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I probably need a slap for allowing this to happen, but ...

post #1 of 28
12/27/10 at 12:28pm
Thread Starter 
... former stray, long hair, fur mats and ..

he won't let me comb him - unless it's his mane, or cheeks, soooo

you can imagine what troubles I have.

Gray is a former stray, FIV, and seems to be overly sensitive to touch. He complains, and maybe a hiss or two, or even a growl, if I try to insist. He's a big guy, too - I just don't want to cross him without being prepared.



(He and his family are now inside 24/7.)

Early this year I took him to the vet for a sanitary shave - the groomer got all the mats out - and, without anesthesia - just a lot of sedatives. Once home, he had been so stressed out that he developed a cold. With each vet visit I now expect him to bring home a cold to everybody else - so, I plan on not going unless his life is in jeopardy - because, then all the cats get sick - so, I've run out of places to separate cats - and this boy is a real stinker!

After the visit, I did my best to comb him, but then one knot began, I started to try and get it out - didn't succeed, then another, then they started having babies - couldn't keep up - soon his whole back will be one giant mat if I don't find a solution.

Problem: not enough knowledge, not the right tools, not enough hands and armor.

I'm scared of using the scissors. I tried baby scissors - has a round tip - but they wouldn't begin to cut that soft fur! Tried another scissor - cuticle - ha! - no dice here, either.

I can't hold him down, and have no one else to help me hold him down - so unless I enjoy emergency rooms, I need some suggestions.

So, are there tools that really work? I saw a comb-like object that had a blade in it - interesting - anyone have one? Here's an example:

http://www.amazon.com/Mars-Coat-Stri...3481007&sr=8-7

Some of these knots seem to include skin (not really, but close).

I need to try, I need to learn how to do this for both our sakes - or else I'll have to expect to take him to the groomer every year - and that will probably mean anesthesia (?) - and another bout with the spreading cold virus.

Got any suggestions or links, or tool ideas?
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post #2 of 28
12/27/10 at 12:50pm
I used to work for a vet before I moved and I did all of their grooms. Between that and having had to take my pets to the vet a LOT I do believe that anesthesia is a a good option, for my cats at least. They get knocked out and don't experience all the stress of being held down, noisy clippers, etc. Other than having him shaved, I'm not aware of any tools that will work to get mats out, and if he's fussy about it there's a good chance you or he will jerk and slip with scissors so like you said, probably not a good idea to try that. Good luck making a descision
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post #3 of 28
12/27/10 at 1:07pm
If you're worried about getting scratched or bit, can you wear a couple long sleeve shirts and some thick rubber dishwashing gloves? The rubber will give you a better grip on Gray, and at least my kitten's claws couldn't penetrate the rubber (not sure how talon-like Gray's claws are). That's the only way I was able to give my kitten a bath without getting maimed.
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post #4 of 28
12/27/10 at 1:09pm
I bought some nice hair cutting scissors for my own hair (snipping split ends when I used to get them) and they have a slightly rounded tip, but they cut so smoothly! I think I got them at Target or Walmart, something like that. I don't remember what brand they are, though. They weren't super cheap but not overly expensive. I'm not sure if something like that would work for you.
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post #5 of 28
12/27/10 at 1:40pm
Buy two things, a large seam ripper and a small one. Use these to work the mats out. They don't pull, you don't run the risk of cutting the cat's skin and they work great. Once the mats are gone, use a Zoom Groom to zip through the hair. No sedatives, no vet visits, no stress.
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post #6 of 28
12/27/10 at 7:14pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hissy View Post
Buy two things, a large seam ripper and a small one. Use these to work the mats out. They don't pull, you don't run the risk of cutting the cat's skin and they work great. Once the mats are gone, use a Zoom Groom to zip through the hair. No sedatives, no vet visits, no stress.
Is this the kind of seam ripper you are talking about?
http://www.havelssewing.com/seam-rip...pro-18950.html
http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-1774517...9_2139_5278604

I didn't realize there were so many kinds. I have some small ones, but really doubt if they'd be able to cut through the mats ??

I found the Zoom Groom at Amazon.

I'm not sure he'll stand still long enough for me to put the ripper into the mat to be able to weaken the mat - but, I'm willing to try anything.

