Update on DD & Her Dramas (sorry, kind of long)

libby74 · Jul 28, 2010

I had to update this; I either just did something really stupid or really caring, I'm not sure which. I called my neighbor, the one DD has moved in with, and asked if he'd meet me in the alley to talk. Of course he said yes, and we did. I asked him how my daughter is; I asked why he was letting her stay at his home. She had told him she didn't have anywhere else to go. I asked if DD had told him how she'd loaded her car in the middle of the night and DH and I didn't know she was moving out until we discovered her stuff was gone. Well, no--she didn't tell him that. She said she'd had to move out because we didn't like her boyfriend. I let him know that was a really bad reason to move out and he agreed. I also let him know that she has 2 grandmothers that each live 5 blocks from us; if she'd really needed a place to go she could have gone to either one. I told him about her Dad driving around town at 3 a.m. looking for her car because he was so worried.

He told me the bf had shown up at his door at 11:30 last night; he didn't care for that, and he was going to tell her that wasn't going to happen again.

I asked him to please give her a time frame to find herself a new place to live. I apologized to him for DD putting him in the middle of her mess. And as much as I hate to admit it, I bawled like a baby. I let him know she had been planning to move for several months to prove she could make it on her own, and that living in his home and taking advantage of his hosptality wasn't proving anything.

I don't know if I helped the situation any or if I've totally screwed up. No, I don't want her back in my home. The drama would kill me. I do want her out of the neighbor's home and standing on her own 2 feet. It kills me that she's taking advantage of this sweet man, and I would love to kick her butt into next week. He even gave her a key to his house, for pete's sake. Unbelievable.

natalie_ca · Jul 28, 2010

You did the right thing talking to him. Had it been me I would have also spilled the beans about the whole crime family. I doubt very much he would be allowing her to stay there, let alone her bf visit her there if he knew what a dangerous sounding family they are.

dusty's mom · Jul 29, 2010

Originally Posted by libby74

Honestly, that thought never crossed my mind. DD is all of 4'11" and 100 lbs soaking wet. The new bf, on the other hand, comes from a family that I wouldn't trust as far as I could throw them. Several members have arrests for assault and battery and, of course, the bf's brother has pending gun-running charges.

Size doesn't matter if you are facing a gun. And I'm sure the BF knows how to get his hands on one. Not saying that is going to happen, but just make sure your actions take that possibility into consideration when dealing with them.

Originally Posted by Natalie_ca

You did the right thing talking to him. Had it been me I would have also spilled the beans about the whole crime family. I doubt very much he would be allowing her to stay there, let alone her bf visit her there if he knew what a dangerous sounding family they are.

I agree. Let the kind man know the entire truth.

libby74 · Jul 29, 2010

For some reason, I don't think my kindly neighbor would worry too much about the bf's family. Members of his own family are in and out of jail on a regular basis. He is such a sweet old guy; I think he's of the opinion that everyone deserves a second (or 7th chance). If/when I talk to him again, I may mention that he shouldn't believe everything he hears about the bf or his family from DD.

She came to pack her stuff this morning; DH & I were both here and I gave her 2 hours. I never would have believed she could fit so much into her little Hyundai. When she got here, I opened the door and she said, "Hey, what's up?" as if everything were normal. As she was leaving I got a couple of thngs off my chest. I told her that if she decided to move out on her own to prove that she was an adult and could be responsible her Dad and I would have backed her 100%. I reminded her how she's always complained about the neighbor's family taking advantage of him and that she was doing the very same thing, except in her case it's much worse because she isn't family. I let her know that DH & I have never been ashamed of or embarrassed by her until now. (believe it or not, she actually teared up at that) I told her she could keep on lying to everyone and telling them that we kicked her out because we don't like her bf. I said I hoped that a year from now she could look at him and say to herself, "Yeah, throwing away my family and everyone who loves me for him was a great idea."

