I don't know how she died?

Hi, I had a cat who passed away recently, her name was Maggie, I feel like I have no closure, she was the most important thing in my life and I lost her so quickly and I dont even understand why or how.

She was still pretty young, strictly indoor cat.
It all started with this ear infection. I smelt something so bad and her ear was all crusty.. shes never been sick before or had one before, I took her to the vet and gave her antibiotics.
The antibiotics gave her a seizure. (which was also a first for her, shes never had one before)
Then that I noticed her eyes disapearing, like her pupils and she didn't close her eyes anymore when she slept,she was going blind.. i took her to the vet again and he said she was anemic and gave me more antibiotics and ear spray.

that night she went down hill even more, couldn't walk, had a hard time breathing, she hadnt eaten or drank on her own in about 5 days, I had to feed her myself.

I rushed her to the vet again the next morning, a lady at the front took her back to the vet and she died, the nurse came out and said the vet told her to tell me my cat died from a tick disease.
That is all the information I got. Thats all they wold tell me. She NEVER even had blood work done and they never found a tick.

I haven't heard of any disease to her symptoms she could get from a tick..

I will list everything that was wrong with her, I just am hoping so much someone on this site can have an idea of what happened, maybe you have heard of these symptoms before, and know if they relate to each other?

Just some ideas of what you think she could have had would be appreciated, I loved her so much and I feel like we don't have closure. I feel like she was just another animal to the vet and he just threw out a possibilty without knowing for sure.

She died very quickly of getting this symptoms, within about a week.

there was the ear infection-
not eating or drinking
loss of balance
she was anemic
pupils were disappearing she went blind (i tink it was called retinal detachment)
high heart rate
swollen throat
seizures
MAJOR weakness

theres nothing i can  find that has all those symptoms.
I've looked up Lyme diease and it doesn't really fit.

Any ideas are so appreciated.

I'm very sorry for your loss. It's especially hard when we lose a pet so suddenly, and without a clear understanding of what happened.

I hope someone can help you with those symptoms, even if it just gives you an idea of what happened, although no one can really know for sure.

To me, it sounds like she had some kind of neurological problem like a stroke. Could explain the blindness and seizures anyway.

Oh my goodness, my heart goes out to you. I'm so sorry for your loss. 

One thing I am curious about is what were the antibiotics that the vets gave your kitty, do you know?

Wow, without a postmortem it's hard to even know what to guess.

However, the ear infection sounds like a yeast infection, which is not all that uncommon in fairly healthy adult cats.  The remainder might possibly be an allergic reaction to the antibiotic, but you just never know.

In addition, cats are so good at hiding illness that they are often VERY sick before we even notice it.
 

It is so easy to say the vet should have done this or that and it was all his fault when nothing makes more sense. I felt that way about my dad's doctors when he died of colon cancer. But thinking that way is not going to help you understand what happened. The only way to know why your vet said what he did is ask him. But learning the causes of all the symptoms you described can help you understand how a completely healthy indoor cat can suddenly get sick and die like that. I hope you can get answers to all of your questions and wish I had some. I do not want to make any assumptions about what happened, but will try to guess some possibilities if you want me to. Please do not be offended if anything I say seems to be unsympathetic; my heart goes out to you while you grieve your loss of Maggie.

 RIP Maggie

Lyme disease would be my guess.  It is passed by ticks.  Another forum member had a kitty die recently with similar symptoms.

http://www.thecatsite.com/t/245176/it-seems-impossible-to-get-over-her-death

I had a cat who had a few of these symptoms, the loss of appetite, weakness, seizures, loss of balance and went blind.   It  was determined to be a brain tumor. 

With seizures, the other symptoms, besides the ear infection, make sense.  An autopsy might yield some results or they might not.  Sometimes just like with people, they don't know what causes seizures.  She could have been exposed to something (the antibiotic though contrary to belief, I don't think that's it.  Or a food or element in the air, whatever.) or it could have been something that was there all along like a ticking time bomb.  It's easy to be angry when you're confused and dealing with the loss and grieving.  Just remember that they did the best they could for her.  And sometimes there are no definite answers.  You can try to find some but that doesn't mean that you will or you'll be any more satisfied with that answer.  A lot of times, with this type of condition, the best they can do is an "educated guess" which I think is what they've done with their current explanation. 