I kinda think if I can get him while he's eating he might be distracted enough to get in a few swipes.
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post #7 of 28
12/27/10 at 7:20pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kara_leigh View Post
I bought some nice hair cutting scissors for my own hair (snipping split ends when I used to get them) and they have a slightly rounded tip, but they cut so smoothly! I think I got them at Target or Walmart, something like that. I don't remember what brand they are, though. They weren't super cheap but not overly expensive. I'm not sure if something like that would work for you.
I'll check out the scissors - I do like the rounded points - the blades look like they may be thin enough to do a more precise cut without cutting hide.
Meanwhile - still leery about using scissors because of the quick action I'll need to be taking like run, cut, run.
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post #8 of 28
12/27/10 at 7:25pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rad65 View Post
If you're worried about getting scratched or bit, can you wear a couple long sleeve shirts and some thick rubber dishwashing gloves? The rubber will give you a better grip on Gray, and at least my kitten's claws couldn't penetrate the rubber (not sure how talon-like Gray's claws are). That's the only way I was able to give my kitten a bath without getting maimed.
I am worried about both those things!

I've got several gloves that have tiny holes in them - so a few claw holes wouldn't matter.

Gray has CLAWS! He's quicker than a flash - and I'm not as quick as I was when I was younger.

And, preparing my arms for battle is a good reminder - looking for my leather coat right now.
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post #9 of 28
12/27/10 at 7:29pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MonaxLisa View Post
I used to work for a vet before I moved and I did all of their grooms. Between that and having had to take my pets to the vet a LOT I do believe that anesthesia is a a good option, for my cats at least. They get knocked out and don't experience all the stress of being held down, noisy clippers, etc. Other than having him shaved, I'm not aware of any tools that will work to get mats out, and if he's fussy about it there's a good chance you or he will jerk and slip with scissors so like you said, probably not a good idea to try that. Good luck making a descision
Yes, if all else fails - this will be what I have to do - the thing is - I MUST learn how to groom him myself because taking him to the vet and putting him under is not what I want to do every year - it can't be good for him, - and, stress reaction is especially something I want to avoid because it has such a ripple effect.
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post #10 of 28
12/28/10 at 7:13am
Have you thought about, or looked into the possibility of a groomer coming to your house? Where I live there are groomers who just work on long haired cats and always come to the clients' homes.

These are probably not available everywhere, but some dog groomers may do cats, too, and make house calls.

I haven't had to use a groomer on my two long-haired cats, yet. But if I do in the future, I'll call the woman who is a "master cat groomer" (with a certification of some kind from some organization). She told me there are only 5 of these in Illinois. She volunteers at the shelter where I volunteer. She takes on the hissy, angry, long-haired cats there (who don't get adopted because of their dispositions) with no qualms at all. She scuffs them and handles them without fear - and they know who is boss. She does a great job.



Robin
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post #11 of 28
12/28/10 at 1:21pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bastetservant View Post
Have you thought about, or looked into the possibility of a groomer coming to your house? Where I live there are groomers who just work on long haired cats and always come to the clients' homes.

These are probably not available everywhere, but some dog groomers may do cats, too, and make house calls.

I haven't had to use a groomer on my two long-haired cats, yet. But if I do in the future, I'll call the woman who is a "master cat groomer" (with a certification of some kind from some organization). She told me there are only 5 of these in Illinois. She volunteers at the shelter where I volunteer. She takes on the hissy, angry, long-haired cats there (who don't get adopted because of their dispositions) with no qualms at all. She scuffs them and handles them without fear - and they know who is boss. She does a great job.



Robin
BOY, Robin!,
that would be THE wonderful solution!!!
I'll research it, ask my vet's groomer about help, and see what happens.

This morning I was trying to get in a few furminator swipes in.
He was purring, while talking sassy to me. I can't figure out if I'm doing good, or if I'm about to cross the line. I'm so confused!
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post #12 of 28
12/28/10 at 1:56pm
Good! I hope you find a groomer who will come to the house.

There are also vets who will come to the house. You can look up American Association of Housecall and Mobile Vets to find them in your area.

I understand perfectly what you are going through. One of mine (also blue - or gray - like yours), Ariel, had to be shaved several times during the 3+ years she was at the shelter because she wouldn't be groomed by a human and she didn't do a good job herself.

I've had her for over a year now, and she is doing much better. She has a mat or two behind her legs (her "pantaloons"), but my vet looked at them a month ago and said they weren't too bad. He'd want to give her anesthesia to cut them out, and he thinks her coat needs to be much worse before that. They did have to knock her out to shave her at the shelter.

I told the master cat groomer, Masako, about this, and she said, "We never have to do that," (regarding give anesthesia to groom cats). So, if I have to, I'll rely on her to handle Ariel. In the mean time, Ariel, who is hypersensitive to touch like your Gray is, gets worked on daily by me to decrease this sensitivity. I pet her every day, even though she squirms away and whines, often. Sometimes she asks to be petted now. I brush her a little (with a wire or pin brush) and comb her a bit. However, she doesn't yet let me near the parts that really need work.

