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On-Star Tracking You; Selling Your Info - Even if you Cancel

post #1 of 8
Thread Starter 
So not only is On-Star still tracking everywhere you go and how fast you were driving to get there even if you cancel service, but they will sell that information to third parties.
Quote:
Navigation-and-emergency-services company OnStar is notifying its six million account holders that it will keep a complete accounting of the speed and location of OnStar-equipped vehicles, even for drivers who discontinue monthly service. OnStar began e-mailing customers Monday about its update to the privacy policy, which grants OnStar the right to sell that GPS-derived data
More commonly, this information is apparently sold to traffic monitoring providers and authorities to determine where roads may need expansion and where and when to set up speed traps. In addition, for $150 dollars an hour, OnStar will track your car and hand over all of your information at their disposal to the feds, as long as they get a subpoena or a court order.

According to the company’s privacy policy, they know your name and billing information, how fast you drive, if and when you apply the brakes, whether you’re wearing your seatbelt, oil life, tire pressure, and odometer reading. If your car is on or off, when your fuel is refilled and your vehicle’s location. OnStar can remotely unlock your doors, slow down your car or prevent it from starting altogether. They record and monitor conversations by you or others from your car, but if you ask for copies of your own records, you will find out that “OnStar is not required to release any audio or physical records…without a subpoena (unless otherwise required by law).”

On-Star indicates that the listening feature will not activate without first making an announcement of their intention to do so. However, in 2003, the FBI used the on-board connection to eavesdrop on the vehicle’s occupants via the passive listening feature. When FBI agents remotely activated the system and were listening in, passengers in the vehicle could not tell that their conversations were being monitored. The United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit, in San Francisco didn’t have a problem with the government converting safety and communications system into roaming in-car wiretaps, as long as it didn’t impact the safety features.

Although it hasn't been used as such to date, it could potentially be used to deny warranty repairs or extended warranty, clear auto manufacturers of liability, increase your insurance premiums or find you at fault in an accident, all even without your consent to service.

Not so sure I'm going to be buying a GM vehicle anytime soon, unless there is an easy way to pull a fuse and disable the system.
post #2 of 8
A car salesman told me that a lot of his customers ask for the OnStar to be disabled. Although he didn't say if it's possible to totally remove it or not.

Part of says meh, if they want to listen to me they can. They'll die of boredom. Unless someone's in the Mob, what do they care if strangers listen to them? And at least they'd find me if I was in a crash on a back road, upside-down in the ditch where nobody can see the car from the road. But of course, that kind of invasion of privacy is a slippery slope, so it shouldn't be allowed to get started. I wonder if anyone else will start selling a GPS service without all the nosiness.
post #3 of 8
I'm so not OK with any of it, but assume it's happening. Don't have On-Star, but do have cellphones. We remove the batteries in meetings, just on principal.

Personally, I find the "if they want to listen to me, they can" attitude very dangerous. Why bother having a constitution?
post #4 of 8
I am going to be thinking of this thread every time I am in my BIL's work truck, wondering if someone is listening to me.
post #5 of 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducman69 View Post
In addition, for $150 dollars an hour, OnStar will track your car and hand over all of your information at their disposal to the feds, as long as they get a subpoena or a court order.
Could you elaborate on this part??
post #6 of 8
I wonder if this is just scare mongering.

If not, it's a wonderful reason not to buy North American (says the VW owner).
post #7 of 8
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minka View Post
Could you elaborate on this part??
According to records, that's supposedly what the company charged the government for their tracking services. Perhaps they get a discount now though, since I believe the US and Canadian government's are still the largest stock holders in the company and has government appointed board members.

So, yes, if there is no court order then only anonymous usage data about you will be sold at present without your consent, but basically they are able to modify their privacy policy at any time because it is their equipment whether you pay for the service or not and will not specify how that data is used or who it is sold to. Even if you sell your vehicle, it is the responsibility of the current owner to inform the buyer how GM will be collecting information on them.

http://www.citizenscommitteeforconst...m/cccp_002.htm

http://www.autoblog.com/2011/09/21/g...after-you-uns/

There is an update today though in a press release from GM that they WILL turn off your connection if you specifically request it though:
Quote:
"Of course, if the customer requests us to turn off the two-way connection, we will do as we have always done, and that is honor customers' requests.
However, under a court order, they would likely still just turn the monitoring connection back on on their end.

And for the record, I am not a GM hater, as both of my cars at present are Chevys (Corvette and Impala SS).
post #8 of 8
Thread Starter 
WOOHOO!!!

Thanks to a TON of bad press around the internet spreading like wildfire, GM has scrapped the plan entirely.

Quote:
"We realize that our proposed amendments did not satisfy our subscribers," OnStar President Linda Marshall said in a statement about its change of course. "This is why we are leaving the decision in our customers' hands. We listened, we responded and we hope to maintain the trust of our more than 6 million customers."
So now the only way you will be tracked is if you CHOOSE to opt-in, which is very unlikely.

Thanks also goes to Charles Schumer, who sought to launch an investigation into data security of GM's handling of customer information. See, I like some Democrats, as its not his first foray into consumer protection (he's the guy who also helped fight the credit card companies not obviously disclosing fees and banks "double-dipping" on ATM usage fees).
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