Need advice on how to handle an extremely sweet FIV+ and FeLV+ cat that we found..

"Mindy" was hanging around our house for about a week.  We noticed she was starving so we gave her some food and water and she promptly cleaned the bowl in about 2 minutes lol.  Every day when we got home, she would greet us and play with us.  A very social and friendly cat.

She appeared healthy, so we decided to adopt her and have her join our other two indoor only cats.  We took her to the vet to get tested, and unfortunately she tested positive for both FIV and FeLV.  I understand FeLV is the bad one after doing some research and is highly contagious.  Thank god we didn't just let her come inside before testing her.

I know there is a vaccine out there for FeLV, but there are risks involved and I really don't want to jeopardize our other two cat's lives so that is out of the question as far as I am concerned.  I contacted over 30 no kill shelters and no one will take her.  I also have had no luck in finding any catless homes where someone could adopt her.  Time is ticking for her and we have to make a decision...

Really the only thing I can do is put her back out in the wild and build her a shelter in our back yard and continue feeding her or euthanize her.  I might be able to build some sort of pen for her to stay in our basement, but what kind of life would that be? Also, there would still be risk in spreading the disease to our other cats.

What would you do?

Here is a video of her...

What state are you in?
 

The cat is located in Morrisville, PA just outside Trenton.  I have contacted so many shelters and no one is helping.  We would be willing to drive quite far to find her a home.

We are also now considering vaccinating our current pets and introducing her to our home.  It is just so hard to find concrete examples of that actually working.  Some say never do it...some say the chances of the existing cats getting sick or almost nothing.  What a hard decision.

I would keep her as an outside cat, providing shelter, if you cannot find another home for her.

I would do some more research on the effectiveness of the vaccines for Felv and FIV to see how effective they are for your other cats. 

I would not euthanize her when she is so happy and social.  She doesn't appear to be suffering and in pain. 

Just my opinion.

To get advice from a no kill shelter that has both FIV and Felv cats, you might want to cal The Cat House.  It is a non-profit organization in Lincoln, NE.  They also have cats without either of these diseases, so they may be able to share info on how to integrate all cats.  This is the number for The Cat House (402) 441-9593.

I live in Washington State so couldn't be further from you.

You won't find many people who will agree with what I did, but years ago (on a vet's advice) I did introduce two FeLV+ cats into my household of 8 other cats. They had been fosters, tested positive several times, their brother had died at 8 months but they were doing well - and going crazy locked in my bedroom.  All my other cats had been strays so had good immune systems. They went through the FeLV vaccination schedule and were given yearly booster shots. The FeLV+ cats, Seshat lived to 7 years and Ted to 9 years old.  The 8 cats they lived with all lived to very ripe old ages and none of them contracted feline leukemia. In fact, they were some of the longest living cats I've every had with three sisters living to 19, 20 and 23.  There is no guarantee, but it can work and I've heard from a few other people who have gone through the same experience with the same result. It is a risk as is taking in any cat.  They can appear completely and rambunctiously healthy and then get cancer at age 3.
 

tjcarst said:

I would keep her as an outside cat, providing shelter, if you cannot find another home for her.

I would do some more research on the effectiveness of the vaccines for Felv and FIV to see how effective they are for your other cats. 

I would not euthanize her when she is so happy and social.  She doesn't appear to be suffering and in pain. 

Just my opinion.

To get advice from a no kill shelter that has both FIV and Felv cats, you might want to cal The Cat House.  It is a non-profit organization in Lincoln, NE.  They also have cats without either of these diseases, so they may be able to share info on how to integrate all cats.  This is the number for The Cat House (402) 441-9593.

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i agree with this. it will buy you some time also. it's the summer as long as she has shade, shelter, food, and water. and maybe you can set up the basement as a refuge in the winter unless you can provide a heated shelter the. i would just add another place for advice:

Best Friends Animal Society 

http://www.bestfriends.org/index.htm

Simka said:

I live in Washington State so couldn't be further from you.