Can you pick up Gray? If so, you are better off than I am with Ariel. I had to hire someone to help get her into a carrier to take her to the vet. And blood was spilled. If you can pet Gray, I think you can work on decreasing his sensitivity to touch and grooming, over time. But these things can take many months, if not years.

Robin
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post #13 of 28
12/28/10 at 3:43pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bastetservant View Post
Good! I hope you find a groomer who will come to the house.

There are also vets who will come to the house. You can look up American Association of Housecall and Mobile Vets to find them in your area.

I understand perfectly what you are going through. One of mine (also blue - or gray - like yours), Ariel, had to be shaved several times during the 3+ years she was at the shelter because she wouldn't be groomed by a human and she didn't do a good job herself.

I've had her for over a year now, and she is doing much better. She has a mat or two behind her legs (her "pantaloons"), but my vet looked at them a month ago and said they weren't too bad. He'd want to give her anesthesia to cut them out, and he thinks her coat needs to be much worse before that. They did have to knock her out to shave her at the shelter.

I told the master cat groomer, Masako, about this, and she said, "We never have to do that," (regarding give anesthesia to groom cats). So, if I have to, I'll rely on her to handle Ariel. In the mean time, Ariel, who is hypersensitive to touch like your Gray is, gets worked on daily by me to decrease this sensitivity. I pet her every day, even though she squirms away and whines, often. Sometimes she asks to be petted now. I brush her a little (with a wire or pin brush) and comb her a bit. However, she doesn't yet let me near the parts that really need work.

Can you pick up Gray? If so, you are better off than I am with Ariel. I had to hire someone to help get her into a carrier to take her to the vet. And blood was spilled. If you can pet Gray, I think you can work on decreasing his sensitivity to touch and grooming, over time. But these things can take many months, if not years.

Robin
Yes, I can pick him up - but for only a brief time.
He walks into the carrier - boy was I surprised the first time he did that for me!

Generally, he loves me. When he first came around the house, and I slowly introduced myself (with food of course) he soon became attached to me. He would come when I called. I originally named him Gray because I didn't want to become attached by giving him a more personal name - ha!

He even ran through a neighbor's sprinklers to come to me when I called - yes, it was meal time.

Once he knew this house as his, and I was in the back yard, he would follow me around the yard like a little puppy.

So, I probably could do more with him, if I just knew cats better, but I realize the potential of getting wounded if I'm not alert, so I'm slow at testing him (or me).

Now that he's inside and I'm in another part of the house and he can't join
me, he calls for me. (We have 3 cat zones. 1 (FeLV) in guest room, 3 in our bedroom, hall & livingroom, and 4 (Gray Family) in the FR, office.)

It's because of Gray that his former feral family is learning to trust us. They watch me doing things with Gray and they seem to want to be scrubbed, and loved on too, but just not ready to trust.

I will continue to work on his sensitivity - I really do see some improvement - I still wonder if the FIV has some influence on his skin sensitivity.
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post #14 of 28
12/29/10 at 7:23am
That's so endearing that he loves you so. I know what you mean about the calling you. My Harlow, who looks a lot like your Gray, calls me a lot, too. He has a chirpy voice - no "meows" at all. What does Gray sound like?

Ariel doesn't love me. I think she thinks I'm relatively OK, as far a people go, and because I feed her. Maybe she loves me as much as she is capable of loving a human, at least at this point. The people from the shelter think it is pretty incredible that she lets me pet her and even comes over to me some days, crying, and asking for pets. And that I can brush/comb her at all. So, who knows? Maybe eventually I'll be able to pick her up and groom her adequately. I do know that cats can and do change a great deal over time.

My other cats love me, though. I try not to take Ariel's feelings personally.

I admire you that you make all the effort it must take to have 3 zones in your house. That's a lot of dedication.

I have no experience with FIV myself in my own cats. However, I interact with several at the shelter where I volunteer each week. They don't seem particularly sensitive to touch. But, I really don't know.

