Great dry food for my kitten?

Hello everyone. I'm Ioana, my kitten's name is Mitu. Mitu is almost 6 months old, he just got neutered sunday and the doctor said I should change his food from kitten to adult so he won't start getting fat.
Right now he eats wet food ( AvoDerm and Merric's) and wellness as dry food. I don't really like wellness since they have some white spots in the food and i see them in hes poop for some reason, but maybe adult food is different. So ill keep in mind wellness too.
So what other premium food that I should look at? A great dry food that would help him keep his weight off. Can you guys give me some ideas?
Thank you.

Well, that's a tough question. :lol3:

Cats are obligate carnivores. This means that they need a high protein diet - and they have zero requirement for carbohydrates. But with kibble, you basically have to have some carbs, and most kibble actually has quite a bit.

In the end, it really depends on what your budget is. Wysong has a starch-free and (almost carb-free) kibble, called Epigen90. If dry food isn't a big part of your kitty's diet, maybe you can afford to feed it. :dk: http://www.wysongepigen.net/epigen90.php

Next to that, one of the highest protein, lowest carb dry foods is EVO chicken & turkey: http://www.evopet.com/products/1441

But if you can, it's actually healthiest for your kitty to feed no dry food at all: http://www.catinfo.org

I would love to feed my kitten only raw or wet food, but those are a little bit expensive and sometimes I am on a buget and I can't afford to do so. He eats mostly wet food, but sometimes gets his nose into the dry food that is always available for him.
Thats why I would love to give him a good dry food too.
I will check those two out. Thank you.

I want to add, that, I feed Evo Chicken and Turkey to my domestic cats and foundation Savannah. That, is the only dry food, the Savananh can digest. He has been on it, for, almost two years now. I also feed, whole live prey, to all my cats daily. But, they all still do well with Evo Chicken and Turkey dry.

Now, a question for LDG, if, you don't mind , the Epigen90, made by Wysong, seems to be marked for BOTH cats and dogs, is that correct? If so, SHOULD a person, add, a commercially made vitamin, specifically designed for cats, to the food? Or, is it not supposed to be, a "complete diet" for cats, hence, not fed, as a hundred percent, of the cats diet?

Thank you .
 

No, the Epigen90 is complete and balanced for both dogs and cats, meaning it is supplemented with the right amount of taurine for cats, so dogs will do fine on it, and it has everything it needs for cats.

I wouldn't add a supplement.

LDG said:

No, the Epigen90 is complete and balanced for both dogs and cats, meaning it is supplemented with the right amount of taurine for cats, so dogs will do fine on it, and it has everything it needs for cats.
I wouldn't add a supplement.

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Okay, thank you, very very very much .

Iona, it might not cost as much as you think: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/242250/survey-how-much-are-you-spending-per-cat-per-day

http://catcentric.org/nutrition-and...y-cat-or-i-can-afford-to-feed-commercial-raw/

I'll look into it. Thank you.

Ioana said:

I would love to feed my kitten only raw or wet food, but those are a little bit expensive and sometimes I am on a buget and I can't afford to do so. He eats mostly wet food, but sometimes gets his nose into the dry food that is always available for him.
Thats why I would love to give him a good dry food too.
I will check those two out. Thank you.

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You will find what is best for your kitty within your budget.  I work with people on the very subject every week.  If they can not afford my brand, which is Nutro, I will help them find a brand they can afford that will give them the best option for their money.   There are several dry and wet formulas out there that might fit your needs.  You can check out the Nutro brands at http://www.nutro.com/natural-cat-food.aspx    The Nutro Max Cat is the more econimical of the 2 lines.  The only dry mine will eat is the Nutro Max Cat Indoor Chicken formula.  I've tried just about all of the premiums out there but this is all they eat.  Their wet is Nutro Max Cat or Nutro Natural Choice.  I also buy several other premium wet foods to give them different textures and flavors.  Do your research, don't hesitate to ask questions and take it all with a grain of salt. By doing your research,  in the end,  you will make the informed decisions that are right for you and your kitty.

I've been doing some research on it and I found a couple of dry food that I would like to look at. I have an all natural pet store here close that I just found about so sunday I'll go take a look.They are:
- young again 50/22 ( i see its a little bit expensive, i'll have to see at the store)
- orijen
- petcurean Go
- wysong epigen 90
- evo
And the least expensive
- wellness core
- nature's variety instinct
I have a couple to look at and surely i'll look at Nutro too. But if someone tried any of these let me know how they are.