I've known cats that had seizures from the time they were kittens (they never lived long after the seizures started).  And, I've known cats that seemed perfectly healthy until one day they weren't and had a seizure.  Usually once they start having seizures (more than one) there is not a whole lot that can be done.  I am so sorry.  I know you must be in incredible pain but try to remember losing a patient is hard on your vet, as well.  So if you do question them, try to keep calm and polite.  And remember that you may not get the answers you think you need.  With seizures in cats, it is anyone's guess really and a postmortem may not reveal a whole lot.  However, if you want to spend the money in hopes of having closure, it may be something to look into.

Hugs to you and take some time to heal and think of your kitty the way she was and the love and joy she brought to your life.    I am so sorry for your loss.

Usually once they start having seizures (more than one) there is not a whole lot that can be done.

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It depends on the cause. Seizures can becaused by diabetes, which of course is managed by changing the diet. Epilepsy is managed by vets prescribing phenobarbitol (and possibly other drugs). Brain cancer can't always be removed surgically, but chemotherapy can take care of the inoperable tumors. Unfortunately, this diagnosis would be the most logical cause of the seizures because other symptoms are not related to a diabetic or an epileptic seizure.

I just read my post and must apologize.  First and foremost, I am so sorry for your loss.   Thank you for loving her while she was here with you.  That is the best you could have done.  {{{HIGS}}}

Oh my goodness, I'm so terribly sorry for the loss of your precious Maggie, honey!

Did the vet take a swab of her ear to determine if it was a bacterial or fungal infection? Antibiotics would be appropriate for bacterial infection, but an anti-fungal should be used if it was a fungal infection. When you went back the second time after giving the antibiotic, did he do any tests? Was the antibiotic the same as the first time?

My thoughts are that the vet may (was! IMHO) have been incompetent because it sounds like he did little if any testing and just prescribed the antibiotic(s) in a one-size-fits-all approach. It also sounds like she was going into anaphylactic shock from the first round of antibiotic given most all of the symptoms e.g. first the seizure(s), then swollen throat, high heart rate and subsequently the retinal detachment/blindness (meaning she was going into heart failure), weakness, and "anemia," which I feel he said because of perhaps pale gums--not by any confirming labs run to properly diagnose this--fit anaphylaxis because none of these symptoms were present before the antibiotic (unless I'm missing something in what you wrote). If I'm wrong about any testing that was done, I'll be the first to apologize for my take on this, but it sure does sound like anaphylactic shock due to the antibiotic to me. I mean, she was a perfectly healthy younger kitty with an ear problem, an inside kitty, and no other known illnesses. It just strikes me as quite strange that the vet didn't at least consider this when you brought her back the first time and taken appropriate action, like using Epinephrine, IV fluids, etc. The seizure alone should have keyed the vet into this right off the ding-dong as a possibility given the proximity to giving the antibiotic so soon before this happened.

Lyme disease? Gimme a break! He's just trying to cover his a$$. Sorry, I'm just so p.o.'d at this vet right now, but I'll sure apologize if I am wrong.

I would ask for a copy of ALL her records from this vet and read through them with a fine tooth comb (you can even scan and upload and attach them here if you want so we can have a look). Something doesn't sit right with me.

P.S. I never, ever let a vet (or tech) take one of my kitties into an area without me--not that you did anything wrong, honey, it's just a particular thing I never allow.

EmilyMayWilcha said:

It depends on the cause. Seizures can becaused by diabetes, which of course is managed by changing the diet. Epilepsy is managed by vets prescribing phenobarbitol (and possibly other drugs). Brain cancer can't always be removed surgically, but chemotherapy can take care of the inoperable tumors. Unfortunately, this diagnosis would be the most logical cause of the seizures because other symptoms are not related to a diabetic or an epileptic seizure.

