TheCatSite.com › Forums › Breeding › Breeders Corner › What type of cat is this cat?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

What type of cat is this cat?

post #1 of 36
12/25/11 at 1:58pm
Thread Starter 

I just got a new kitten who I believe is a She and we named her NutterButter... I think she might be part calico but I am not sure about her Breed. If she is part calico I am planning on breeding her for more calico kittens... if possible...and even if it isn't a calico I would really like to breed her because she is VERY GORGEOUS as a kitten of now around 5 or so months. 

 

She has white tipped toes and tail but you can't see that in the picture below and is mostly black with orange streaks and white streaks on her face with greenish eyes. So if anyone has an idea of what type of cat she is then please let me know. I really love her colors and stuff. 

 

http://s589.photobucket.com/albums/ss335/Rin_Sohma10691/?action=view&current=2011-11-06_10-59-43_488.jpg

Reply
post #2 of 36
12/25/11 at 2:12pm

She is a tortie, which is not a breed, rather a color pattern. She is no particular breed and yes, she is beautiful. However, if you were to breed her there is no guarantee she will have a tortie. There is actually no reason to breed her, unfortunately there are thousands of homeless torties in shelters all across the country. And, allowing your cat to go through even one heat cycle increases her chances of certain types of cancer, and to the fact that going into heat is no fun for her OR you. 

 

She is gorgeous, but please spay her as soon as possible and if you want another like her, go on petfinder and look in your area for others that need rescuing. 

Reply
post #3 of 36
12/25/11 at 2:18pm
Thread Starter 

Alright I thought so... she kind of has strange coloring for a cat and I have been told that she needs to go through her first heat cycle before we get her fixed because it's better for the cats health...or that is how I was taught so she will be fixed next month when she goes into heat...but we're not sure she is a girl either... she is extremely shy and so we kind of thought she was a girl...but we still need to have a check up with the vet to check on her reproductive health... But I was planning on getting her fixed before hand I just don't think we'd get another kitten like her...she's got a personality of her own and I love her so much

 

I was just curious cause she's really pretty and although there are kittens out there who need homes and that is how I saved her...I saved her and her best friend pangur from a home with a ton of kittens and cats everywhere...She was really skinny and almost wild because we had to dig her out from under a house, and very scared and I took her into my home...I couldn't believe they would treat the kittens like they did because they where clearly not getting enough nutrition...

 

I kind of have a thing about breeding though....and although I do know the risks I just thought it might be nice to have kittens... It's a weird concept because I know many people who have said "SPAY HER SPAY HER" and while this is all and good I have never really had kittens with any of my cats and I would like to have kittens sometime...

 

But seeing as she is just a regular cat I might not... and well I know that if the other kitten we have Pangur Bahn is a boy then it wouldn't be a good idea to not have her fixed because we'd have to seperate them every time she had her heat cycle. 

 

The reason we haven't done this vet thing sooner is for money purposes so don't get too uppity about it... Both kittens are very healthy and the only problem I've seen are fleas...they eat and have healthy gums and are very active and haven't shown signs for worms or bumps (as in cancer)... 

Reply
post #4 of 36
12/25/11 at 2:30pm

There is no reason for her to go through a heat cycle, it is actually NOT good for them. And you want to have her spayed before she goes in to heat. Typically, a vet will charge more to spay a cat in heat. 

 

And she is most likely a girl as the tortie pattern is very rare in males. Extremely rare. 

 

If you are wanting to breed cats I would recommend you spend some time in the Breeders Corner portion of the forums. Breeding cats is not something you go in to lightly and it takes a lot of work to even become a breeder. I have worked with cats all my life and have some knowledge of feline behavior, requirements and health and I would never get in to breeding them as it is a time intensive, financial commitment and there are already too many without homes. I feel very strongly that responsible breeders are not just know knowledgable, they are experts on the breed they work with and have spent years studying them and understand the genetics behind breeding responsibly. 

 

Check out the Breeders Corner here on the forums, you will be amazed at the knowledge that is shared there. 

Reply
post #5 of 36
12/25/11 at 2:50pm
Thread Starter 

Yeah I thought that was the case as well with Torties (that they usually are female because that is a very close trait in calicos as well) but it wouldn't hurt to find out at a vets... 

 

As for breeding I will look into the prices as well with the idea of breeding one day...I probably won't do it with NutterButter because she is one of the first cats I've ever had the pleasure to raise as a kitten. And I've never heard that it's really bad for them to be in heat but I have had a cat be in heat before... She meowed so much and loud too and it was kind of hard to sleep for a couple days.