I went to the store today and I came home more confused then anything. So a couple of questions:
1. How much protein does dry food has to have for him not to get fat? Is 48% to high? ( adult dry food) whats the best percentage?
2. How much fat does it have to have? Is 18% good?
3. What does grain free really mean?

Ooooo, you're doing a good job of research! :bigthumb:

I like the list of foods you came up with. :nod: Here are my observations:

Orijen is a high quality food - but all of their "flavors" have a LOT of fish, and a similar list of veggies and fruits to the Petcurean. The fish can be a problem for many cats over time - whether it's allergies or UTIs, there's just something about a diet where a lot of the protein comes from fish/fish meal that seems to cause issues. It doesn't need to be avoided altogether if your kitty doesn't have allergies or problems with crystals - but it's just something to be aware of.

The Petcurean Go - not sure which flavors you're looking at, but they all seem to have a lot of fruits and veggies, broccoli, spinach, etc. Now - those are just above the list of supplements, so the amounts may be very small. :dk: Personally, I'd prefer the EVO or even Wellness Core over that, I think.

The Wellness Core also has a lot of fish - but the EVO has herring and peas. So kind of a trade-off there.

The Nature's Variety Instinct has that similar list of fruits & veggies, but they're all listed AFTER the supplements, so even smaller amounts.

When ingredients are more or less comparable between the foods, I look to which has the lowest carbohydrates. Those are calculated using a "Dry Matter Basis" calculator. Basically, when comparing foods, to make them on an apples-apples comparison, you "remove" the water, and what's left is protein, fat, fiber, "ash" (minerals), and carbohydrates. This is also the best way to compare dry and wet foods (the only way, actually). Comparing dry foods to each other is easy, because most have about 10% or 11% moisture - and most wet foods have about 75% moisture.

In the wild, the natural diet of a feral cat, on a dry matter basis, is 62.7% protein, 22.8% fat, 11.8% ash, and 2.8% carbohydrates (there was really no fiber in their diets). (This is from an analysis of 27 studies of feral cat diets published by Plantinga et al. 2011, "Estimation of the dietary nutrient profile of free-roaming feral cats: possible implications for nutrition of domestic cats." British Journal of Nutrition 106; s35-s48).

So on a DMB basis,

The Orijen Cat & Kitten is

47% protein
22% fat
3% fiber
I assume 7% ash because it's not listed (this is typical in dry foods) (so on DMB basis its 8%)
which leaves 21% carbs


The Petcurean GO "Fit + Free" Grain free chicken, turkey, and duck is

53% protein
20% fat
2% fiber
10% ash
which leaves 15% carbs


EVO turkey & chicken is

56% protein
24% fat
2% fiber
I assume 7% ash because it's not listed (which is 8% on DMB basis)
which means its 10% carbs


Nature's Variety Instinct Chicken Dry is:

56% protein
24% fat
3% fiber
I assume 7% ash because it's not listed (which is 8% on DMB basis)
which means its 9% carbs



Wellness Core is:

51% protein
20% fat
3% fiber
I assume 7% ash as it's not listed (which is 8% on DMB basis)
which means its 18% carbs


Oh - and the Wysong Epigen 90.

67% protein
13% fat
4% fiber
I assume 7% ash (which is 8% on DMB basis)
which means it is 8% carbs


Of these choices, I'd use several in rotation. I'd consider EVO, the Nature's Variety Instinct, the Epigen 90, and maybe the Petcurean GO! Fit + Free

When I fed dry, I used EVO Turkey & Chicken, and NV Instinct Chicken.

Hope this helps!

Oh - forgot to address the "grain free" part - and your question about fat.

Cats are built to use protein and fat for energy. A high fat diet in and of itself will not make them fat. But fat does have about twice as many calories as protein, so they need less food for the energy they'll get from a high fat food. What makes cats fat is carbohydrates. They don't utilize them efficiently, so they feel the need to eat more to get the energy they need: the carbs go to fat on their bodies, while they need more food to get the energy they need from the protein and fat that's in the food with the carbs. This is why you needn't worry so much about how much fat is in a cat food, but how many carbs are in the food. :nod:

And that's why "grain free" is a bit of a misnomer. Many people assume that if a cat food has no grains in it, it is naturally low in carbohydrates. But what happens is that many pet food manufacturers just replace grains (wheat, rice, corn, etc. - which are cheap sources of protein cats don't efficiently use) with other forms of protein-based carbs, like peas or potatoes.

This is why it's important to analyze not just the ingredients of a cat food, but its composition on a guaranteed analysis basis (but converting it to a dry matter basis).

