So glad to know that's "as fed"Very interesting, Carolina. Thank you for sharing that! (And good to know!)
One less thing to worry about it :bigthumb:
So glad to know that's "as fed"Very interesting, Carolina. Thank you for sharing that! (And good to know!)
And another super premium "air dried" raw: ziwipeak:
http://www.ziwipeak.com/zpintl/nzl/cuisinefamily.shtml
You know.... This is really an acquired taste.... No, it is not cooked.... But good luck getting them to eat! It feels just like little pieces of jerky meat... quite tough. You feed very little of it though.
Those links you provided are great! Thanks! I have a question about ziwipeak air dried food. It says the product is air dired, but it never says if it is cooked before drying. Is it raw? I was going to buy one bag, but I thought I should ask first.
Wowzer! Those are good prices, and free shipping (besides the $9.99 which is entirely reasonable)! I'm definitely making an order with them soon. I actually had an order all worked out, but then I realized I wouldn't be home next Friday to get the FedEx order. . .so I'll order next weekend, I guess. I had a bunch of stuff in my cart (around 20 pounds of various brands) and still hadn't reached the $60 free shipping minimum. . ...FYI, http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/cats/ seems to have some better prices for most of the commercial raw foods than PetFoodDirect.com.
And there is "free shipping" (apart from the $9.95 frozen surcharge for packing) for quite a number of commercial raw products. The coupon code is not being automatically applied, which is PIA, but I'm sure if you call them, it can be sorted.
I just spoke with a Nature's Variety representative and she says their foods are not actually 95% meat; instead, they're approximately 15% bone, 30% organs (incl. heart) and 50% meats.
That bone percentage is half again as high as I believe it should be, given the frankenprey guideline is 5 - 10% bone, with 7% being the average, so there is a chance there's more bone content in this food than Bugsy is comfortable with (especially coming off a year and a half with no solid stool at all).
Raw fed cats usually poop every other or every third day. I'd watch Bugsy and if he looks like he's straining or he goes beyond three days, I think I'd do whatever is normally done with a constipated kitty (some kind of kitty laxative?). I would also start replacing an ounce or two of the NV raw with fresh raw meat every day to lower the daily concentration of bone he's eating, or start feeding another brand of food in rotation with the NV.
Not saying that's what's going on here, just giving you a heads-up that it's a possibility.
AC
For those who might be confused, when discussing the 80-10-5-5 (meat, bone, liver, other [secreting] organ) ratio, heart is considered to be a meat so the meat component of NV is actually higher than 50% although we don't know how much higher.
I second that 15% bone is kinda high. With my cats when I go over 10% I start seeing caulky poops.
Also, they don't say 95% Meat, as in muscle..... they say: "95% Meat, organs and bone" - which means that all combined is 95%. "5% of vegetables, fruits, and other wholefoods" (eggs for example), "0% of Grains and Gluten" :nod:
For more on the HPP process, you can read about it here: http://www.primalpetfoods.com/education/foodsafety . From the Primal site:On the store, I found out a VERY good thing while talking to Laurie on the phone - I was on a mission to find a food for them..... I did bring home Venison from Nature's Variety..... However, I found out that Primal also uses the same High Pressure Processing to ensure pathogen free poultry - so I just got three more choices for Bugsy: Pheasant, Quail and Turkey
.
Feline's Pride is akin to Rad Cat in quality, if anyone is interested. Both companies make their foods without adding any non-essentials like fruits and veggies.
Generally-speaking, cats on a raw diet shouldn't be on either laxatives or fiber supplements. If a particular recipe is too bone-heavy for a given kitty, then balancing the diet by rotating it with either another recipe (there are some that are bone-free) or a meal of fresh, raw meat is the most natural method of addressing the issue. Alternatively, of course, the bone-heavy product can just be dropped from rotation altogether.
I'm guessing that Bugsy's system is still getting used to actually forming solid poops. Between that and the 15% bone in the NV, it's understandable that he's pooping less frequently. And like someone's already mentioned, depositing waste in the litter box every three days is not outside what's normal for a raw fed kitty. Given a bit of time, I'm sure Bugsy's system will adjust enough to not need the fiber supplement he's getting now..
AC
I wonder...... Is the nutrition in the dehydrated food the same as in the regular raw? :scratch:
AC, want to chime in?
