Working in a vet's office and dealing with declawing

I'm currently enrolled in a vet assistant program with plans to go on to a vet tech training. Part of the assistant training is to do 80 hours of clinical at a vet office and during my first day at the clinic I'm assigned to I had to assist in a declawing of a poor little 4 months old. I didn't really have much choice and refusing or speaking up wouldn't have changed anything for the poor kitten. It really hurt my heart to see him laying there with his mutilated paws, in pain just because some selfish human thinks it's convenient.

I realize that working in a vet clinic this will likely come up again and I'm not quite sure how to handle it. Where I am now there isn't much I can do or say and I will just have to keep my mouth shut and do as I'm told. But as a working vet assistant or vet tech in the future I would hate myself if I was an active participant to paw mutilation.
I would of course prefer to work at a place that didn't do declawings but that may not be an option. I could really use some advice here on how to handle the issue as an employee. What would you do? Would it be out of line to educate a cat owner who wants to have their cat declawed about what the procedure is, that there are options and that the cat would be happier and healthier with his claws? Or would that be a stupid thing to do since the vet office probably wants the business and influencing an owner not to declaw their cat could cause the clinic to lose out on income?

I'd love to hear from those who works in vets offices. Any advice would be very appreciated.

Thanks

I have seen a declaw done(ugh). Vet would do anything asked if money was there. I also took care of a nasty cat who was 4 paw declaw.

I can only say look for a vet who avoids it or at minimum will not endorse it as part of the neutering/spay package. Vet I use now will do it but its not a check this box/no questions asked-they advise you of what happens and the risks(asked them early on to see the response) Maybe an anti declaw sticker on your car will be seen. I see educating anyone as a way to get in trouble as if someones mind is made up on it they may give you issue.

Also another thought get a local friend to call up and ask about getting her kitten declawed to get a true feel for the policy.

I hear you on that. Being an rvt for many years now, plus working clinics as assistants, kennel helpers ect since I was 16, I've seen the good and bad of many clinics. I've even left clinics where our differences were too much and I couldn't deal with it( stuff that I thought was unethical, or money grubbing.)
I also worked for a good, honest vet that also did ear crops and declawing. Now we were against both and he would a lot of times try and talk a client out of it, but there are some that can't be talked out. We figured since we did the procedures properly aka not a hack job like down the street, we could help save the animal from. Being disfigured or in worse pain. You see, if a client is determined to have the procedure done, they are going to get it done. If we don't do it, they will go down the street and have it done. We did many repairs from botched ear crops and declaws, from them. There was even a dog that had two inch difference on his ears. It was terrible, but we got so the poor dog looked decent so to speak, but not after it had to suffer twice the surgery.
Don't get wrong, I am as against these needless surgeries as I could possibly be, but if they are going to be performed, they might as well be done right under a professional setting. (there were even breeders performing their own crops!) I have talked many clients out of these surgeries as had my boss. We even did free required consultations before scheduling the surgery so that we could lay out the risks and alternatives to them. If they were outlawed alltogether, that would be great, but until then, there is always the vet down the street.
Being a vet tech isn't all fun and games, I'll be the first to tell you. It is good to get the experience now so you can see the good and the bad. Even in the best clinic in the world, you are still going to see stuff that is sad and painful to watch. There are going to be patients that can't be saved no matter how hard you try. There are going to be ignorant clients that bring in a patient on deaths door because they didn't notice signs sooner or didn't care. Your are going to see the family that would love to save that member of their family but can barely put food on the table let alone pay for the thousand dollar life saving surgery. They choose euthanasia instead, even though it is a savable case. You will see cruelty and neglect and even gross stuff,( maggots are my kryptonite, I always pass those on to the tech with the stronger stomach). Counteract that with all the good things you will see. The hit by car that was a sure goner, but with quick thinking and support, you personally were able to stabilize and save it's life. The c section that you assist in and rub those puppies til you hear the first squeaks of life. The clients that become like family and you care for their pets from puppy or kitten hood all the way to senior stage. All the pets that you can personally save is worth it. I love being able to educate an owner on better foods, dental hygiene ect.

