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Does anyone feed whole prey diet?

post #1 of 73
8/24/11 at 6:48am
Thread Starter 
Since many of you are very opinionated about your cats diet I want to know if anyone feeds whole prey to there domestic cats? By whole prey I mean either live or fresh frozen mice, rats, chickens and such food items.

I would imagine Amberthebobcat, the owner of the F1 Savannah Loki (Kali Bengal is the screen name maybe?) might do that type of diet. When I worked with Bobcats, Lynx, Jungle cats and high percentage Jungle cat hybrids that is the diet the cats ate.

But why did this type of diet not catch on with domestic cats? I am not trying to start trouble. Just asking a question.
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post #2 of 73
8/24/11 at 9:52am
Does my cat stealing from a bird nest count? :P

I'm not sure what you mean by 'why didn't it catch on'. You mean, why don't more people feed this kind of diet?
Mostly because most cat owners think of cats as unimportant animals. Dogs get it a lot better; better food, more toys, more accommodation..
Also, the majority of people want quick and easy; they don't want to look at dead animals, chop them up, hear the crunching of bone.
*shrug* :/
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post #3 of 73
8/24/11 at 2:55pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minka View Post
Does my cat stealing from a bird nest count? :P

I'm not sure what you mean by 'why didn't it catch on'. You mean, why don't more people feed this kind of diet?
Mostly because most cat owners think of cats as unimportant animals. Dogs get it a lot better; better food, more toys, more accommodation..
Also, the majority of people want quick and easy; they don't want to look at dead animals, chop them up, hear the crunching of bone.
*shrug* :/
Sure that can count .

Yes that is what I meant by "catching on". I am not always sure people treat dogs better then cats. But I would tend to agree with you for the most part.

The whole prey diet would just require people look at the dead animals at least in my experience. No cutting, listening to bones crunched or chopping needed .
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post #4 of 73
8/24/11 at 5:40pm
From another thread:

While feeding various types of whole prey is the "best" diet from a whole-body perspective, it is also the most difficult for the majority of cat owners. Most of the time, kibble and/or canned fed cats don't recognize the little animals sitting in their dishes as any sort of food and while it's definitely possible to help them come to relish this diet, the effort is time-consuming. In addition, many cat owners are actually animal people and feeding one fur-clad "friend" to another is difficult, especially during the transition process when extraordinary measures (don't ask unless you really want to know) are almost always necessary (this is the reason I do not fed whole prey - I tried and simply could not handle what I had to do before all my cats became aware that what I was offering was actually edible). Finally, most people don't have the resources necessary to raise their own cat food, and purchasing whole prey is more expensive than any other diet I've ever seen.

Trust me, Cat Person, unless you put your kitty on whole prey from the very beginning, or get really, really lucky with your cat, there's a whole lot more to transitioning to whole prey than just laying the mouse down (unfortunately ). I still have over a hundred mice in my cats' freezer that they're never going to eat and that I have no idea of what their final disposition will consist. *sigh*

AC
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post #5 of 73
8/24/11 at 6:41pm
Yeah, I like mice and rats, I've had both as pets, and I don't really think I could feed them to my cats. And I don't know that my cats would know what to do with a dead mouse (other than bat it around a lot and leave it lying somewhere to rot and stink up my house). This is probably why it didn't catch on. And whacking the rats into pieces would definitely be out of the question for me. Plus, a cat would need around 5 mice a day (or so I gather from what little info I could find on that subject). 150 mice a month would be difficult to procure, even if you bred your own that would be a huge breeding operation and expensive.
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post #6 of 73
8/24/11 at 9:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auntie Crazy View Post
Trust me, Cat Person, unless you put your kitty on whole prey from the very beginning, or get really, really lucky with your cat, there's a whole lot more to transitioning to whole prey than just laying the mouse down (unfortunately ). I still have over a hundred mice in my cats' freezer that they're never going to eat and that I have no idea of what their final disposition will consist. *sigh*