 

So I am not sure about the idea of her going into heat...but again it is very Financial in the fact that right now I have no money to get her fixed...I will have it next month though so she will be fixed one way or another. I was just curious about breeding and she's special to me right now so I am kind of fasinated with her. 

Reply
post #6 of 36
12/25/11 at 2:51pm
Besides, torties/calicos don't always have tortie/calico babies. . .red females have torties/calicos. A red female bred to a black male will always have tortie/calico female babies.

But, yes, if she isn't a breeding-quality purebred, it's best not to breed her. The risks are high and millions of cats and kittens are killed every year because there aren't enough homes for them. It is extremely difficult to find responsible homes for non-purebred kittens, so if you did ever breed a cat, there's a fair chance you'd have to keep all/most of the kittens yourself.

And, yeah, the cancer risk is higher if she goes through heat before being spayed, and there aren't any benefits (in cats anyway; I do believe there are benefits to allowing a dog to have one heat). Plus, if you have a male and he isn't neutered yet, she probably would get pregnant if you let go into heat, and it's pretty risky for a cat to get pregnant that young.
Reply
post #7 of 36
12/25/11 at 3:06pm
Thread Starter 

Yeah we'll see what the vet says next month...I am still pretty sure that if one is male then you would be right...

 

The other one is orange so I am sure it's a boy... 80% of orange cats are boys and torties tend to be girls so yeah we'll fix them both because of that..

 

plus my boyfriend isn't keen on getting them with kittens... so I am sure that that would be the best idea 

 

again I was just curious what she was cause of her fur but thanks for everything you have told me about it it's very helpful 

 

Btw the link is Pangur Bahn :) he's very adorable and is actually younger then nutter butter by about two months...He's very playful and fiesty and is the opposite of Shy and or scaredy cat Nutter Butter 

 

393170_106988152747793_100003098276083_61098_1754670598_n.jpg

Reply
post #8 of 36
12/25/11 at 3:19pm
I think the ratio of red (orange) males to females is about 75% to 25%. Both my mom and I have a red female, so I guess I never thought of them as rare, LOL. So your little orange kitty could be a female (1-in-4 chance), but more likely that it's male. Torties are about 99.9% female (I think it's about a 1-in-3000 chance it's a male), so I would pretty much guarantee she's female. She is so pretty. . .but I'm a real sucker for longhaired torties/calicos biggrin.gif.
Reply
post #9 of 36
12/25/11 at 3:25pm
Thread Starter 

OMG same here I love Torties and Calicos they are BEAUTIFUL

 

<3 I love NutterButter because she is such a beautiful tortie

 

 that is kind of why I want more of her around lol XD but I know for the better health of my cat I should just let her live her live and get her fixed...

 

As for Pangur Bahn I think he's a he...he looks really strange compared to nutterbutter back there...while I am sure Nutter is a girl I am not sure about Pangur.. XD it's hard to explain the back end of a kitten because it's strange...But he's like... four months old or maybe three so I am kind of like "What is going on back there?" so I kind of labeled him a him lol  

Reply
post #10 of 36
12/25/11 at 3:37pm
If that's a recent picture of him, I wouldn't say 3-4 months. . .more like 2 months. He's pretty small. And if she's 2 months older, well, I wouldn't guess her to be more than 3 months old, really. Maybe 4. But certainly not 5 or 6 months old.

If he's over 8-10 weeks, his testicles should have dropped by now. To sex young kittens, looking at their back ends, the male looks like : (top dot is the anus, bottom dot is the penile opening). If he's old enough, you can see two little bulges in between, those are the testicles. A female looks like ¡ (the dot is the anus and the slit is the vaginal opening).
Reply
post #11 of 36
12/25/11 at 3:51pm
Thread Starter 

Actually that pictures I have right now was when we first got them...

 

There fur hasn't really changed color much so that is why I posted them up... but they have gotten quite a bit bigger...

 

Nutter is now big enough to appear around maybe 5 months or so maybe a little more then five months because she was a big kitten when we got her well now she is quite big...But not enough to be called a cat yet...I think that is kind of a long furred cat thing to be big

 

  :P...But anyway back then Pangur was two months or younger when we got them and Nutter was around 3 or 4 or so we where told when we got her...they have gotten a little bigger since we got them...Pangur is still quite small so I am thinking he's barely three months or maybe three and a half months..