I guess my point is that being a vet tech isn't all fun and games and you are going to see a lot of unpleasant stuff, declaws and ear crops included, but you are going to see and experience a lot of good and fun stuff. Not everyone can do it, but stick with and you might be surprised. Also ask the vet their reasoning for doing declaws. Hopefully they will have a good and reasonable answer, if not don't be afraid to professionally and reasonable state your opinion and suggestions. I have changed my bosses view on lots of things through doing just that. We changed our declawed protocol by giving a better pain killer before the procedure rather than after. Helps a lot. I've changed our whole megacolon kitty protocol due to my research and experience in owning a megacolon kitty. I've also convinced him to recommend better foods instead of just science diet. By having open communication and respect for each other, I believe a lot of good stuff can happen. Closed communication or starting the holier than thou stuff doesn't get much done( we had a tech that always questioned the drs way of doing things) needless to say she is gone. Well I have written a ton, but feel free to ask questions about being a vet tech and such. Also dont be afraid to ask your boss questions. In my experience they love an inquisitive tech that wants to know why she is doing a certain procedure, not just how. Hope that helps.

Becky

Onychectomy is legal in the States and up to 25% of domestic cats are declawed. Without sounding harsh, if you have a real problem with it then you have three options.

1. Find and work for a vet that refuses to perform the procedure except on medical benefit grounds. They do exist, but these are tough times and fewer vets are turning down work these days even though the trend in america is to catch up with the UK and euprope in banning it.

2. Get over your squeamishness and ethical issues about and recognise that it's a reality of the industry. Wait until you put to sleep a perfectly healthy and happy cat because the owners doesn't want it anymore, or is moving house and woudl rather see it dead than rehomed. Trust me, you want to punch someone in the face. There's a reason i have a house full of animals...

3. Seriously consider whether the industry is for you. Veterinary work is tough, and nasty. You'll see the very worst in animal cruelty. However, for what its worth, the times when you have a good day and save something, or rescue something from someone who doesn't deserve a pet, far outweighs the days when you have to swallow your ethical issues and do something you personally disagree with. And take comfort from the fact that the world-wide trend is to ban this practice.

I have a simple stance on declawing. It's illegal in the UK. Personally, I think its disgusting. It's a symptom of human laziness to direct the cat to scratch something appropriate, like a post. Like so much in our world, the animal suffers not through necessity, but rather through human laziness.

But then I think killing an animal because you don't want it any more is disgusting as well, and that's part of the reality of veterinary work. My wife comes home very upset some days, but some days she comes home glowing. That's what makes it all worthwhile.

I could not have said it any better then Garth. I just want to add four points.

One, I am a veterinarian technician. I have seen the procedure done thousands of times. I think laser-dewclaw is the best way to declaw. But I think any declaw done by a veterinarian is acceptable, if the owner wants the procedure done.

Part of living in the USA, as far as I am concerned is having the RIGHT to declaw your animal. That does not mean everyone needs to or wants to do it. But we should be allowed to do so legally.

Next is I have worked in no kill shelters across the USA. I have seen way too many cats given away for clawing furniture. I would much rather see the cat kept in his/her home and declawed.

Lastly, I own an F3 Savannah cat. While he is not declawed, I very much wish he was. Since clipping his claws is "circus act".

It's all part of the industry that you're choosing to work in, unfortunately.

Regarding talking clients out of it - unless you have permission from your employer to talk to them about that, you can seriously risk losing your job over it.

that is awful, if I were you I would feel the same way. I don't know what to tell you. All I know is I hate even the idea of declawing, in my humble opinion it should be ilegal.

Originally Posted by Cat Person

Part of living in the USA, as far as I am concerned is having the RIGHT to declaw your animal. That does not mean everyone needs to or wants to do it. But we should be allowed to do so legally.

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And what "Right" is that?? You see, my problem with the "good ol USA" is this outrageous attitude of entitlement that so many Americans embody, i.e., we all have the RIGHT to do anything, as long as it's not illegal. People only have the RIGHT to declaw because animals have NO RIGHTS in the USA. They are considered "property". I think that the law is perverted in that regard, and needs to be changed. Believe me; many are working on it. It's sad that you approve of this legality, and also work in the field.

As far as the OP is concerned, I agree with most of what's been said here. It is extremely painful to watch animal suffering, but it has to come with the territory. Hold on to your values and you will ultimately do great good for the creatures you love, and you will also be an ambassador for those values by helping us humans to understand more.

Good luck to you.

Originally Posted by Presto

And what "Right" is that?? You see, my problem with the "good ol USA" is this outrageous attitude of entitlement that so many Americans embody, i.e., we all have the RIGHT to do anything, as long as it's not illegal. People only have the RIGHT to declaw because animals have NO RIGHTS in the USA. They are considered "property". I think that the law is perverted in that regard, and needs to be changed. Believe me; many are working on it. It's sad that you approve of this legality, and also work in the field.

