Herpes Virus of the eye

Another issue I have with my adopted stray (please also see my "Budda belly" thread)

is his chronic watery eyes.

He showed up at my doorstep with full blown Upper Respiratory Infecton, worms, and watery eyes.

The discharge was not thick, not yellow or greenish.  It is clear and often (not always) stains brown-reddish brown on the tissue when wiped off. it's definately not dirt by the color of the discharge.

His eyeballs themselves are clear, never bloodsot, and the vet couldn't find any scratches, lesions.

He went through a 7 day course of erythromycin, then two 7 day courses of terramycin. If for nothing else but to assist with co-infection and be palative.  These treatments did not help.

My understanding is that herpes of the eye, and less often clamydia of the eye, for cats has the tell-tale brown watering.

So because the antibacterial courses did not clear it up, I gather it was not clamydia (bacteria), but is in fact herpes virus.

I also all this time have been adding lysine to his food, as I have read that it may help his body keep the herpes virus busy and eventually get it under control.

But although he's become so much healthier in other areas, this pesky eye problem persists.

I sure would like to solve this for him.

Any suggestions?

By the way, I suppose there's an outside chance it's allergies, but he had it in the middle of winter til now, and has no other allergic symptoms.  He doesn't scratch or paw at his eyes, only to clean his face normally.

Hi and Welcome!! You seem quite knowledgeable on the eye issue because yes, it could be either herpes (viral) or chlamydia (bacterial). It still could be Chlamydia even though the antibiotic therapy did not work - yet. The cat should be on an antibiotic for the very least - four weeks. And you have to find the "right" antibiotic to kill the bacteria. My Perla has Herpes - and herpes usually only affects one eye. Chlamydia is usually both eyes, but can affect one eye as well. With Perla, her eye issue started with a clear watery discharge and can progress to a full blown flare up including sores around the outer lids and swollen/red conjunctiva, with the brownish tears that dry around the eye. The eye itself looks totally normal. It is the tissue surrounding the eye and if left untreated can start to destroy the eye itself, over time. I am working closely with an eye specialist now for Perla. Here is what we have tried so far, and before that I should mention that Perla was on Pred last summer for a severe chin acne infection and I have to wonder now if that was one of the components that allowed the Herpes virus to become ocular. There is a very fine line on the dosage of Pred that a Herpes kitty should get. If they are given too high a dosage - let's say even 5 mg. or more a day - then you could potentially open them up for a herpes flare up because the Pred will suppress the immune system. The Pred will help clear the eye - but that is only putting a band aid on the problem. I would only use Pred as a last resort for Perla if all else fails. But I would discuss in great detail with the specialist about this and the exact dosage to try. I doubt she would agree with me, though. Prednisone is contraindicated for Herpes kitties.

Anyway - we have tried: Neo-poly-dex ointments and drops (which helped because of the steroid), Erthromycin ointment, Gentomycin drops, Terramycin ointment, Tobramycin drops, an extremely expensive anti-viral drop called Cidofovil. She has also been on oral Baytril and clavamox. All of this over the last eight months with no avail.

We are currently using Azithromycin oral liquid. A powerful antibiotic that is fairly new to cats and might be the antibiotic of choice for ocular herpes in cats. She has been on this for six days now and her flare up has settled almost immediately. She has to be on this med for at least four weeks. It is a triple fish flavor and given once daily - 1 ml. I think she will always have the "watery" eye problem, no matter what we try - the weepy eye persists. :shame:

I would suggest the above to your vet and see what he has to say about trying that for your kitty. There is no cure for ocular herpes, there are only ways to manage and control the flare ups. OH I also give Perla Lysine - 500 mg. AM & PM. (1/4 tsp. twice daily) All of this is coming from one of the best and sought after small animal eye specialist. I found out I was not giving her enough Lysine. Not sure it helps Perla though :dk: But it won't hurt to keep her on it.

I would see about trying to find a specialist or an experienced vet in treating ocular herpes or chlamydia. Sometimes you can do a phone consult just to discuss treatments - but they usually want to see the cat first anyway. Best of luck and I know how you feel - it hurts to see them unwell and chronically fighting off this awful viral infection.