You won't find many people who will agree with what I did, but years ago (on a vet's advice) I did introduce two FeLV+ cats into my household of 8 other cats. They had been fosters, tested positive several times, their brother had died at 8 months but they were doing well - and going crazy locked in my bedroom.  All my other cats had been strays so had good immune systems. They went through the FeLV vaccination schedule and were given yearly booster shots. The FeLV+ cats, Seshat lived to 7 years and Ted to 9 years old.  The 8 cats they lived with all lived to very ripe old ages and none of them contracted feline leukemia. In fact, they were some of the longest living cats I've.. every had with three sisters living to 19, 20 and 23.  There is no guarantee, but it can work and I've heard from a few other people who have gone through the same experience with the same result. It is a risk as is taking in any cat.  They can appear completely and rambunctiously healthy and then get cancer at age 3.
 

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Haha it really is true, you couldn't be further unless you left the country haha.

Thanks for your story...it is giving us some hope.   We are going to vaccinate our two cats and the requirement is that they stay separate from the infected cat for 5 weeks.  So I figure, at the very least, this gives her 5 weeks of shelter, food, and water and also gives us more time to find a home for her.  She will have to be locked in a room, but it is better than what she had before right?  If we still cannot find a home for her, then we can make the decision to take the risk with introducing us to our cats.   

Every article I read says never let them near each other, even if the others are vaccinated.  But every personal story I have read or have been told has said that they have been successful in mixing the sick cats with the healthy cats with no issue.

Oh aren't you two complete loves for wanting to figure the best way to help this kitty! :rub: :heart3:

It seems you already know that FIV isn't the issue. My husband and I TNR the local cats. We're not set up to foster, but when there are "adoptables" (most of the cats are ferals, but if they turn up young enough... ) there's a local foster network that will take them when they have room. :heart2: Long story, a feral turns up, completely disrupts the colony - but he's so food motivated, we think that even though he's older, he's a foster candidate. So we drop him at the vet so he can get his FIV/FELV test done, get his first distemper shot, and then he'll be picked up by the foster org.

Nope. We get a call - he's FIV+. They can't enter him into their system, or they'll have to euthanize him! So off we rush to the vet. We got a rather quick education on FIV, and decided to adopt him and bring him inside with our crew (we had 7 other cats, one of which is immune compromised). We couldn't find any rescue orgs to help either. Tabby's Place, a sanctuary in NJ will take her, but there's a 2-year wait list, and you have to pay up front to help offset her lifetime care. Personally, I think living in your yard is a better option than that, but if you're not familiar with Tabby's Place, http://www.tabbysplace.org/ this is it.

Thankfully, our vets are all FIV literate, and though they cautioned us on the risk (as it does exist, though minimal), but no one had a problem with our adopting him. FYI, no point in vaccinating against FIV. The strain up here (we're in NW NJ) is different than the one used in the vaccine. The FIV vaccine is only useful if you live in the South - Texas, southern AL, LA, and panhandle of FL. So don't even bother with the FIV vaccine for your other kitties, it's just not necessary anyway.

Now... FeLV complicates the situation. The FeLV vaccine is only about 70% effective. That said... FeLV does seem to have a higher rate of infection than FIV. But given the entire population of infected feral cats is estimated to be 2%-5% (vs the FIV infection rate of, if I remember correctly, 2% - 3%), clearly it isn't as easily passed between cats as the vet community would have us believe. I do know they're both retroviruses, and the consensus is that the virus doesn't exist outside the body for very long. The thinking with FIV is that it basically "requires" that deep-tissue bite wound to create the environment where the virus can take hold, and that the FeLV virus does not. I don't know why with FeLV the litter box would be considered a problem, I don't know if it's actually shed in the feces. Even if it is, I imagine keeping the litter boxes clean helps solve that potential source of infection. But if it is shed via saliva, if it doesn't exist outside the body for more than a few minutes, then if they don't share food bowls and they don't groom each other, I'm not convinced it's some huge risk. But I don't know. I do know that in healthy adult cats, they have a 30% chance of fighting off the FeLV virus without illness or becoming infected and then have lifetime immunity - without a vaccination. This is a VERY informative piece: http://www.winnfelinehealth.org/pages/felv_web.pdf

Now, most people on TCS that rescue FeLV kitties have all FeLV+ kitties. OR they keep their FeLV kitties in a separate area of their home. I'll bring the thread to the attention of GloriaJH who has an FeLV kitty that lives in his own room. (FYI, space isn't the issue for most cats; ensuring they're not bored is. We live in an RV with 8 cats).

