Spraying all over the front and back porch!

Seems the cats I've been feeding are spraying all over the front and back porch!I've had many heart attacks, back and lung problems and lost my job and home years ago!I had to move in with my sister! She's extremely upset about this spraying problem and ifI don't do something quickly, I'm gonna need a new place to live!!!!Is there any way to stop the spraying????? I think even if I stop feeding them theywill still come every day and night looking for food and spraying all over!What the heck do I do?????

Sorry to hear about your problem.  Thanks for feeding them.

Are the cats spayed/neutered.  If not, then the cats will continue to spray (mark their territory) until they are.

I know money is tight, but many counties offer low cost/free spay/neuter clinics.  And will even loan you traps and maybe help you with trapping them.

Ritz said:

Sorry to hear about your problem.  Thanks for feeding them.

Are the cats spayed/neutered.  If not, then the cats will continue to spray (mark their territory) until they are.

I know money is tight, but many counties offer low cost/free spay/neuter clinics.  And will even loan you traps and maybe help you with trapping them.

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No their not! Their completely wild! Even though I've fed them for a long time now their stillscared of me and everyone else! The mother dropped off 2 kittens recently and one of themnow lets me touch it when I feed them. This is becoming a real problem! No body seems to want them around and now it'scausing problems in the family! I don't know what to do! I've lost so much sleep worrying about them and trying my best to help them! Now it seems their just pissing on me! I don't knowhow to deal with it! The neighbors don't want them around either! I've sorta gone againsteveryone to help them as much as I can.I've searched for groups or anyone in the area that could help or offer advice with no luck!Seems anywhere that could help is so very far away! I've also searched here about sprayingand it appears that even the ones that are pets and love their owners continue even after beingspayed or neutered! (not all but lots of them do)\I'll be completely honest! I've had 7 heart attacks in the last few years and I won't be around much longer!I've been praying for death for quite a while, I can't deal with being almost invalid! Feeding these catshas been my only real joy in a long long time even though it's so hard to do. Snow or sleet, rain or shineI drag myself out there and keep that feeder full!! I just can't sit by and not help!I'm lost! I have no idea how to help them anymore! I fear they'll have to be trapped and taken tothe Humane society where they'll be killed in a few days! Adult wild cats have virtually no chance at being adopted!I'm sorry to bother you all with this stuff but I don't know where else to go or what to do! I'm lost!There is no money to help them with! I haven't had an income for almost 10 years! I used gas moneya family member gave me to buy the feeder for the cats! It's just not possible to pay anything tohave them fixed or even go and get traps from someone! It's very hard to admit that I'm so uselessI can't even get a cat fixed but it true!Anyway, I'm sorry for rambling on! Everyone has problems and just staying alive is difficult enough!

If you're in or near a larger city, there may be a TNR group in the area. One of the volunteers may be willing to come to your place, trap the cats, get them fixed, and return them to your yard. Check the phone book, call a few rescues (don't call kill shelters because they might do something not so nice). It's worth asking anyway. Even if they don't totally stop spraying after being neutered, it will be reduced and it won't smell as bad.

Maybe if you move the feeding stations farther away from the porch, that would help?

I agree with Willowy about the feeding stations, try moving them as far away as you can physically get to (I know you have physical limitations).  The cats will go where the food is:  no food, they'll locate other sources.

There is another expression:  if you feed, do not let breed.

What a situation you have and in all honestly, if those cats don't get fixed and TNRd (Trap/Neuter/Return) there will be more. It is best not to feed these cats, hard as it is for me to say, if you cannot get them all neutered. They will colonize and breed near feeding resources. Try calling a TNR organization in your area and ask for help with these cats. Try googling Trap/Neuter/Return for your county on the internet and hopefully there will be some options. Many of these organizations have incredible people/volunteers that are willing to assist people with good hearts such as yourself in the community. There is such a need and so many cats needing TNR. Here is a thread that might have some options for you as well. http://www.thecatsite.com/t/16045/h...ng-and-low-cost-or-free-spay-neuter-resources Keep us posted as we care very much!!!

