Indoor v.s. Indoor/Outdoor Domestic Cats - Page 5

If someone told me their cat was indoor/outdoor and he meowed at the door, I would let him out. . .so if he's an "enclosed-yard-only" kitty they'd better say so .

Well if he goes out to a fenced yard or enclosure, he definitely isn't indoor only!

Dogs love running around outside too, and there is nothing wrong with that, but it needs to be supervised IMO.

It doesn't matter if the dog is a German Shepard or a Chihuahua, we have leash laws because the owner is responsible for the actions of their pet in a social environment where they could be a nuisance on people's private property and for their own safety as well considering the vehicles, mean people, ferals, poisonous plants, worms/fleas, chemical spills/insecticides, etc.

Why this doesn't apply to cats, I don't understand (well it does in many cities by not nation wide). A neighbor may not like cats climbing up his window screens, pooping in his garden, jumping up and scratching his cars, etc. Regardless of the debate on the amount of impact, fact is that cats do hunt for fun, and can harm wildlife. Cars swerving to avoid cats have also been in accidents, and when they aren't able to swerve in time its unfair to subject them to that guilt and remorse most people would feel because someone wouldn't supervise their pets.

So by all means if the cat wants to go outside, then invest in a cat fence or start leash training. Its the same expectation as one has with dogs, and recommended that they go outside every single day, just not by themselves.

Regarding indoor cats being in misery, have you seen vids of Wesley and Buttercup? I'd argue that they don't appear to be depressed.

Indoor cats aren't miserable... or at least Wessie isn't miserable inside. He does prefer to be outdoors however.

And most kids would prefer to have ice cream for dinner. Responsible parents wouldn't let them.

Speaking of accidents....this was a particularly tragic one in April 2007

http://gawker.com/255587/cat-kills-vet

PS:

About Dr. Richards

http://www.vet.cornell.edu/news/articles/Richards.htm

My cat is not a child, and I would not let him out when he is a kitten. Most cats that get run over are kittens who don't know much about the world, cats are different. Also, eating ice cream for dinner is bad for the child's health. Going outside is just allowing the cat to be "vulnerable" to outside dangers. One is knowingly putting the child right in danger, the other there is a chance that something bad will happen. Everyone is in danger, every moment. But we're not going to just put our cats in danger. Do I put my cat in the street? No. I at least try to keep my cat as safe as possible... being outdoors.

This kind of heartbreaking thread, that we see here at our very own Bridge session, is the reason why I would never let my babies outside.
http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/sho...40#post3102440

These are not the exception to the rule unfortunately.... The Bridge forum is full of heartbreaks

As others have said here, I am not saying at all that owners of inside outside kitties don't love their babies... I just love mine way way too much to put let them face some unnecessary and known harm out there....

Unfortunately, this is just wrong. I refer you to an earlier post in this thread: http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/sho...0&postcount=68 The number one cause of death of outdoor cats is trauma due to vehicle collision. The reference is Schmidt et. al 2007. Survival, Fecundity, and Movements of Free-Roaming Cats, Journal of Wildlife Management 71(3):915-919.

And letting a child play outside, unattended, is also knowingly endangering the child.

Sadly, as you're all too familiar, the second cause of mortality of outside cats is being shot. Thank goodness Wessie wasn't killed but.... I just don't get it.

Even if it's an issue of quality of life, I have to agree with Ducman - it's an issue of responsibility when it comes to how our cats are allowed outside.

Which is definitely appreciated, and I don't think anyone would question that you do love your kitty.

Really, while I may not agree I can understand that, and if you lived on an island by yourself, it really wouldn't be anyone else's business. You could also have dogs that ran around free which they would LOVE. I'd wager you live in a decently populated area like most though, and so it would seem a bit selfish IMO.

And as it turns out, Wessie was in danger, which is why he's now kept inside.

Forgive me if I am wrong.... I thought your cat no longer went outside since it was shot? So.... The last sentence no longer applies, does it?

BTW, Shooting is a huge cause of mortality in outside cats. I think, in fact, ranked second to car traumas.....