Note: Stella & Chewy's dehydrated cat foods ARE complete meals. Obviously they recommend rehydrating before feeding.Nature's Variety doesn't recommend freeze-dried raw for daily feeding, and from everything I've seen and read so far - dehydrated raw is great for treats and for the occasional meal (such as when you're traveling!), but not as the primary diet.
Although I've read several articles that rave about it, I haven't seen anything that I could positively get behind and say, yeah, it's ok to feed full time. Until I do, I won't recommend the practice.
Not a very definitive answer, I know, but I hope it helps a bit!
AC
OMG Can I just say OMG
Now.....THAT is quality meat right there
Here is an impressed momma with RadCat! Wow! You open that pack and mix it up...... mix it up.... and you see nothing, nothing but meat. And that's what it is - meat. This is definitely a no-BS-commercial raw food, not that the others are, but on this one, you SEE it :nod:
The only part of momma's that's not impressed is her pocket - at $8.99/lb, it would definitely be a problem to feed :nod:
I LIKED it though - the look, the feel, the texture.... the moisture content.... This looks exactly like the very fresh meat with all the juice you get from the market, red, bright and beautiful, as soon as you grind it clap.gif Totally impressed :bigthumb:
With all that stated:
Bugsy and Hope:
Hope was pretty disappointed she only got 1/4 of the turkey mixed into 3/4 of the rabbit :disa: Nothing that a little Fortiflora wouldn't do.... Ha! Yeah Hope - you need to wait until tomorrow...... but momma has her tricks! biggrin.gif
For Bugsy, even this little bit of RadCat made a difference biggthumpup.gif It is just SO much easier on him agree.gif It has more moisture (blood), the meat is softer and clumpier, his bites are more effective...... He eats faster and it required less fortiflora - he also ate a bit more - 1.60oz clap.gif And with no bones to chew on, nothing gets stuck on his teeth!
There are some interesting things about RadCat, especially for Bugsy:
For example:
Quote:
Why Does Rad Cat Use Human-Grade Bone Meal Instead Of Ground-In Bone?
Here are a couple of reasons why we made the choice to use a high quality completely human-grade bone meal over ground in bone:
#1) Many people and veterinarians have serious concerns about feeding raw ground bones. Ground bone is challenging for a cat's digestive system. We agree that this is good, but cats with sluggish digestive systems might have problems digesting bone shards. You are a better judge as to the value of bones in your cat's diet. That is why we recommend feeding bones in the natural condition a cat might find it - whole and chewable! You are at the mercy of the manufacturers on the size of bone shards in their grind. In a typical 'kill' for your backyard carnivore, he or she would most likely consume far less bone than is in a typical serving of food with bone ground in.
#2) It is difficult to guarantee the ratio of bone to meat unless every bone ground is exactly the same size. We have chosen to use a human-grade bone meal powder so that we can closely regulate the calcium and phosphorus content in our diets, which is so important for cats.
Also:
Quote:
Is Rad Cat Good For My Cat With IBS/IBD (Irritable Bowel Syndrome/Disease)?
As irritable bowel syndromes and diseases may have many causes, a healthy diet to support their digestion and immune system is paramount. Rad Cat is formulated to be the most easily digestible raw cat food and to provide support to maintain a healthy digestive tract. This issue was the driving force behind the formulation of Rad Cat (see About Us for Juno's story)!
Raw diets are easily digestible due to the presence of naturally occurring enzymes in the meat and high moisture content. At Rad Cat, we add gelatin to our diets to enhance the digestive process. Gelatin is high in the amino acid proline (as well as many others), which increases the hydrocloric acid (HCl) content of the stomach. This is very beneficial for cats that are eating a high protein diet. Cats generally have very acidic stomachs, but many cats come to eat raw after being ill and have compromised immune systems and sluggish digestion. Cats without digestive problems can also benefit from the presence of the added amino acids that gelatin provides.
Gelatin is also a wonderful source of collagen that is necessary for maintenance and repair of the digestive lining (as well as all epithelial tissue and joints). IBD and IBS cause a breakdown of this lining which not only contributes to many of the bowel symptoms associated with IBS and IBD, but can lead to general lower immunity. A healthy gut leads to a healthy immune system.