If there is two cats male and female that are allowed to breed freely and fed constantly, after four years there are thousands of cats, in 7 years that is over 780 000 cats (probably feeding resource run out before) if none of them starve or die other horrible death. That is if there is constant food supply and enough shelter so they get two litters in a year.

Not feeding them might sound cruel, but in nature creatures adjust to food supply, so cat's breed as much as food supply will allow, if there is little food they breed lot less, it is natures way of population control, something we humans tend to mess with and cause unbalance which leads then to problems in other location or species.

So if breed control can't be made it is less humane to feed cats as there will be soon so many of them and all of them suffering when limit of resources are met.

There was also recent study that did connect extinction of 33 species to cats, house cats alone did eat billions of birds in a year (in US) and as there are 60 million house cats, there probably are quite many ferals too which were mentioned to hunt down even more. Large feral cat population on single area can thus have great impact to other species and if they are breeding freely, there are hundreds in few years around yard and hunting every small creature that moves.

That is why above is mentioned stopping the feeding being better and why seemingly horrible thing to do is actually better thing to do.

Here there has been cases where at rural area people had kept cats, feeding them and letting them breed, at some point animal control then had to be called as there has been several hundred sick cats many starving, even more carrying diseases, only possible solution has been to put them to sleep, except few healthiest that has been then fixed, but I would say it is more sad to put several hundred to sleep than not feeding much smaller number of them and not letting situation to get to that bad in first place.
That has happened so many times that it can be said that will happen if fed and let breed freely, there is just no way around it really and that is why it is brought up that you would not need to experience it first hand as it will be horrible experience.

These are just things that many don't know, some have here known but have not believed that cat's could breed so much, often there has been lot more of them than what persons feeding them have known too.

Hopefully TNR solution can be found, though, it would be always better one!

Thanks Folks! The common theme here seems to be don't feed them! I'll sure stop! Makes life so much easier for me! I guess starving andfreezing to death is better than getting gassed or injected at a shelteranyway! At least they'll get to die near home!Thanks so much for all the great advice! I appreciate it!!!

Feral cats are tough. . .they probably won't die, the adults at least. They know where food sources are and they'll manage. They will breed less if there's less food, and maybe they'll find a place where people are doing TNR. If you live in the northern states (probably not since there are kittens, you said), I wouldn't stop feeding them until the snow is gone. But if you're in the south, they'll be fine, really. I know it's hard to think so, but it really is best for the cats not to provide food if you can't have them fixed.

If the kittens are tame, I think it would be best to try to find them homes, though.

TheOldFart said:

Thanks Folks! The common theme here seems to be don't feed them! I'll sure stop! Makes life so much easier for me! I guess starving and freezing to death is better than getting gassed or injected at a shelter anyway! At least they'll get to die near home! Thanks so much for all the great advice! I appreciate it!!!

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You really should not look at it that way as far as them starving and freezing. How long have you been feeding them? How did they come to you in the first place? I am certain that before you, they found a way to survive, so they will again if you stop feeding. The best thing that could happen for all of these cats is for someone to become their full-time feral caretaker and get them all TNRd. That is what I will wish for them. for all of those kitties.

Mama my be able to care for herself! She has hunted before but here in Michigan in winter there's not much for her! The rest of the bunch are her young from this summer! They've been fed by me since they were only weeks old and she dumped them here! They have no idea how to hunt and have nothing to hunt here! They must raid garbage cans to survive and those are only out one day a week and in tightly closed containers!I'm really am amazed that the so called cat lovers here would rather they die than not be TNR'ed! Absolutely incredible! Politics I suppose! Pushing an agenda!Anyway, thanks for your time and advice! I really don't trust your opinions anymore and won't be asking anymore questions here! I don't really want to be associated with the fix em or kill em folks! I thought the little critters would have a voice and some friends here but I guess it's only for the fixed ones!I find it interesting that someone who doesn't know me at all suggests that they know the situation better then I and they won't starve or freeze! It's just my ego! Incredible!I truly hope that in your time of need you find caring and kind folks that may help you no matter what color you are, gender or any of the other excuses people use for not helping those in need! These wild cats need help or they won't make it till spring! But then again that seems to be what your all hoping for I guess!!

