Mad mad mad

My sister is in nursing school and today they had to dissect...a CAT. I was veryyy angry then I was angrier when she posted it on Facebook and THEN she texts me the picture on top of it.

I went crazy on her to say the least and so for the past half hour she's been laughing at me and making fun of me for being so upset. I'm childish and it's better a cat than a child. Apparently better a cat than a child molester in jail too. Or a donor that gladly offers up their body at will.

Her excuse is that it was euthanized. So it must be ok. I'm so irate right now, I can't stop crying, and I don't even know what to say to her anymore. It makes me sick to my stomach that someone I'm related to thinks animals are so disposable.

Yes, it sucks that has to be done, but It's done with the hopes that the ends justify the means, and according to most people, they do. Ive heard this kind of stuff, euthanizing animals for learning purposes is also done in vet school. It makes me sick but what has to be done has to be done. I know we don't do this to people, but then again people don't get euthanized daily at shelters due to over population..

Originally Posted by ut0pia

Yes, it sucks that has to be done, but It's done with the hopes that the ends justify the means, and according to most people, they do. Ive heard this kind of stuff, euthanizing animals for learning purposes is also done in vet school. It makes me sick but what has to be done has to be done. I know we don't do this to people, but then again people don't get euthanized daily at shelters due to over population..

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The University here buys (or breeds, not sure which) beagles to practice spay and neuter surgeries on. After these pups are out of surgery and have recovered, they are euthanized to teach that. A local rescue group has stepped up and takes in a lot of the pups to rehome them now, which is good.

Unfortunately, these things have to happen so that we can have the advances in medicine and veterinarians that actually know what they're doing.

I do realize that your sister is in a nursing program that has nothing to do with animals, and I'm not sure why they are using cats. I'm sorry she has dealt with it with you the way you describe.

There's overlaps in parts of the nervous system between cats and humans, and also overlaps between HIV and FIV. I see no reason why a nurse would be studying that - especially, since in my experience, if you mention any ANS problem to most nurses they make the "durr" face at you like you just said something so far over their heads they can't conceivably understand it.

If one really wants to be offended, how about tallying up the numbers of cats that are euthenized in shelters simply from lack of room and no homes? Their deaths don't even serve an ultimate purpose.

To the OP: siblings like to annoy each other. I'm willing to bet your sister does this with other things and takes advantage of you reacting. Once again she proved she could get you worked up.

That part of my anatomy lab was the hardest for me. My lab partner did the "dirty work". I just identified the organs for the tests.

I had a high enough score to completely skip the lab portion of the course but it would have dropped by grade point average to less than a B from an A+ and grades are important to me, especially when my grade for that course was being scrutinized by the school of nursing as a condition for acceptance.

I think your sister is being very cruel to you though. She knows how you feel, yet she continues to taunt you about it. Shame on her!!! Nurses are supposed to be caring and compassionate. She's not being very much of either the way she is behaving towards you.

Originally Posted by RiffxRaff

Or a donor that gladly offers up their body at will.

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Unfortunately, human cadavers are most often not available to nursing students. They are highly prized and "hoarded" by the medical faculty for medical students.

When I was in nursing school I tried so hard to be able to sit in on an autopsy, but was repeatedly refused because I was not a med student.

I wish that the cats that are euthanized at shelters could be put to a good use, like training students.

That said, the local college uses our cats in their vet assistant training course, then does a spay/neuter and guarantees adoption.

Originally Posted by nerdrock

The University here buys (or breeds, not sure which) beagles to practice spay and neuter surgeries on. After these pups are out of surgery and have recovered, they are euthanized to teach that. A local rescue group has stepped up and takes in a lot of the pups to rehome them now, which is good.

Unfortunately, these things have to happen so that we can have the advances in medicine and veterinarians that actually know what they're doing.

I do realize that your sister is in a nursing program that has nothing to do with animals, and I'm not sure why they are using cats. I'm sorry she has dealt with it with you the way you describe.

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The story with the beagles sounds awful I dont understand why it's so important to teach how to euthanize, I thought all they have to do is to know the right amount of chloroform or whatever they use....
When I worked at a biology lab, we used mice and we killed them in a jar with chloroform. It was supposed to be humane, there were rules about it.

I still remember my cat from OT school that I dissected. He was a huge black polydactyl kitty and still had burrs in his fur. I took all them out and got him "fixed up" the best I could before we turned him in at the end of the semester.

RIP Kitty.

Originally Posted by strange_wings

To the OP: siblings like to annoy each other. I'm willing to bet your sister does this with other things and takes advantage of you reacting. Once again she proved she could get you worked up.

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Yepper....sounds like she know exactly how to push your buttons.

Why don't they allow euthanized shelter cats to be dissected?

That is so sad about the beagle puppies....I'm glad that the rescue group came in to try to rehome the little ones.

I understand that this is a way to learn about veterinary medicine to save cats lives, but a nursing student?? I hate to think of the cats that are in those horrible research facilities. To me that is animal abuse and nothing less. I am sure your sister was also pushing your buttons on the matter, but I too would be very upset if my sister did that and sent pictures!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Natalie_ca

I think your sister is being very cruel to you though. She knows how you feel, yet she continues to taunt you about it. Shame on her!!! Nurses are supposed to be caring and compassionate. She's not being very much of either the way she is behaving towards you.

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thats what i told her. i said i am sitting here crying to you about how hurt i am that you would shove this in my face and you cant even back off for ME? if she cant be compassionate toward her own little sister than i sure do feel sorry for her future patients.
the childrens hospital here also uses cats that are alive to teach students how to intubate children..most of the cats die from collapsed wind pipes or internal bleeding.
my sister says i do not deserve an apology and that im being ridiculous. i understand they need to learn somehow and that its "just the way it is", as she puts it, but theres no reason for it to be posted on facebook and then texted to me over and over.

There might be some context that would make the situation easier to digest; do you know if it was a healthy cat? Perhaps it was a cat that was euthanized first for good reason?

For veterinary purposes, no problem. However, I'm not comfortable trading a cat's life for a human's. Or even a gaggle of humans. So I would react in a similar fashion to you.

Either way, your sister sounds like the sort that needs a good slap to the face for her dismissive and callous treatment of you.

she even named him, oliver, to make matters worse btw.
but she said that he lived in a bar and was then euthanized. thats about it.

Originally Posted by ut0pia

The story with the beagles sounds awful

I dont understand why it's so important to teach how to euthanize, I thought all they have to do is to know the right amount of chloroform or whatever they use....
When I worked at a biology lab, we used mice and we killed them in a jar with chloroform. It was supposed to be humane, there were rules about it.

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Euthanasia doesn't always go right, and when it doesn't, it's a lot harder on both the vet and the owners - if they chose to stay with the pet. I do think it's something that's important to practice, but again, not really on healthy animals.

When my old dog was euthanized (4 years ago today actually), he went peacefully. It was about as wonderful as it can be, he was first sedated and then given the injection. We were with him, petting him and talking to him.

When my old cat was euthanized it was horrible. She was diabetic and had had a stroke as well. She was not there at all when we had to do it and her veins were extremely hard to find. He had to try about 4 times to get it in the right place and when he finally did get a vein it almost burst. She fought, despite how sick she was and it took a lot more than it should have for her to finally go.

So if you can imagine, especially from the last example, if a vet that was fresh out of school was performing a euthanasia with no past experience how that might make the owners feel?

Originally Posted by RiffxRaff

thats what i told her. i said i am sitting here crying to you about how hurt i am that you would shove this in my face and you cant even back off for ME? if she cant be compassionate toward her own little sister than i sure do feel sorry for her future patients.

my sister says i do not deserve an apology and that im being ridiculous. i understand they need to learn somehow and that its "just the way it is", as she puts it, but theres no reason for it to be posted on facebook and then texted to me over and over.

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I think your sister is being very cruel to you and if it was me I would change my number and not speak to her. You are being abused and it's NOT okay. It sounds like she was having too much fun with that dissection and it makes me think she is sick in the head for sending you all those pictures and texts. It is obvious she intended to hurt you. If this behavior continues, I would definitely let her go. I "divorced" my dad years ago and it was the best thing I've ever done for myself.

Originally Posted by nerdrock

Euthanasia doesn't always go right, and when it doesn't, it's a lot harder on both the vet and the owners - if they chose to stay with the pet. I do think it's something that's important to practice, but again, not really on healthy animals.

When my old dog was euthanized (4 years ago today actually), he went peacefully. It was about as wonderful as it can be, he was first sedated and then given the injection. We were with him, petting him and talking to him.

When my old cat was euthanized it was horrible. She was diabetic and had had a stroke as well. She was not there at all when we had to do it and her veins were extremely hard to find. He had to try about 4 times to get it in the right place and when he finally did get a vein it almost burst. She fought, despite how sick she was and it took a lot more than it should have for her to finally go.

So if you can imagine, especially from the last example, if a vet that was fresh out of school was performing a euthanasia with no past experience how that might make the owners feel?

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But there has to be a better way to practice it, like maybe with a placebo injection??

A lot of universities accept donated pet cadavers after euthanasia.
I have papers filed for my cats, and dog, so that their medical histories and bodies will go towards teaching.
The universities will use them, volunteer students will memorialize your pet before cremation once they are done, and they return the ashes to you with a letter of thanks, all at their expense.

Originally Posted by ut0pia

But there has to be a better way to practice it, like maybe with a placebo injection??

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As nice as that would be, I don't know that it's possible. Of course, I'm not a vet, vet tech, or anything like that and I haven't been to vet school at all. I do have a cousin that is a farm vet that lives a few hours away, I'll be seeing him next weekend hopefully and will try to ask him.

Personally, I believe CO2 poisoning is more compassionate and easier on the animals - but the risk that it will harm the humans (leaking tank, etc) is so much greater that that's probably why they don't do it. It also wouldn't really allow the owner to be with the pet.

I guess the bottom line is that there's only so much that can be learned from a text book and lectures, the rest needs to be practiced. And good luck finding a real vet clinic that will take you on - one of my friends went through a vet tech program a few years ago and still hasn't graduated because she can't find a clinic that will take her on even though she's willing to work for free just so she can graduate. I asked my own vet about this as I was going to take the vet tech program, all she could say was good luck finding somewhere around here.