Robin
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post #15 of 28
12/29/10 at 7:31am
If you are still looking for a dematting tool, I bought this one yesterday to remove mats from Gracie, who is also sensitive and skittish...
Alison_joy recommended it to me, and I gotta say, it is GREAT! If you can comb him, you can remove the mats... There is a little amount of pulling involved, but she was not annoyed at all, and the mats come right off. Big or small... Highly recommend it!
I bought it on petsmart - There is a pink one on the cat session, and a blue one on the dog session. They are exactly the same thing, same size, same number of blades, but the blue in the dog session is $2 cheaper, so buy that one. It is really really good!
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post #16 of 28
12/29/10 at 10:59pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bastetservant View Post
That's so endearing that he loves you so. I know what you mean about the calling you. My Harlow, who looks a lot like your Gray, calls me a lot, too. He has a chirpy voice - no "meows" at all. What does Gray sound like?

Ariel doesn't love me. I think she thinks I'm relatively OK, as far a people go, and because I feed her. Maybe she loves me as much as she is capable of loving a human, at least at this point. The people from the shelter think it is pretty incredible that she lets me pet her and even comes over to me some days, crying, and asking for pets. And that I can brush/comb her at all. So, who knows? Maybe eventually I'll be able to pick her up and groom her adequately. I do know that cats can and do change a great deal over time.

My other cats love me, though. I try not to take Ariel's feelings personally.

I admire you that you make all the effort it must take to have 3 zones in your house. That's a lot of dedication.

I have no experience with FIV myself in my own cats. However, I interact with several at the shelter where I volunteer each week. They don't seem particularly sensitive to touch. But, I really don't know.

Robin
Gray's voice:
He has several sounds, he can be soft, and he can be really loud.

When he's calling for me, it's a moaning yowl, I can hear him from any part of the house.

He has a silent meow - he moves his mouth but sound hardly comes out. Usually it's a response to us talking to him, or petting him.

No matter the circumstance, he usually responds to our talking to him, or petting him.

At other times he just talks - maybe to complain about no food, or ?? he's just not a happy camper. Lately I've thought it's because he's in pain from the fur mats - but, I don't know ??

In fact he's calling for me right now - I'm in the office, and he's in the FR - guess he just lost track of me - I always answer him.

He wanted more cookies. I give the Gray family a treat before bed (a very small amount of dry food - now called cookies) while they're eating their treat, I close the cat door to the outside enclosure so they're in for the night.

He's really an interesting study. Thanks for the interest. g
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post #17 of 28
12/29/10 at 11:06pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carolina View Post
If you are still looking for a dematting tool, I bought this one yesterday to remove mats from Gracie, who is also sensitive and skittish...
Alison_joy recommended it to me, and I gotta say, it is GREAT! If you can comb him, you can remove the mats... There is a little amount of pulling involved, but she was not annoyed at all, and the mats come right off. Big or small... Highly recommend it!
I bought it on petsmart - There is a pink one on the cat session, and a blue one on the dog session. They are exactly the same thing, same size, same number of blades, but the blue in the dog session is $2 cheaper, so buy that one. It is really really good!
OoooH. Carolina - that really looks like the Ticket! Thanks for the tip about the pricing.
I was just at Walmart today, and almost picked up a wire comb - but put it back, now, I'm glad I did - I'll get it later.
The rake will help keep the newly forming mats from developing into a bigger problem.
Thanks!
g
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post #18 of 28
1/7/11 at 7:10pm
I found that clipping mats on the cats at the shelter I volunteer at is pretty easy using a pair of claw clippers like these. Just as close to the skin as you can (safely!) and clip the mat off from its root. Depending on how close to the skin it is, there may be a little stump left, but usually you can easily comb that out or at least cut it out with more visibility, since most of it's gone. Sometimes, if it's really big, you have to clip a few times to get through it, but since there's no point, at least you can't really stab the cat; just be careful not to pinch skin!
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post #19 of 28
2/12/11 at 7:15pm
Thread Starter 


I can see a vet visit - for getting the mats removed - in Gray's future.
I've been cutting at the mats, he's beginning to look just awful.

I thought I'd post a picture of his huge paw, just so you'd understand why I'm afraid of trying to force him to comply.

When he climbs up on my desk, I have the scissors ready. His fur is soft, but trying to cut it is something else - it's as tough as wire!

I've tried searching for someone to come in and tangle (no pun intended) with him, but, so far no luck. But will keep searching.

If I do find someone, I think I'll have them sign some sort of disclaimer - I'm not sure if my homeowners' insurance would cover a cat attack.

Okay, here's a pic of his paw on top of my hand:


Understand, this guy knows no fear - he'd fight anything that he thought was a threat.

Even though he loves me, I'm not willing to cross him - I think you'd understand why, too.

Also, do you think that his previous grooming changed the way his fur is? It seems to be more troublesome after the first grooming - maybe its just the weather causing his fur to be more likely to mat???