AC
If I ever decide to switch to raw, you can send them to me. :P
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post #7 of 73
8/24/11 at 9:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minka View Post
Mostly because most cat owners think of cats as unimportant animals. Dogs get it a lot better; better food, more toys, more accommodation..
I am sorry Minka, but this as a reason to not feed whole pray is IMHO so, so insulting to me as a loving cat owner (and to the majority of TCS, who, as you know, do not feed this diet), and also so far away from the truth.... not even funny.
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post #8 of 73
8/24/11 at 11:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carolina View Post
I am sorry Minka, but this as a reason to not feed whole pray is IMHO so, so insulting to me as a loving cat owner (and to the majority of TCS, who, as you know, do not feed this diet), and also so far away from the truth.... not even funny.
Just to add, and no disrespect meant, dogs don't get whole prey either. It just happens that some dogs will eat anything so it is much easier to feed them such a diet. Dogs that are fed a prey model diet aren't given the whole carcass, in most cases. They get the backs and some wings and the muscle and organs but typically not the whole prey.

I will say that, in general, cats are seen by the general public as more disposable than dogs. It is a sad reality and that is why there are cats running around without a home or are.stuck in shelters. Why.is it that if you look up ads there's always some for free kittens but never for free puppies? I would not say this about most cat owners because the ones I've met and those on this site would do anything for their cats. I am not sure why people consider cats disposable but if I were to guess, maybe because there are so many on the streets, people feel you can get them anywhere and cheap. Also, it is generally more costly to get a dog so maybe people think they are worth more. I certainly don't support this view but I have read about people trying to eliminate this prejudice against our feline friends.

Sorry don't mean to detract from the original topic...
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post #9 of 73
8/24/11 at 11:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SweetPea24 View Post
Just to add, and no disrespect meant, dogs don't get whole prey either. It just happens that some dogs will eat anything so it is much easier to feed them such a diet. Dogs that are fed a prey model diet aren't given the whole carcass, in most cases. They get the backs and some wings and the muscle and organs but typically not the whole prey.

I will say that, in general, cats are seen by the general public as more disposable than dogs. It is a sad reality and that is why there are cats running around without a home or are.stuck in shelters. Why.is it that if you look up ads there's always some for free kittens but never for free puppies? I would not say this about most cat owners because the ones I've met and those on this site would do anything for their cats. I am not sure why people consider cats disposable but if I were to guess, maybe because there are so many on the streets, people feel you can get them anywhere and cheap. Also, it is generally more costly to get a dog so maybe people think they are worth more. I certainly don't support this view but I have read about people trying to eliminate this prejudice against our feline friends.

Sorry don't mean to detract from the original topic...
Certainly, nothing to do why a cat owner would not feed a prey diet - that I can guarantee you. And to hear that simplistic answer as a reason why this diet is not fed, really bothers me.
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post #10 of 73
8/25/11 at 12:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carolina View Post
I am sorry Minka, but this as a reason to not feed whole pray is IMHO so, so insulting to me as a loving cat owner (and to the majority of TCS, who, as you know, do not feed this diet), and also so far away from the truth.... not even funny.
It is the truth though Carolina..
A member of another cat forum will tell you the same. She works in pet store retail and dog owners in general really do put more effort into their dogs than their cats.
You have to realize that for right now, we are the Minority. As sad as it is, it really is the truth...

What I was trying to say was: because the majority of cat owners don't want to/don't care to take the time to look into their cat's diet past grabbing a bag of Friskies, they would never look into raw or ever find out about it, and therefor would never have the chance to feed a whole prey diet. And so, it has not caught on.
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post #11 of 73
8/25/11 at 1:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minka View Post
It is the truth though Carolina..
A member of another cat forum will tell you the same. She works in pet store retail and dog owners in general really do put more effort into their dogs than their cats.
You have to realize that for right now, we are the Minority. As sad as it is, it really is the truth...