That said... I work with a small TNR advocacy group. Obviously FeLV comes up. A long time rescuer (and one of the women that helped bring TNR to the US, in fact) said that she's never worried about it. Over 30+ years, she's mixed FeLV+ with FeLV- kitties, and has never had one of her own contract FeLV. Personally, I don't think I'd take the risk. If faced with the issue, given our living situation, we'd probably build a shelter, and provide for her outside. When a friendly kitty turned up here Spring of 2011 (so unusual here - a friendly!) we got Baloo tested when being neutered before calling the foster group. And he was FIV+. We agonized about what to do, but decided just to release him. We are so beyond our limit - and he's an alpha male. Being inside in our little home just was not possible, even though we already have an FIV+ kitty. We have numerous shelters for the kitties, and he pretty much lives here. He's our outdoor pet kitty. :rub:

...But we're used to caring for ferals. It's hard. I worry more about them than our indoor kitties, because we have no control over where they go and what they do, and when they disappear, you can't help worry until they show back up. And sometimes they never do. And it never stops hurting.

If we lived in a house, we'd probably figure a way to bring her inside, and we'd probably adopt an FeLV+ kitty so she'd have a pal, and we wouldn't have to worry about her being alone. But that's because our other cats aren't healthy. (Rescuing for over 10 years, we always kept the health compromised cats. The only two that weren't health challenged were the first two we rescued, and our first rescue baby is now a cancer survivor). I think if our other cats were healthy, we'd probably go the route Simka did. :dk: I really don't know.

I just know it's got to be a completely agonizing decision. :heart2:

Thanks for the reply! Whatever happens, we will figure something out for her.

I found someone who said "If she is ok going outside, I will take her".

I am trying to get specifics on what he means...permanently or casually?  If it is casually, like some people do, that would be fine right? I know there is risk for her spreading it but she will be spayed so no chance to give it to any new kittens and it seems it is still hard to transmit based on the fact that only 3% of outdoor cats have it.

It sounds like you are coming up with some solutions.
By "outside", do you mean roaming free?, or in an enclosure?

I've started a Social Group, http://www.thecatsite.com/groups/show/152/caring-for-cats-with-the-feline-leukemia-virus
that you might find interesting.

The best information that I've found is in a text book entitled: Infectious Diseases of the Dog and Cat, 4e, a generous vet copied and sent me just the chapter on FeLV which laid to rest some of the ambiguity that I was finding in my internet searches - the Cornell site was so vague that it was almost useless. I digress.

All I can tell you is from my personal experience - and I also know that each cat is such an individual that no one can generalize - especially when it comes to diseases.

Personally, knowing that I have a FIV, or a FeLV cat - I couldn't take the chance that it would infect another cat - NOR - could I kill them simply because they tested positive.

My solution has been to bring them inside. I have one with FIV, and one FeLV. The one with FIV also has a family (former feral born) he brings with him. My husband built an outside enclosure with a cat door in a window in our office.

Other cats are safe from him, and since the disease is only spread through a deep bite wound, I doubt the other 3 have the disease. My only concern is of other outdoor cats that may come up to the fencing of the enclosure and spread something to Gray and/or his family. A problem is that a immune depressed cat is more vulnerable to other diseases so I am slightly concerned that he could pick up something while he's outside in his enclosure.

Buddy - our FeLV: He has been permanently housed in our former guest room. I do have many posts and pics concerning him and the arrangements we have made for him. We purchased an inexpensive bedroom door - it happens to match our other inside doors.

http://www.thecatsite.com/gallery/image/view/id/20889/album/46767

We cut a hole in the bottom and installed plexiglas so that he can watch the activity in the hall. We cut a hole in the top and put a screen guard in that hole so that he can hear us as well has get air circulation in the room.

I keep a bottle of hand disinfectant in his room, and each time I leave the room I wash my hands for about 30 seconds with antibiotic soap before I touch the other cats. I may be fanatical but, then, that's just me. I chose not to get my other cats the vaccine after reading pros and cons on it. I do lean on the side of no vaccines, anyway - and I think I should say that.

