Deafness and raising kittens?

Yes, I edited my reply because I didn't see page 2 of the thread! lol yeah..kitchen scales are great. It's so easy to lose one if they are not

eating properly.

My mama is still acting normal. Extremely affectionate too...grabs me when I try to stand up to leave. I moved her to my daughter's bedroom

for now.

Suspect it's hard for them to pull themselves around on the tiles - I really would put something down and hope she leaves the kittens on it.  They need to be able to move around to keep themselves the right temperature, to huddle when mum is away, and in general to develop.

Nice video, what a sweet, sweet girl! Good luck w/ the new babies. You will have to post picts for sure.

I put a puppy pad under them. Luna promptly removed it. She wants her kittens on the floor, darnit! I've held them, and they are all nice and warm and clean, so if she insists, I am not going to stop her. There are lots of cuddly boxes around when she decides she wants one.

Oh well - you tried.  Is she OK with you picking them up once a day to weight them?

Yes. I'm making a chart to keep track now. My brother is coming over tonight, so I think I'll weigh them when he's here. I just have to figure out how to distinguish the graybies.

I'll post the weights, since I think that could be potentially useful to someone else. I do have a runt that is noticeably smaller than the others. He is latching well and gets around ok, so I am hopeful he will be ok. I noticed that the others often knock him off a popular teat, so I might have to start doing supplemental feeding if he's not nursing when I check in on them.

Day 1 (all weights in ounces):
Calico- 4.1

Eyebrows-3.9

All gray-3.7

White feet-3.5

Speckled-3.5

Black and white-2.5

Good call on the runt... They are all very very cute. I had a litter of four orange tabbies. All male. I used a non toxic marker and coloured the tip of an ear.- I used different colours but grey will be harder to see. I've heard of someone marking armpits. So perhaps grey right ear mark, grey left ear mark, grey left armpit and grey right armpit...you get the drift... I did have to reapply the marker every other day or so.

I thought the B&W looked rather small.  Best to weigh them about the same time each day, and it looks like you can tell them apart now.

brinnan said:

 I noticed that the others often knock him off a popular teat, so I might have to start doing supplemental feeding if he's not nursing when I check in on them.

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A common advice is to set him to ma when the others are sleeping.  Or set him to a teat which is not so popular...

Supplemential may be necessary yes. The risk is, it is easier to eat supplement, so some dont want to bother with the mom milk anymore.

So if possible, use the natural resource as long you can.

About the colouring:  another tip is to use your nail colors - on their nail.  Just  on one nail apiece.

I have a couple of questions I'm hoping you all can help me with.

This morning Luna is leaving bloody spots wherever she sits. I think that is normal, so I'm not too worried. How long before I should get worried, though? Another day or two?

Luna is having quite a bit of loose stools. She bit eat a lot of wet food after delivery (3 small cans), and I'm sure her body is adjusting, so I don't think it's a big deal, but I wasn't to ask. Is that normal? I mean, she ate six placentas, so I figure it is.

Also, Luna is not interested in food this morning. She took a couple of sips of water, but no food, despite fresh wet food. She was never a big eater while pregnant either, but I figured she'd be starving now. She did eat a lot right after birth, but not a lot last night or this morning.

Today I am a tiny bit concerned. Luna is very cuddly (she leaves the kittens to sit on my lap whenever I visit). The kittens seem to be sleeping a lot against her more than nursing. How often should the kittens sleep? I figured they'd be pretty non-stop with the nursing. My concern is that maybe with her not that interested in food and all, maybe she isn't producing milk, and maybe that's why they aren't nursing. Is there a way for me to tell?

Sorry for so many questions! I am a protective first-time foster mommy!

 

brinnan said:

. My concern is that maybe with her not that interested in food and all, maybe she isn't producing milk, and maybe that's why they aren't nursing. Is there a way for me to tell?

Sorry for so many questions! I am a protective first-time foster mommy!

 

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Ah, you SHALL be protective, it is your duty. 

If they eat enough? the trick is to weigh them! going up - good, going down- bad, nothing different - not so good.  Easy.

Yes, they do sleep a lot in the beginning. And eat in between. The rest moms helps them with..

As you said, 6 placentas is 2 more than recomended.

The bloody traces...  somewhat blood-coloured discharges is pretty normal, fresh blood not so.

In between?  May be difficult to decide if arent there.

As always, if unsure, phone your vet.

Does she seems to have any higher temp than usual?  Something smelly (ie pus) coming out?

Her not eating "isnt necessary good".   I would suggest forcefeeding. With a little luck you can do it with a tea spoon in the corner of the mouth, otherwise use such a injection used for dosage of medicines.

And, of course, another reason for perhaps phone your vet.

*vibes*

ps. Her intensive cuddling with you, almost neglecting the kittens, may perhaps also be because she isnt entirely well.

I would say, phone the vet if you have good contact. Dont wait till tomorrow.

I was just reading that after eating all the placentas, it is normal for the mother to not be terribly hungry for 24-28 hours after birth. She did eat some yesterday, so I think I'll worry more if it keeps up tonight.