TheOldFart said:

Mama my be able to care for herself! She has hunted before but here in Michigan in winter there's not much for her! The rest of the bunch are her young from this summer! They've been fed by me since they were only weeks old and she dumped them here! They have no idea how to hunt and have nothing to hunt here! They must raid garbage cans to survive and those are only out one day a week and in tightly closed containers! I'm really am amazed that the so called cat lovers here would rather they die than not be TNR'ed! Absolutely incredible! Politics I suppose! Pushing an agenda! Anyway, thanks for your time and advice! I really don't trust your opinions anymore and won't be asking anymore questions here! I don't really want to be associated with the fix em or kill em folks! I thought the little critters would have a voice and some friends here but I guess it's only for the fixed ones! I find it interesting that someone who doesn't know me at all suggests that they know the situation better then I and they won't starve or freeze! It's just my ego! Incredible! I truly hope that in your time of need you find caring and kind folks that may help you no matter what color you are, gender or any of the other excuses people use for not helping those in need! These wild cats need help or they won't make it till spring! But then again that seems to be what your all hoping for I guess!!

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Your emotions are misleading you now.

Nobody here likes to any cat to die, but also from two devils smaller is sometimes better one and it is not always very clear which one is the small one!

Multiply females by 4-5 and you get how many cats you will have next spring that again need same care for same reasons can you still feed them? How about next autumn when again next springs females can be multiplied by 4-5 to get how many there are then that needs feeding to survive for the winter, can you feed them all?

We all hope that TNR would happen, but also we have seen so many times how doing good becomes doing bad and from how small things get out from hand that it is something we don't wish to happen to you as it will be far more horrible experience.

But how cats spray all over porch if they are in closed containers? Do you have two groups of cats, other free roaming and other not?

JTbo said:

If there is two cats male and female that are allowed to breed freely and fed constantly, after four years there are thousands of cats, in 7 years that is over 780 000 cats (probably feeding resource run out before) if none of them starve or die other horrible death.

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those numbers are nothing more than a myth that sadly gained traction.
http://www.sfgate.com/pets/yourwholepet/article/Damn-lies-and-cat-statistics-2479652.php

i also believe that Bialik was only talking about total births, not actual survival since a study from the Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Association found "Cats produced a mean of 1.4 litters/y, with a median of 3 kittens/litter (range, 1 to 6). Overall, 127 of 169 (75%) kittens died or disappeared before 6 months of age. Trauma was the most common cause of death". so there research found an actual survival rate average of just over 1 per year.

There was also recent study that did connect extinction of 33 species to cats

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more of the bird zealots lies - http://www.voxfelina.com/2011/08/fantasy-islands/

house cats alone did eat billions of birds in a year (in US) and as there are 60 million house cats, there probably are quite many ferals too which were mentioned to hunt down even more.

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i am surprised that LDG did not jump on this - http://www.straypetadvocacy.org/wisconsin_study.html

JTbo said:

TheOldFart said:

Mama my be able to care for herself! She has hunted before but here in Michigan in winter there's not much for her! The rest of the bunch are her young from this summer! They've been fed by me since they were only weeks old and she dumped them here! They have no idea how to hunt and have nothing to hunt here! They must raid garbage cans to survive and those are only out one day a week and in tightly closed containers! I'm really am amazed that the so called cat lovers here would rather they die than not be TNR'ed! Absolutely incredible! Politics I suppose! Pushing an agenda! Anyway, thanks for your time and advice! I really don't trust your opinions anymore and won't be asking anymore questions here! I don't really want to be associated with the fix em or kill em folks! I thought the little critters would have a voice and some friends here but I guess it's only for the fixed ones! I find it interesting that someone who doesn't know me at all suggests that they know the situation better then I and they won't starve or freeze! It's just my ego! Incredible! I truly hope that in your time of need you find caring and kind folks that may help you no matter what color you are, gender or any of the other excuses people use for not helping those in need! These wild cats need help or they won't make it till spring! But then again that seems to be what your all hoping for I guess!!

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Your emotions are misleading you now.

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agreed.