Each day with Buddy could be my last, and living with that fact isn't easy - but it is a good Life Lesson.

I still get a chill up my spine just when I think about the time I had to decide between life and death and I opted NOT to kill him. He was first so sick from getting neutered (after he first arrived) that one of the vets thought he wasn't going to last and thought I should decide that day. That was July 2010. I brought him home thinking that he was going to pass in a few days, and that's been two years ago.

He did have some struggles - with food allergies - I found that putting him on NO-GRAIN foods was the solution. He only gets dry food as a treat, or in a toy - otherwise, he's been on wet food, - at first it was Merrick's, then he didn't like that - so now it's Weruva, and some Wellness.

I don't do anything that may cause stress - that includes NOT taking him for a general vet visit. If he becomes ill we'll go, but otherwise he's kept in his Safe Place. I've taken him outside of his room - wrapped in a towel - probably only about 3 or 4 times in the last two years. The towel helps two things - it makes him feel safe, and it also would collect any virus that he may shed.

Caring for a cat with a contagious disease is a huge commitment.
In my effort to keep him healthy I
(1) spend time with him - I have a large screen TV in his room - and it's easy to love on him for two-three hours each night while I'm watching my shows. This boy is such a joy I can't imagine not having him in my life.
(2) I give him quality WET food, and fresh water each day,
(3 )I do what I can to keep him entertained, and
(4) stress free.
He gets some interaction from the other cats as they come to the door and talk to him or paw on the plexiglas window.
Summary:
He is confined and every effort is made not to spread the virus to my other cats.
I have chosen not to vaccinate the other cats because the likely hood of them actually getting the disease is not very high
I feed him quality WET food
I keep him stress free which includes not taking him to the vet for a "health check-up"
I give him a lot of attention and lovin'

If I have confused you, let me know. I've typed this in a hurry - got 9 inside cats to care for, and now 9 ferals that are trying to stay cool (from the 100+ temps) in our garage - another whole story, and a husband just out of minor surgery. :lol3:

Thanks for the reply.

The person who may be interested did not specify, I am still waiting to hear back.  However, he implied he had a fenced in backyard and asked "how can I keep her from escaping and roaming?" so it seems his intent is to only let her outside to roam in his backyard.  I think that is acceptable.  Maybe she will take to a harness and a long leash?

She is so damn cute, I am glad progress is being made in one way or another.  My wife is very attached to her already and has been visiting her in the vet.  We are going to take some good pics today and write her up a story and post it everywhere just in case.

Mike42 said:

Thanks for the reply.

The person who may be interested did not specify, I am still waiting to hear back.  However, he implied he had a fenced in backyard and asked "how can I keep her from escaping and roaming?" so it seems his intent is to only let her outside to roam in his backyard.  I think that is acceptable.  Maybe she will take to a harness and a long leash?


She is so damn cute, I am glad progress is being made in one way or another.  My wife is very attached to her already and has been visiting her in the vet.  We are going to take some good pics today and write her up a story and post it everywhere just in case.

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Okay - she has your heart now - I do know how that feels!!

Did the vet say how old she might be? She could beat this virus - there's always hope as I think most of the free roaming cats do beat off the viruses - the tests have no way to show what stage (there are stages) the virus is in and her body just may be fighting it - I sort of think Buddy may have beat it, but with my "no stress" rule, I guess I won't find out unless he actually gets sick.

Estimated at 9 months.  I know there is a chance they can beat the virus and judging by how healthy she appears, it is likely she just caught it.  If she had caught it as a kitten, she would most likely be dead or close to death by now.  We are not counting on that, however.

Our theory is that she had a previous owner and they discovered she had the disease and they threw her out.

Mike42 said:

Our theory is that she had a previous owner and they discovered she had the disease and they threw her out.

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So sad. 

I would find out more about the person interested in her.  Will she be allowed to live inside with occasional trips outside?  Or will she be an outside only kitty?  If outside, what type of shelter will be provided?  Are there busy streets nearby?  Outside with you would be better than outside with someone else since she seems to have started to form a bond with you.