As far as the OP is concerned, I agree with most of what's been said here. It is extremely painful to watch animal suffering, but it has to come with the territory. Hold on to your values and you will ultimately do great good for the creatures you love, and you will also be an ambassador for those values by helping us humans to understand more.

Good luck to you.

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I agree. I love America. I think you guys live the most beautiful and exciting country in the world. the culture is dynamic, the scenery is just, well, breathtaking. You have every type of landscape in the world in one country, and every type of weather system. The people are by and large extremely friendly, and extremely welcoming. My wife and i have considered emigrating for several years.

But your animal welfare laws suck. My wife, being a vet, has ethical issues which stop her from practising in the states so, for the moment, in the cold, wet, grey UK we stay. A Uk where we are years behind you in terms of technology, but a UK where declawing is banned, where vets are sworn to protect animal welfare above ALL other considerations, where animal welfare legislation is progressive, and where being cruel to an animal results in some gorilla like me kicking your door down, stomping into your house and removing the animal, whilst you are taken to prison and charged $40,000.

Originally Posted by Gareth

"...a UK where declawing is banned, where vets are sworn to protect animal welfare above ALL other considerations, where animal welfare legislation is progressive, and where being cruel to an animal results in some gorilla like me kicking your door down, stomping into your house and removing the animal, whilst you are taken to prison and charged $40,000."

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Congrats on your Country and on your attitudes! I presume that the foxhunting nonsense has gone by the wayside too. No??

It's a tough position to be in. I've worked in a few different vet clinics, and with the exception of one single vet in one of the clinics who was very adamantly pro-declawing to the point of deriding clients who resisted her pressure to declaw their cats (ugh! She would say all cats were naturally destructive, could not be trained, and if they didn't declaw they'd regret it, and that it was perfectly safe to declaw outdoor cats! Made me so ill.), none of the other vets I worked for had any objection to taking a client education approach to declawing.

I tried to use booking appointments for declaws as an opportunity for client education. I found the most effective approach was a simple open, friendly conversation. Be very careful to avoid coming across as sounding condescending, accusatory, or preachy. I would start by asking why they were interested in the surgery. Many of the clients would simply answer that it was what they thought they were supposed to do, sort of like preventive health care. I took that as an opening to explain that declawing is actually a major surgical procedure usually reserved for cats who were extremely destructive and resistant to training or alternative methods. This usually opened the door to explain training methods and declawing alternatives. I would often refer to educational web sites such as catscratching.com.

For the clients who were opting to declaw because of an existing problem, I would ask if they were interested in learning about other alternatives to surgery. If they were, I would offer information on options such as training and soft paws. One of the clinics where I worked sold and applied soft paws - that was great because we could offer those services and followup with training support.

If the client was dismissive or negative about the idea of training or alternatives, I would courteously drop the subject. Although I felt bad for the cats in those situations, I did want to keep my job, so I always avoided creating tension with a client.

Fortunately, the majority of the times I had the opportunity to offer client education, the cat owners usually decided against declawing. I like to think approaching the issue from a friendly and educational standpoint not only helped to save some cats from the surgery, but also helped to improve relations between the human and cat as they learned to coexist. It did cut down on the number of declaws the clinic performed, but on the other hand I believe that enough of the clients appreciated having someone take the time to explain things and work with them created some more loyal clients, who in turn brought the clinic more business through referrals.

Of course you'll need to feel out each place you work so you don't put your job in jeapordy, and you may find occasionally that time constraints prevent an extended discussion (this is where having some web links handy can help, as long as your boss is OK with it), but if you can make as much of a positive difference as reasonably possible, you should be able to sleep better at night, while remaining employed.

Best wishes to you!

ETA: Most of my time spent in clinics was as a receptionist/tech (not RVT), so while I had more opportunities to head off declaw appointments at the front end, I had less time to discuss training options in detail. I did end up assisting a lot in the back whenever we were short, and had the unfortunate experience of helping with declaws. In your position as an RVT you may find that while you might have a little more opportunity to discuss things in depth with clients as you settle them in rooms, you will probably have less opportunity to head off declaw surgeries before they're booked, unless you bring up training & declawing alternatives at well pet visits (which IMO should be a standard part of well pet visits). So to avoid throwing your vet's schedule off and infuriating everyone by stopping surgeries the day they're booked, perhaps it might be better to openly discuss the subject of declawing with your vet, perhaps to try to see if everyone can get on the same page regarding the clinic's declawing protocol. The vet and staff may decide (hopefully) that it's better for everyone involved if cat owners make a well-informed choice on whether or not to get their cats declawed.