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True but most of the time, when seizures are involved they don't always find a cause or a link to why they occurred.  So most of the time, if they can't find like a tumor or diabetes, whatever, they will chalk it up to anaphylactic shock.  That does not mean, though, that the medicine (antibiotics) or ticks caused it.  It is just an educated guess because they didn't have a history or another more concrete reason for the seizures.  The same thing in people, too.  My cousin has dealt with and even died twice from seizures (they brought her back) but she was perfectly healthy until she was 25yrs old and never had a seizure.  They still, to this day, have no idea what caused the disorder.  They chalked it up to anaphylactic shock and she once in awhile still has them.  They are much more mild with her medication but they still have no idea what is wrong with her.  And my aunt (a doctor) says that they just don't know why seizures happen a lot of the time.  My point is, anaphylactic shock is the reason they are giving you and mostly it's just because they don't know and that's an educated guess. 

Take some time to grieve and be angry and go through all the steps.  Be comforted knowing that you and your vets did all they could for her.  It may not seem like much now.  But at least you tried.  She knows that. 

P3 and The King said:

True but most of the time, when seizures are involved they don't always find a cause or a link to why they occurred.  So most of the time, if they can't find like a tumor or diabetes, whatever, they will chalk it up to anaphylactic shock.  ... They chalked it up to anaphylactic shock and she once in awhile still has them.  They are much more mild with her medication but they still have no idea what is wrong with her.  ... My point is, anaphylactic shock is the reason they are giving you and mostly it's just because they don't know and that's an educated guess. 

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Huh? Educated "guess"? Stephanie said the vet said it was due to a tick--Lyme disease, when clearly Maggie could have had next to no exposure to ticks given her history--if this vet even read her history. Most all of Maggie's symptoms, when taken in totality, could be explained by an allergic reaction and anaphylactic shock, including the seizure soon after giving the antibiotic, and should have been thoroughly investigated by the vet before he sent her home with more antibiotics. Most vets worth their salt would recognize the numerous symptoms immediately after a thorough exam, given onset was soon after the antibiotic. Stephanie's vet did not--he did little examination, if any, when she came back to the vet. Antibiotic = onset of symptoms where none existed before = vet does a full work up. Period. There should be no "educated" guessing to it given the numerous symptoms Maggie was exhibiting.

Even, me, as a lay person knows the signs of an allergic reaction and anaphylaxis in my kitties! Stephanie relied on her vet, and he failed her and Maggie miserably. IMNSHO.

I've had an allergic reaction (not immediate; after a day or so of medication) and anaphylaxis began setting in (swelling, throat began to close up, etc.), but I am a human and could recognize what was happening, stop the medication and get help.

Stephanie, you in NO WAY did anything wrong, honey. You relied on the one person that should have been knowledgeable enough to diagnose Maggie; if he had cared enough to do a thorough exam of her. I'm so sad this happened to you and Maggie. My heart goes out to you, sweetie. You did the best you could for your little girl, so take comfort in knowing that. Maggie knows you loved her beyond measure.

WhollyCat said:

Huh? Educated "guess"? Stephanie said the vet said it was due to a tick--Lyme disease, when clearly Maggie could have had next to no exposure to ticks given her history--if this vet even read her history. Most all of Maggie's symptoms, when taken in totality, could be explained by an allergic reaction and anaphylactic shock, including the seizure soon after giving the antibiotic, and should have been thoroughly investigated by the vet before he sent her home with more antibiotics. Most vets worth their salt would recognize the numerous symptoms immediately after a thorough exam, given onset was soon after the antibiotic. Stephanie's vet did not--he did little examination, if any, when she came back to the vet. Antibiotic = onset of symptoms where none existed before = vet does a full work up. Period. There should be no "educated" guessing to it given the numerous symptoms Maggie was exhibiting.

Even, me, as a lay person knows the signs of an allergic reaction and anaphylaxis in my kitties! Stephanie relied on her vet, and he failed her and Maggie miserably. IMNSHO.

I've had an allergic reaction (not immediate; after a day or so of medication) and anaphylaxis began setting in (swelling, throat began to close up, etc.), but I am a human and could recognize what was happening, stop the medication and get help.