Here's the problem: if the females, at least, aren't spayed, there's going to be more and more and more of them every year. Say 2 surviving kittens from each female, half of those kittens are female, in a few years you'll be feeding 20-30 cats. Can you afford to feed that many ? If something happens to you, will your family members continue feeding them, can they afford to feed so many? It's really a difficult situation . Keep trying to find a TNR group, hopefully something can be done before the situation gets out of hand.

TheOldFart, it is a difficult thing no doubt and I again encourage you to consider getting help with TNR.   If you will PM me your location I personally will make the effort to find you resources though I can't guarantee success.   That's how much I care about this. 

To see where people are coming from here I'll share a story of what happened right next door to me.  A neighbor who loves animals saw a feral cat and began to feed her.  One cat.  The cat was female and became pregnant and she kept feeding her, she had kittens, the kittens grew up wild, she had another set of kittens.   I got involved to get the mother fixed and the youngest kittens caught and adopted out, but many of the first kittens had scattered far and wide throughout the neighborhood, some probably female and reproducing even now.   Sometimes when I'm driving  I'll see a dead cat on the road that I recognize as one of this cat family - they all have a distinguishing fur/color pattern - it makes me very sad.   In the end many cats were born to grow up to starve, scrounge for food, and eventually die because my neighbor did not TNR the first cat.   Even though she continually fed them many of the cats still left to establish new territories - and reproduce.  The legacy of this will affect this neighborhood for years.  My neighbor moved away leaving two cats hungry and me in the position of feeding them or not - I've TNR'd one already.  The others are scattered to the wind.  It is hard work physically and some financial commitment - I get it if you aren't up to it but please let us help you to the degree we can.

We do care deeply for the feral/homeless cats and their survival. These cats must be TNRd to stop them from producing more homeless/feral cats. It will also benefit them healthwise and allow them to use their energy to survive and not be focused on reproducing and fighting. Best scenario if you could, would be for you to take on this responsibility of getting them TNRd and then continuing to feed/care for them. Maybe check with people in your neighborhood who might want to come together and help with caring for these cats? Most importantly they must be neutered or more kittens will be born to a life of uncertainty and adding to the already huge dilemma of feral cat overpopulation. This is not about politics, race or an agenda here, quite the contrary. It is about standing up for and fighting for a better life for all feral cats and that starts with getting them all neutered and into a managed feral colony where they will live much happier lives and no longer reproducing more unwanted cats. I understand you are emotional about your concern for these cats and it is not easy to just close the door on them. Just think about that very soon they will breed and you will be inundated with kittens. It could quickly get out of hand if you keep feeding and don't get them TNRd. for all of those cats.

Whaler said:

those numbers are nothing more than a myth that sadly gained traction.
http://www.sfgate.com/pets/yourwholepet/article/Damn-lies-and-cat-statistics-2479652.php

i also believe that Bialik was only talking about total births, not actual survival since a study from the Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Association found "Cats produced a mean of 1.4 litters/y, with a median of 3 kittens/litter (range, 1 to 6). Overall, 127 of 169 (75%) kittens died or disappeared before 6 months of age. Trauma was the most common cause of death". so there research found an actual survival rate average of just over 1 per year.
more of the bird zealots lies - http://www.voxfelina.com/2011/08/fantasy-islands/
i am surprised that LDG did not jump on this - http://www.straypetadvocacy.org/wisconsin_study.html

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I did read number from this place:
http://www.sey.fi/in_english

Of course it is theoretical value, fraction of females and males in litter have effect on it, litter size varies from availability of food, shelter, climate, age and health of cat, newborns can die and probably it will not get as bad, but I believe point of that is just how quickly things go bad and they do go really quickly bad, resulting those even more sad stories.

This is the study I did mentioned:
http://www.esajournals.org/doi/pdf/10.1890/110251

Here is some English news about that:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story/2013/01/29/science-cats-kill-billions-birds-mammals.html

Of course as we love cats we don't want to believe they would be harmful as it could mean harm to them, but they do make a big hit liked or not.

Then there is another point, as we humans are creating lot better chances for bird population to grow too, which again is mostly often ignored, difficult to answer question will be what is net outcome, do we help populations to grow enough so there is enough for cats to take their share.