She tried again to tell me she hadn't been sneaking her stuff out of the house (what, she was taking her tv and underwear for a ride?). I let her know that I'd asked her girlfriend if she and DD had planned this, and the answer had been that DD had asked if she could move in a week ago. My own daughter lied to me, but her friend was honest with me. Nice, huh?
Lastly, I reminded her again to stay away from my family. As long as she's willing to give up everything for a guy she's dated for 3 weeks, a guy who's family should probably be on America's Most Wanted, she has no business being anywhere near the people I love.

I held myself together while I talked to her, then I locked the door behind her, sat on the couch and cried like a baby. DH thinks she'll come to her senses one of these days, but I know she's just as stubborn as I am. We may have lost her forever. I do think , tho, that by this time next week the drama will have settled a bit and we'll enjoy having the house to ourselves.
It's just so odd having her living with people right across the alley.

libby74 · Jul 30, 2010

I have to give one more update to this, something so unbelievable I don't know if anyone actually will believe it.

Three weeks ago, DD wanted to buy a moped. I told her she couldn't afford and didn't give her the savings account book. Two weeks ago she wanted to trade off the car she's had for all of 4 months and take out an $18000 loan to get a different car. Again, I told her she couldn't afford it, plus she couldn't find a co-signer so the deal fell thru. Last week she went back to harping about getting a moped. I told her to think it over for a week or 2 and decide if it was really a good idea or just a spur of the moment idea.

DH and I drove by her place of employment last night (his idea, I didn't want to) and there in here parking spot was----a moped. She's telling people she moved out because we didn't like her bf. Now, it seems apparent that all she really wanted was her savings book so she could buy herself a moped. I think the bf is only a small part of the equation.

I never would have believed that the going price for a loving family is a no-good bf and a moped. As DH was driving home last night I ranted for a good 5 minutes--"she threw her family away for a moped!"

-_aj_- · Jul 30, 2010

I am so sorry for saying this but if she runs her savings out on crap she doesnt need its her fault not yours you have advised the best you can

she had a car why did she feel she needed a moped its beyond belief

mystik spiral · Jul 30, 2010

Libby - I can't remember if I've shared this here before, but please let me tell you a story about my little brother. He gave my parents so much grief and heartache in his teens/very early 20's. He smoked pot constantly, he drank a lot, he was in jail, he freakin' had LSD in his backpack on one of his court dates!!! He once said to my parents (in his VERY egotistical phase): "Everything I am is in and of myself, and YOU had nothing to do with it." He said and did horrid things to my parents. They too had to let him go to live his life, even to the point that when he was 16 my dad was ready to give him a few hundred bucks a month so he could get his own apartment. It didn't happen, but they did stop supporting him and his lifestyle. My brother took a year off of college, painted houses to make a living, and finally got his act together and got his degree.

He met the love of his life, and got married 6 years ago (he's 34 now), and he and my SIL are in the process of adopting after learning that they can't get pregnant. My dad died of cancer almost two years ago, and thankfully, my dad and my brother MORE than made peace with each other before my dad died. This brother now comes over to my mom's house at the bare minimum every other week, just to spend time with her, to mow her lawn, to help her with odd jobs around the house. He is a wonderful, wonderful person who will go out of his way if he can help somebody he loves.

While I agree that you are doing the right thing by your daughter, don't write her off just yet. She may well do a lot of growing up in the next couple of years, and if she is anything like my brother, she will realize that what you and your husband did for her was the best thing for her, and she will appreciate it.

I hope your daughter's story turns out like my brother's...

libby74 · Jul 30, 2010

Thank you so much for sharing your brother's story. I have hopes that eventually DD will (as her Dad puts it) "get her head out of her butt" before too much time passes. I honestly never knew anyone could hurt me as much as she has lately. It took us 9 years before we were able to adopt her; I took one look at her picture and said "this is the one". The only person in this world that I love more than her is my DH, and I've told her that. She knows I'm a very emotional person whose feelings get hurt easily, and I truly think she's been using that to her advantage. Changing our locks the other day must have been like a slap in the face to her, but it's a slap she had coming. The last 5 days have been awful; each time I've talked to her I've steeled myself to be calm and detached, and I believe that has thrown her for a loop. Then, when I'm alone, I bawl like a baby.
I know we did the right thing, I truly do know it. I guess I didn't realize it would be this hard.