We, at Rad Cat, have also eliminated ground bone from our products. While we agree that chewing on raw bones is extremely beneficial for cats and dogs, ground bone can be difficult to digest for cats with inflammatory or irritable bowel diseases. Ground bones can provide some roughage and be challenging to the digestion. While this may be fine for healthy cats, in general, often it is too challenging for cats with digestive issues and can exacerbate their symptoms.
(this might also be easier for Bugsy to chew with his stomatitis :nod:
And finally, I like that they post their complete analysis against the AAFCO nutrient/dry matter analysis:
Quote:
http://www.radfood.com/site/856/LabAnalysis.pdf
Here are the ingredients for the Turkey:
Free-range turkey thigh and leg meat, free-range turkey heart, free-range turkey liver, filtered water, organic egg yolk, human-grade bone meal, organic kelp, organic dulse, gelatin, organic psyllium husk powder, wild salmon oil, manganese gluconate.
Lauren, Their meats (NV's are USDA Meats, therefore fits all the standards for the human-grade USDA meats - including hormone-free poultry & Pork (hormone is prohibited in poultry and Pork)Laurie ......... OMgosh - You have done so much leg work on the subject and I can't thank you enough for the hard work you put into gathering all of this information for us. A zillion for you taking the time to prepare this!!!!! IF we still had the option of gifts I would give you a bunch and a loads of those bags of money . I really appreciate this list.
p.s. I returned the frozen raw rabbit from Nature's Logic I purchased yesterday only because I opened the bag and it was filled with frozen ice crystals amongst the patties. And the patties looked like they had freezer burn. The date on the bag said it was good until July 1012 but I didn't like the look of it - too much ice inside the bag. They took it back and I exchanged it with NV rabbit and a bag of NV chicken. about the NV rabbit's in china - and a concern now about the meat not being antibiotic/hormone free, humanely raised animal's and grass-fed.... .
From the USDA:All of the materials used in our raw diets and raw frozen bones are obtained from USDA-inspected facilities (or meet USDA requirements in the case of imports) and from animals that have passed ante- and post-mortem inspection. Our quality control and quality assurance programs include but are not limited to: Sanitation Standard Operating Procedures (SSOP’s), Good Manufacturing Practices (GMP’s), a Hazard Analysis & Critical Control Points (HACCP) program, regular lot segregation, and other industry best practices. That said, our manufacturing facilities are used to produce pet food rather than human food, and since this is not in line with the USDA's definition of human grade, our foods cannot be classified as being human grade.http://www.naturesvariety.com/learning/questions/5
On the link above you will also find some answers on labeling of the meat, according from the USDANO HORMONES (pork or poultry):
Hormones are not allowed in raising hogs or poultry. Therefore, the claim "no hormones added" cannot be used on the labels of pork or poultry unless it is followed by a statement that says "Federal regulations prohibit the use of hormones."
http://www.fsis.usda.gov/Factsheets/Meat_&_Poultry_Labeling_Terms/index.asp
Nature's Variety meats are hormone and antibiotic free. The animals used for the meat are also fed only crops that are not genetically modified, they're fed the same crops that are used in the foods that the company produces.Nature's Variety. Many meals are not single-source protein. All are 95% meat/bones/organs. Organs typically include only liver & heart. Nothing said about hormone-free or antibiotic-free meats, humanely raised sources, or grass-fed. Rabbits sourced from China. http://www.naturesvariety.com/learning/questions/5
Note: Nature's Variety, Stella & Chewy's, and Primal's poultry all use High Pressure Processing, which provides a higher level of assurance that the product is pathogen-free.
Thanks for those! Darwin's looks great - and for anyone interested, though their regular order is a minimum of 20 pounds, they have an INTRODUCTORY OFFER of 10 pounds for $14.95 with FREE shipping! http://www.darwinspet.com/our-cat-food/There's also http://www.darwinspet.com/our-cat-food/ and vital essentials has frozen/freezedried cat food. Personally I have had no luck getting my cat to eat freeze dried, either mixed in canned or rehydrated on it's own or dry. I've started breading raw chicken/turkey in the powder from the freeze dried bags and she ate some yesterday. We'll see. I'd like to try a frozen option but can't get any locally and not paying shipping.