Help selecting a new food

LDG said:

Oh I'm sure it is.

The kitten food may have higher protein, so when they do have it in stock you may want to get it. I'm on the website -the calories are comparable.

The 3 oz can of chicken has 120 calories, the 3 oz can of Turkey has 119, both have 12% protein on an "as fed" basis, and the kitten food, oddly, is 11.5% protein. Hunh. That's weird. The kitten food has more fat than the others.

Well, I wouldn't really worry about the kitten food vs the others then!

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Well that's good. Now that I know she likes Wellness, I was thinking of trying another brand and seeing if she likes that too. She eats it so much better than Innova, and I wonder if I should try something else too so she doesn't get bored. I would have Wellness as a sure thing. Or should I not rock the boat and just leave well enough alone and stick with what I know she likes.

I have all the Blue Buffalo types easily available as well as Avoderm as far as grain free go. I did use the Blue Buffalo Wilderness with her, she liked it, not necessarily as much as the Wellness though. I have Petsmart where I can get food from so anything sold their I can easily get to try.

I know there are website where I could order food and have more brands to choose from. I have no clue what they are right now and would have to see if I could find them, but with those would you have to order a case or could you order a can or two. I don't want to order a bunch of something if I don't know if she will eat it.

What about baby cat from royal canin mixed in-its for younger kittens and very tiny kibbles.

CatNamedPanda said:

I'm not necessarily opposed to raw. There are just a few factors I would have to look at. I have never seen commercial raw sold anywhere here. As far as pet stores go I have Petsmart and that is it. There is a small pet store but they sell more fish and small pets stuff. There is one tiny little area where they sell cat and dog stuff but the selection is extremely limited, and no raw. With that I would have to figure out cost if I could even find it. I also have other cats and I feel like I would have to feed them raw too if I were to start with Delilah.

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If you have a Petsmart near you, you can check out the Nutro Natural Choice kitten food.  It is in pate' form.  Petsmart does not have commercial raw yet but they do for dogs so I think raw for cats will be coming there soon.  Whatever you choose I know you will do what you think is best for her.  The two of you have been through so much together

Thanks Ill look into it Mike. I am thinking that finding a variety of foods that she will eat well will keep her eating well. I don't want her to get bored of a food. I have to go buy some more food today. In 2 days between her and her sister they have gone through 4 cans (5.5oz cans). I hope eating a can a day is good. They are both still so small, Delilah is only 11.5 oz and Penelope is a little over a pound.

CatNamedPanda said:

Thanks Ill look into it Mike. I am thinking that finding a variety of foods that she will eat well will keep her eating well. I don't want her to get bored of a food. I have to go buy some more food today. In 2 days between her and her sister they have gone through 4 cans (5.5oz cans). I hope eating a can a day is good. They are both still so small, Delilah is only 11.5 oz and Penelope is a little over a pound.

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I mix up my brands of wet food to give them different choices.  On the kibble I stay the same but it's the only kind they will eat anyway.  Mine don't eat a lot of kibble as it is.  I would allow them to eat as much as they want at this age but in small doses over several meals per day.  But you will do what you need to do.  We've all seen what miracles you have in you

I have 6-7 week old kittens who were having a bit of trouble chewing dry kitten food even soaked in KMR. I switched to Royal Canin baby cat 1-4 month and the pieces are so much smaller than average dry kitten kibble. They love it. I mix it sometimes with a little KMR or some canned chicken Soulistic. I usually feed Wellness core but it was way to expensive for me to feed 7 kittens and 4 adult cats canned 3xs a day. I offer them the dry and KMR 2xs a day as a snack.

I don't have to worry about changing up kibble, they won't even try any. I would try the Royal Canin but I am 99% sure they wouldn't even touch it. I can't even get them to eat treats. If it's nit wet food they don't want it.

I just got back from the store with a selection of food. We have Naturo kitten, Avoderm, Blue Buffalo Wilderness and Basics, and some more Wellness and Wellness Core.

As far as feeding them I figured as much as they would eat was best. They eat a minimum of 4 times a day, but with Delilah being so small still I try to feed them 6 times a day. I put a few spoonfuls out and if they are licking the plate I give them more until they are done. Delilah tries to cover hers when she is full.:lol3:

If they're eating a can a day each (5.5-ounce can, I assume?), that's pretty good! A lot of adult cats eat that amount :lol3:. They'll be packing on the ounces in no time!

Willowy said:

If they're eating a can a day each (5.5-ounce can, I assume?), that's pretty good! A lot of adult cats eat that amount

. They'll be packing on the ounces in no time!

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Yes they are 5.5oz cans. Hopefully they do pack on some weight soon.