Also there is no clean science anymore, everyone is driving some agenda, attempting to make data fit their cause instead of being just skeptic of the data, which would be real scientific way, so only way to be sure would be need of reading whole study and especially methods used, but I can't afford to buy that at the moment, however it is not hard to believe there being big effect when knowing how much they eat and what are their hunting habits, truth is somewhere in the middle as it always is, either side are just pulling the strings of poor cat lover and I would say both are wrong.

It is same here when gov's forest research unit makes study that show climate change increase growth and gov's meteorological institute says it is decrease growth, then gov's geology department shows study that both happen just different times same way it has happened thousands of years, which one to believe? We humans are just so silly at the times, we think we would actually know and be able to control big things while nature just goes on, cats are born, cats are dying and whole process just moves on, but we like to look things at individual level and thus we don't like to get our loved ones get hurt, that is our cats, but we would benefit a lot from ability to zoom out and look at the bigger picture at times, instead of focusing that individual aspect.

That is issue TheOldFart is facing at, looking situation close makes it difficult to see whole picture and seeing how good can be bad and how gradually ending up feeding is less inhuman than letting cats breed to much larger numbers and increasing demand of food far beyond nature or resources of caretaker can handle.
But it is just last resort nobody wishes to happen, but which is one of necessary decisions if things go to worst, however there are many other possibilities to be exhausted before that, but it is option one should prepare to take if things come to worse.

Cat's have hunting instincts in their genes, so unless food supply is suddenly cut off they most likely will adjust and that way nature will adjust their breeding to match better to what environment has to offer, it is amazing how much food there is around for a cat, things we never even see, even at winter times, if there are too many of them, all will suffer and weakest die, strongest live on and when overpopulation is cut by nature they will not suffer at least not at same level, it is mechanism of nature, it is not perhaps nice mechanism, it is quite brutal actually, but it is efficient and has been controlling population millions of years.

What I think is that governments should use more tax money to TNR, money is put to so many less important things that maybe responsibility of problem should be taken and every cat neutered. After all if pets are allowed to be kept, consequences should be taken care of and if because anyone is allowed to have pet without registration is allowed and that creates consequence of ferals roaming in environment they don't belong to, then at least that should be done is to cut the breeding. I don't like from method which around here where all ferals are killed, I think gov should put money to house them for rest of their lives because lazy law making allows problem to happen in the first place. There could be law that restricts un neutered cats to only a registered breeders to have or something of such to put some serious control over the issue, but if not, then at least problem should be handled decently, sadly such does not happen as they are 'only' animals, so pretty lights at some building drives over such cause.

Well, maybe some day, recent years have brought a lot improvements and big change to general view of animal rights and general public's understanding of relation of issues, but surely there are still long way to go. One day I plan to form association to drive that cause, but it is big thing to do then...

I hope to hear how TNR is progressing, for example when I had bit of issue getting two of the boys operated I got suggestion of crowd funding, which I think would be great, but I live in wrong country for that, in US there are more possibilities for such as there are more options in general.

regarding the loss, will and marra study, i would strongly recommend you read this http://www.voxfelina.com/2013/02/garbage-in-garbage-out/ as well as some of the work that LDG has done showing the inaccuracies in previous studies that are the foundation of all others http://www.straypetadvocacy.org/cat_predation.html in the case of the "scientists" involved in the study, they certainly do have an agenda as it is clearly shown in their disregard for actual science.their unscrupulous behavior is even worse due to the fact that are being paid by the taxpayers.

as far as TheOldFart's situation; i agree that it is difficult to see the big picture at times, especially when you are on the front line. emotions can and do run strong when you are the one facing tough decisions.

here in the u.s. it is both good and bad dependent on where you live since the policies and laws vary not only by state but by town as well. for me personally i am blessed due to living in connecticut. not only is the state on the progressive side as far as feral cats go - $54,000 in vouchers to pay in full for tnr by non profits - but most towns have animal control officers that are extremely supportive of tnr. but at the same time there are a great many (majority?) places where the scenario is the complete opposite.