OH here is my thread on Perla IF you want to look at it - it is quite long though :lol3: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/239700/...rs-needed-for-feralvrs-perla/210#post_3219754

Huh. Wow.

4 weeks, huh?

That has me remembering the huge, 8 weeks I think it was, I had my dog on antibiotic for his 3rd bout of Lyme Disease.

Thanks for the response, I sure do appreciate feedback.

One eye is definately worse, but the other eye will produce the discharge too.

So it's more likely Chlamydia, then?

Though I had leftover erythromycin I gave him to start, I can only get terrymycin eye ointment right now, through Tractor Supply (or sometimes the internet) without a prescription, which, long story - is my only option right now.

And I have a ton of leftover amoxycillian I can give him for 4 weeks.

He did do a 2 week course of cephalexin antibiotic when he was initially sick with URI.  But that obviously was not enough to resolve his chlamydia of the eyes.

I have also been giving him Lysine as a supplement, but had no idea 500 to 1,000 mg a day was in order.

He's been getting less than half that, and I admit, quite sporadically after a month or so when he got over his URI.

So I will up that for sure, since he doesn't seem to mind the cheap human pills ground up and mixed in with his food.

That ought to aid in viral infections, though, correct?

If this is chlamydia, it'd be bacterial.  Or does it aid in general immunity boosting, regardless?

Also - again, I had read that herpes produces a telltale brown/reddish brown stain when the discharge is wiped on tissue.

That's what I'm seeing - would chlamydia do that as well?

As usual, researching on the internet fills me with lots of possible info, but I always end up needing first hand accounts from those who've experienced the diseases in question.

All your thoughts are so appreciated.

There is just an outside chance there might be another problem, although I assume the vet would have seen anything like turned -underin eyelashes.

Oh, and by the way - great to hear about a fish flavored Azythromycin.

I had to have something compounded once with beef and fish flavor because my cats were just getting too damn good at resisting pilling.

I've been so frustrated with inavailability and cost, I started trying to compound stuff myself, with malt and liver. etc... mixed in, with mediocre results.

Basically it's hard to blend and grind down fine enough all the stuff; ya just can't get it as good as the professional pharmacies.

You may be familiar with it but I'll menton that one recent antibiotic suspension my vet gave me

THAT MY FUSSY CATS FOUND ACTUALLY PALATABLE, SO MUCH SO THAT THEY DID NOT WASTE ANY SPITTING IT OUT! -

was Orbax. 

The manufacturer claims it has a molecule-binding way to mask the antibiotic bitterness and let your cat taste only the malt flavoring.  I dunno - but it worked.

Expensive ($60 bucks for a standard bottle, I think it was?) but not as pricey as the Baytril was at the time.

Where are LDG and catspaw66 when you need them? I thought they would read this thread because of their one-eyed cats.

Yes, Mr. Blanche - the vet did look at his eyes with the microscope wand thingie - nothing noticable.

My cat doesn't paw at his eyes; odd that it doesn't bother him more, outwardly.

As a matter of fact, he has pretty fabulous, sparkling peepers. 

They're his best feature. 

They just leak at the moment.

I'm no expert but I thought I would chime in. I read reviews Revolution that said it will clear up herpes virus of the eye for felines. it's an "off label use" for the drug, but one of the main ingredient supposedly does so. You might want to check with your vet. The reviewer in question said they had tried everything to fix it, and Revolution is the only thing that worked.

www.luckyvitamin.com/p-75907-solaray-l-lysine-500-mg-120-capsu..

.Good advise from Feralvr. My little boy has Herpes too, & when I see his "Third eye" starting to show,  (Usually his left eye), & it's a little "Pinkish,"

That's when I know it's time for a round of eye drops, & an increase in the Lysine.

The Neo Poly Drops have worked well for us, for a couple of yrs. I have learned that w/ my boy, I do have to go the full 10 days, instead of the 7.