You have a nice selection for them. I've had the best success with Nutro and Wellness. I think your smart to let little Delilah eat whatever she wants and just clean her nose out afterward. Hopefully once she gets bigger that won't be a problem. Food up the nose is better than no food in her belly!

Has your vet ever mentioned Nutri-Cal paste? I use it when I have large litter or malnourished nursing queens to keep their weight up and just mix into wet food. I have never used it with kittens but if it's suitable for them you may want to try it just to give her even more of a calorie boost since she's so tiny. I know Penelope is thriving (I have been following the other posts for awhile now) but she could probably also benefit from some extra calories. It's not something I would start without the vet's okay (too much may give them diarrhea which is the last thing you need) but if s/he agrees it might be worth trying. 

Finally, do you heat the food up before you give it to them? A few seconds in the microwave will make the food super stinky and may help Deliliah smell it better. 

I love reading about little Deliliah's progress- what a little fighter! Props to you for not giving up on her! 

CatNamedPanda said:

Since I cant find raw anywhere here, I bought some more canned food. I had bee feeding her Innova, but switched to Wellness to see if she would eat it. She is in love with Wellness. I have ever seen her so excited to eat as she is when I get her a plate of Wellness. I still have some a/d so that is mixed in there too. I couldnt find anything about how many calories is in a can, but she seems to be eating more of it than she has anything else.
 

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i haven't read all the way to the end so hopefully this isn't a duplicate but you can make your own raw with a supplement mix: http://www.wildkittycatfood.com/catfoodkit.html  i haven't used this myself but i was considering it.  you might need to invest in a grinder because most commercial raw already has the ground bone and taurine, among other things, added to it.  just google raw cat food kit or mix if you want to research it yourself.

i feed weruva sometimes and it is probably one of the lowest calorie foods at 90 cal for 3 oz.  most of the others are about 120.  my cats like wellness, but it is pate.  none of them will touch the blue buffalo flaked wildnerness, but it's chunks.  you might try that and grind it up in your food processor.

EB24 said:

You have a nice selection for them. I've had the best success with Nutro and Wellness. I think your smart to let little Delilah eat whatever she wants and just clean her nose out afterward. Hopefully once she gets bigger that won't be a problem. Food up the nose is better than no food in her belly!

Has your vet ever mentioned Nutri-Cal paste? I use it when I have large litter or malnourished nursing queens to keep their weight up and just mix into wet food. I have never used it with kittens but if it's suitable for them you may want to try it just to give her even more of a calorie boost since she's so tiny. I know Penelope is thriving (I have been following the other posts for awhile now) but she could probably also benefit from some extra calories. It's not something I would start without the vet's okay (too much may give them diarrhea which is the last thing you need) but if s/he agrees it might be worth trying. 

Finally, do you heat the food up before you give it to them? A few seconds in the microwave will make the food super stinky and may help Deliliah smell it better. 

I love reading about little Deliliah's progress- what a little fighter! Props to you for not giving up on her! 

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She is definitely getting some food in that belly for sure.

No she has never mentioned Nutri-Cal I have used it with kittens and cats before. My vet tends to give me Viyo to give to my kitties when they are sickly.

Yup she eats her food best if it is just a little bit warm.

I think you will like the video I posted tonight, it just sums up her progress report without me having to say anything.

The girls eat Avoderm, I don't think Delilah enjoys it though, she eats slower and less. I don't think it agrees with her stomach either she now has diarrhea that she didn't have before. Am I changing her food too much on her? I thought it was ok to change wet foods. I have several cans of wellness that I can go back to and see if it clears up.

I was revisting the idea of feeding them raw. I was looking at different sites and see that you can order some in smaller quantities than a case. Penelope will eat anything you put in front of her, and lots of it. Delilah is apperently a bit picky and will eat all the types of canned foods I got her, but she eats so much better when I give her Wellness. Plus I think it might be one of the brands that gave them diarrhea it could be something else, I will have it looked at when I go to the vet tomorrow. With buying Wellness I am spending $4 a day to feed the girls. I was looking at random various sites for raw and have no clue where to even start when looking or how much I should expect to feed them. I was trying to figure out cost as well and how it compares to what I am feeding now.
 

Are you talking about Penelope and Delilah? Are they both kittens? And between the two of them you're feeding how much food (ounces)?

And yeah, you don't have to buy cases if you buy online! I think that's only CountryPet. We can help figure out how much they'll need to eat (roughly) to make it easier for you to figure cost. :nod: I just know that part of the reason I switched to raw was that even if I fed commercial raw, it would cost me the same or less than I was spending to feed them. I don't buy commercial any longer (though I do buy some ground from Hare-Today http://www.hare-today.com, where I source most of the organs I use) and I'm spending less than I was feeding canned food. :nod: (Hare Today has REALLY reasonable shipping charges!!!)

