"If you touch my junk, I'll have you arrested" - Page 3

Government: the mommy state - fear to control the masses - less personal freedoms
Body Scans: - safe feelings - false (groping: interesting)
Radiations levels: exactly my understanding, too
Less government - The original intent in the forming of the Republic of the United States of America

My husband is fond of saying that people never lose their rights all at once.

They lose them one. at. a. time.

There are probably many future terrorists dancing in their streets right now, laughing at what we in the good ole' USA are doing because of our fear of them.

And furthermore, I just watched this. How in God's name are we safer because that little boy just got groped in front of what appeared to be a huge amount of people?

I sit here in disbelief that folks aren't seeing the whole picture and raging against this until it's overturned.

This video, with the agents (most of whom would probably much rather be somewhere else) pulling on and off those rubber gloves - looks like some of the worst "B" movies I have ever seen.

And this: this just made me cry. This poor man. His quote at the end of the article said it best: ..."we have already lost the war"...

There are always 2 sides to every story and we are only hearing one - the alleged victims.

This is very true. But they just began this groping business in what, the past week or so? And we already have this many victim stories?

I can only imagine the stress that those TSA agents are having to go through. I think I'd be happier working at McDonalds.

To a degree yes, it's as you say, I'm being a Devil's advocate. I do, however, think the body scans and pat downs are a necessary evil for travellers. There will always be some individuals who will over-exert their power, especially in those areas of work, like police, border guards, etc. They let the power go to their heads. Those individuals need to be reported and dealt with and of course the media is the only way sometimes to get that to happen.

I don't blame those individuals for being so upset, I'm sure I would be as well. Having said that, oft times, some people go out of their way to annoy the officers and that is the way the officers retaliate - because they can. They have a job to do too.

I really don't know what the big deal is here, but I think people who make this a big deal are those who do not travel often... Because we who do travel often and care for our safety enough and actually have been though this procedure so many times tend to actually think it is not a big deal at all... The only time it annoys me, is when it might makes me late to catch my flight. And really, on those times it is my fault for not getting there early enough.
About being random, yes and no...
You have more chances of being searched if you have one way tickets, or do not check in luggage...
I gotta say, I have been through the "pat down" plenty of times, and not once my genitals or breasts were touched. Being a frequent flyer for so many years, I find it very strange to hear these claims... I got pat downs in big airports, small airports... I was always treated with respect. On the genital area they go over with the metal detector - there was never touching involved. On the back of the bra, always told me: "Now I will touch the back of your bra with the back of my hands", and asked if I would have a problem with that. Same thing with the sides of the bra, under the arm pit.
On the legs, they only go so far up - nowhere close to the genitals.
On the x-ray machine, like Sarah mentioned, there is no graphics showing on the outside for the World to see.

I am sorry, but so many things can happen when you are up in the skies with no where to go...

When I travel internationally and overseas security is lacking, I feel very nervous and wish I had what I have in the US. I do not like at all to jump in a plane for hours in a flight without knowing that full security has been enforced prior to boarding - it is a very unsettling feeling.

I do not care a bit for those who cry wolf for a little pat down - quite frankly, IMHO suck it up and get it with the plan, or get in a bus and do not fly... Security for me is the most important thing when thousand of feet high in the air.

My understanding is that the new pat down is now "enhanced" - Carolina, have you flown in the last few days and received the "new enhanced" pat down?

here's some Q&A's from CNN's website: http://www.cnn.com/2010/TRAVEL/11/23...edures.primer/



.

I can't find it quickly, but I think I heard that the pat-downs are now without gloves ?? which would make the pat down a LOT more personal.

I also heard that the pat downs may have a constitutional problem as well ??

Like I said, don't have time to run these resources down, maybe someone else already has and can post them ??

I wonder if people will have a problem being stripped searched - that, too, may become part of the security procedures ??

Well said Carolina, I agree 100%..
Most of us would let a doctor "probe" our private areas only for a physical every year, let alone the kind of things we allow doctors to subject us to when we are sick in the name of preventing us from dying- so how is it different to let a security officer do a pat down in order to ensure your safety?
I think there is a very obvious difference between being patted down and being groped- I have been through security many times and like I mentioned earlier I've been patted down, and in countries where the procedures are not the same as in the US, i.e. a more intense search- like when i was leaving Germany and getting on a plane to the US they patted down EVERYONE no exceptions...and every single time you can tell the person is not trying to touch your private parts because they want to make you feel uncomfortable, they are only feeling for hard objects or anything that might be hidden in there. I dunno, at least to me it is obvious that they aren't doing it to get a feel by the way they keep their hands straight and just their overall approach...

I flew a couple of weeks ago, but will fly again in a week. I will be sure to ask for an "Enhanced pat down" to post my impressions here.

Great! I'll be just one that will look forward to your "Review".

I always appreciate first hand knowledge from those I trust.

You're not serious I hope. Comparing a doctor and a security officer as the same is waaaaaayyyy out there!

I really have no problems with the scans. They can scan everyone even kids for all I care. We all know that Terrorists don't care of the age group and they'll send 9 year olds out with a pack strapped to them.

It's a no-win situation really.

But I enjoy protesting so I'm going to have fun seeing if anything major really happens at the airports tomorrow.

You can opt out for a pat-down instead but a "pat down" should be JUST a pat down and not a groping session. I would not like someone feeling me up either and that, to me, is much more uncomfortable than standing in a machine for a few seconds and having someone you can't even see snickering at you.

