Help me find a low phosphorus canned food!

shantyel

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I am new to this site and just now seeing this thread, so I'm sorry if it's a little late or after the fact.. I just had to ask.. I am looking at this link for the By Nature Organic Chicken and Turkey, the food you are feeding Mazy, right?  The ingredients have thrown me, there is indeed a form of carrageenan among other misc things that really don't strike me as organic at all.  Is this the same food? and is Mazy still eating it/doing fine?  I am in the exact same situation with my elderly girl Lacy, who is struggling with CRF and I also had her on the c/d diet for years. She actually did ok on the c/d but my vet has asked me to switch to k/d and/or all low phos foods..so begins my journey.  I have not had much luck except to give her Castor and Pollux chicken and rice, with a tiny bit of Fancy Feast thrown in..she eats it well but is getting fat!  Anyway, I came across this thread and was thrilled to find a food that may work for Lacy but then the ingredients stumped me...
 
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otto

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I am new to this site and just now seeing this thread, so I'm sorry if it's a little late or after the fact.. I just had to ask.. I am looking at this link for the By Nature Organic Chicken and Turkey, the food you are feeding Mazy, right?  The ingredients have thrown me, there is indeed a form of carrageenan among other misc things that really don't strike me as organic at all.  Is this the same food? and is Mazy still eating it/doing fine?  I am in the exact same situation with my elderly girl Lacy, who is struggling with CRF and I also had her on the c/d diet for years. She actually did ok on the c/d but my vet has asked me to switch to k/d and/or all low phos foods..so begins my journey.  I have not had much luck except to give her Castor and Pollux chicken and rice, with a tiny bit of Fancy Feast thrown in..she eats it well but is getting fat!  Anyway, I came across this thread and was thrilled to find a food that may work for Lacy but then the ingredients stumped me...:confused:
The website is incorrect. The labels on the cans are correct. There is no carrageenan in the By Nature Organics. I have had many exchanges with the people at By Nature about this. Why they can't seem to fix the website I don't know.

Here is a list of canned foods and their phosphurous levels from the felinecrf.org website:

http://www.felinecrf.org/canned_food_usa.htm

You can look at the levels there, then look up the food to check ingredients, but, as you have found out, websites are not always accurate, so if you have questions, contact the manufacturer.

Welcome to TCS and good luck to you and Lucy!

PS Mazy is still having some trouble with regurgitation. I still think the years of c/d kibble is the culprit, I think she has an acid reflux problem. Pepcid helps but I don't like to give it to her too often. But she is much much healthier over all, on the By Nature Organic canned food. She eats two flavors, the turkey and chicken, and the chicken and liver. No, it is not a perfect food. There is no perfect commercial food out there. We can only do the best we can with what's available, what the cat will eat, and what the cat will keep down.
 
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nancy54

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otto~I just found your thread..January 25th 2013. I hope that you find my reply so much later. I have NEVER met ANYONE ELSE sooo much like myself when it comes to their kitties!!! The photos say it all:) THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU first of all for sharing the best you can find canned cat food with the rest of us..my two thirteen year old sister-cats are both ill now, and I truly believe their diet is at least in part responsible. Like yourself, I have been driving myself CRAZY trying to fond 'the perfect cat food for them'..it sounds like By Nature organic cat food is the best you've found, and that will be good enough for me. They have been on Fancy Feast classic like so many other cats, and what a garbage cat food! :(  Would you please update us on your cats? And are you still happy with this food(By Nature organics)? Any info. would be helpful. Thank you. The very best to you and your kitties:)
 
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otto

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Hi Nancy, welcome to TCS to you and your girls! Mazy still eats the By Nature Organic turkey and chicken, but is also on a partial raw diet now, started in September 2012. She still has trouble with too much variety in the form of canned diets.

Mazy now eats daily:
1 ounce of Rad Cat frozen raw, either turkey or chicken rotated,
.55 ounce of prey model raw (boneless, supplemented with egg shell calcium, and other vitamin supplementation), a rotation of chicken thigh, turkey thigh, chicken breast, turkey breast, and cornish hen (cut up with all parts), chicken gizzard and hearts, with the only organ meat being chicken liver.
2.7 ounces By Nature Organic turkey&chicken canned

She gets egg yolk lecithin for hairball control, she was getting 1/2 capsule every other day, but she has started her spring shedding early this year and I have just increased this to 1/2 capsule a day.

She takes a probiotic daily, and Krill oil every other day.

Mazy is still struggling with some regurgitation, going through a 3 day urpy period about ever two weeks, once it starts, she gets a pepcid dose daily (1/4 of a 10 mg tablet pepcid ac) until she feels better, it takes about 3 days to pass.

Periodically I try to add something new to Mazy's rotation, but if I try adding any other commercial canned foods, she has trouble, so I've turned to some freeze dried raw products to try.