What I was trying to say was: because the majority of cat owners don't want to/don't care to take the time to look into their cat's diet past grabbing a bag of Friskies, they would never look into raw or ever find out about it, and therefor would never have the chance to feed a whole prey diet. And so, it has not caught on.
So Minka, why do an owner like us, here on TCS, like me, who will do anythyng for my babies, will not feed this diet? What is your take on it. You have many like me here. I sold pretty much all I had to pay for my Bugsys heathy care (and gracie's), when I was unemployed.. Their wet food today for my trip was $180 plus the dry, another 100... My food was about $30. Their meds was about another 100... Mine, around $80. You see the pattern here? Their food is served and spoon-fed at that, before I have anything to eat. When I didn't health insurance, they had.
Clearly their care and wellbeing comes before mine.
My house is completely modified for them-shelves on the living room, sills, trees, baby gates... Feliway on the walls... This is clearly a cat's house, and I am their loving care taker, rent payer, food provider.
So, in the situation where clearly they ARE my life an I will do EVERYTHING for them, what is your theory for me to no be feeding a whole prey diet?
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post #12 of 73
8/25/11 at 1:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carolina View Post
So Minka, why do an owner like us, here on TCS, like me, who will do anythyng for my babies, will not feed this diet? What is your take on it. You have many like me here. I sold pretty much all I had to pay for my Bugsys heathy care (and gracie's), when I was unemployed.. Their wet food today for my trip was $180 plus the dry, another 100... My food was about $30. Their meds was about another 100... Mine, around $80. You see the pattern here? Their food is served and spoon-fed at that, before I have anything to eat. When I didn't health insurance, they had.
Clearly their care and wellbeing comes before mine.
My house is completely modified for them-shelves on the living room, sills, trees, baby gates... Feliway on the walls... This is clearly a cat's house, and I am their loving care taker, rent payer, food provider.
So, in the situation where clearly they ARE my life an I will do EVERYTHING for them, what is your theory for me to no be feeding a whole prey diet?
The OP asked 'why didn't it catch on?' Since we are the minority here, even if we did All feed whole prey, from the perspective of all cat owners, whole prey still wouldn't be classified as having 'caught on.'

And as for the members here, my second sentence would apply - "Also, the majority of people want quick and easy; they don't want to look at dead animals, chop them up, hear the crunching of bone."


There is no reason to get so angry. I am not questioning your love of cats, nor the love of anyone else here.
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post #13 of 73
8/25/11 at 1:54am
The question of "why not?"- whether that's referring to 'why not let cats outside', 'why not have one litter box per cat plus one', 'why not feed cats raw' or why not anything else - needs to be approached carefully.

There are many reasons why people are caring for their cats as they are. Sometimes they don't know there are options, or that some of those options may be better than their current choices, many times there are financial or other resource constraints, sometimes they're following a veterinarian's advice while caring for an ill, old or otherwise-compromised beloved - if furry - member of their family, and so on... there's no way to even guess all the reasons.

TCS, however, is a subset of the general population - a subset that is particularly concerned with their cats AND has the resources to contribute to online discussions. I don't believe there is a single member on this forum who doesn't love and adore their cat, who doesn't make their cat's care a top priority and who isn't doing the best they can for their cats. Their choices for that care and the reasons for those choices are going to be very different from those of the general population, and that absolutely must be taken into account when discussing any "why not" topic.

In my opinion.

AC
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post #14 of 73
8/25/11 at 5:33am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auntie Crazy View Post
From another thread:

While feeding various types of whole prey is the "best" diet from a whole-body perspective, it is also the most difficult for the majority of cat owners. Most of the time, kibble and/or canned fed cats don't recognize the little animals sitting in their dishes as any sort of food and while it's definitely possible to help them come to relish this diet, the effort is time-consuming. In addition, many cat owners are actually animal people and feeding one fur-clad "friend" to another is difficult, especially during the transition process when extraordinary measures (don't ask unless you really want to know) are almost always necessary (this is the reason I do not fed whole prey - I tried and simply could not handle what I had to do before all my cats became aware that what I was offering was actually edible). Finally, most people don't have the resources necessary to raise their own cat food, and purchasing whole prey is more expensive than any other diet I've ever seen.

