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How early can my kittens go outside?They are driving me mental.

post #1 of 33
12/22/10 at 2:45pm
Thread Starter 
My 8 month old boys wake up and jump around my head at about 5am. The easiest thing for me to do would be to put them outside for a couple of hours. Is this ok? will there be foxes outside? They have been really good going outside after 7am and returning home multiple times throughout the day, but im not sure if I should let them out earlier? I would also be interested in knowing what is the lastest time they should be out? And how old do they have to be before I dont have to worry about all this??Many Thanks...a women who needs some peace in the mornings.
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post #2 of 33
12/22/10 at 2:55pm
You shouldn't let your kittens out at night, because they will be more likely to run in front of cars than adult cats, and drivers won't be able to see them. Also, cats won't come when it gets to be dusk, they go crazy. The night is too fun. We waited until Wessie was about a year old before we let him stay out all night.

Hope this helps,

Eileen
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post #3 of 33
12/22/10 at 2:58pm
It really depends on where you are. Here in the US, many people don't let their cats out at all. I live in a neighborhood with lots of foxes, and coyotes. So the former feral goes out only during bright sun. No one else is allowed out. They are not smart enough LOL.
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post #4 of 33
12/22/10 at 3:39pm
Are they neutered? They shouldn't go outside at all unless they are!!!!

I know there are cultural differences in a lot of places, but many of us - around the world - keep our kitties indoor exclusively. With time, they adjust to our schedules, and with sufficient stimulation from us, they don't miss going outside at all.

Others construct outdoor enclosures - some people even have them connected to their homes so the cats can come and go inside and out whenever they please - so they get the benefit of being outside, but without the many risks that come with it.
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post #5 of 33
12/22/10 at 6:37pm
Are they neutered? I assume so.
They must be neutered - or they will leave and make thousands of strays in a few years. The statistics are staggering.
Where do you live?
Are you near any roads?
Are you in the country?
Unless there is plenty of open space where they will not get hit by cars - most people only keep their cats indoors these days.
They live great and happy lives indoors. They will begin to settle down.
Cats are nocturnal - but they will adjust to your schedule.
Good Luck. Keep them safe as you have!
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post #6 of 33
12/22/10 at 8:48pm
Coyotes are a big problem here. Know someone who lost 2 kitties to coyotes. I had a neighbor who's cat got oil poured on her face when she wandered into their yard. Aside from cars, antifreeze (if you live somewhere cold), getting locked in peoples sheds, being outside is not the best place for cats to be. However, if you are going to let them out, I agree they should be brought in at night.
They do get along just fine indoors though. Stick to feeding them at a certain time and they will get used to it and bug you around feeding time instead of hours before :P At least it worked for me.
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post #7 of 33
12/23/10 at 7:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginaKitty View Post
Are they neutered? I assume so.
It's not a good assumption to make, and an important question to ask!
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post #8 of 33
12/23/10 at 9:27am
I'd close the bedroom door or find some other solution.

If they aren't fixed, they contribute to the out of control feline population.

If they are fixed, there are risks to themselves and to the environment as a non-native predator.

There are cars, dogs, feral toms, poisons, weirdos, parasites, and more outside. The US Fish and Wildlife government services site lists domestic cats in the top five threats for endangered wildlife such as songbirds who's pre-flight grounded hatchlings and nests often fall victim to the overabundance of well-fed energetic domestic cats that innocently see them as real-life Da Bird toys.

The responsible thing to do is keep cats indoors IMO.
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post #9 of 33
12/23/10 at 9:35am
Leave your vacuum cleaner parked in your room, but not plugged in. Leave the switch set to "On". Place the cord near an outlet close to your bed. When they start bugging you, plug in the vacuum cleaner. Continue to do this when they disturb you. They'll soon get the message that it's not appropriate to bug you at 5AM.
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post #10 of 33
12/23/10 at 10:23pm
My opinion -
Don't ever let them outside.
It's a dangerous world out there - so, unless you have an outside enclosure for them - ... keep them inside where they are safer. There's always a way to overcome some issue that comes up when you share the space with your furbabies.

That's my 2¢ ... you asked, I answered.
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post #11 of 33
12/24/10 at 6:27am
I would say that you can put them outside whenever you decide you want to expose them to the diseases, parasites, predators, and cars in your area.

Of course, some places are safer that others, but I haven't put a cat outside in 30 years.
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post #12 of 33
12/29/10 at 5:53pm
I wouldn't send them out if its still dark. Even my indoor only cat Jack pesters me at 5 am if I let him. I recently lost an outside cat when a snow plow hit and killed her during the night. She was the most street smart cat I've ever known so that's saying a lot about the dangers. I will never allow another cat out unsupervised or when its dark.

Leslie
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post #13 of 33
12/29/10 at 7:10pm
I would either just let them out of your room or shut your door when they start pestering you. Nora sleeps in our room most nights and she usually wakes up around 5-6am b/c she has to pee. We just let her out and shut the door, then we go back to sleep and she has the run of the house until we wake up. I think it is fairly normal for cats to wake up at that time.