She does okay with PureBites freeze dried chicken breast, and just today I gave her some freeze dried turkey heart which seems to have settled well. Neither of these are balanced meals, just treats or toppers.

The next thing I am going to try with Mazy cat is Stella&Chewy's freeze dried complete meals, the Duck and Goose flavor. I really want her to have another protein and she's already shown me she can't tolerate red meat (I was hoping the Rad Cat frozen raw lamb would be good for her but she can't keep it down). I don't really like for her to have anything with bone in it, but I think she will be okay with a bone in meal twice a week, if she can tolerate the duck and goose. I haven't started that yet though.

I'd be interested in hearing what foods you have tried with your two senior girls and what kind of problems they are having. Have they been to the vet? I do encourage you to feel free to start your own threads in the health or nutrition sections, you'll get lots of help and support!
 
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raintyger

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Hi otto,

Do you know if it is common for kitties eating Nature's Variety to have high urine pH? I find it curious that you mentioned Mazy's went up while on it. Raw is supposed to acidify urine. Yet, when my kitty was eating half raw Nature's Variety and half canned, her urine pH went up to 7.0, up from 6.5.

Also, how are you obtaining pH readings like 6.25? My urine strips only read in .5 increments, and the vet's office said they only measure in .5 increments themselves. If there's more accurate urine strips, I'd like to know where to obtain them.

Thanks.
 

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Otto, first of all, hugs and kudos for going through all of this to find the best food for Mazy. Having started that research myself (with fewer issues to deal with to begin with), I know how hard and frustrating it is.

Could I ask how you all are getting the urine pH readings. Are you putting the strips on top of the litter or are you putting them under the cat as she's urinating? I just can't picture it how to accomplish it effectively.
 

ldg

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These are the pH test strips I use:
They measure in 0.25 increments.

To measure the urine pH, you have to put it in the stream of urine as kitty pees.
 

vball91

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LOL ok. I can just picture this. My cat looking at me and wondering what in the world I am doing. I hope I don't scare her.
 
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otto

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Yes, those are the strips I was using.

Mazy had no problem allowing me to stick the strips under her, and in fact, even allowed me to obtain a sample of urine with a tube, stuck behind her. She was very accommodating that day, standing up to pee straight out, straight into the tube.

All her life, Mazy has known it is important for me to see her pee. She doesn't know why of course, but she knows it's important to me. Every morning after her pre-breakfast meal she sits at the top of the stairs and waits for me to go down with her to watch her pee. At other times during the day, if I am scooping boxes, for instance, she will hurry down and pee for me. I didn't train her to do this, it evolved naturally over the years of her urinary tract troubles.

Now, if it were Queen Eva I might have trouble. She is very private about peeing, doesn't like to be watched. She doens't mind me watching her poop, and in her early days with her digestive problems that was a good thing, because I needed to know how things were going. Or coming, haha. But never her pee. :)



Hi otto,

Do you know if it is common for kitties eating Nature's Variety to have high urine pH? I find it curious that you mentioned Mazy's went up while on it. Raw is supposed to acidify urine. Yet, when my kitty was eating half raw Nature's Variety and half canned, her urine pH went up to 7.0, up from 6.5.


Thanks.
I don't know if this is common for Nature's Variety. It wasn't the raw I was feeding then, it was canned NV. And yes, Mazy's pH did go up after eating it so I never gave it to her again. I don't feed the Raw NV. The only commercial raw Mazy eats is Rad Cat.


LOL ok. I can just picture this. My cat looking at me and wondering what in the world I am doing. I hope I don't scare her.
You can start by just getting her used to you watching her pee, and praising her. Let her know it is important to you, to see her pee. Get an idea of her habits, her timing, and kind of hover so she gets used to you being there. Talk to her, use her name a lot and tell her what you are doing and why.
 

vball91

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You can start by just getting her used to you watching her pee, and praising her. Let her know it is important to you, to see her pee. Get an idea of her habits, her timing, and kind of hover so she gets used to you being there. Talk to her, use her name a lot and tell her what you are doing and why.
Thanks, I will try that. She is used to me watching her so hopefully it won't be too traumatic for her. She will often follow me down when I clean her litter box and likes to use it right after, so I wait for her to finish, so I can clean it again.
 