 

I noticed a small little round thing below the anus when we first got pangur...it's not like a hole like with girl cats...but it looks kind of like a very small ball sack..but at the same time it doesn't look like one

...it's not really seen though because it hasn't dropped or anything...(I could see the hole below the anus on NutterButter which is why I knew she was a she)... but on Pangur it's rather more like a bulge... But it's not really a hole...He hasn't really changed since we got him either...(except in weight) and I have yet to see anything drop really... So I am not sure.... 

 

It's very very very odd 

Reply
post #12 of 36
12/25/11 at 4:04pm
If you can get a picture of his back end, someone should be able to tell. You wouldn't believe how many kitten-booty pics are floating around this forum laughing02.gif.

When it's said that their testicles "drop", there isn't any actual dropping. . .that just means they pop through the muscle that was holding them back when the kitty was a baby. If you see bulges he probably is a male.
Reply
post #13 of 36
12/25/11 at 4:04pm

Aww, such cute kitties.  As others have said, they are mixed breed and should not be used for breeding.  If you really want to have kittens you could look into fostering pregnant cats from a shelter.  Of course, it's kind of hard to give them up when they're old enough to be adopted.

Reply
post #14 of 36
12/25/11 at 4:17pm
Thread Starter 

I know but I almost expected them to kind of show a little more was all...but that is how everyone thinks though

 

... and yeah I was pretty sure that it was a boy but when we got it home someone said they thought it was a girl... XD Which kind of made me want to take it to a vet...

 

will have to go over to my bf's take a picture and upload it here so people can tell me and maybe save me a trip ...someone has to let me know cause seriously if Pangur is a boy it totally makes things harder...

 

as for Nutter I won't know how old she is until she has her first heat... but I am sure a vet can tell me how old she is... so either way she is getting fixed.... it's just knowing what they are could be really helpful... 

 

I have a picture of Nutter which is only maybe from the beginning of December that is closer to now...It's hard to see but she has grown up actually quite a bit 

 

386753_2650767835776_1453144603_32785476_912059283_n.jpg

Reply
post #15 of 36
12/25/11 at 10:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flinch4me View Post
As for breeding I will look into the prices as well with the idea of breeding one day...

 

Your original questions have been answered, unless I missed someone letting you know so long as the kittens weigh 2lbs they are old enough to be fixed and it's best to get females done before their first heat which can happen from 4 months.

 

I just wanted to comment on the breeding and costs.

 

First of all you need to fall head over heels with a certain breed,  the best way to become a breeder is to show a neuter or two for several years first, to learn all about the standard, meet other breeders before getting a breeding girl - good breeders also will not hand over an entire to just anyone who comes along.

 

Some of the other costs have been well outlined here:

http://www.mcbfa.org/breedcats.html

http://www.nitewindes.com/costs.html
 

 

 

Reply
post #16 of 36
12/26/11 at 2:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flinch4me View Post it is very Financial in the fact that right now I have no money to get her fixed...I will have it next month though so she will be fixed one way or another.

 

You had already got some excellent and friendly answers.

Here is the last "spike in the chest"[EDIT this is rather svenglish. My son advises me "last nail in the coffin" sounds better. :)   ].  As MissyMotus had hinted, breeding is no cheap.  Or rather, if everything goes well and you do it a cheap way,  it perhaps doenst cost much.  But if things dont goes well?  A  backyard breeder without any conscience just abandon them, or let them lay there to make it or not, on their own.

But you arent such. You ARE a rescuer.  So as soon there are any complications, it will cost you. It may cost multum.

 

While if you do cooperate with a good shelter or a well organized rescue group, and foster their preg moms, and later on, the kittens resulting, you will not have the vet costs, as this shelter will pay the vet costs.

Being a fosterer is not completely for free, but usually you dont have the heavy costs at least.  The costs are time, patience, effort, your mental investment...

But being a rescuer, you are prepared for it, righ?    :)    The joy and the glory is a nice bonuses.   :)

 

 

That said, I myself Im not totally against private non pedigree breeding, if you are really determined to do some litters, and know all the know hows, why´s  AND have people waiting for the kittens.  etc.  So these are in practice rare exceptions.  

 

I do have reasons for believing so. But this is a completely another story for another tread.

 

(Do also observe, most pedigree cats should also be spayed, so this of routinely spaying preferably ASAP is not only just for 99.99 of moggies).

 

 

Welcome to the TCS site and our Forums!