ut0pia · Jul 30, 2010

I know it's probably too late for that, but have you tried therapy with her??
I know you said she was adopted, but I don't remember you saying how old she was when you got her- if she still has memories of her life before she came to you, that could be contributing to her defiance...I really don't know much about this, but friends of my family had an adopted son whose actions sound a lot like your daughter's..

libby74 · Jul 30, 2010

Originally Posted by ut0pia

I know it's probably too late for that, but have you tried therapy with her??
I know you said she was adopted, but I don't remember you saying how old she was when you got her- if she still has memories of her life before she came to you, that could be contributing to her defiance...I really don't know much about this, but friends of my family had an adopted son whose actions sound a lot like your daughter's..

We went to family therapy when she was about 11; her lying had gotten so out of control we had to try something. It didn't do a thing to change her inability to tell the truth, but it helped us handle the lying better.

She was 4 years and 10 months when we adopted her. I don't think she's ever remembered much from her days in the orphanage. When we adopted her, there was a little girl (the same age) who was being adopted by a family on the east coast; they traveled here together. That young lady had an attachment disorder, and has never bonded with her family. She now lives in a group home. I've never thought we had that problem with DD; she's always been a very loving, considerate girl. I have no idea what has changed her. She's always made decisions without thinking them thru or looking at the long-term consequences. I've assumed that's because she is still very immature in some ways. I'm just finding it very difficult to wrap my brain around this. I would totally understand if she had wanted to prove she could live on her own and be her own boss, and would have supported her in that choice. My understanding is she still has a curfew at the neighbor's house (and she should; it's not her house) and can't have visitors anymore after a certain time. Sounds a lot like home, you know?

I have this picture in my head now of the first time I saw a photo of her. Her little head was almost shaved--easier to care for that way. She had the biggest brown eyes I'd ever seen with amazingly long eyelashes. She looked so solemn. And she was sticking her tongue out at the camera.
How in the world did things go so wrong?

dusty's mom · Jul 31, 2010

Libby, do you know anything about her natural parents? It very well could be that nature, in this case, trumps nurture. It happens. I once knew a family that adopted 2 boys from different natural parents. Both boys were adopted as infants. One was very loving, played piano, was obedient, nearly a perfect child. His older adopted sibling was just the opposite - in an out of jail, did drugs, stole from his parents, quit high school, joined the marines, got kicked out of the marines, and last I heard died of a drug overdose.

I believe some kids are just genetically programmed to be difficult. Don't beat yourself up over it, but just know that you are doing the right thing. I think the speech you gave her the other day was just perfect. Keep strong and whatever you do, don't backtrack or she will see it as a sign of weakness and vulnerability.

cheshirecat · Jul 31, 2010

Originally Posted by libby74

I have this picture in my head now of the first time I saw a photo of her. Her little head was almost shaved--easier to care for that way. She had the biggest brown eyes I'd ever seen with amazingly long eyelashes. She looked so solemn. And she was sticking her tongue out at the camera.
How in the world did things go so wrong?

Sharing my Mother's theory here. She says it's just luck.

Her words "every mother does the best she can. Has only her child's best interest in mind. Kids from good homes turn out bad and kids from bad homes turn out good. You do your best and hope for the best."

You've done your job. Who knows where she would be if you hadn't been there.

libby74 · Jul 31, 2010

We know next to nothing about DD"s birth Mom, only that she was a 28 y.o. Bulgarian Gypsy. We know nothing at all about her birth Dad; her original birth certificate lists the Father as unknown. We were told that's the way it's done in some foreign countries to make adoption easier.

I just found out from my MIL that DD had been to her house 2 weeks ago asking her grandparents to co-sign on a car loan for her. They refused, of course; no one wants to get into that kind of debt at age 89! The sad thing is, DD's step-grandfather later said that if she hadn't been messing up so much lately he would have flat-out given her the money! (and no, I don't think that's just talk; I'm sure he meant it)

It also seems that DD is telling everyone at her work that she's moved in with her boyfriend instead of telling them the truth (no surprise there). I guess she forgot that her step-uncle is best of friends with one of the bosses. The news will soon get back to her work that she's moved across the alley from her parents, not into playing house with the bf. She's going to be the most embarrassed little girl in town, and it serves her right.