My personal opinion, I wouldn't let them out at all. *shrug*
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post #14 of 33
12/30/10 at 5:47am
Yup, its completely normal.

Many people think that cats are nocturnal, but they are not. They are a crepuscular species, which basically means "twilight animal", and thus are most active at the period around dawn and dusk, their peak hunting hours.
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post #15 of 33
12/30/10 at 9:23am
The night helps them hide as they are out and about - BUT - it also hides the predators such as coyotes - coyotes just love our neighborhoods and all the abundant food they can now find.

My husband's niece - lives in AZ - has cats, and dogs. They don't usually live very long. A few years ago one of her cats had a litter of 4. We took two of them. Today, only the 3 that she adopted out are still alive.

The coyotes raid the neighborhoods at night especially.

The mommy cat was missing a few days, and the niece went looking for her - she had dragged herself up into a road drainage pipe, and had died. The niece said she had been attacked by something.

When people spend hard-earned money - not only for food, but for the altering and the usual vaccines - but yet allow his/her cats to brave the elements of danger - I find it difficult to comprehend - especially when I look at the two we now have and think of what their fate would have been if we hadn't "rescued" them.

Sometimes people don't have a choice, I understand that - and I guess it's just the way things are - but if there is a choice - choose to make the cat(s) inside cats 24/7.
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post #16 of 33
12/30/10 at 1:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by stephanietx View Post
Leave your vacuum cleaner parked in your room, but not plugged in. Leave the switch set to "On". Place the cord near an outlet close to your bed. When they start bugging you, plug in the vacuum cleaner. Continue to do this when they disturb you. They'll soon get the message that it's not appropriate to bug you at 5AM.
I need to try that with mine. They want me up at 5am or 5:30am. A hair dryer is another recommendation. Mine run when they see it. I guess it's too loud for them too.
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post #17 of 33
12/30/10 at 2:46pm
So glad we don't have coyote's here, but being more urban we have lots of vehicles. I have considered talking to my neighbor a few houses down, but I keep convincing myself its none of my business.

Its mildly annoying that everyday she screams "PRECIOUS!!!" at the top of her lungs while shaking what appears to be treats when its mealtime, but the real issue is that I nearly killed her cat a couple weeks back.

Its against the HOA rules, but it seems almost EVERYONE still keeps parking their cars in the street. Luckily, I was driving slower than the speed limit, as Precious was underneath one of the cars and didn't dart out until the last second. All of my groceries I stupidly put in the back seat instead of trunk flew forward, but it was much better than the alternative which would have just ruined my whole year having to live with that consequence.

There are no leash-laws for cats though, only for dogs, so really I don't have any right to say anything. Thats what I tell myself anyway.
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post #18 of 33
12/30/10 at 3:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducman69 View Post
I'd close the bedroom door or find some other solution.

If they aren't fixed, they contribute to the out of control feline population.

If they are fixed, there are risks to themselves and to the environment as a non-native predator.

There are cars, dogs, feral toms, poisons, weirdos, parasites, and more outside. The US Fish and Wildlife government services site lists domestic cats in the top five threats for endangered wildlife such as songbirds who's pre-flight grounded hatchlings and nests often fall victim to the overabundance of well-fed energetic domestic cats that innocently see them as real-life Da Bird toys.

The responsible thing to do is keep cats indoors IMO.
Sorry, this is off-topic... Ducman69, I do a lot of cat predation-related research, and was wondering if you could provide me a link to that USFWS citation? Thanks.
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post #19 of 33
12/30/10 at 4:50pm
Its all over the government FWS website.

http://library.fws.gov/Bird_Publications/songbrd.html
http://www.fws.gov/migratorybirds/Cu...Predation.html
http://www.fws.gov/home/feature/2010...0/ecotips.html

The gist is that cat predation is another added stress factor on top of habitat loss, pesticides, vehicle/window strikes, and other problems caused by man and his satellites. Just better for our kitties and our environment to keep fluffy happy, warm, and safe indoors.
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post #20 of 33
12/30/10 at 5:08pm
Cats are part of nature. It is their nature to catch birds. Humans are also part of nature. It is our nature to adopt cats as pets. The fit will survive. That has been the way of the world for billions of years.

Some people value their cat's freedom over the dangers of outdoor life. Others do not. It is a personal choice.
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post #21 of 33
12/30/10 at 5:14pm
Since the OP was saying how much of a problem this is, and with the lack of responses by them, I think they might not have heeded advice here. I suspect the kitten is being let out in the AM. I don'twant to assume, since OP could be away for holidays, and I hope I am wrong, but I just have a feeling...
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post #22 of 33
12/30/10 at 5:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by garyganoo View Post
Cats are part of nature. It is their nature to catch birds. Humans are also part of nature.
The practical fact though is that ecosystems need time to adjust and evolution is a very slow process (no animal can adapt to major changes in a matter of a few hundred years) and cats are not native to the North American ecosystem, and if we aren't responsible for caring for our environment, we can sacrifice quality of life and biodiversity for future generations which in my opinion is short sighted and a bit selfish.