 

Good luck!    *vibes*


Edited by StefanZ - 12/26/11 at 2:19am
Reply
post #17 of 36
12/26/11 at 8:33am
Your kittens are gorgeous. I agree with everyone else about getting them both neutered (but especially little Nutterbutter) as soon as possible. A girl kitten can go into heat any time between 4 and 7 months, so it is no guide to their exact age. A better guide is the teeth - they lose their baby teeth at 5 months, so if you start to find teeth on the floor or the kitten chews everything even more than usual, then you know. A vet will tell at once by looking in the mouth, but don't do this yourself unless you are an experienced handler, or you will get bitten and scratched.

If by any chance your little girl goes into heat before you can afford to get her to the vet, do not risk her getting pregnant. Separate the kittens at once, however much she may be crying. Keep her in a bathroom or anywhere secure - it will not hurt her for a few days, and will be much better than her getting pregnant. Spaying her will be much cheaper in the long run than the costs involved in her having kittens, especially if anything goes wrong, and it often can when a very young cat becomes a mother. It would be like a 12 year old human girl having a baby.

If you have not already done so, I would suggest talking to a local vet, explaining the whole situation, and asking their advice. It may be they will help you with a payment plan, or at least let you know when they think you should bring the kittens in to see them. Good luck, and stick around - there is lots of advice to be had here, and photos and experience to share!

By the way, I love having kittens around, despite having 8 adult cats of my own. I foster kittens for a local shelter, and get them ready for adoption when the time comes. Yes, it is hard to say goodbye to them sometimes, but is is wonderful to watch them grow and develop, and to know you have helped provide a loving companion for someone. Once you have seen the terrible condition of many orphan and abandoned kittens, you would never want to bring more into the world.
Reply
post #18 of 36
12/26/11 at 1:02pm

I would strongly recommend getting her spayed right away. If you have a male and a female you really don't want to wait until after she goes into heat because she could get pregnant-- if she's 5 months old she could go into heat at any time, and a male cat can breed as early as 5 months as well... It is very unhealthy for a 5-6 month old kitten to have a litter and if she did the kittens could be unhealthy or she could have complications or the kittens might not survive. It is also a good idea to get the male neutered because once male cats go through puberty they will often start marking their territory (spraying) in the house.

Calico and Tortie and basically the same thing. They are both cats with patterned fur that includes black and red/orange. Some have white. Different people have different definitions of which is which, but neither one is an actual breed of cat it's just a color pattern. They are fairly common in the non-purebred population so it's not like it is something that people need to breed more of, there are already plenty calicos and torties out there who need homes. If you like her color keep checking in shelters and such and I am sure you can find another cat that looks similar instead of breeding more mixed breeds. Also breeding a calico cat does not guarantee you will have calico kittens and in fact there is a good chance none would be calico.

 

There are already tons of beautiful cats in shelters that need homes. If you want kittens, call your local shelters and rescues and offer to be a foster home for pregnant cats or cats who have young kittens. They are often looking for people to take care of these cats until the kittens are old enough to find homes.

 

If you want to become a breeder, the way to go about it is to figure out what breed you are interested in and then do research on them. Many people start by purchasing a purebred who has been spayed or neutered and showing them in Alter class in cat shows, so they can get to know more about the breed, how to show and to network with breeders, and then find a breeder to mentor them in the process. 

 

 

Waiting for a cat to go into heat before spaying is not healthier. In fact if a cat goes into heat before they are spayed, this increases the risk of some types of cancer. Also spaying a cat in heat can cause complications due to an increased blood flow to the area and many vets will charge more because the surgery takes longer.

Reply
post #19 of 36
12/27/11 at 1:10pm
Thread Starter 

I think Pangur was too young to tell when we first got her...she was very small and very very skinny... Which I am glad she is so much better looking now...She's still rather small but I know she's had to gain at least two pounds since we got her maybe more

 

Also for those that where bugging me about breeding and getting them spayed that is definitely a given I wasn't saying I was still going to breed them I was saying that if Pangur was a male it would be hard on them and that I was planning on getting them spayed or nuetered because of the health risks and problems that young cats have when they are trying to have kittens anyway....

 

Also...I looked at Pangur now and she looks like a very healthy female in the backend. Her back end I concluded was so skinny that it was hard to tell from the lack of neutrition in her diet...so we won't have to worry about male cats getting either of them... We keep them inside...

 

I was just curious about Breeding costs and although I do realize they are expensive I was just curious about it and I wasn't going to breed the ones I have now and I have already come to that conclusion... So again it's nothing to worry about I DO plan on getting them both fixed as soon as possible.