If not, then you may be faced with the difficult choice between assissting frequently with those surgeries & recoveries, or finding alternative employment in a different clinic or even a different field.

Best wishes

Originally Posted by Presto

Congrats on your Country and on your attitudes! I presume that the foxhunting nonsense has gone by the wayside too. No??

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A ban has been in place for several years now. There are still plenty of people who ignore the ban but more and more people are being prosecuted for it every year. It's difficult to get rid of several hundred years of tradition but it'[ll be gone in a generation.

To answer your original question, if your vet hasn't asked you or given you the freedom to discuss this with your clients, you don't. Period. You may love the animals but it is the vet or business owners decision what/how things are discussed with clients. If you object so strongly to the practice, don't get into the vet tech line of work because until it is illegal, you will see them, all the time.

Originally Posted by Gareth

I agree. I love America. I think you guys live the most beautiful and exciting country in the world. the culture is dynamic, the scenery is just, well, breathtaking. You have every type of landscape in the world in one country, and every type of weather system. The people are by and large extremely friendly, and extremely welcoming. My wife and i have considered emigrating for several years.

But your animal welfare laws suck. My wife, being a vet, has ethical issues which stop her from practising in the states so, for the moment, in the cold, wet, grey UK we stay. A Uk where we are years behind you in terms of technology, but a UK where declawing is banned, where vets are sworn to protect animal welfare above ALL other considerations, where animal welfare legislation is progressive, and where being cruel to an animal results in some gorilla like me kicking your door down, stomping into your house and removing the animal, whilst you are taken to prison and charged $40,000.

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I know this isn't related to the OP, but I must say that I agree with this as well. I wish cats weren't considered to be property the way they are. Though I won't go into it... sometimes I wish more people understood how declawing affects cats. To the OP, if it's something you really hate, stand up. I know it might cost you a job. It depends on what is more important to you. I know it must be a hard decision.

I think the appointments to discuss alternatives to the procedure are best. That is what we did at my clinic like I said in the previous post. Alot of times clients didn't know any better on training and such and most people, when given the no frills details of what their pet will endure will try alternatives in the end.
Now a vet that is all about the money and not the pet, and there are alot of those out there, will not try to disuade the client and do the procedure because it is money in. We did free consultations to avoid doing the procedures! In the end though, we did a moderate amount of declaws and earcrops. It is the nature of the industry in the US. I never liked it and never will, but it is apart of my job. As to the euthanizing of a healthy animal, we wouldn't do. If the animal had a valid health problem, or the owner couldn't afford an alternative we would euthanize, but owner surrenders just because they didn't want a pet, we wouldn't allow. In fact my own cat was an owner surrender that we wouldn't put to sleep.
Now all vet clinics operate differently and there are the clinics that will kill perfectly healthy pets, but I chose not to work at those and that is what you have to do. You have to make sure a clinic fits in with your beliefs as much as possible otherwise you aren't going to be happy. being head technician at my clinic helped me change things there alot. I wasn't afraid to voice my opinion, or call the Dr out on a bad move as the patients were my priority. That is how I got better pain meds implemented on certain surgeries, changed protocol on megacolon treatments, better nutrition info for clients ect. This isn't always possible when you are new at a place, but you can always feel things out, alot of clinics are open to new ideas and ways of doing things. Now going to a client and blatently telling them not to declaw their cat, is not your place and could have serious reprocussions, but you should be able to talk to the Dr with out having the same rammifications.

There is a lot of ugliness in the industry and sometimes I think that the bad gets looked over too frequently and the good gets too sugarcoated. The work is hard, back breaking literally at times. I have many injuries, bites, scratches and a bad back but it comes with the job. You will get exposed to stuff like Xrays(there are protections, but there are minute amounts that you will get), chemicals, and zooinotic diseases. You will still clean nasty kennels even as an RVT, (I had one intern that thought that because she was going to be an RVT she didn't have to clean the cage that a dog just vomited in lol. I told her that wasn't so and gently reminded her we all do our fair share of the gruntwork.)The pay isn't nearly enough for what you do, and there are many clinics that will underutilize their techs and you won't use your skills you've learned. Now thankfully I have a great boss that basically let me do everything that my license allows me to do. I draw blood, get urine samples, place catheters, monitor fluids, anesthesia, assist in surgery, extract teeth, suture existing skin wounds ect. It is a fun job and I learn something new everyday, but it isn't easy and the hours are long. Overall the job isn't for everyone and that is why I think all prospective RVT students should work in a clinic before devoting time to getting the education and licensure required for the job. It is good to know what your getting into before you can't back out.