Stephanie, you in NO WAY did anything wrong, honey. You relied on the one person that should have been knowledgeable enough to diagnose Maggie; if he had cared enough to do a thorough exam of her. I'm so sad this happened to you and Maggie. My heart goes out to you, sweetie. You did the best you could for your little girl, so take comfort in knowing that. Maggie knows you loved her beyond measure.

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OK, so according to you, she shouldn't have taken her to the vet at all?  Vets are bad.  They don't know what they're doing.... And they didn't help.  They killed her cat.  Were you there?  Do you know this for a fact?  I'm just wondering how you know she wasn't examined and they didn't help her at all and in fact failed her?  People often want to blame medicine but usually that is not the case.  And you can check that too.  My point is, this attitude hardly helps.  You are placing blame unfairly where it does not belong.  I know you are into the whole holistic approach but the same result could very well have happened with that approach as well.  You just don't know.  So pointing fingers and placing blame when you don't have all the facts is hardly helpful.     

Seizures are hard, often impossible to determine if they don't have some kind of history to back it up.  That is the fact I stated.  You can argue that all you want.  But the fact is, you are furthering a misconception that vets don't care and medicine does not help. Keeping your anger and opinions toward medicine in check and just being supportive would be more helpful...  

Stephanie, Please know that most vets care very deeply and do all they can.  But sometimes, in situations like this they may not know.  I am sorry for your loss and I hope you harbor no misplaced resentments out of this experience.  You did the best you could and you got her help.  I am sure that they did all they could for her, too.  You should know that, too. 

I would love to know why the vet automatically prescribed antibiotics without testing Maggie's ear to determine if the infection was caused by a bacterium or fungus. Wilbur was diagnosed with allergies after his vet found yeast in both ears. Antibiotics do nothing for yeast infections because yeast is not a bacterium. So there is an excellent chance Maggie had a fungal, not bacterial, infection because her ear did not improve when she got the antibiotics. The fact that the antibiotics failed to kill the infection was proof a bacterium did not cause it. The vet should have looked for yeast in that ear.

Stephanie, please remember it was not your fault the vet failed to test Maggie before prescribing antibiotics. I know you were only trying to do the best you could with your limited knowledge and the vet, not you, should have looked for yeast in Maggie's ear to determine what caused the ear infection. There was no way you could have known it was not a bacterial infection without training and an otoscope.

King, how do you know for a fact the vet did nothing wrong and it was simply impossible to diagnose? A good vet will attempt to determine the most likely cause, even if a diagnosis really is impossible, then do something different if the first treatment does not work. If the problem was obviously anaphalaxic shock, which anybody who suffered that can determine, it is safe to blame the vet for killing the cat. But it does not mean the vet tried to kill Maggie, of course. It just means he did not know what to do with her and how to do his job.

P3 and The King said:

OK, so according to you, she shouldn't have taken her to the vet at all?  Vets are bad.  They don't know what they're doing.... And they didn't help.  They killed her cat.  Were you there?  Do you know this for a fact?  I'm just wondering how you know she wasn't examined and they didn't help her at all and in fact failed her?  People often want to blame medicine but usually that is not the case.  And you can check that too.  My point is, this attitude hardly helps.  You are placing blame unfairly where it does not belong.  I know you are into the whole holistic approach but the same result could very well have happened with that approach as well.  You just don't know.  So pointing fingers and placing blame when you don't have all the facts is hardly helpful.     

Seizures are hard, often impossible to determine if they don't have some kind of history to back it up.  That is the fact I stated.  You can argue that all you want.  But the fact is, you are furthering a misconception that vets don't care and medicine does not help. Keeping your anger and opinions toward medicine in check and just being supportive would be more helpful...  

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Oh man, you are missing my point completely. I did not say that [traditional] vets are bad because they all are most obviously not. I was not pointing fingers. I did not say that she shouldn't have taken Maggie to the vet and would never have suggested such a thing. I am not against traditional vet medicine at all. All your statements related to me are very untrue. I said that this vet appears to have missed the boat completely based on what Stephanie wrote. If he was a holistic vet I would have said the same things I did--I have no bias when it comes to vets in any genre. None. Zero. Nada. Zip. What is clear to me is that you have a bias when it comes to non-traditional, holistic means of treating kitties. Me, it doesn't matter. If a traditional vet is needed, that is most definitely the best route to go. In my case I would also use gentle holistic means in conjunction with a vet drug IF the need was indicated e.g. giving probiotics to support the good bacteria in a kitty's system while on an antibiotic because it will be non-discriminate and kill both bad and good gut bacteria. Please don't try to pigeonhole me into one modality. I am very open to all means to treat our little ones. I believe that both traditional and non-traditional holistic vet drugs, treatments, modalities can be used at the same time.

