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Flowerbelle's turn: Heart problem? Asthma? Megacolon

post #1 of 59
Thread Starter 
Flowerbelle, as an adult, has always had problems with hairballs. When our herbal vet did so well with Chumley, we decided recently to take Flowerbelle to see the vet trained in alternatives to discuss treatment options, because nothing we've done has helped much. (Flowerbelle is 8 years old).

The past few weeks, she was coughing more than usual - but she hadn't gotten up a hairball recently either. Flowerbelle is one of the three cats that isn't on a wet-only diet. She eats a little bit of the wet food four times a day, but she mainly eats the dry food. sigh.gif Anyway, she had regurgitated some of her dry food two days in a row. The next night, there was a large hairball "gift" left for us to find. That was four or five days ago, and Flowerbelle has hardly been coughing since then.

At the appointment today, the first thing Herbal Doc said was she hears a heart murmur. Now - she's explained that a heart murmur can be from increased heart rate/fear of being at the vet. But Flowerbelle is 8, and the two vets that have seen her over the years have never heard one. So that was a little red flag.

She listened to her, and said she heard slight "crackling." Not "wheezing," but "crackling."

We asked if an xray was in order. (Bear in mind, back in July when we took Lazlo for hairballs/vomiting, we didn't do an xray right away and really regretted it, as his problem turned out to be cancer!). She felt it was. So xray we did.

Her lungs were cloudy. Cloudy in a way that made her think bronchitis. But ALSO cloudy in a way that isn't explained only by bronchitis. She gave her a shot of convenia. She would normally have given her steroids, BUT

She also has an enlarged heart. If she has a heart problem, steroids are contraindicated. So no treatment outside of the convenia for bronchitis until we know more.

Finally (as if that wasn't enough), apparently Flowerbelle's problem with hairballs over the years has been a motility problem, very different than the more normal "spleen Qi deficiency" (chinese medical diagnosis) cause of not properly passing hairballs. Even though she is not dehydrated, she is "dry" (from a chinese medical diagnosis perspective). This is resulting in her stool getting backed up in her small intestine, which is what most likely causes the reguritation, and her "dry" ... "constitution" (for lack of a better word) means she's been constipated... even though I see her going to the bathroom normally, without straining. But with 8 cats, I do not know how often she goes. I just know I've seen her recently, and everything looked fine. Herbal Doc says it's entirely possible to be constipated without the straining, and you can't always tell just by looking at the poop, you'd have to feel it. She says Flowerbelle's would feel dry if I mushed it around compared to other (normal, not constipated) poop. This has created megacolon, though very early stage, and very treatable. *phew*

Most vets would prescribe miralax for the problem. We are treating her with the chinese herbal treatment she recommended for Flowerbelle, Dang Gui Cong Rong (found this, for anyone interested: http://books.google.com/books?id=2ut1Cvgj9pYC&pg=PA523&lpg=PA523&dq=Dang+gui+cong+rong&source=bl&ots=HClhy06llh&sig=XhH6l9Fdr8IE69L-JLd_UudPtpw&hl=en&ei=-4rWTqHgEojk0QHkobHaCQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CDMQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Dang%20gui%20cong%20rong&f=false). This formulation is powdered capsules (cute little ones LOL). I am not to supplement her with fiber or anything, it won't be necessary with this treatment. This should not only improve her "dry" poop, but resolve the megacolon, AND resolve the hairball problem going forward.

The xrays of her lungs and heart are being sent to the Board Certified Radiologist everyone in NJ uses. They are also being sent to the cardiologist her clinic uses.