Originally Posted by Kattiekitty

We did free consultations to avoid doing the procedures!

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bravo to your vet!

So true about how hard, dirty, and saddening the work can be.

The vet practice that had the GREAT vet that saved Flowerbelle's life had one of those forms where you check the box to have your cat declawed when you take them in to be spayed/neutered. We scheduled an appointment to talk to the owner of the practice. We told him we understood it's an important revenue generator, but as they charge people for grooming and clipping, why not sell soft paws and charge for putting them on? It's not a one-time revenue, it's every month or so for the cat's life. AND they can sell the nail covers as well as the service of putting them on.

We brought the educational material on alternatives to declaw, and suggested that when people want a declaw, they send or give them the material, and then have them sign a waiver that says they understand the procedure, the pain and problems it may cause their cat, and that they've read the material.

So they still do the procedure, but they now provide educational material beforehand, make people sign something that says they've read the material (and the declaw won't be scheduled for at least a week after the material was sent/given to them).

In your current position, you can't do anything. But in the future, if you want to broach the subject, focusing on the revenue potential of the alternative can be a real tool to help you alter how they handle it.

Originally Posted by Presto

And what "Right" is that?? You see, my problem with the "good ol USA" is this outrageous attitude of entitlement that so many Americans embody, i.e., we all have the RIGHT to do anything, as long as it's not illegal. People only have the RIGHT to declaw because animals have NO RIGHTS in the USA. They are considered "property". I think that the law is perverted in that regard, and needs to be changed. Believe me; many are working on it. It's sad that you approve of this legality, and also work in the field.

....

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Third (or is it fourth?) everything said here. I volunteer at a local rescue shelter and it's disgusting some of the things that people take for granted as their "right".

With power comes responsibility... we, every single one of us, is responsible for the care of those weaker than ourselves. That means we should be protecting them, not twisting their lives for our amusements.

/rant

If I were you, Ziggy'sMom, I would use every opportunity to educate those with whom you have no say (as in the scenario you describe). Ask questions, say, "but I heard..., but I read..., but I thought..." to bring up the negatives associated with declawing. You never know which little seed will bear fruit (sometimes long after you're gone).

Once you're on your own and looking for employment, I would absolutely seek out a vet who shares your point of view. Sure, they aren't in the majority at this time - but their numbers ARE growing, and there are cities and regions in the US banning declawing as the barbaric procedure it is. This is important enough to stand up for.

As the saying goes, "A principle is nothing more than abstract thought, until it costs you something." Or, if you like, what you do is more important than what you say.

Good luck!!!!!!!!!

AC

Thanks to everyone who responded. You all gave me a lot of good info and suggestions.
I do realize that there are a lot of uncomfortable and sad things going on at a vet clinic and that as an employee you will have to put up with some of that. I've been in the rescue "business" for years so I've seen a lot of crap on that end. I think I have a decent idea of what I'm getting into. I also understand that it's like any job - you don't go against the boss. But I'm hoping that if you have a good boss and approach it the right way you can work something out. I would never do anything that I think would tick the boss off unless I didn't care about losing the job. I may be stupid but not that stupid

I really believe, as tuxedokitties mentioned, that a lot of people declaw their cats simply because they think it's something you're supposed to do with a new cat - you have them vaccinated, fixed and declawed. They do it because that's how everyone they know have always done it. Most of these people have any clue that it's a partial amputation and not a simple nail removal like you do on people, that it's extremely painful and that it robs the cat of an important part of who they are. I think that once these people are educated they choose not to declaw. And as mentioned taking the time to educate owners may actually be good for business in the long run.
I recently did a home visit with a couple that was interested in one of our cats. They had another cat that had been declawed at a few months old. It had been offered to them as a part of a neuter package with no information provided. They went for it because declawing is something their family had always done and didn't think anything of it. Well, the poor kitty ended up with an infection and the owners went online to do research. They came across a bunch of info about declawing and were horrified over what they had done to their kitten. They had no idea. On top of feeling really guilty they were also furious with the vet who had not bothered to tell them anything about the cons or alternatives. They felt so betrayed and decided to never go back. Had that vet given all info to the owners and allowed them to make an informed decision he would have kept their business and these people spared no expense on that cat.
This couple is just one example. I have met numerous people who knew nothing about what declawing really is and changed their minds after finding out. Because of this I think that a vet clinic has an ethical obligation to present both pros and cons to owners who are thinking of declawing their cats. Still, I understand that it's up to the vet.