 

So again I am not going to breed them although both are beautiful as could be and I love them both I think my love should go to them not the kittens they could make...I love the idea of kittens though and I wish I could have some one day...that doesn't mean I will breed them forever...in fact if I do fall in love with a breed (SCOTTISH FOLDS) I will only probably breed them only ONCE in my lifetime... Also to those who gave me info on the idea of fostering that sounds like a very good plan...although this probably won't happen until I am older and have more experience with cats anyway... I am very happy with all the info you have given me everyone and thanks for the info on everything.

 

P.S. by the means of Money it wasn't that I couldn't get them fixed because I don't have money.. I just don't have it at the moment... I will have my money by probably the end of this week and will have to schedule a time to see the vet in that time... I have a means of money and although some would get mad at me for the saying I don't have money to spay them at the moment that doesn't mean I can't take care of my cats.. 


Edited by Flinch4me - 12/27/11 at 1:21pm
Reply
post #20 of 36
12/30/11 at 5:30am
I've moved the posts on breeding Scottish Folds to a new thread.

http://www.thecatsite.com/t/239879/discussion-on-breeding-scottish-folds
Reply
post #21 of 36
1/5/12 at 2:34am
Thread Starter 

Actually her fur takes on more of a burnt orange amber color... she doesn't really have a whole lot of black to her fur...maybe a little true but up close she has gold and amber and more of a deep orange color to her fur. 

Reply
post #22 of 36
2/8/12 at 5:15pm
Thread Starter 

Are you all sure she isn't a Calico? She has white on her paws that look kind of like calico colors and white on her chest and face and some on her belly even...with yellowish colors as well...but I've seen Calicos with her coloring before... She hates showing her belly so a lot of the time no one sees it and pictures don't do her coloring justice...she's very orangish, yellowish redish with black underneath with little bits of white and when you look at her paws and belly she does have a whole lot more white 

Reply
post #23 of 36
2/8/12 at 5:40pm
I think calicos have a white based coats with orange and black patches. She looks like a tortie and white to me (but I'm not a breeder so take that with a grain of salt smile.gif )
Reply
post #24 of 36
2/8/12 at 6:13pm

I have a tortie that has quite a bit of cream color to her fur....but nothing that is truly "white."  Her name is Chloe:

 

IMG_9895.JPG

Reply
post #25 of 36
2/9/12 at 5:27am

"in fact if I do fall in love with a breed (SCOTTISH FOLDS) I will only probably breed them only ONCE in my lifetime..."

 

There is no point in paying for a breeding queen and only breeding her once.  There is also no point in finding out all the stuff you need to know and doing it once.  The point of breeding pedigree cats is to try to breed some really good show cats, and that doesn't come from doing it just once.

 

Hopefully you are getting both kittens neutered ASAP.  My suggestion after that is two-fold - go to some cat shows and have a good look round, *and* do some fostring of queens with kittens for your local shelter.  As to Scottish Folds - investigate before settling on this breed. 

Reply
post #26 of 36
2/9/12 at 3:52pm
Thread Starter 

@ oriental: That already has been said 

 

@ Blue: She looks kind of like that in the face but maybe more red with a white little stripe that goes around her eye but her under belly and feet have white which is why I am kind of confused...

Reply
post #27 of 36
2/10/12 at 12:47am

If her feet are white (pink pads?) she is tortie and white, and they don't usually have the mingled pattern you see in Blue's photo.  Instead they have patches of plain black and red tabby, or the tabby pattern is all over but changes colour from brown tabby to red tabby and back.

 

Neither of the photos of your cat are clear, neither of them show her feet, it's hard to know which of the two patterns she is.  It's clear for example the fur under her chin is pale, but it's not clear if it's very pale ginger tabby or genuinely white.  Messybeast has a couple of photos that clearly show the difference between patches and mingled patterns:

 

http://www.messybeast.com/tricolours.htm

 

Reply
post #28 of 36
2/10/12 at 11:09am
Thread Starter 

I will try to get some better pictures of her feet... but for the most part it looks very much white...I will also add her chin so people can see how she looks on the underside... but you might be right she might be a tortie...it's just her coloring looks so calico it's kind of a strange tortie in my opinion 

Reply
post #29 of 36
2/11/12 at 12:11pm
There's no real definition of "calico" vs "tortie and white". But to me, a tortie has fully mingled black/red coloring (it would be called brindle in a dog), while a calico has large clearly defined patches of color.
Reply
post #30 of 36
2/11/12 at 12:42pm

I always thought that calico was  US term and tortie & white a UK one for the same cat - one with patches of black, white and ginger, the ginger having a tabby marking.

Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Breeders Corner
TheCatSite.com › Forums › Breeding › Breeders Corner › What type of cat is this cat?