Trust me, Cat Person, unless you put your kitty on whole prey from the very beginning, or get really, really lucky with your cat, there's a whole lot more to transitioning to whole prey than just laying the mouse down (unfortunately ). I still have over a hundred mice in my cats' freezer that they're never going to eat and that I have no idea of what their final disposition will consist. *sigh*

AC
I only know three people who did the whole prey diet with there domestic cats. They had no problem changing the cats over to the diet. Now all three cat cases where indoor/outdoor cats. So they knew what mice and such prey animals where for. So I am sure that helped.

Loki my F3 Savannah would like your mice if you care to donate them ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willowy View Post
Yeah, I like mice and rats, I've had both as pets, and I don't really think I could feed them to my cats. And I don't know that my cats would know what to do with a dead mouse (other than bat it around a lot and leave it lying somewhere to rot and stink up my house). This is probably why it didn't catch on. And whacking the rats into pieces would definitely be out of the question for me. Plus, a cat would need around 5 mice a day (or so I gather from what little info I could find on that subject). 150 mice a month would be difficult to procure, even if you bred your own that would be a huge breeding operation and expensive.
The only economical way I could see to feed whole prey is to buy it like people buy for there reptiles or breeding your own feeding supply.
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post #15 of 73
8/25/11 at 6:55am
I feed mice, as far as cost, I breed them for my snake and ferrets so it's not an issue and generally kitty gets them very fresh, however like stated you need quite a few mice if you are using as much of the diet. I use them as one meal of the day or something, usually a couple times a week, depends on how many spares I have, but I wish she would eat more whole prey options, you get the plus of a complete diet, roughage and all. Honestly I would say most cat owners probably aren't comfortable buying cute little micecicles to feed and most cats wouldn't know what to do with it. My cat only started eating them because a few got loose and her prey drive kicked in, took her awhile to be ok with prekilled, thawed mice and can't get her to even try anything else, the ferrets eat whole quail, guinea pigs and rats but she won't touch them so far.
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post #16 of 73
8/25/11 at 9:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auntie Crazy View Post
The question of "why not?"- whether that's referring to 'why not let cats outside', 'why not have one litter box per cat plus one', 'why not feed cats raw' or why not anything else - needs to be approached carefully.

There are many reasons why people are caring for their cats as they are. Sometimes they don't know there are options, or that some of those options may be better than their current choices, many times there are financial or other resource constraints, sometimes they're following a veterinarian's advice while caring for an ill, old or otherwise-compromised beloved - if furry - member of their family, and so on... there's no way to even guess all the reasons.

TCS, however, is a subset of the general population - a subset that is particularly concerned with their cats AND has the resources to contribute to online discussions. I don't believe there is a single member on this forum who doesn't love and adore their cat, who doesn't make their cat's care a top priority and who isn't doing the best they can for their cats. Their choices for that care and the reasons for those choices are going to be very different from those of the general population, and that absolutely must be taken into account when discussing any "why not" topic.

In my opinion.

AC
Thank you AC, I think the answer is far, far more complex then a simple - cat owners don't care enough about their cats to feed like dog owners care about their dogs- type of answer..... That one I won't accept....
I agree wholeheartedly.... There are many reasons... A few of the cited resons by you just here in my home alone!
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post #17 of 73
8/25/11 at 10:24am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingPostal View Post
I feed mice, as far as cost, I breed them for my snake and ferrets so it's not an issue and generally kitty gets them very fresh, however like stated you need quite a few mice if you are using as much of the diet. I use them as one meal of the day or something, usually a couple times a week, depends on how many spares I have, but I wish she would eat more whole prey options, you get the plus of a complete diet, roughage and all. Honestly I would say most cat owners probably aren't comfortable buying cute little micecicles to feed and most cats wouldn't know what to do with it. My cat only started eating them because a few got loose and her prey drive kicked in, took her awhile to be ok with prekilled, thawed mice and can't get her to even try anything else, the ferrets eat whole quail, guinea pigs and rats but she won't touch them so far.
Yes you hit the nail on the head in my opinion regarding the poor cute mouse. I have worked with and breed various reptiles and exotic birds. So I am used to the "predator" and "prey" relationship. But like you said most people are not.