I have a very capable, open minded, non-holistic, traditional vet whom I highly trust and love. I have no holistic vet because I live in a small rural area. I am so not against veterinary drugs at all, even if I do try to use a holistic approach when I can. You are judging me based on an ill conceived notion with little knowledge of what I think or feel regarding vets, traditional or holistic. There are bad or indifferent ones in both these areas of veterinary care.

Hopefully the above sets the record straight as to how I think about vets, no matter how they practice medicine? If I need to expound further, please just PM me.

My basic point is this: You are zeroing in on the seizure and not considering ALL the symptoms that Maggie presented with after taking the antibiotic. There was a history of seizures after the antibiotic was consumed, not before, which is a severe symptom of anaphylactic shock. You are not taking into consideration what Stephanie said about the lack of testing done. Stephanie did all the right things and no blame should ever be placed with her. I do place blame with this vet--and stand behind this statement still.

WhollyCat said:

Oh man, you are missing my point completely. I did not say that [traditional] vets are bad because they all are most obviously not. I was not pointing fingers. I did not say that she shouldn't have taken Maggie to the vet and would never have suggested such a thing. I am not against traditional vet medicine at all. All your statements related to me are very untrue. I said that this vet appears to have missed the boat completely based on what Stephanie wrote. If he was a holistic vet I would have said the same things I did--I have no bias when it comes to vets in any genre. None. Zero. Nada. Zip. What is clear to me is that you have a bias when it comes to non-traditional, holistic means of treating kitties. Me, it doesn't matter. If a traditional vet is needed, that is most definitely the best route to go. In my case I would also use gentle holistic means in conjunction with a vet drug IF the need was indicated e.g. giving probiotics to support the good bacteria in a kitty's system while on an antibiotic because it will be non-discriminate and kill both bad and good gut bacteria. Please don't try to pigeonhole me into one modality. I am very open to all means to treat our little ones. I believe that both traditional and non-traditional holistic vet drugs, treatments, modalities can be used at the same time.

I have a very capable, open minded, non-holistic, traditional vet whom I highly trust and love. I have no holistic vet because I live in a small rural area. I am so not against veterinary drugs at all, even if I do try to use a holistic approach when I can. You are judging me based on an ill conceived notion with little knowledge of what I think or feel regarding vets, traditional or holistic. There are bad or indifferent ones in both these areas of veterinary care.

Hopefully the above sets the record straight as to how I think about vets, no matter how they practice medicine? If I need to expound further, please just PM me.

My basic point is this: You are zeroing in on the seizure and not considering ALL the symptoms that Maggie presented with after taking the antibiotic. There was a history of seizures after the antibiotic was consumed, not before, which is a severe symptom of anaphylactic shock. You are not taking into consideration what Stephanie said about the lack of testing done. Stephanie did all the right things and no blame should ever be placed with her. I do place blame with this vet--and stand behind this statement still.

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And you (and EmilyMayWilcha) misunderstood me completely as well.  You took one small part and not even the point of my post and attacked me for it because you didn't agree.  I was trying to offer a level headed and not overly emotional response.  My point originally was that when they say something like "your cat died from anaphylactic shock" which is basically what they said with the tick story could be a way of saying they don't know what happened and why the seizures started.  This is the truth.  Many times this is a scapegoat excuse which decoded means "we don't know what happened."  People are always quick to blame medicine.  Many times this is not the case.  It could be but maybe not.  I seriously doubt she died as a result of the ear infection.  She died most likely as a result of the seizures.  And the other symptoms besides the ear infection are symptoms resulting from seizures and not just anaphylactic shock.  Pointing fingers without knowing all the facts and seeing the charts is highly biased in it's own right.  That's all I was saying.  YOU DON'T KNOW EVERYTHING. Neither do I.  But saying "Oh it's the medicine and your vet is stupid." without knowing all the facts is wrong.  Heated and overly emotionally charged posts to someone dealing with grief and confusion is not helping in my opinion. 