We SHOULD have the reports from the radiologist and the cardiologist by the end of the week. Depending upon what they say, we may be off to a cardiologist... and we'll just have to see about the potential asthma. Basically, depending upon what the radiologist says, we may just do a follow-up xray after several weeks to see how her lungs are looking (if it's potentially "just" bronchitis). The odd thing is... when I have bronchitis, I cough a lot. Flowerbelle, since the appearance of the hairball, hasn't been coughing. dontknow.gif We'll just have to see. cross.gif
Edited by LDG - 11/30/11 at 12:38pm
post #2 of 59
Thread Starter 
Oh, I should add that we were worried about Flowerbelle's hairball coughing before. We took her to her normal vet in 2009 to have him listen to her lungs and do an xray. On the drive home, Gary pointed out that something we didn't consider is that maybe Flowerbelle's "normal" lungs are a little grey on an xray due to scarring from the really bad herpes and lung worm problems she had when rescued. So I called him. He looked it up, and her lungs were clear. So whatever's going on is new - well - within the last two years, as that was her last lung xray. (And at her annual, obviously no heart murmur or wheezing or crackling lungs).

So the good news is, whatever's going on - with ALL of it, we caught it all early. *phew* cross.gifheartpump.gif
Edited by LDG - 11/30/11 at 12:40pm
post #3 of 59

Oh Laurie, I hope it's nothing serious...

 

Poor Flowebelle, I have my fingers, toes and everything else crossed for the gorgeous girl and sending vibes for a good report vibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gif

post #4 of 59
Laurie hugs.gif I just think you are handling this SO very, very well. It is just a true testiment of the especially strong woman you are biggrin.gifhappy2.gif Just want you to know - we are all here to help you through this rough patch of sick kitties grphug.gif Somehow we just seem to manage day to day - whatever comes our way agree.gif I am really sorry about this news of sweet darling little Flowerbelle. But she couldn't have a better mommy and daddy and is one lucky girl to have been blessed to find her way into your home and your hearts. I am sure you feel the same way about her too heartpump.gif It sounds to me that so far the information you have on your little angel is all treatable. Stay positive that the radiologist and cardiologist will find nothing serious other than the bronchitis or asthma which is also treatable. I think it is excellent that both a radiologist and cardiologist are going to have a look at the xray biggrin.gif!!! It WILL be alright alright.gifagree.gif

Thanks for the link on the Dang Gui Cong Rong (I had to copy and paste that name laughing02.gif) It almost sounds like " Dang Girl, Gone Wrong" in english flail.gif or some fancy chinese fruity drink bluelaugh.gif Anyway - I think that absolutely could be of a benefit for another cat experiencing the same problem with "motility".

Loads and loads of vibes flowing to you tonight..... sigh.gif Just so much all at once sigh.gif Hang in there, sweetie - like you always do:heart3:. It is a lot all at once when one or more of our babies gets sick at the same time - it is not easy by any stretch of the word..
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post #5 of 59
Poor Flowerbelle! vibes.gif
post #6 of 59
Good health vibes for flowerbelle.
post #7 of 59
Thread Starter 
Thank you. hugs.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Feralvr View Post

Thanks for the link on the Dang Gui Cong Rong (I had to copy and paste that name laughing02.gif) It almost sounds like " Dang Girl, Gone Wrong" in english flail.gif

flail.gif Oh that had me laughing! It was so funny at the hospital today - they throw these complicated sounding herbal formula names around like nothing. Obviously they use them all the time. But each time Doc went to say the name of it, she tripped up. It's a real tongue twister, and Gary was making fun of her. Same thing happened at check out when the receptionist was asking me if I had the Dang Kwi, um Dang Gui.. the medication? flail.gif She said she can usually pronounce the names, but that one's tough to say.

Dr. Cheng is going to get a REAL kick out of the "Dang Girl, Gone Wrong" clap.gifflail.gifclap.gif
post #8 of 59
Lots of vibes.gif for Flowerbelle. FWIW, Jamie never had a heart murmur despite having HCM. His heart sounded normal right up till he went into congestive heart failure.
post #9 of 59
Quote:
Most vets would prescribe miralax for the problem. We are treating her with the chinese herbal treatment she recommended for Flowerbelle, Dang Gui Cong Rong (found this, for anyone interested: http://books.google.com/books?id=2ut1Cvgj9pYC&pg=PA523&lpg=PA523&dq=Dang+gui+cong+rong&source=bl&ots=HClhy06llh&sig=XhH6l9Fdr8IE69L-JLd_UudPtpw&hl=en&ei=-4rWTqHgEojk0QHkobHaCQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CDMQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Dang%20gui%20cong%20rong&f=false). This formulation is powdered capsules (cute little ones LOL). I am not to supplement her with fiber or anything, it won't be necessary with this treatment. This should not only improve her "dry" poop, but resolve the megacolon, AND resolve the hairball problem going forward.