The blood does look frank to me, but it is also a really small amount when she sits down. There is no pus or smell that I can tell. Since we're still so soon after delivery, I'm starting to think it's nto too bad.

She has been incredibly cuddly since I got her two weeks ago. She LOVES people. She'll settle back with the kittens after I spend about 5 minutes petting her, but she'll leave them again to try and stop me when she sees me going for the door. Today I tried putting the runt to her while she was sitting on my lap. She picked the runt up and put it back with the other kittens, then laid between me and the kittens purring with her paws out so that she could touch us both.

Fingers crossed that it will all be ok. I have to go to work I took yesterday off to moniter them, but today I can't miss. The normal vet is open until 8pm, though, so I will take her immediately if she still isn't eating and has more blood tonight. The ER is also three blocks away and open 24 hours. Both places are open tomorrow.

Congratulations on the new kittens! So cute. What a good meowmy you are. I hope all pans out to be well with Luna & that she is just adjusting to all of this.

Congratulations on the new kittens! So cute. What a good meowmy you are. I hope all pans out to be well with Luna & that she is just adjusting to all of this.

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Thank you! Tonight things seem a lot better in some ways. Luna is eating a ton and the bleeding seems to have stopped. She also let me put a blanket behind the toilet, and she puts all of the kittens on a puppy pad when she goes for a walk around the bathroom.

Here is the one concern-- I just did day 2 weights. One of the kittens lost weight, one gained a bit, and the others stayed almost exactly the same. The kittens are all definitely latching and pooping. Should I be concerned? Or are kittens like human babies in that they lose the first day? Here is the weight chart:
One other dumb question-- are kittens always so aggressive with each other? I mean, they have no eyes or ears yet, but they will go to one on a nipple and scratch it like crazy to get it off (while they both mew). It is good that they all seem so strong, mobile, and their mews are pretty loud/whiny, but are their usually some bullies in the bunch?

I can't answer your question as I have no experience. But I wanted to check in to see how things were going... and

I can imagine it's a bit scary, but you seem to be doing SO well with her, and she seems like such a love - and a good mom!

brinnan said:

 are kittens like human babies in that they lose the first day? Here is the weight chart:

Kitten	Day 1	Day 2
Calico	4.1	4.1
Eyebrows	3.9	4.4
Graybie	3.7	3.9
White feet	3.5	3.5
Speckled	3.5	2.9
Black and white	2.5	2.5     = 77 grames

One other dumb question-- are kittens always so aggressive with each other? I mean, they have no eyes or ears yet, but they will go to one on a nipple and scratch it like crazy to get it off (while they both mew). It is good that they all seem so strong, mobile, and their mews are pretty loud/whiny, but are their usually some bullies in the bunch?

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Yes, it is quite common they lose some weight the second day. But you do already see the use of these weights and tables - you know at once which one you must look a little extra for. Blackie and Speckie.

No larm bells as yet, but keeping extra eye on.

Btw, I had looked on how much ounce is in grames. If it is correct 2,5 = about 77-78 grames, it not too bad.      You could almost say it is entirely normal weight.

Yes, Im afraid it is quite common with some competition...

Keep your eye on Speckled. That's a significant drop. I tend to weigh my babies twice a day. It's easier to see a pattern. If they drop from morning to night...I note it and then if they seem to

even out or gain overnight...I relax a bit. At this age, it could be as simple as weighing them after momma has stimulated them to pee/poop. I will drop down to once a day once I am confident that everyone is heading in the right direction. These first few days are crucial.

As for you second question..yes, very common to fight over teats even when they don't have to. There is usually always one bully to the bunch...the one that gains consistantly because he makes it his job to eat.

My last four actually ate at the same teat EVERY time. I'd never seen it before but one always preferred the one closest to the tail and they littlest prefered to up near moms armpit and the other two in between. It was kinda funny.

It all sounds very normal.  Kittens sometimes do scrabble furiously to get to the teat - although they are blind they can detect heat and have a good sense of smell.  They also do sometimes lose weight like human babies, and a healthy newborn kitten sleeps most of the time and suckles the rest.  If they are being noisy and moving around a lot then something is wrong.  Of course once their eyes start to open they start to spend some time looking around, but until then they do little but sleep and suckle.

The fresh blood is normal to start with as she has raw spots in her uterus where the placentas were.  After a couple of days or so you don't normally notice it.  Keep a good eye on her for any signs of unwellness.  If the discharge increases, or smells, or fails to change to dark blood then ring your vets.

I grabbed a morning weight check.
So they all had some kind of increase, though for the two smallest, it was very slight. We'll see tonight. I'm more concerned about speckled than the black and white. The black one latches well and has a round tummy. Speckled seems to struggle more to settle at a nipple.

This morning I found Luna lying against the bathroom door, waiting for me. Unfortunately, I only found 4 kittens behind the toilet on the blanket. The other two were wandering the bathroom alone. I picked them up and put them back. I need to figure out how to make a barrier or something. They climb right over blanket barriers, and Luna doesn't seem to care when they wander. She does not want them in the nest box, though, and brings them back then. Oy.