Just look at what has happened in Australia as an extreme example.

Not only were (and are) animals going extinct that had been there for millennia, but they found that even dependent fauna was going extinct. Those are plants and animals that once gone are gone forever.
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post #23 of 33
12/30/10 at 5:40pm
Extinctions, even mass extinctions, are part of nature. If not for the mass extinction 65 million years ago, humans might never have come to be. Extinctions create opportunities for other species. However, bird extinction is not the topic of this post.

IMHO, it is a personal choice to choose between the excitement and freedom of outdoor life and the dangers that go along with it. If I were a cat, I would choose the excitement and freedom of outdoor life coupled with the safety and security of a warm home to go to at night. It is a personal decision that is dependent on the personality of the cat and it's owner.
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post #24 of 33
12/30/10 at 5:56pm
Hey garyganoo and Ducman69 -

this topic may be better served if you would be able to start a thread in the IMO: In My Opinion Forum.

but, there are restrictions: http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17161, and if I remember correctly you need to have posted a minimum of 100 posts (?)

Or - maybe The Lounge Forum would be a place to post if you have less than 100 posts ??

Just a suggestion on an interesting topic that you've raised.
g
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post #25 of 33
12/30/10 at 6:19pm
Gloria, you're right, and I'm sorry to have taken it off topic. I also agree with rad65 that the op probably isn't coming back.

But I do want this out here publicly, and if a mod wants to move the end of this thread to an appropriate forum, I'm all for it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducman69 View Post
Its all over the government FWS website.

http://library.fws.gov/Bird_Publications/songbrd.html
http://www.fws.gov/migratorybirds/Cu...Predation.html
http://www.fws.gov/home/feature/2010...0/ecotips.html

The gist is that cat predation is another added stress factor on top of habitat loss, pesticides, vehicle/window strikes, and other problems caused by man and his satellites. Just better for our kitties and our environment to keep fluffy happy, warm, and safe indoors.
Oh I know it's all over the USFWS site(s), I was just wondering about that specific quote, as there is certainly no actual research to back up the claim that cats are among the top five threats to endangered species in anything other than island or isolated habitats. I've tangled with the USFWS NJ Field Office over the move in NJ to have cats classified as an exotic, non-native species.

While I completely agree that it's potentially another stress, you may or may not be aware, there is a HUGE... let's call it... "debate" between a certain group of conservationists and pro-TNR groups. A LOT of bunk research is being used to support anti-TNR efforts, and, sadly, the USFWS has perpetuated some of this "research," and in many instances has deliberately twisted the work of peer-review published research to suit their needs. It's one thing for private groups to do this, another altogether for our tax dollars to be used this way.

Cats should be kept indoors because it is safer for them.

But how to manage the unowned cat population is what is at stake.
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post #26 of 33
12/30/10 at 6:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducman69
Just look at what has happened in Australia as an extreme example.

Not only were (and are) animals going extinct that had been there for millennia, but they found that even dependent fauna was going extinct. Those are plants and animals that once gone are gone forever.
I hope you are not implying that cats are solely responsible for this. That they played a major role (other than on the islands) is not even scientifically clear. In fact, there are studies that indicate the primary diet of cats in some areas are on non-native species. Further, there are many other introduced species, and quite a bit of habitat loss.
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post #27 of 33
12/30/10 at 6:47pm
People, Nature is beyond human control. We are just small part in the grand scheme of things. We are powerless to direct the course of nature. It is arrogant to think that we can.

After all those years of the global warming alarmists blaming climate change on human activity, it has been proved to be a massive hoax. I don't believe a word that these environmentalists have to say. Especially if they are sanctioned by government or the UN.

Let's just do what is best for ourselves and our cats and let nature handle the rest. It is good to be kind to animals, especially cats, but we don't control the grand scheme of things anymore than our cats do.
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post #28 of 33
12/30/10 at 6:51pm
garyganoo, you ought to join us in the cat lounge for some of the basically "one word" games to get your post count up to over 100 so you can join us in the IMO Lounge. I'd love to address your answer, but this is getting WAAAAY off topic!
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post #29 of 33
12/30/10 at 7:21pm
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post #30 of 33
12/30/10 at 8:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kara_leigh View Post


If the OP is still lurking and reading...Depending where you live you may have minimal to an Outrageous number of dangers... I have always lived in more minimal danger area s and trained my cats to stay in the yard ( you may want to leash and harness train ) ... I have only one indoor to sometimes outdoor cat now , she stay s in the yard but that has not proven entirely safe as she was out for 5 minutes and got a tapeworm( ie vet visit and meds about 60$ ) another ODD danger the dog next door is her friend and he dug a hole JUST big enough for her and she ended up going in the house with him one night via his dog door... When I trained my indoor / outdoor cats... They had been in my home NO less than 6 month s , I then leash train them and walk in the yard with them...

Today only one is indoor / outdoor due to the issues I have encountered and Adoption agreements saying indoor only unless in an enclosure
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