Laurie, I forgot to talk to you about this.... today..... My vet had spoken to me about this type of constipation, as it is just what Lucky has..... Her poop is dry, and it looks old, when it is bad. When she got blocked, it was awful - the piecesthat came out of her looked like an old witch's nose, or a dry tree branch... dry and ugly (not that poop is cute, but you know what I mean laughing02.gif)
Anyways - psyllium Fiber, like metamucil is a no-no for Lucky, as it sucks out water from the gut, drying up the poop even more, and it can get stuck in the folds of their digestive system and increase the constipation, megacolon and you risk blockage.
However - Pumpkin...... ah we love pumpkin LOL - Pumpkin is safe. The type of fiber and the amount of moisture on pumpkin helps with motility, preventing constipation, and does not offer risks of drying up, blockage, etc etc etc..... Oh, good source of fiber for hairballs too, helping to move them out wink.gif
Just wanted to let you know..... if she needs an extra push laughing02.gif
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hugs.gif for the most wonderful meowmy of them all!!
post #10 of 59

hugs.gif Laurie. Lots of good vibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifcoming for Flowerbelle. Hopefully you can get her sorted out quickly. Cotton had a heart murmur most of the time we had him but nothing ever came of it.

post #11 of 59
Thread Starter 
Tricia, I didn't know (remember?) that. I'm sorry. heartpump.gif Good to know, and interesting. I'm assuming because of her enlarged heart the recommendation will be to take her to the cardiologist.

Carolina, thank you as always! I remember Lucky's problem, but didn't realize it's the same thing! Actually, it was specifically about pumpkin that I asked. And she said it wouldn't hurt, but isn't necessary. That was a relief, because Flowerbelle won't eat food with pumpkin mixed into it. If it would help and the additional benefit was "worth" the stress on her, of course I would syringe her, just as I would for any required medication, I'd get it into her lol.

But she is little, struggles, and stresses. I can get pills into her without too much stress. But the vet felt the benefit of pumpkin wouldn't be worth the trade-off of the stress given this course of treatment. smile.gif. With miralax, she recommends it, but apparently this works differently enough. agree.gif If Flowerbelle would just eat it, she'd be on it LOL.

hugs.gifsmile.gif
post #12 of 59
Eightball appeared to have a heart murmur when we took him to the vet, then when they would sedate him and listen to it, the murmur would go away. The stress to the vet alone can cause what sounds to be a murmur. But realize that Eightball was the cat that usually had to be sedated just for a basic exam, as he was absolutely terrified of any situation other than being home alone with me.

Sending mega vibes that you get to the bottom of this quickly and its easy to manage!!

vibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gif
post #13 of 59
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms. Freya View Post

hugs.gif Laurie. Lots of good vibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gif coming for Flowerbelle. Hopefully you can get her sorted out quickly. Cotton had a heart murmur most of the time we had him but nothing ever came of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momofmany View Post

Eightball appeared to have a heart murmur when we took him to the vet, then when they would sedate him and listen to it, the murmur would go away. The stress to the vet alone can cause what sounds to be a murmur. But realize that Eightball was the cat that usually had to be sedated just for a basic exam, as he was absolutely terrified of any situation other than being home alone with me.
Sending mega vibes that you get to the bottom of this quickly and its easy to manage!!
vibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gif

Yes, and we've discussed the "stress murmur" possibility. agree.gif But in her 8 years, a "stress murmur" just from the trip to the vet has never before been detected. That's why we opted for the xray, which indicates her heart is enlarged. It may still not mean anything - or may not mean there's a cardiac problem. We did bloodwork, and should have those results today. Tuxie had an enlarged heart from the prolonged struggle with anemia, but once that was resolved, his heart went back to a normal size after some time. agree.gif With Flowerbelle, we'll just have to see as results/reports/recommendations come in.

