Maxi-Guard Gel - Lesions

Has anyone any experience using Maxi-Guard Oral Gel to “improve†beginning tooth resorption issues? The vet did a poor job explaining what would the benefits of using it be.

Ossi just went to vet and couple of his teeth were deemed bad. The vetâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s opinion was that they would need removing in few months time. The teeth look fine to me but he has like a little loose piece of gum around one of the teeth that I put on his ‘check listâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji] month ago. He does not seem to have too much sensitivity when I brush his teeth, except that it is very hard to brush the lower premolars that were the problem ones.

If anyone has used the Maxi-Guard or something similar, would you share your experiences? What does it do? I see itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s like 1/4 of the price on the internet vs the vet, so Iâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]d be happy to get it for Ossi or my other boys. The vet said Siamese are more prone to resorptive lesions, so I might need to get more vigilant with this with my boys. What else is there to do but to brush and feed more dental treats to prevent this from happening early?

Also, how could the vet know the state of the teeth by just looking?

With Resorptive lesions I would advise to take your kitty to the dentist - that is a very painful condition.
Maxi-guard is good, but it will not reverse a resorptive lesion... I would also be very very careful brushing that area...
Can your vet refer you to a dentist?

There is no way to prevent resorptive lesions, at least not that I've heard of yet. Perhaps there is something new now?

I agree with Carolina FORL is a terribly painful condition and the sooner those teeth and roots are out the better.

Tolly has had to have the surgery for FORL twice so far. The first time he lost 2 teeth, the second four teeth, and the vet said there was one that had already been completely resorpted (is that word?). An xray showed even the root was gone so she left it alone..

As for that gel, after doing a quick search all I see is that it is used to "clean" the teeth, doesn't say anything about enzymatic action (breaking down bacteria).

The cause of FORL is not known at this time either, unless there is something new that I have not heard about yet.

Poor Ossi

MAXI/GUARD Oral Cleaning Gel has a long history of being the most complete home dental care product available. The unique zinc ascorbate formulation is very effective in helping reduce gingival inflammation, reducing the deposition of plaque and neutralizing offensive mouth odors. It is considered a "professional strength" product and is very concentrated. MAXI/GUARD Gel is recommended for severe oral problems such as advanced periodontal cases, post oral surgery and pre and post dental cleaning.

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source:

http://www.medi-vet.com/prod-MaxiGua..._oz_-2072.aspx

I read the description for the gel too after the vet basically could not give me satisfactory answer how does it help (and she basically then just kinda backed off offering it, so I decided not to take it but find out a bit more...)

My first question was "is Ossi in pain and should I book him for dental procedure right away". The vet said that he is not in pain yet and she would recommend removal in few months time. This way the teeth would be removed before they become a problem, and also she said she has deal in Feb which is her Dental Month, and we'd be fine waiting till then.

I read some more about the FORL, and I found out there are different stages. I wonder if she could have judged the stage by such a cursory exam, and maybe Ossi only has the beginning stage? He does enjoy when I rub his gums. I do it after I brush his teeth, and maybe that indicates he has extra itching but not to too painful level - yet. Confusing though because the stageI usually does not require removal, so maybe he's moving beyond that.

I certainly do not want him to have discomfort and if any of these gels help with that while we decide who to take him for the removal, I'll get it for that too. This vet does surgery/dentistry but I might want a second opinion on that too.

For you with experience, what is usually done prior to the dental stuff? Blood work? Are the X-rays only done when the cat goes in?

Resorptive lesions are extremely painful - basically, putting in layman's language, the nerve is exposed, outside of the teeth... can you even imagine the pain? IMHO this is a case of immediate extraction. Don't forget cats are experts in hiding pain.
There are different levels of lesions, where in some of them the nerve is not exposed, and still covered by a thin layer of dentine.

I would take her to a dentist ASAP.
Yes, blood work before the dental to rule out problems and IV in case of emergencies during the procedure.

Originally Posted by Carolina

I would take her to a dentist ASAP.

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I would assume this vet was a dentist as she performs dental surgery? Are you suggesting I should seek a particular type of vet for another opinion?

I am thinking Ossi having a bad time with his pink belly this summer might be a symptom related to the mouth now that I think of this.

I would assume the vet would not have lied to me when she said she does not believe Ossi is in pain - I was ready to commit for surgery (=money), why would she have said no to that and let me come home unless she truly believed so? She must have seen there was still some protective layer left on the worst tooth. The other one I know was not that bad but she said it would be all the same to take it at the same go.

I am a bit confused of this 'dentist' thing. I thought there were some vets who do oral surgery while some don't. I would assume I should be able to trust an opinion of a vet that performs stuff like that or should I search for someone even more specialized?

Some vets will do dental stuff too, however, for things like this IMHO you will be better off with a Veterinary dentist... In my experience, it has not been more expensive, just money better spent.
I don't think it is a case of her lying to you either... but an experienced dentist will be better equipped to guide you and treat your baby appropriately.
If she in fact has Resorptive lesions, she is in pain. And if your vet said Maxi-guard reverses it, well... she is misinformed.

Originally Posted by Carolina

And if your vet said Maxi-guard reverses it, well... she is misinformed.

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She particularly said it won't. I asked if it will and that is when she kinda started hesitating and putting the stuff back in the cabinet because I was like "What use is it actually?"