nancy54

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Hi Gail(is it?) and thank you for the warm welcome!  My cat Brandi has recently been diagnosed with hyperthyroidism, and she has at least two teeth that need to come out the vet said. Just today I tried to get Brandi in her cat carrier for her appointment for the radiation therapy in Burlington, Vt.(45 minutes away). It didn't happen..somehow she 'sensed' that something was up and spit, hissed, and SCREAMED at me. The fella that was providing transportation said he was sure that he could get her in her carrier..it didn't happen. He had work gloves on and tried picking her up with a towel..and quickly learned that I wasn't fooling when I told him that Brandi wasn't going to make this appointment. I was sooo afraid that Brandi was going to have a heart-attack!  Needless to say..it has been a very stressful time for both me and her sister Brigit. When she sees Brigit she seems to be able to handle it..just keeps staring at her sister..if Brigit tries to walk or make any movement around Brandi Brandi starts spitting, hissing, and screaming. Poor Brigit..she slinks away on her belly..and hides behind the couch..sad  because they used to be sooo close:( My sister told me today to see if I can get a vet to come to the trailer and put her down..I've been crying ever since. Just because I can't get my beloved brandi in her cat carrier??!!  Brand's sister Brigit has also recently been diagnosed with chronic kidney disease(moderate). She is eating well(no constipation since I started putting egg-whites in her Fancy feast classic cat foods(NO FISH). She drinks ALOT of water and has a high urine output though. Brigit was overweight to begin with and has lost one pound in two years since putting them both on a canned only diet. The egg white suggestion is mentioned in a book called 'Your Cat' by a vet(Hodgkins) in California. She has her own website too.She also believes that ALL cats with renal disfunction should be on an anti-hypertensive drug called benazepril for their lifetime..it slows the kidney disease substantially she says. Unfortunately my vet is an old vet and I guess doesn't get aggressive with kidney dysfunction or hyperthyroidism(MY idea for Brandi to have the radiation therapy)..she was on the thyroid pills but I had to stop them..she developed diahhrea, and stopped eating:( Right now both of the girls are on Fancy Feast Classics(lowest phosphorus of Fancy Feast)NO FISH Classics though. Both girls had mostly hard food all of their lives until Brigit came down with a urinary tract infection two years ago and I kept reading to NOT FEED CATS ANY HARD FOODS. Please read the aforementioned book everyone-it is truly an eye opener. Cats MUST HAVE a HIGH-PROTEIN/LOW PHOSPHORUS diet with kidney disease. I am going online to order the By Nature Organic turkey and chicken canned cat food as soon as I'm done here. Thanks so much for your help, Gail:) Please keep us posted on your kitties. ANY ADVICE would be most helpful here. I feel so scared for my beloved girls right now.
 

jessica lambert

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Egg whites are a phosphorous binder and will help eliminate any phosphorous that inevitably finds its way into their diets. My cat will only eat it when it's warmed up but still raw, but the usual recommendation is that it's cooked and chopped. Be careful not to include any of the yolk, which is high in phosphorous (for CKD kitties).
 

lisamarie12

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I don't know if this is common for Nature's Variety. It wasn't the raw I was feeding then, it was canned NV. And yes, Mazy's pH did go up after eating it so I never gave it to her again. I don't feed the Raw NV. The only commercial raw Mazy eats is Rad Cat.
 

That's interesting re: NV's canned food and the increase in urine PH -- I wonder if it has anything to do with the spinach in the food? 

http://www.aspca.org/about-us/faq/spinach-0

Is spinach poisonous to cats? I looked at several websites and found conflicting information.

There is currently no solid data pertaining to feline ingestions of spinach, but we do know that it contains a small amount of calcium oxalates. While a leaf or two may not be an issue for a healthy adult cat, chronic and/or large ingestions of spinach could potentially cause crystal formation in the urinary tract. (And P.S., Because of this, spinach should be avoided completely in any cat with a history of urinary problems, including infections, crystaluria and kidney disease.)
 
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emily11111

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my cat also have beginning renal failure give her fancy feast tuna anything she wil eat to help her gain weight if she goes on a prescription diet mix it with a can food she liked never dry
 

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Hello, just joined this site as I saw this thread finally.  First, Otto - I am glad you cat is doing well now. 

Also.  Thanks for the input on the food.

I know it has been inactive for a bit but responding hoping to get a response though.   I am curious on where you can buy the By Nature canned cat food you are talking about.  I am having trouble finding this.

Trying to find a good cat food with a reasonable price is horrible. 
 
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otto

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Hello, just joined this site as I saw this thread finally.  First, Otto - I am glad you cat is doing well now. 

Also.  Thanks for the input on the food.

I know it has been inactive for a bit but responding hoping to get a response though.   I am curious on where you can buy the By Nature canned cat food you are talking about.  I am having trouble finding this.

Trying to find a good cat food with a reasonable price is horrible. 
Unfortunately By Nature has stopped making the Organics line. It is no longer available. I have enough to last me about a year, if I'm careful with it.

Mazy cat is still getting the Rad Cat raw and By Nature Organics canned and I still don't know what I will be feeding her to replace her canned portions when my supply of By Nature runs out next March.

It's very depressing. Perhaps by then I will have decided to give her Rad Cat only, but it is just not feasible right now.
 
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