I agree about mice and birds being a complete diet and all the benefits of such diet. Loki my F3 Savannah gets a mouse a day for the past three weeks. He plays with it for about two hours before killing it. He then eats it. Do you feed live quail to the ferrets? I am going to go and get a fresh frozen one and see how it goes . Thank you for the idea .

Before you all jump down my throat the mice are raised to be eaten. Like from a pet store. I am sure many of you are offend. But this is just "nature" and most importantly environmental enrichement if you ask me.
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post #18 of 73
8/25/11 at 12:44pm
My cat never really plays with her mice, but at the same time she doesn't quite grasp how to kill them, she just catches and starts eating, which I'm sure is quite lovely for the mouse but I CO2 some of my feeders and that isn't any faster really. The ferrets prey is all prekilled frozen, except mice sometimes I let my female dispatch them, depends on how many I am euthing that day. They love mice the best but quail is a close second. I just order most of my feeders from rodentpro or haretoday.
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post #19 of 73
8/25/11 at 2:11pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingPostal View Post
My cat never really plays with her mice, but at the same time she doesn't quite grasp how to kill them, she just catches and starts eating, which I'm sure is quite lovely for the mouse but I CO2 some of my feeders and that isn't any faster really. The ferrets prey is all prekilled frozen, except mice sometimes I let my female dispatch them, depends on how many I am euthing that day. They love mice the best but quail is a close second. I just order most of my feeders from rodentpro or haretoday.
I have used rodentpro with great results . I have heard great things about haretoday but never used them. Did you find them to be easy to work with?

Thanks very much .
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post #20 of 73
8/25/11 at 2:33pm
I like hare today, they rock because I can't really get anything for organs locally, just poultry livers so I usually order a bunch of organs, some quail, rabbit, chicken necks, etc, nice because they will do 2-3 day shipping which is a lot cheaper! But organs come in huge frozen hunks so I had my whole fridge full of food while it thawed enough to chop and bag smaller. Prices I find are reasonable except on guinea pigs.
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post #21 of 73
8/25/11 at 2:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingPostal View Post
I like hare today, they rock because I can't really get anything for organs locally, just poultry livers so I usually order a bunch of organs, some quail, rabbit, chicken necks, etc, nice because they will do 2-3 day shipping which is a lot cheaper! But organs come in huge frozen hunks so I had my whole fridge full of food while it thawed enough to chop and bag smaller. Prices I find are reasonable except on guinea pigs.
I've ordered from Hare-Today many times and up until the last shipment, I've been pleased with the quality of the food. This last shipment, however, much of the product contained a lot of fat (meaning the animals were overfed); I'm hoping it was an anomaly, but if not, I might look for a new source of rabbit and poultry hearts.

I always order in 50-pound increments and, yeah, having to work with all that meat at one time was insanely draining. Now, however, I just toss it all into my chest freezer and only (partially) thaw and repackage the products I'm in need of for the upcoming week; MUCH more manageable.

AC
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post #22 of 73
8/25/11 at 4:11pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingPostal View Post
I like hare today, they rock because I can't really get anything for organs locally, just poultry livers so I usually order a bunch of organs, some quail, rabbit, chicken necks, etc, nice because they will do 2-3 day shipping which is a lot cheaper! But organs come in huge frozen hunks so I had my whole fridge full of food while it thawed enough to chop and bag smaller. Prices I find are reasonable except on guinea pigs.
Thank you very much for the information .
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post #23 of 73
8/25/11 at 4:56pm
I usually feed my dogs a whole prey/prey model raw diet.

The main reasons I don't feed my cat raw:
1) She plays with it for too long and frankly I'm not going to sit there and watch her play with a dead mouse to make sure she doesn't lose it
2) It's too expensive around here to find a reliable source for whole prey items - I can readily get mice, but they're still close to $2/mouse. I haven't been able to find anywhere (local) to get chicks, quail, etc. We get rabbits for free (10lb) so I can't justify driving 45 minutes away to pay $6 for a rabbit small enough for my cat.
3) I don't have anywhere to lock her while I feed her raw - we feed the dogs in the bathroom but she won't eat in there if she's locked in. She likes to drag it all over our apartment.