I just checked her credentials on their web site and it does not state Veterinary Dentist. I would think she'd have that there if she was one. Sounds like I'll be calling around a bit again.

Ossi is quite a cry baby when he has pain/sensitivities and I have not had him scream when I brush his teeth. That's why I was so surprised of this news too. I am living in hope his teeth are only starting to go but I will pursue to find out. I hate dental stuff myself, I have very sensitive teeth. I would not want him to suffer.

He certainly has not lost weight (gained), he crunches his kibbles like always and has no bleeding gums. Only that little blistery type of thing next to that one tooth and some gum irritation in general that he gets occasionally.

Interestingly enough the two biggest and most hailed Veterinary Hospitals in the area do not list any Veterinary Dentists either. One of them has one of the Vets listed as having a "special interest" in dental issues. None of the local regular practices have anyone marked down as dentist either. There is only one "only cats" vet in the area and they have no Dentist listed (no surprise as they only have two vets). My vet is ex cats-only practice vet who only does cats and dogs.

I did not call around yet but I wonder what will come out of this, and how common it is for regular vets to do these surgeries, in non-metro areas like ours. And what kind of questions I should ask. I will certainly ask how routinely they perform these things on cats.

Try to do a search online for a veterinary dental clinic close to your zip code...

Are you near a vet school?

My vet does Tolly's dental work and his resorptive lesion extractions. I trust her because she knows him. Tolly is special needs, takes phenobarbital for seizures. She knows his mouth, which may mean less time under anesthesia. She did offer to send us to Cornell University Companion Animal Hospital last time but I decided to stick with her.

As for x rays, she only did them if she felt they were necessary. I actually asked her to do them last time, based on what I had read, but she insisted that it isn't always necessary and she would be able to tell if they were needed.

Tolly has a full blood panel done prior to any anesthesia procedure. He is pre-medicated with the antibiotic clindimyacin (antirobe) starting three days before any dental procedure.

My vet uses sevorflorane gas anesthesia and Tolly is on IV fluids during the procedure. He also receives a penicillin shot during the procedure.

He is sent home with buprenex for pain, and continues on the antirobe starting the following day (since he has the shot on the actual day) for another 7 days.

The sevoflurane is fast acting and there is very little dopiness in recovery though the buprenex makes him stoned as heck.

He will be due soon for a dental cleaning, he has liver damage now, and my vet wants to wait as long as possible before putting him under, so she keeps an eye on his mouth. Tolly gets check ups and blood work every three months now.

Tolly is not showing any signs of FORL currently. Watch Ossi for the classic "chattering" of the jaw. That is a tell-tale symptom of FORL, though I am not sure at which stage the chattering begins.

I have had a vet tech who specializes in dentistry (not at my clinic, she lives in TX) tell me that FORL (she calls them neck lesions) are so painful that the cat even reacts when under the anesthesia when the nerve is touched.

Observe Ossi when he eats to see if he is favoring any side of his mouth. Watch for the chattering, and watch for any jumping away from his food dish.

When Tolly has resorptive lesions he can only eat dry food, as he swallows that whole. If he tries to eat canned food he often jumps and runs away as if the food dish bit him. This is because the wet food particles can get to places, sensitive exposed roots for example, dry food swallowed whole cannot.

Since he usually only has dry as snacks, he did lose quite a bit of weight at his last episode of FORL, because he did not eat enough kibble to keep him up to par.

At that time he was still only going to the vet twice a year for well visits. I was absolutely mortified when my vet told me at his routine January appointment that year, that he had probably been in pain for some for at least a couple of months. And I watch my cats so closely, but didn't know he was hurting.

I did notice he was protesting getting his pills, but for some reason I didn't think of his teeth bothering him. Even three years later I still feel just terrible about that. I was hurting him pilling him twice a day and didn't even know it. Just writing it makes me cry.

Here's a link to a list of veterinary dentists, from the AVDC:

http://www.avdc-dms.org/dms/diplomates.cfm

I have two Siamese, and one or both will probably need a cleaning soon. Like you, we do our best to provide preventative care, but sooner or later at least one of them will probably acquire some special attention. I have thought about it a lot, and I will probably go with a dental specialist when the time comes, even though my regular vet is great.

Well I checked and the closest specialist to us is 3 hr drive. Also, I did not even know there was only one vet school in whole NYS. That pretty much means I will make some calls and just find out who locally is to be trusted with these things.

Otto thank you very much for the signs to watch. I am pretty confident Ossi has not shown any major signs. I supervise his wet food dinner, and he is his usual meticulous he has always been. No jumpiness but he has always been the slowest ever, we call him limp tongue. Only thing I can think of is possible that he has just lately been little less eager with the Hill's big dental kibble. He walks away after a couple when before he'd have as many as I would give for snacks. It's possible those rub him too much.

However, I read about that chattering you mention. Oh no. Now I worry about Kille! I need to take him in for another check. Kille has always been very particular with his mouth. He does a lot of twisting and 'killing' and weird motions when he eats. I brush his teeth the least because he has teeny mouth and gets very gaggy and insulted even though he lets me do it. I always thought he gets the same thing as I get when at dentist when I get nervous - my jaw tenses and trembles. Kille has some of that. Maybe it's that chattering and the other vet just was not very thorough with the oral check ups? His teeth were last checked in April but I think I have someone else look now for my piece of mind. It might just be his nerves but it might just be a sloppy vet too.