hugs.gifhugs.gifhugs.gif
post #14 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDG View Post

Thank you. hugs.gif
flail.gif Oh that had me laughing! It was so funny at the hospital today - they throw these complicated sounding herbal formula names around like nothing. Obviously they use them all the time. But each time Doc went to say the name of it, she tripped up. It's a real tongue twister, and Gary was making fun of her. Same thing happened at check out when the receptionist was asking me if I had the Dang Kwi, um Dang Gui.. the medication? flail.gif She said she can usually pronounce the names, but that one's tough to say.
Dr. Cheng is going to get a REAL kick out of the "Dang Girl, Gone Wrong" clap.gifflail.gifclap.gif

I am glad you got a laugh out of it. It is a tongue twister for sure but now we won't forget it, will we! flail.gif

vibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gif For beautiful Flowerbelle's blood test results today cross.gif And hoping you get the xray results by tomorrow cross.gifvibes.gifvibes.gif
post #15 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDG View Post

Yes, and we've discussed the "stress murmur" possibility. agree.gif But in her 8 years, a "stress murmur" just from the trip to the vet has never before been detected. That's why we opted for the xray, which indicates her heart is enlarged. It may still not mean anything - or may not mean there's a cardiac problem. We did bloodwork, and should have those results today. Tuxie had an enlarged heart from the prolonged struggle with anemia, but once that was resolved, his heart went back to a normal size after some time. agree.gif With Flowerbelle, we'll just have to see as results/reports/recommendations come in.
hugs.gifhugs.gifhugs.gif

Eightball didn't get the stress murmur until he was older (over 10). His heart also looked enlarged with the xray (which also didn't amount to anything). His blood work also kept coming back normal. He and Flowerbelle share one thing in common - they both had rough starts in life. I've had vets tell me that while this doesn't always affect their long term health, if a cat is genetically predisposed to having health problems, a bad start can hurt them in the long run.

I know, wait for the results of her tests. Hopefully this won't be an allusive problem. These are the times that you wish they could talk.

Poor little sweetie pie!!
post #16 of 59
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momofmany View Post

Eightball didn't get the stress murmur until he was older (over 10). His heart also looked enlarged with the xray (which also didn't amount to anything). His blood work also kept coming back normal. He and Flowerbelle share one thing in common - they both had rough starts in life. I've had vets tell me that while this doesn't always affect their long term health, if a cat is genetically predisposed to having health problems, a bad start can hurt them in the long run.
I know, wait for the results of her tests. Hopefully this won't be an allusive problem. These are the times that you wish they could talk.
Poor little sweetie pie!!

Amy, thanks for the further info. hugs.gif That's really good to know!!!! If they recommend a cardiologist, even if we pay for the diagnostics and it turns out not to be anything, we'll be a bit poorer in exchange for peace of mind. laughing02.gif And it'll be good to have the xray for baseline comparison. Right now we're really happy we've got the one from a couple years ago!
post #17 of 59

Just sending vibes and hugs to you!  vibes.gif  hugs.gif vibes.gif hugs.gif

post #18 of 59
Thread Starter 
Good news: blood work all normal! Leukocytes (white blood cells) at the low end. But as she's not FeLV+, this could likely be from infection (bronchitis) it it's been going on for a little while. frown.gif (Bad mommy and daddy!)

More good news: Not one single cough today. Doc says the convenia really can work that quickly because as an IM shot, it goes to work pretty much right away.

The bad news: Doc has a long weekend and isn't back until Tuesday. If reports come in and there's bad news, someone will call her and she'll call us. Otherwise we won't hear from her until Tuesday.