I'm trying to understand how these long-furred cats would survive as ferals - getting tangled in underbrush, or weeds, etc. ugh.

I know water is a huge NO NO, it will tighten the mats - but I wonder about oil and if it would help keep the fur from matting so easily ??? ... hmmmm.
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post #20 of 28
2/12/11 at 7:21pm
Oh Good Lord, that is the biggest cat paw I have ever seen, and I have seen plenty. I would be afraid too, about crossing him

I used to be a groomer. Don't use scissors on those mats. Cats skin is so very thin and you could accidentally cut his skin. YIKES!!!!! I have clippers and would gently clip the mat, close to the skin to loosen that mat. But, he might not let you get near him with clippers
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post #21 of 28
2/12/11 at 7:40pm
Did you try MA's suggestions for the large and small seam rippers? They're blunt at the front so you don't have to worry about breaking the skin, and they don't pull the fur.....
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post #22 of 28
2/12/11 at 7:41pm
And I forgot to say.... OMG he is HUGE! Gorgeous - but that is one gigantic paw. I wouldn't want to risk it either!
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post #23 of 28
2/12/11 at 8:22pm
Gray is a stunningly beautiful kitty, and you are a saint for all you're doing for him and the others.

Although I have long-haired kitties whose fur needs sanitary cuts and regular attention, they let me snip away any mats that happen to form, so I've no personal advice to offer; I just wanted to give you props for your efforts. I do know matting can be painful and it's so good of you to ensure this gorgeous boy doesn't suffer needlessly.

And, WOW, I seriously believe that's the biggest paw I've ever seen in my LIFE. *gulp*

Good luck in all your feline endeavors!

AC
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post #24 of 28
2/12/11 at 9:10pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDG View Post
Did you try MA's suggestions for the large and small seam rippers? They're blunt at the front so you don't have to worry about breaking the skin, and they don't pull the fur.....
I tried the seam ripper that I have - it may be too small ??, I managed to get it inside a part of the mat, but the ripper just wouldn't pull clean enough - and, as you might suspect, I was getting some sassy warnings from Gray, so I didn't try to do more.

He really doesn't hold still enough for me to direct a point between all the fur strands in order to attempt to pull on the mat.

What ever I do is like "on the run".

I understand that I'm taking a huge risk with scissors - when I cut it's only the top of the mat, and only when I know the vet is available.

However, now that I've received another reminder from Feralvr about the dangers of using scissors, I'll lay off using them.
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post #25 of 28
2/15/11 at 2:29pm
Since he lets you put him in a carrier, why can't you take him to a professional groomer, if you can't find one to come to the house?

And vets will shave cats down, though they may put him out for it. It may the only way with him - and you may have to do it a couple of times a year.

He is quite formidable looking. I, too, have never seen a paw that size, except once. I had neighbors when I was in high school who had an absolutely huge black cat. He weighed something like 30 pounds (my memory may be exaggerating a bit), but he wasn't fat.

My Harlow looks a lot like your Gray, but he's not nearly as big. He doesn't much appreciate my pulling at mats either. And, somehow, he has managed to develop a couple small ones, though I comb him often. I'm going to call a cat groomer who makes house calls. I don't want Harlow to actually bite me (he just threatens at this point when I pull on his mats), and I don't want him to avoid being by me because he is thinking I'm always going to go at them. He leaves ASAP when I start.

Then I have the female DLH Ariel. She won't let me comb her anywhere that mats actually form. So, I'm going to let the groomer deal with her, too.

Robin
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post #26 of 28
6/17/11 at 12:01am
Thread Starter 
Well, we did it. And everything went great. Our vet was able to keep his stress levels down - in fact the groomer was talking to him and loving on him while he was still in his carrier. He actually layed down sideways to let her rub his cheeks - and purring and totally relaxed!

Prior trips were so stressful that he developed a cold after he came back home - the last cold then caused the other 3 to get sick and I didn't want to have to go through this again.

We decided that his fur would be shaved on his back and tummy where the mats were formed, a sanitary cut - leaving his tail, legs, and mane in tact.

Here's our handsome boy:


I do see he has dry skin, will be researching a remedy. He now allows me to touch him all over (still very careful though ), even get some tummy rubs in.

His family didn't even notice his new cut!
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post #27 of 28
6/17/11 at 11:39am
Yay for an easy cut!! (And good boy, Gray!)

AC
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post #28 of 28
6/17/11 at 12:26pm
Ah, a nice, cool, summer cut. How nice he was so good!

Robin
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