All that being said, we do get her mice as a treat occasionally and she gets chicken hearts/livers when we get them for the dogs.

It seems to be a lot easier and cheaper to feed a dog a whole prey/prey model raw diet because it's easier to get whole prey animals and we can get meat for free or cheap off of hunters and freezer scraps.
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post #24 of 73
8/25/11 at 5:25pm
Having kept rodents as pets for more than a decade..I have unfortunately seen what happens to these animals when other animals do not care to eat them. While I do not argue that whole prey is most definately a better diet, most of us have cats that just cant be bothered because they were not raised to know any better. I know its not a popular opinion, but feeding any feeder animal live is cruel. I have been arrested and have permanent bans in some places because of protesting and whatnot. Im not saying whole prey is bad, live whole prey is just wrong.

Minka, Im sorry but your one freinds anecdotal evidence means nothing in the grand scheme of things. What you see in one place is not really true of the entire country.

I spend a fortune of both the cats and the dog. Our pitbull hapily eats whatever meat is given to her, the cats not so much. Its a work in progress.
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post #25 of 73
8/26/11 at 5:33am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nerdrock View Post
I usually feed my dogs a whole prey/prey model raw diet.

The main reasons I don't feed my cat raw:
1) She plays with it for too long and frankly I'm not going to sit there and watch her play with a dead mouse to make sure she doesn't lose it
2) It's too expensive around here to find a reliable source for whole prey items - I can readily get mice, but they're still close to $2/mouse. I haven't been able to find anywhere (local) to get chicks, quail, etc. We get rabbits for free (10lb) so I can't justify driving 45 minutes away to pay $6 for a rabbit small enough for my cat.
3) I don't have anywhere to lock her while I feed her raw - we feed the dogs in the bathroom but she won't eat in there if she's locked in. She likes to drag it all over our apartment.

All that being said, we do get her mice as a treat occasionally and she gets chicken hearts/livers when we get them for the dogs.

It seems to be a lot easier and cheaper to feed a dog a whole prey/prey model raw diet because it's easier to get whole prey animals and we can get meat for free or cheap off of hunters and freezer scraps.
Thank you for contributing to my post . Yes live mice, rats, and other critters running around the house is NOT good/fun. My DSH Shadow will kill the mice and rats outside and then eat them on my deck . But if the food source escapes they are already outside anyway.

As for the feeder mice that I am feeding to the F3 Savannah I feed them in a small room. I spend my computer time (it is a laptop) in that room now while he plays with and then kills the mouse. Once he kills it he eats it in two bites. He does not drag it all over. But the room is easy cleaning just in case .

Quote:
Originally Posted by anita1216 View Post
Having kept rodents as pets for more than a decade..I have unfortunately seen what happens to these animals when other animals do not care to eat them. While I do not argue that whole prey is most definately a better diet, most of us have cats that just cant be bothered because they were not raised to know any better. I know its not a popular opinion, but feeding any feeder animal live is cruel. I have been arrested and have permanent bans in some places because of protesting and whatnot. Im not saying whole prey is bad, live whole prey is just wrong.

Minka, Im sorry but your one freinds anecdotal evidence means nothing in the grand scheme of things. What you see in one place is not really true of the entire country.

I spend a fortune of both the cats and the dog. Our pitbull hapily eats whatever meat is given to her, the cats not so much. Its a work in progress.
I am a bit confused by what you are saying. So keep that in mind with this response. I know where I live it is NOT ILLEGAL to feed any animal another feeder animal. Like you can feed feeder mice to reptiles/amphibians, cats, fish or any other animal you choose.