It was my understanding, she was in the vets office when she died?  Perhaps I read that wrong?  But usually when they are at the vets being treated overnight or whatever, they do run tests and treatments to figure it out and try to save her.  She said she didn't know everything that had gone on.  Most people are afraid to ask or don't know the right questions to ask.  But I am sure if she would ask them what was done to help her, they would be happy to answer that and she would find their answer satisfactory.  Maybe not.  But, my point was we can't say they failed her when she was there overnight. She probably has those answers now as I haven't seen her post all day.  I hope she did find the answers she was looking for and her mind is at ease.

Oh and a lot of times bigger city vets or not so small town vets do not allow people to go into the back examination rooms (the very back, not the private exam room they take you into).  It is something that could get them in trouble with insurance.  So your statement that you don't let them take your cats without you going as well, could get your vet in trouble.    

Don't tell me that I am biased.  I believe both methods are very useful and helpful.   I wasn't judging you.  I was saying that maybe taking it down a notch and not being so emotional yourself would be more helpful is all... Your post come across as very charged and overly emotional.  If you want to place blame with her vet without knowing everything, that is fine.  I just think it's better served keeping it to yourself is all in this situation for all the reasons I stated is all.   

P3 and The King said:

And you (and EmilyMayWilcha) misunderstood me completely as well.  You took one small part and not even the point of my post and attacked me for it because you didn't agree. 

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I kindly request you take a step back and read through the thread. Whollycat replied to Stephanie directly, without addressing anything else posted by anyone. You seem to have confused some of the well reasoned information posited by Whollycat (anaphylactic shock most likely from the antibiotic) with statements from the vet, who merely said Stephanie's kitty died from a tick borne disease.

In Whollycat's response to statements you made, I see no attack at all: I see disagreement with the concept that this vet made an educated guess when calling this a death due to a tick disease (based on the information provided by Stephanie), and Whollycat goes on to explain why. It seems you confuse disagreement with attack.

It also seems perhaps you didn't read Stephanie's original post closely. She states there was no diagnostic work done

Stephanie1233 said:

She NEVER even had blood work done and they never found a tick.

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and Maggie did not spend the night in the hospital. From the information provided by Stephanie, it's hard not to draw the conclusion that the vet did not recognize symptoms of a reaction to the antibiotics given, and IMO, it's hard not to be upset with the vet . :dk:

It's not clear what antibiotics were given, but it sounds very much like a shot of convenia, which can cause this reaction in a minority of cats, and yes, it can result in death. :heart3:

http://catinfo.org/?link=convenia

http://fdlibrary.yuku.com/topic/160...hot-dangers-and-warnings?page=-1#.UBdry_UsHwM

When I did a search on VIN, I found a post that discussed severe hemolytic anemia in two cats. Both cats died - 1 within 7 days of Convenia, the other one on Day 10. Both had normal HCTs prior to the Convenia administration.

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Here is a FB page devoted to reporting adverse events from Convenia - many kitties have died from anaphylactic shock after being administered Convenia.

Stephanie, I'm sorry that this thread has become so contentious. I hope when - if - you do come back to the thread that you're able to disregard the tone of the discourse, but are able to take away helpful information to discuss with your vet, and perhaps have a better understanding of what happened to Maggie. It would help if you were able to find out what antibiotic was administered. If it was Convenia, Maggie can help other kitties by having this reported. :heart3:

Stephanie, I so hope you see this and can post the antibiotics that were used, vet records, etc. that would be very helpful. We truly are here to help and care so much about your Maggie. And as Laurie (LDG) said, it will help other kitties in the future.

I apologize if anything I have said has upset you, honey; it was so inappropriate to get into an off topic discussion here. Please do post when you can. I know how hard it is to lose a beloved kitty, but not knowing what happened would be even worse.

P3, please check your PM inbox.