You can buy less of the CountryPet, too! You just get free shipping if you buy the case. Sorry if I gave the wrong impression!

Yeah, Hare Today and Nature's Menu have very reasonable shipping. Only Natural Pet Store has an excellent selection, and shipping isn't too terrible.

LDG said:

Are you talking about Penelope and Delilah? Are they both kittens? And between the two of them you're feeding how much food (ounces)?
And yeah, you don't have to buy cases if you buy online! I think that's only CountryPet. We can help figure out how much they'll need to eat (roughly) to make it easier for you to figure cost.

I just know that part of the reason I switched to raw was that even if I fed commercial raw, it would cost me the same or less than I was spending to feed them. I don't buy commercial any longer (though I do buy some ground from Hare-Today http://www.hare-today.com, where I source most of the organs I use) and I'm spending less than I was feeding canned food.

(Hare Today has REALLY reasonable shipping charges!!!)

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Yes Penelope and Delilah. I plan to eventually get the adults I have on a better diet, but as of right now they free feed on dry. Penelope and Delilah don't even want to try dry and I have a feeling they never will because they eat wet, why would they want to go to dry. So I may as well go ahead and put them on raw.

They are both kittens. About 12 weeks old but very small for their age. I will have updated weights for them tomorrow after the vet if that makes a difference. Right now each kitten eats roughly 5-6oz a day of wet.

When I was kinda looking around I noticed all sorts of different types. I would guess some sort of ground is what I would be looking for. Would that be the type that comes in a tube only or are the patties I see essentially the same thing but I guess portioned already. Sorry if that is kinda a dumb question.

Willowy said:

You can buy less of the CountryPet, too! You just get free shipping if you buy the case. Sorry if I gave the wrong impression!
Yeah, Hare Today and Nature's Menu have very reasonable shipping. Only Natural Pet Store has an excellent selection, and shipping isn't too terrible.

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That's ok, I figured it out after looking around some. I didn't look at shipping cost though, I was distracted by just trying to see what.

No dumb questions.

The tubes are called chubs. They're typically less expensive than the patties. They're quite easy to cut frozen, so you don't HAVE to dethaw the whole things. The patties are already portioned - some (like Primal) are 1 ounce portions, NV are 8 ounce portions. I think most are 8 oz. If you throw them in a baggie and dethaw in cold water, they dethaw pretty quickly. But the raw lasts in the fridge 2-3 days. :nod:

All the commercial raw foods are ground foods. :nod: You can order chunks of various meats from Hare Today, but totally not necessary, just an option. And it IS easiest to start with ground, because the texture is most like canned, what they're used to eating.

The Hare Today ground mixes are easily made nutritionally complete by ordering the Alnutrin supplement for meat/bones/organs. :nod: All you have to do is mostly dethaw the chub (the tube) (easy in a bowl of cold water, takes about an hour), add the alnutrin supplement (1 small scoop per pound), a little bit of water, mix, and then just portion up into bags or tupperware containers, and freeze. (When feeding raw, it does help to have a food scale).

I do think that would be the most economic option, especially given shipping rates. But if you want to order a few things from OnlyNaturalPet, it's best to call them. Apparently when you order online, the shipping doesn't necessarily calculate correctly.

As to how much to feed them, if they're eating 4-6 ounces of canned food each every day, I'd just use that as your guide to how much raw they'll eat. That will be an over-estimation, because cats eating raw don't need as much. The bioavailability is higher. But they'll be growing, and needing more food as they get bigger. At first they may only need 3 - 4 or 5 ounces if eating raw, but when figuring out how much it'll cost, it's better to assume more than less (IMO) so you get happy surprises down the road. :lol3:

BTW, if you have any concerns about raw being appropriate for growing kittens, the Winn Feline foundation conducted a study to determine if raw food (commercial and home made) is nutritionally adequate for both kittens and adult cats. They found it is. The final study hasn't been published, but an update indicated the general findings of the study.

Oh - these were priced at http://www.petfooddirect.com (for the most part), but the color coding is red is raw food without shipping costs; the kind of purplish color is raw with the shipping costs included. They may be cheaper other places online (like OnlyNaturalPet), and Hare Today isn't included at all, because it has no supplements already in it. But this might help give you a feel for the most commonly available raw foods: http://catcentric.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Canned-Raw-Table-1.pdf (It's a cost comparison of raw and canned foods. The article that precedes it is here: http://catcentric.org/nutrition-and...y-cat-or-i-can-afford-to-feed-commercial-raw/ )

There is so much to look at and think about. So from what I can tell getting the ground from Hare Today and adding the supplement would be the best cost wise? If that is the option I went with I would be getting the meat/bone/organs not the boneless ground right?

Is there a type of meat that would be best to try with the girls first. Also are some meats better for putting on weight than others?