I'm sorry, but it seems to me like you're contradicting yourself. Letting a cat roam outside IS knowingly putting it in danger. Allowing a cat to be "Vulnerable to outside dangers" IS knowingly putting it in danger. I just believe that we should keep our pets as safe as possible, just like we do with human kids.

I wonder if this sort of thing is ever discussed/debated on dog sites. Probably not, which really makes you wonder...

Being a mom to cats, dogs, and kids - I have to say that letting them go outside without me standing right beside them is something I do for all of the above! Once my human kids reached a certain point of maturity, I allowed them to play outside without me supervising them constantly. We do not live on a street...we live on a farm.

For momma Kitty, I let her outside after her spay healed and she had had her rabies shot. For Percy, I waited until he was neutered and had his rabies shot. Juno has still not been allowed to roam free outside because she is small, un-spayed, and is not old enough for a rabies shot. I am also thinking she fits better indoors and she may just be inside once her cold clears and she poses no danger to my elderly cat.

What I am saying is that it has to be a judgement call. I feel like my outdoor cats are safe outside at this point in their maturity. Just as I do not let my kids sleep in the barn at night, I dont' let my cats either. I call them indoors at night and they sleep in their soft beds with their food and litter box near by.

Let me also say that I have owned indoor cats for the last 14 years. In that 14 years, I almost lost one cat to an accidental ingestion of the tiny stem of a lily. She didn't eat the stem, she bit it. She almost died! I didn't put her outside, I brought the lily unknowingly into her home. Things happen, no matter what. Accidents happen and are unforseen at times. Just like raising kids, you can't control every minute of every day of their lives. You do the best you can - and heck...sometimes you do let them have ice cream for dinner.

Actually, yes. Not as often as on cat sites, since most places have leash laws and those are more easily enforced with dogs (it's much easier to corner and catchpole a dog than a cat), so usually if someone doesn't obey dog leash laws they end up paying big fines and maybe eventually lose their dog. But a lot of people who live in an area with no leash laws do let their dogs run loose. And the discussions are a lot like this one.

And your children know not to bother the neighbors, they don't hunt your neighbor's birds at the birdfeeder they put out, they don't leave dead chipmunks on your neighbor's doorstep. They don't leave footprints on your neighbor's car, they don't scratch your neighbor's car by playing on it, they don't poop in your neighbor's flowerbed, and your children do not pee on your neighbor's home to mark the territory. Your children don't drive your neighbor's indoor cats nuts by being visible outside.

You live on a large farm, you may argue. But what about people in suburban neighborhoods?

In the end, forget the safety issue. You're right - that's a judgment call. But it's irresponsible as a member of the community to let your cat roam free, it's not respectful to your neighbors, and it indicates a lack of concern for the environment. IMO.

I can't speak to someone in a neighborhood but my cat lives on a 60 acre farm. She has never once killed anything. We don't have neighbors.

I think that just as I can't judge your situation, you can't judge mine. And it is not very welcoming here at the forum to be put down for this choice. These cats would be dead had I not brought them here. I love them dearly and I am doing the best I can for them with the restraints that my husband has put on my indoor cat limits.

I was addressing the point, not you specifically, though it came out that way. I simply took the analogy the next step. It could have been in response to anyone.

As discussed before - there are many shades of gray, it's not a black & white issue. I understand there are other considerations, and personally I think what you're doing for the kitties is great. Please don't take the discussion personally. The forum is IMO, afterall, and IMO the issue in many circumstances - obviously not yours as you live on a 60 acre farm - is one that goes beyond just consideration of the safety of our pets.

In discussion of indoor vs outdoor, some people choose safety. Others feel that indoor-only diminishes the quality of a cat's life. Those are judgment calls, and one choice doesn't necessarily mean someone loves their cat any less than another.

But there are many considerations beyond the health and welfare of the cat, and it's one that many people that advocate for outdoor free roaming cats don't or haven't addressed. That was the point.

I see...so this is more of a debate type forum. I guess that makes my opinion that it depends on your situation as to whether or not having indoor/outdoor cats is a good thing.

No hard feelings. Thank you for pointing out the reason for the discussion.

Rebecca

Yup, debate forum! Didn't mean it to sound personal but didn't know how to follow the analogy without the use of "your children." Example only.