And this is the Dry Matter Basis Calculator I use: http://catcentric.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/DMB-Calculator.xlsx

Ohhh my thank you so much for your message, very helpfull and informative.
So here is what I came up with
when I was to the store the lady told me that she feeds her cats orijen fish something so I cut that one of my list because I did read that to much fish is not good.
Then Petcurean Go chicken, turkey, duck I got a sample bag, the food is very small and I love that. My kitten did eat it without thinking to much about it. I also read very good reviews about it. But as you said a lot of veggies and first ingredient is chicken meal!!! But Ill keep it mind.
Then when i asked about evo she said that it contains alot of fat. But I am still keeping evo in mind...ill try to get some samples.
Then I went to other store...I asked about instinct and she said she doesn't recomend it because of the recall...I really don't know anything about it or if that was recently but since it was last on my list I don't even think about it anymore.
They didn't have wysong epigen 90 or young again.
Now about wellness...I really, really don't like wellness kitten that I have now, so I don't know about it, even if they are different. But I'll keep it in mind.
So evo, petcurean Go and wellness core.
This is very difficult
But he eats mostly wet food so now I have to look into that too.
Thank you for helping me with this...I find it confinsing and Im still learning about what is good and bad for them.

It IS confusing. :nod: :lol3:

I don't think you need to pick just one. In fact, I'm in favor of including several foods, either in rotation, or just mixing them together. Wet, rotate brands/proteins. Dry, either rotate brands or mix a couple together.

Because those you're looking at are all actually made by different companies, it's even better. Different ingredients, different sources, maybe even different plants! (A lot of companies contract out manufacturing, so even if different brands, some may be manufactured in the same place).

It provides a variety of ingredients; it reduces recall risk. I'll search tomorrow for the NV recall, I'm posting from my phone so searching/posting links is kind of a PIA. :lol3: But consider using 2 or 3 different brands rather than picking just one.

Oh, another FYI thing. Most dry food has "meal." It pretty much has to, especially to be affordable, because dry food is, well, dry! So the moisture has to be removed. But even if "chicken" or something is listed as the first ingredient, and some kind of "meal" is 2nd, 3rd, or even 4th on the list, the meal will still be contributing most of the protein. Consider how much fresh chicken weighs compared to powdered chicken. You'll have a heaping pile of powder to arrive at the same weight, because fresh chicken is about 75% water. So I wouldn't knock something off the "maybe" list just because "meal" is a first ingredient.

Ohh thank you for helping me with the "meal" as first ingredient, when doing my research I found that meat should be first, but now Im starting to understand a bit more about how it is.
So other question. You said I should change them up, but shouldn't I do that in 7 days? Can I just mix them together without giving him an upset stomach?
About wet food...I tried almost everything at petco/ petsmart but he is picky. Now he likes Merric only the beef one and avoderm. He doesn't like anything that is too pate like.
I will look into some new ones at this natural store.
But really thank you for helping me with this, I really apreciate it.

Oh, this may help. When picking out wet food, you definitely want a named meat as the first ingredient, and there's really no reason for "meal" to be in a wet food.

But for dry food, it's nearly impossible not to have "meal" in it.

And as for introducing dry foods, you're right. A new food should be introduced slowly. :nod: When I switched from one prescription food to several dry foods, I introduced one new one slowly, and let them eat that for a couple of weeks. Then I slowly introduced the other one I wanted them to eat. From there, you can either mix them, and feed them mixed, kind of like a "custom" food, or you can alternate between the 2 or 3 foods you pick out, giving each one on a different day. But with the slow intro, you avoid the stomach upset from the new ingredients; but once they're introduced, it won't cause tummy upset to rotate.

Another one to consider is Earthborn Holistic Primitive Natural. It does have fish but doesn't look like too muuch (I hope). And it's reasonably priced. Once my current stock of emergency kibble runs out, I plan to mix that and EVO, and I want to have at least 3 in the mix so I have to find another one that's low-carb but not ridiculously expensive. Maybe Before Grain. . .I have to look into it. But I still have a lot of the old stuff left so I don't have to hurry.

I've always mixed kibble and it's never caused any problems. You'll want to transition him slowly from the old stuff to the new mix, though.

For wet food, if your kitty likes chunks and gravy, you can look into Soulistic, Earthborn Holistic, and some Weruva pouches. Cats in the kitchen, I think they're called?

I'm not too familiar with that style of wet food. My cats liked gravy foods, so I bought pate foods and added water to make it all "gravy," and that worked for them. Then I slowly fed it with less water, and then they were eating the pate foods. :lol3: