TheCatSite.com › Forums › Ferals and Rescue › Caring for Strays and Ferals › The perils of outdoor-feeding
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

The perils of outdoor-feeding

post #1 of 36
Thread Starter 
Hi all - I have a bit of a dilemma with a rogue hedgehog!

3-4 days ago, when I was taking the pans out of one of the Happy Hutches, I noticed some bizarre-looking poop in there. I had a quick squizz at the Internet and basically became pretty convinced that it was hedgehog poop.

I cleaned the straw (and poop) out of that Happy Hutch and have continued to feed in just the one hutch, as Rudi and Little Cow don't seem to have any problems sharing the hutch (as long as they don't see the other going in!). Moreover, I realised that they were giving the 'mystery poop' hutch a wide berth, as if the interloper had 'scented' it in some way.

The last few days I've been having some lovely bonding sessions with Rudi on the back step of the house. This usually involved my sitting on the step with food (and, importantly, special cat milk and treats) near me while Rudi rubs around me, demanding strokes and love before he tucks in to his hard-earned food (dry - Burgess, wet - it depends. They seem to like variety). Anyway, last night I left the remaining food out there when I went to bed and, through my night vision scope, I saw him tucking in with gusto. Tonight, we've had the same routine. Only this time there's no Rudi, just a prickly little chap sat on our back step filling his face!! It's very cute, but it does pose a bit of an issue.

I guess the easy solution is to take all food in at night. But both Rudi (and to a lesser degree, Little Cow) are pretty nocturnal so I'd really rather not upset their routines. In England (and, I'm assuming, elsewhere), having hedgehogs around is considered a sign of a really healthy patch of land and they do wonders for the garden so I'd actually like for the prickly ones to hang around. It's just I'd rather they don't eat the cat food!! Are there ways of handling this, other than the easy solution? I've had two thoughts:

1) lift the boxes up to a decent height....but hedgehogs can climb, I guess?
2) just go with and put extra food out!

You know, this may be why Little Cow in particular seems to do all her feeding during the day!
bests
post #2 of 36
Actually, several members of TCS have hedgehogs as pets and love the little things!

I have no idea if they can climb. Out our way we have a problem with raccoons, skunks, and possums.

I don't know how large their hutch is - but can it accommodate the kind of outdoor patio type table that has a pedestal in the center to support it rather than legs? Because that deters our nocturnal creatures from getting at the food - if you get the right size, they can't jump onto it (but the cats can), and they can't climb it.

This type:



I couldn't find a picture of the best type - one that doesn't have the legs that spread out at the bottom, but drop down into a heavy circle that holds it upright.
post #3 of 36
Or if you're handy, you can just construct a feeding platform on a pole post you support by getting it down into the ground.
post #4 of 36
Thread Starter 
Love the table idea, thanks. No hedgehog could defy gravity!
I wish I were handy - sadly I'm all fingers and thumbs.
Let's see what I can find. And I may devise a special hog hutch too!
Btw - more cat-specific question. I'm guessing lots of people's cats do this. Rudi seems to love 'standing up' on two legs with his eyes closed when he comes in for affection - am assuming this is a good sign? He's still a little temperamental (though no surprise when you consider he's been a stray for so long). Something really spooked him a couple of days back mid-pm : one minute he was in the courtyard all loving, the next I saw him dash off startled. He didn't surface again for 4-5 hours! I was starting to get worried!
post #5 of 36
Lazlo was rescued and moved indoor with us full time when he was about 10 weeks old. He hides for company, and he'll still bolt sometimes when we drop something or have a good sneeze. (Sometimes he'll sleep through it or ignore it, so don't ask me what the difference in the triggering is!).

Two of our 8 stand on their back legs to approach us when we're walking about if they want pets - but this doesn't sound like what you're describing? (And if I lean down, Billy hugs me! ).
post #6 of 36
I have had the same problem with my shelter of late. Although, I took down my winter shelter and just have a feeding station now. But there were racoon (I saw them often) and one possum who were also eating out of the winter shelter. They were pooping in there as well. I had to keep cleaning out poop and it wasn't cat poop. It really irritated me.

I have an old wooden child's swing set in my back yard. Was there when we moved in fifteen years ago. It has a play platform about four feet off the ground. And I have seen my ferals on that platform. My hubby suggested putting the feeding station on that platform! So I am going to move it there tomorrow, but am worried they won't eat for a day or two because the station has been moved again.

For next winter, I plan on buying one of those feral villas and hopefully racoons/possums can't get in there. It really bothered me about the poop in my kitties shelter.

p.s. That is absolutely hilarious about the cats standing on two legs!!! The only cat I have ever do that was Potsie. He would hop on two legs for a milk carton ring, too. Very funny.
post #7 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDG View Post
Two of our 8 stand on their back legs to approach us when we're walking about if they want pets - but this doesn't sound like what you're describing? (And if I lean down, Billy hugs me! ).
AWWWWWWWW I love Billy (and so does Perla)
post #8 of 36
Thread Starter 
thanks for all the advice.
just had a very strange experience with Rudi. I was sat with him on my back door step, having a good old love-in. After about 15 minutes something a little worrying happened:

* he tried to bite me! I saw him open his mouth (not all the way) and make for the hand that wasn't stroking him.
* simultaneously, he clawed/ scratched my leg

Fortunately no damage done - I pulled my hand away in time and had long trousers on (although I can definitely see scratch marks on my leg) ! I'm guessing he was just playing and overstepped the mark/ was a bit rough without realising it. Any ideas?
post #9 of 36
I had a feral at a barn that had that same behavior towards me from time to time. They can get overstimulated/confused by just your presence. And petting causes more of this. Not all of them do this, but some of the males will IMO. Coalman would go for my hand and also go for my leg as I would walk up to feed him. Coal is now in a home environment and never does that behavior anymore at all. I think Rudi is still adjusting to the fact that he now has a human friend and it causes some confusion in his mind still. As time goes on, this behavior will cease. We also had a barn cat named Charlie who was very aggressive just like this to the people he loved which was me and a friend. When someone else would come around, he would bite or scratch as us as to tell us not to socialize with those scary people. I wouldn't worry too much because I am sure Rudi will never meaningly hurt you. You are his family and he was just trying to share his emotion with you and figures you will know what he is trying to tell you
post #10 of 36
Thread Starter 
Thanks, FeralVR. Interesting to know I'm not the first (I somehow guessed I wasn't )
When I got back from work tonight, Rudi bounded up to me in the courtyard as if nothing had happened! He got some petting from me - I just took it a bit easy and stayed standing rather than sitting on the step.
As you say, I know he feels no malice, only exuberance. I'm just guessing he's getting used to his human chum. It's at times like this that I wish he and Little Cow were friends! Indeed, I think LC may be behind this at one remove - and not her fault in any way! By this I mean I've noticed that, if Rudi and me are near the back door/in the courtyard, he gets kind of agiated if I walk towards the barns where she lives to put food in the happy hutch. This shows itself in Rudi being very vocal and cutting across my path as I walk down there - almost as if he's saying 'oh no you don't Mister - you're mine, not hers!' I've a feeling he's one of those cats who really needs to have a playmate to get some of his energy out but is temperamentally in the wrong place at the moment. Maybe, just maybe, he'll let me get him some company one day....
Anyway, I shan't hold it against him. I'm just glad he's bonded with me, even if I will have to keep a close eye on the scratch on my knee!
post #11 of 36
Yes, I had a few scratches on my legs. When I would go feed Coalman at the barn in the mornings, I would walk up to the back barn where I fed. He would come bounding out to me and meet me half-way. As I kept walking, he would sometimes lunge at my leg as to tell me to hurry it up. He did calm down a bit after his neutering, but he just had that tendency outside. In his new home, he hasn't put a paw out of place. Your scratch should be just fine, not to worry. I have had plenty and am still walking around
post #12 of 36
I have had such experience before and I have read that when cat gets too much of good feeling it must release that energy buildup that comes from that good feeling and then closest object is what will suffer, let it be hand or leg.
post #13 of 36
if they haven't been handled by people soon after their birth, kittens grow up to be cats who can get overstimulated by to much petting. They have sensors all over their backbone and these can get very sensitive if you touch to much. They will bite you because they can't handle the sensations they are feeling. It is close to what they feel when they are sexually stimulated.

On the hedgehog front- elevate your food feeder and get pieces of tin to surround the base with. Hedgehogs can climb but not jump- the tin will prevent them from climbing. It isn't the prettiest solution, but it does work. Kind of makes it look like your feeder is wearing a skirt.
post #14 of 36
Thread Starter 
Many thanks, all, for the help. On the hedgehog front, I've not seen any any the past few days. I realised the answer was staring me in the face: the top of the happy hutches! Basically the roof overhangs just enough I reckon to prevent all but the more daredevil hedgehog from getting up there! No more biting/ scratching incidents either.
Sadly, though, am going to have to take Rudi to the vet tomorrow night. When he turned up tonight, one of the poor lads eyes was almost totally closed. The top lid was very puffy. I only saw him quickly this morning and thought it did look slightly strange - but nOthing like tonight. Also looks like he's got a scratch behind his ear. I'm guessing he's been in a scrap. He seems chipper enough, though. So fingers crossed that I can get him into his carrier (step 1) and that all is well with him (step 2 - the big one)
Best to all
post #15 of 36
Well that's a convenient solution!

Vibes for Rudi and getting him into the trap so he can get the medical attention he needs.
post #16 of 36
Best to get Rudi to the vet, eye issues are nothing to ignore. Please let us know how it turns out!! Rudi, Go in the crate like a good boy
post #17 of 36
Thread Starter 
Sadly no luck catching Rudi. Very frustrating. Poor lad's eye still looks swollen but whilst we can pet him as much as we want, the moment we tried to grab him he scooted off. The vets are clearly used to such palavers and have said that, if we get lucky (cos I ain't quitting) then they are open most of sat and Sunday. Could even call a vet in, but I'm not sure that will help. So it might have to be the trap.
Cats, eh?! If only they knew that, every day, they have the capacity to break your heart and bring you joy in equal measure.
Best to all for the weekend from a very frustrated Anglian (region of England, in case unsure!)
post #18 of 36
Oh shoot! I saw you posted and was so hoping....

Ramping up the "be ABLE to get Rudi to the vet!" vibes. !!!!!!

LOL, and studies indicate having a pet REDUCES our stress!
post #19 of 36
I just wanted to say that I have been keeping up with your posts. I too am sending you and Rudi lots of good luck vibes as well as love vibes

Hopefully you will be able to get him to the vet this weekend!!

He sure is a handsome boy and I just loved the pic of him at the gatepost!!

Hope everything goes well!!!

Also sending love for Little Cow too!!!
post #20 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDG View Post
Oh shoot! I saw you posted and was so hoping....

Ramping up the "be ABLE to get Rudi to the vet!" vibes. !!!!!!

LOL, and studies indicate having a pet REDUCES our stress!
Pets reduce our stress level, so they say. I don't think that includes outside feral pets??.

I love LDG's use of RAMPING.... So I am ramping up more vibes as well for Rudi. So sorry he didn't get in that trap. You are doing the best you can
post #21 of 36
Fingers crossed you can catch him. You might want to look at their diet, burgess is quite a poor quality food.
post #22 of 36
Thread Starter 
Hi all - thanks for the good vibes.
1/ still no luck catching Rudi. The good news is that his eye looks loads better. On Thursday/ Friday there were certain angles when it seemed 75% closed. Yesterday and today (in particular) it's almost back to normal. Am still going to get him to the vet, I promise
2/ some more Rudi background. Had some friends over last night, and one of them saw him in the garden and said 'oh that's your cat - I remember seeing him when we were driving away from your BBQ last year'. A bit of calendar checking revealed this was august 2010. So that's now at least 9 months he's been hanging around - and it means 5 months until he started meowing at me and c. 8 before petting. No wonder he's such a bugger to catch ;-)
3/ saw little cow yesterday wandering to her feeding station just outside the courtyard while Rudi was curled under a hedge at the side of the courtyard (his
favourite place these days). So having not had a chat with her for days, I opened the back door and stood on the step for a natter. Understandably Rudi
thought I was talking to him and so came up to see me while little cow
watched on about 25-30 feet away. Rather splendidly, she saw me petting him for a few seconds before he turned in her direction and she bolted. Don't think he saw her - he was too busy purring.
4/ thanks to booktigger for the info on burgess. When I got the ferals (long before the Rudi reveal) I was told they'd only had dry before in the shelter and so to be initially sparing with wet. Long story short, I ended up buying 3 x 20kg bags from the shelter (via cash and carry). There's probably about half of it left! I'll switch when it's done - any recommendations? Good news is that it's the one thing they are unfussy about: Rudi in particular seems to enjoy it over and above wet at the moment. Little cow seems to eat pretty much anything wet I give her as long as it's in gravy, not jelly (I reckon she was born ooooop north) but Rudi will often eschew even decent quality food (Sheba or Felix or la perle, I think it's called) in favour of his dry food. As long, of course, as a couple of treats are mixed into his 'roodifoodi' - an expression he now seems to know
post #23 of 36
RoodiFoodi, . I love kitty nicknames. The more little cow sees you petting on Rudy, the better. Cats learn from watching and that might spark a bit more desire to become friendly with you down the road. I have had no luck at all with Dixie, she reminds me of your little cow. I rarely see Dixie, unless I am peeking out the window. She takes off the second I come out the door. She is so reclusive, smart and savvy and does not want to seem to have any contact with me. Yogi always waits out there for me and I can get about four feet away. he will hiss, but he just stays put. With the warmer temps here now, I am going to try to spend more time outside with him. I would love to have Yogi be like your Rudi, someday.

On Rudi's eye looking better. It truly amazes me that these feral cats are sometimes able to just overcome these issues all on their own without vet assistance. I sure hope it is on the mend and sending more vibes to Rudi
post #24 of 36
Thread Starter 
Thanks, Feralvr. Yep, I reckon Dixie and Little Cow may be long-lost relations!

That said, just had another splendid Rudi/ LC exchange. I'm having to write a report this afternoon (and boo to that - it's gorgeous here, about 22 degrees C/ 70F) and my upstairs office looks out over the courtyard. I saw LC come for grub to her happy hutch and, once she'd had her fill, I popped to the back door to say hello. She was about 35ft away, but she let me come a few steps outside the back door to say hello.
Anyway, I was chatting to her for a couple of minutes and then heard the big lad come a-meowing. So he and I had a couple of minutes of petting whilst she watched us from under the shade of the caravan. This time Rudi definitely saw her and, though he stiffened, he didn't make to chase her. Just as importantly, she didn't scoot off either. Indeed, after watching us for a few minutes she just walked calmly away to her barn.
You know, I reckon they might have had a tiff, she's given him his black eye and he's now gained some respect for her. More (girl) power to her elbow if so! And his eye seems even better, too. So it's been a win-win day on the cat front: now if only I could summon the enthusiasm to write this report....
post #25 of 36
Great news it's healing - sounds like he managed to avoid an infection.

I don't know about brands of food in the UK. I do know that many people feed ferals/outdoor cats poor quality food and they thrive - basically because they supplement that food with what they SHOULD be eating (mice and other little nibblies)! If you want to get them a better quality food, by all means do so. But I also wouldn't fret overly about it.

That said... cats actually require no grains, but they're cheaper protein. A higher quality food will have meat (of some type and in some shape or form) as the first three or four ingredients, and if possible, avoid meat by-products. Avoid stuff with "wheat gluten" up there on the list.
post #26 of 36
I bet you are right. LC might have given Rudi a sock to the eye!!! That's great she is staying and watching you more. BTW, I feed my feral's plain old purina cat chow and friskies canned food. YEP, they get some wet food too. Over the winter I felt is was important. What I am noticing lately since temps are on the rise, is that they are not eating as much as over the winter. I do think they are out hunting rodents and such and have fuller bellies. Over the winter I fed twice a day a.m. and p.m. Lately when I go to feed the p.m. meal the food hasn't been touched. So I might just feed in the a.m. only to see how that goes. I haven't seen two of the regulars at all. Just Yogi and maybe Dixie here and there. They must be enjoying their hunting outings.
post #27 of 36
Glad his eye is looking better. Purina has better ingredients without being too expensive and is rice as the carb. You could also try pets at homes own brand - in silver bags - they have a very good money back guarantee if they don't like it. If they will eat tins butchers classic is a good price and can help with gum issues so might be good in case they aren't catching a lot.
post #28 of 36
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the info and advice

Food: unless they are famished, they don't seem to go for tins. Indeed, at the moment neither has much of a hankering for any wet stuff. I shared a pouch between them first thing this morning along with plenty of dry food, came back this lunchtime and found the wet hadn't been touched but that the dry had a big dent in it. 'Twas the except opposite over the winter

Rudi: well, his eye's fine. But as I was petting him this lunchtime I noticed quite a painful-looking cut/ tear on top of his head. I shall watch him (and the cut) very closely for signs of infection. Given that he' loves being petted, I'd have thought that, if antiseptics of any kind are appropriate (do let me know!!) that I can apply these while I'm tending to him.

I suspect that we have an overnight interloper who is having fisticuffs with Rudi. LC runs from him and so, while she might have bopped him once, I can't see it being an ongoing thing. The other possibility is a fox - but I've been told that foxes tend to shy away from cats as they have an in-built sense of 'ooh, that thing has short claws'. Time to spend an evening outside with the night vision lens.....

bests to all
post #29 of 36
It is possible it could be a feral cat whom you never see!! Some ferals are so very reclusive and you might not see them. Hope Rudi's cut heals up well. You could always clean it with saline (I doubt he will allow it) and put some neosporin on it. But most of the time these scuffs and cuts just heal up on their own.
post #30 of 36
So how have things been going? Any more cuts?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Caring for Strays and Ferals
TheCatSite.com › Forums › Ferals and Rescue › Caring for Strays and Ferals › The perils of outdoor-feeding