Now if you mean it is cruel/immoral to feed live prey to another animal I can understand your point of view. But we will have to agree to disagree .
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post #26 of 73
8/26/11 at 9:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by anita1216 View Post
Having kept rodents as pets for more than a decade..I have unfortunately seen what happens to these animals when other animals do not care to eat them.
They go back in the cage? I guess I don't really see much difference in the end if I give my cat or ferret a live mouse to kill, or if I gas them with a bunch of others first? It's dead and going to be eaten either way. Seems to be cute furry things though, don't hear much uproar over feeder worms, roaches, crickets, fish and lizards. Of course it's similar to the folks who can't handle feeding their precious kitty real meat but kibble for their carnivore is fine, what do they think is in that?
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post #27 of 73
8/26/11 at 9:41am
One thing I forgot to mention before is that when we move to a house we will be raising rabbits and chickens for meat - both for ourselves and out pets. At that point, Leiki (the cat) will probably get more whole prey items.

We will also have an outdoor enclosure/kennel for the dogs (required by law here for breeder's license). Even though we won't be really keeping them in there, that is probably where we will be feeding them. Leiki will be able to come and go from there as she pleases, so we will probably feed her her prey items in there. Then she can carry them around and play with them all she wants.
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post #28 of 73
8/26/11 at 3:02pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingPostal View Post
They go back in the cage? I guess I don't really see much difference in the end if I give my cat or ferret a live mouse to kill, or if I gas them with a bunch of others first? It's dead and going to be eaten either way. Seems to be cute furry things though, don't hear much uproar over feeder worms, roaches, crickets, fish and lizards. Of course it's similar to the folks who can't handle feeding their precious kitty real meat but kibble for their carnivore is fine, what do they think is in that?
I think that was a great post. Thank you for posting. I agree why do people not worry about other "feeder animals"? In my opinion it is because these animals are not "cute".

Quote:
Originally Posted by nerdrock View Post
One thing I forgot to mention before is that when we move to a house we will be raising rabbits and chickens for meat - both for ourselves and out pets. At that point, Leiki (the cat) will probably get more whole prey items.

We will also have an outdoor enclosure/kennel for the dogs (required by law here for breeder's license). Even though we won't be really keeping them in there, that is probably where we will be feeding them. Leiki will be able to come and go from there as she pleases, so we will probably feed her her prey items in there. Then she can carry them around and play with them all she wants.
That sounds like a great idea for Leiki and your home . Again thank you for adding to my thread .
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post #29 of 73
8/26/11 at 3:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingPostal View Post
They go back in the cage? I guess I don't really see much difference in the end if I give my cat or ferret a live mouse to kill, or if I gas them with a bunch of others first? It's dead and going to be eaten either way. Seems to be cute furry things though, don't hear much uproar over feeder worms, roaches, crickets, fish and lizards. Of course it's similar to the folks who can't handle feeding their precious kitty real meat but kibble for their carnivore is fine, what do they think is in that?
Easy there...

Worms, roaches, crickets, fish and lizards all lack the ability to feel either pain OR panic at the level mice, rats, birds, etc. can feel them. Gassing is quicker, less scarier and definitely less painful than being killed by a cat (usually after it's done "playing" for a while). It is simply cruel to deliberately cause a prey animal more pain and fear than is necessary to attend to the needs of your cat.

In addition, you are unnecessarily risking damage to your cat. Rodent bites are notoriously painful, and an untended bite can abscess in no time at all. A cat might even start refusing to eat rodents if it's been bitten hard enough or often enough. Responsible snake owners feed pre-killed mice and rats to prevent risking damage to their snake; should cat owners be any less responsible?

AC
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post #30 of 73
8/28/11 at 4:20pm
Who's to say reptiles and roaches don't feel pain or fear? And if they didn't, why does that make it any more ok to feed your cats crickets than to feed mine mice? They are still a living creature. I have reptiles and I assure you, they get frightened and stressed. I also do gas many of my rodents, did some tonight and doing co2 correctly, my cat could easily eat a couple mice in the time it takes them to die from gassing. She doesn't play with them however and I wouldn't allow her live mice if she did. I only have one ferret who kills mice, because the rest are horrible at all but she is an impressively fast killer biting the spine.
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