However, at one point a few months ago, the Neo Poly didn't do it that time, so he was put on the antiviral one that I think is similar to the one Feralvr mentioned

above, because it was expensive too. (34.00), (& has to be refrigerated)  Along w/ another one that starts w/ a "C." (Cipro, something, I think) ??

 I'm not at home, so I can't go to the 'fridge, & look.

As far as the Lysine, if you have a health food store near you that sells the Solaray brand, that's what I use, because it comes in a 500 mg. capsule.

This way, it's already in powder form. I just split one capsule for am, & pm. unless he is having a flair up, then he gets the full 500 mg. 2xs/ day, as stated above.

I like the Solaray because I know it's a good quality brand, & It's only $11.00 for a 120 caps/ bottle, so at the least, a 60 day supply!

Good luck with your baby!!  You are defiantly in the right place for advise.

I did just find the Solaray on line, for a lot cheaper! ( For some reason, it pasted above, instead of below. ) I hope this helped.

bigperm20 said:

I'm no expert but I thought I would chime in. I read reviews Revolution that said it will clear up herpes virus of the eye for felines. it's an "off label use" for the drug, but one of the main ingredient supposedly does so. You might want to check with your vet. The reviewer in question said they had tried everything to fix it, and Revolution is the only thing that worked.

Click to expand...

That is very interesting. Do you know which ingredient did the trick?

Angel, you posted a dead link.

It is really hard to tell the difference between the two, Chlamydia and Herpes, but the Lysine will help both. BUT Please do not give your cat the Amoxicillin that you have on hand Don't do that unless you get permission from your vet. And yes, I forgot to mention, that Orbax was another one we tried for Perla, did not work. I can say that the Terramycin will not be strong enough for an ocular viral infection. And again, check with your vet first even if via phone about that.

Mega vibes for your kitty and I think you should follow through with your vet before you ever give your cat anything suggested on a board. These eye infections can go from bad to worse rather quickly and need to be treated by a vet. :nod:

Angels mommy said:

www.luckyvitamin.com/p-75907-solaray-l-lysine-500-mg-120-capsu..

.Good advise from Feralvr. My little boy has Herpes too, & when I see his "Third eye" starting to show, (Usually his left eye), & it's a little "Pinkish,"
That's when I know it's time for a round of eye drops, & an increase in the Lysine.
The Neo Poly Drops have worked well for us, for a couple of yrs. I have learned that w/ my boy, I do have to go the full 10 days, instead of the 7.
However, at one point a few months ago, the Neo Poly didn't do it that time, so he was put on the antiviral one that I think is similar to the one Feralvr mentioned
above, because it was expensive too. (34.00), (& has to be refrigerated)  Along w/ another one that starts w/ a "C." (Cipro, something, I think) ??
 I'm not at home, so I can't go to the 'fridge, & look.
As far as the Lysine, if you have a health food store near you that sells the Solaray brand, that's what I use, because it comes in a 500 mg. capsule.
This way, it's already in powder form. I just split one capsule for am, & pm. unless he is having a flair up, then he gets the full 500 mg. 2xs/ day, as stated above.
I like the Solaray because I know it's a good quality brand, & It's only $11.00 for a 120 caps/ bottle, so at the least, a 60 day supply!
Good luck with your baby!!  You are defiantly in the right place for advise.
I did just find the Solaray on line, for a lot cheaper! ( For some reason, it pasted above, instead of below. ) I hope this helped.

Click to expand...

Actually, it is called Cidofovir (anti-viral), and it is about $160.00 :shocker:!!!!!!!! and no refrigeration. AND yes, the NEO-POLY-DEX drops did work for Perla because of the steroid. :nod: BUT once she stops those drops, it is only a matter of time before the eye goes bad again. My vet does prescribe me those drops with just a phone call and I have them on hand. They do work MUCH better than any other eye medication out there IMO. But again, not a cure, just a bandaid and helps with the inflamation. Since taking Perla to the vet eye specialist - she does not recommend anything or prescribe anything with a steroid in it for a ocular herpetic eye. She knows her stuff and is the best in the Midwest.

EmilyMayWilcha said:

That is very interesting. Do you know which ingredient did the trick?

Angel, you posted a dead link.

