprised.

and there are scams claiming to offer Servals and other wildcats.

I have seen some of those, now, that you mention it.

Speaking of publicity, I bet there are definitely scams offering "Asheras" which is ironic because that was a scam in the first place.

Yea, that Simon Brody, sure was "helpful"

.

I am very sorry you lost your F3 so young.

Thank you, I lost my F1 Bengal and pure male African Serval to Lymphoma as well. But, at least, the other two, made it till there teens. My F1 Bengal, lived for about fourteen years and my Serval till 10 to 15 years old. I never got an accurate age on him, since, I was his fifth and final owner.

Savannah breeder - actual or scam?

TCS Member

Thread starter

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

Advisor

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member

TCS Member