I mean...come on. A penis is a penis and boobs are boobs and we've all seen them. What's the big deal?

Honestly I feel bad for the TSA agents themselves. To have to deal with this at work... not to mention that it is a low-wage job. The media has thrown out a lot of backlash about this but one thing that I question is truly how effective these measures are.

I don't trust these scanners to be properly calibrated in a year or two. It is not out of the ordinary for xray machines to malfunction and omit more radiation then they should. These scanners are no different. I don't think people should trust that so blindly.

Naturally I don't care much about airport measures. When I have to fly I just grin and bear it even if I feel this is ridiculous. I suppose it is because I question the effectiveness of the measures. I am not convinced all this silliness makes me safer.

Telling people to "suck it up" is ridiculous. I'm not against these searches because I would personally be offended because of the intimacy of the search. That's not why. I'm against these searches because we keep siphoning away our rights, and as long as people drink the kool-aid when they're told it's for their safety, we'll continue to lose them. There are dangers all around us, every day. To all of you who say if we don't want to be searched, then take some other mode of transportation, all I have to say is that if you're so afraid to fly because of the threat of terrorism, maybe it's you that needs to find an alternate form of transportation. To expect the rest of us to give up our civil liberties so you feel better is unacceptable.

They also have a long way to go to prove that the body scanners are not harmful. They haven't been around long enough to prove that. For me it wouldn't matter so much, but I would hate to bring up children, and have to subject them to that for the duration of their lives. Just because they say it's not harmful, doesn't make it so.

There are a lot of things the government can do in the name of "safety"...nearly all of them would require them to have more control over us and our lives. If we don't speak now, it will continue. Nothing good has ever come of citizens relinquishing control of their lives to a government. Ask those who lived in Nazi Germany, Iraq under Hussein, Russia under Stalin, or present day North Korea under Kim Jong Il. Those are governments who had/have complete control over their citizens. They didn't take it all at once...it was a slow process in the name of safety, or economic gain. If you think it can't happen here, you're fooling yourself. It can happen anywhere...under any political party. There is a climate of fear right now, and the target is Muslims. In Nazi Germany, it was Jewish people, and in WWII America, it was the Japanese. The concentration camps killed millions, the American government stripped our Japanese citizens of their possessions, and their freedom, and interred them. I see some really ugly things posted, not just here, but on the internet, on facebook, and it saddens and sickens me.

My point is, we think we're making things better, but we're making them worse.

As for finding an alternate form of transportation to avoid scanners......Well, here's the latest news on this

Next step for body scanners could be trains, boats, metro

http://thehill.com/homenews/administ...and-the-metro-

As for trusting the scanners - that they are entirely safe at all times and nothing can go wrong with them.......Well, let's hope so, but here's something to think about anyway

http://www.medcitynews.com/2010/11/h...ring-ct-scans/

http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/10/...s-mistake.html

http://www.newsinferno.com/health-co...rdose-scandal/

I completely agree with what you said Clixpix...*are you reading my mind?*

I am not a frequent traveler, as a matter of fact I have never flown ever but Im not up in arms over this because of feeling offended or anything like that its because I cant help but wonder what is next. From what Ive read about these new pat downs it doesnt sound too pleasant it is described a lot worse than a pat down in a prison or by a cop. I dont even let a Dr get that in depth with me, its been 6 yrs since Ive let a Dr get 'in depth' with my body and Ive got 4 more yrs till I HAVE to deal with it again.

Thank you, clixpix, for saying it better than I could have. I don't personally have anything against being groped, either - I just want to choose the groper.

My son took two seconds the other day and brought up countless images on the web of folks in body scanners. Some image somewhere has been saved.

And what really bothers me most is the folks who "suck it up" and go through the scanners, only to have an "anomaly" bring them to the gropers. A necklace. A urine bag. There is so much room for abuse here it's not even funny.

I find flying to be a pain, and annoying most of the time with screaming children, therefore I drive everywhere. And if I cant drive because of water, I'll hop on a boat.

BUT, if I were to fly, and were selected, I'd probably opt for the x-ray full body scan. I work in a field with radioactivity in samples, and have to wear a dosimeter. I doubt that the radiation I'd receive from the scanner would be any worse for me than the environment I work in on a daily basis.

The pat down isn't really my thing, I'd rather not be touched all over by a stranger in an airport, but I also understand why they do it and I'd rather be safe than blown into a million pieces at 35,000 feet.

I just got an e-mail "joke" - have a booth that would automatically detonate any bomb one might have on their bodies. That way the bomber would be no burden on the taxpayers or justice system and there would be an extra seat for a standby person on the plane.

Now that is a plan I can get behind!

It's not only the amount - it's the accumulation of radiation that concerns me - especially for those that are frequent flyers.
Maybe we all should buy a dosimeter?

Now THAT'S no JOKE -
THAT's A Plan!!

I'd still be more radiated than frequent flyers, unless they fly daily

Who knows, maybe they can provide frequent flyer dosimeters in the future for those worried (Yeah, right, the government paying for that?)

Hey, there's an idea - set up vendors at the airports and sell the things - could be a good business - and get lots of people back to work.

How about being a vendor at the airport and selling t-shirts that say "I was groped by the TSA and all I got was this lousy t-shirt"?

Did you know the TSA employees are prohibited from wearing dosimeters?

And, to bring this back to the original post, I wonder how many noticed that the guy that started this not only didn't get the TSA worker arrested for "touching his junk," he was detained and not allowed to fly.