Click to expand...

 OOps, must have done something wrong, because I was just on there. It was Lucky Vitamins.  Sorry.

Feralvr said:

Actually, it is called Cidofovil, and it is about $160.00

!!!!!!!! and no refrigeration. AND yes, the NEO-POLY-DEX drops did work for Perla because of the steroid.

BUT once she stops those drops, it is only a matter of time before the eye goes bad again.

My vet does prescribe me those drops with just a phone call and I have them on hand. They do work MUCH better than any other eye medication out there IMO. But again, not a cure, just a bandaid and helps with the inflamation. Since taking Perla to the vet eye specialist - she does not recommend anything or prescribe anything with a steroid in it for a ocular herpetic eye. She knows her stuff and is the best in the Midwest.

Click to expand...

Thanks! Good Info. I will check & see what it is when I get home. Defiantly couldn't afford 160.00!! WOW!

Angels mommy said:

Thanks! Good Info. I will check & see what it is when I get home. Defiantly couldn't afford 160.00!! WOW!

Click to expand...

AW sure I know.... this is just breaking the bank... Mega vibes for your little guy too - these eye problems just don't seem to ever go away and I think that is why Dr. Lindley wanted me to be prepared down the road for the possibility of her eye being enucleated. :sobbing: Hoping we won't ever get to that point and things are looking better at the moment. :cross:

I really don't have much to add to the wonderful advice that is already here.  I wish I had known all the stuff on here before Silly's eye got so bad.  I might have been able to save it, even though I had only a tiny income at the time.
 

Feralvr said:

AW sure

I know.... this is just breaking the bank...

Mega vibes

for your little guy too - these eye problems just don't seem to ever go away

and I think that is why Dr. Lindley wanted me to be prepared down the road for the possibility of her eye being enucleated.

Hoping we won't ever get to that point and things are looking better at the moment.

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Thanks Feralvr!  Mega vibes for your little girl too!! Okay, I looked, & the drops I was thinking of were actually Ciprofloxacin, & Idoxuridine. When the Neo Poly didn't work last time, (Feb.) The Dr. put him on both of these, at the same time. The Idoxuridine were the ones that needed to be kept in the 'fridge. I still didn't see great results after all of that, so I finally

ordered the Eye See Clearly from Allergicpet.com. (Holistic eye drops). Thankfully, his eye's aren't to bad, no drainage or anything, just the "3rd eye" looking a little pink, when he has a "flair up."

He hasn't had a flair up sense Febuary (thank goodness!), So, I have only used the holistic drops here, & there. I don't want to stress him out putting eye drops in, if I don't really need to, sense stress

causes flair ups.

If you're trying to figure out what you're dealing with, you could always ask the vet to do a culture and sensitivity test of the eye drainage.  It might just be something that is "normal" for your kitty, esp. if he has herpes.

I also give my herpes kitty lysine twice daily.  I use the powdered kind (1 lb jug) and give 1/4 t twice a day when she's having a flare up and half that dose as a daily maintenance.  I have given her Gentimycin drops when her eyes get really bad and when she's sneezing a lot via her nose. 
 

catspaw66 said:

I really don't have much to add to the wonderful advice that is already here.  I wish I had known all the stuff on here before Silly's eye got so bad.  I might have been able to save it, even though I had only a tiny income at the time.
 

Click to expand...

Was Silly's vet able to do anything before he/she removed her eye?

stephanietx said:

If you're trying to figure out what you're dealing with, you could always ask the vet to do a culture and sensitivity test of the eye drainage.  It might just be something that is "normal" for your kitty, esp. if he has herpes.

I also give my herpes kitty lysine twice daily.  I use the powdered kind (1 lb jug) and give 1/4 t twice a day when she's having a flare up and half that dose as a daily maintenance.  I have given her Gentimycin drops when her eyes get really bad and when she's sneezing a lot via her nose. 
 

Click to expand...

I've never heard of the Gentimycin drops. What can you tell me about them?  I'm always trying to learn more, especially, if Angel get's "resistant" to one.

The vet has never mentioned that one before.

Thanks!