So from now until Tuesday... no news is good news. laughing02.gif

Thanks for the support, hugs and vibes!
post #19 of 59
cross.gifcross.gifcross.gif FOR NO NEWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif Excellent about the bloodwork happy2.gif and no cough today clap.gifclap.gif Another YAY jumping.gif Keep feeling better, beautiful Flowerbelle heart-on.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gif
post #20 of 59

Hi Laurie:

 

I'm sorry Flowerbelle is sick, that girl has been through so much, I'm sending all the vibes I canvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gif

Thank God the bloodwork was good, yes!  that is great news, I hope the other results are good too, I will pray for that.  She is in the best hands and I know she will be just fine:) 

post #21 of 59

I'm glad you got some good news today.  clap.gif  I'm praying you will get more good news soon!!!

post #22 of 59
Thread Starter 
Well. Flowerbelle reguritated her wet food yesterday and again this morning. frown.gif As her xray showed her small intestine had a lot of ... stuff ... in it, I decided to start her on pumpkin.

We had to work on that, as she won't eat it mixed into food. She is hard to medicate, and using the syringe didn't exactly work at first LOL. So out came the cat bag. Well THAT was a bust. She thrashed around SO MUCH I thought she was going to give herself a concussion, so I released her as quickly as I could. I put a few pieces of kibble down and she immediately started purring LOL. So we worked out an agreement. I would syringe 1ml (of a/d mixed with pumpkin), and she'd get a piece of kibble. I only got a teaspoon of pumpkin into her last night - most of it had wound up on the floor, bathroom wall or cabinet. laughing02.gif I didn't want to stress her any more.

But she remembered our "deal" this morning, and I was able to get a little more than a full tablespoon into her, alternating the syringe with letting her eat a piece or two of kibble. smile.gif

I'll probably give her some more tonight, as we're not yet doing the poop dance..... cross.gif
post #23 of 59
vibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifvibes.gifcross.gif to get some more pumpkin into our little sweetie, Flowerbelle. Poor little sweetie, I wish it could also be easier for you. I hope Flowerbelle begins to realize that this must be done and give in a bit. AWWWWW she is just so cute and I know this is hard on you to have to do this to her hugs.gifhugs.gifhugs.gif It is much harder having to get these "medicines" in our babies when they stress so over it being done frown.gif.

Doing the POOP dance!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! biggrin.gif And I think the blobs do a better job of the "pooping" dance bounce.gifblobyellow.gifjump2.gifblobturq.gifblobpink.gif Hope to hear you have poop very soon cross.gif
post #24 of 59

just checking in to see if we're doing the "poop dance" yet.  Maybe you're so busy cleaning it up you don't have time to post!! laughing02.gif

post #25 of 59
Thread Starter 
flail.gif There was only one poop this morning! I don't know if it was hers... there was a lot of hair in it. dontknow.gif She hasn't pooped yet today though. We were out and about, but I know this because there wasn't any poop to clean out of the box yet. laughing02.gif I gave her more pumpking this morning. We'll just have to see what happens. cross.giflaughing02.gif
post #26 of 59
Well somebody did that hairy poop flail.gif Let.s just hope it was Miss Flowerbelle's. One way to know, upon closer inspection, was the hair in the poop white? confused.gifflail.gif

Seriously, I worry about your furbabies so much heartpump.gif and sending cyber hugs.gif for you and rub.gif all around for the kids heartpump.gif. biggrin.gif
post #27 of 59

Here's hoping the poop patrol found what it was looking for!  ;-}

 

AC

post #28 of 59
Thread Starter 
banana1.gifbanana2.gifbanana1.gif Flowerbelle was very obliging, and was pooping as we walked in this afternoon. laughing02.gifclap.gifclap.gifclap.gif I think I'll just keep her on maintenance pumpkin for a while. She's not thrilled about the syringe, but with the kibble treats, doesn't fight it (in fact, I don't have to do any cleaning up any more, as it all gets into her!).

And.... so far no news, so I hope Doc was right and that means good news. cross.giflaughing02.gif
post #29 of 59
clap.gif for Flowerbelle!
post #30 of 59

Way to go Flowerbelle!  highfive.gif  We're doing the "poop dance" now dance.gif

 

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