Sharing my Mother's theory here. She says it's just luck.

Her words "every mother does the best she can. Has only her child's best interest in mind. Kids from good homes turn out bad and kids from bad homes turn out good. You do your best and hope for the best."

You've done your job. Who knows where she would be if you hadn't been there.

Since people of her ethnicity are so looked down upon in her native country, DH & I both think she'd be on the streets---in one way or another.

ldg · Jul 31, 2010

I can't even begin to imagine how hard this is on you.

I'm betting she's in shock, and doesn't believe this is going to last long. This is a whole new world for her, and she doesn't seem to have much forethought as to her actions to begin with.

This is such an important lesson for her. I'm sure it is one that will resolve itself happily, it's just a question of when. It may be a few months, it may be a few years. But she really needs this.

BTW - did you suggest to your neighbor that he charge her rent?

Stay strong.

larussa · Jul 31, 2010

If I had gone thru what you've been thru with this kid, I'd have locked her out years ago. You and hubby are doing the right thing, it seems like she is not going to change no matter how much you have tried to help her. Don't let her ruin your life one more day. She has had enough chances and I don't see why you need to go on living like this. If you were able to, I would sell the house and move and not tell her where you are, then she can do whatever she pleases without killing both you and your hubby. No kid is worth that, no way.

larussa · Jul 31, 2010

Originally Posted by Dusty's Mom

I'm going to be straight with you. I know she is your daughter and you love her, BUT she is very angry with you now, and for your own safety if you meet with her, do it in a very public place and do not let her into your house, even and maybe especially if you are there.

No one likes to think that their child could be violent, but there are many, many cases similar to yours where the child went postal and killed his/her parents - sometimes alone, but sometimes with the help of a boyfriend or girlfriend.

Just keep knowing that you are doing the right thing. Part of being a good parent is setting boundaries. Kids, even adult kids, need to know where the boundaries are. If there are no boundaries, then the child keeps pushing the envelope, escalating the bad behavior searching in vain for the illusive boundary. You have now set a boundary. Whatever you do, do not cave to her demands or the bad behavior will just continue and get worse.

I was going to say the same thing, meet your dh in a public place, I wouldn't trust her at all. You never know what kids will do today.

libby74 · Jul 31, 2010

[BTW - did you suggest to your neighbor that he charge her rent?
/QUOTE]
Actually, DD's friend said DD had given the neighbor $50. That's pretty reasonable rent, IMO. The neighbor, being the man he is, didn't want to take it, but his daughter told hm to!

If I had gone thru what you've been thru with this kid, I'd have locked her out years ago. You and hubby are doing the right thing, it seems like she is not going to change no matter how much you have tried to help her. Don't let her ruin your life one more day. She has had enough chances and I don't see why you need to go on living like this. If you were able to, I would sell the house and move and not tell her where you are, then she can do whatever she pleases without killing both you and your hubby. No kid is worth that, no way.

Click to expand...

The thought of just packing up and moving had actually crossed our minds, but we love our home and live in a nice neighborhood. I have gardens that I can piddle in to keep myself sane. And, I won't let one immature, ungrateful 21 y.o brat drive me out of my own home.

I can't even begin to imagine how hard this is on you.

Click to expand...

As hard as this is on me (and believe me, sometimes I feel as if my head is just going to explode) I know DH & I are doing the right thing.

natalie_ca · Jul 31, 2010

Originally Posted by libby74

Actually, DD's friend said DD had given the neighbor $50. That's pretty reasonable rent, IMO.

$50.00 is reasonable rent?!

I thought you said she was working? She should be paying more than $50.00 to live somewhere.

If she had her own apartment it would cost her probably $600.00 or $700.00 or more just for the rent. Then add utilities and groceries and laundry on top of it all.

You daughter needs a good swift kick in the butt or she will never get her life together.

While it's not in your control, if they are giving her room and board, she should be paying them at least $1,000.00 per month if not more!!!

One way to get her away from living practically in your back yard would be to get a restraining order against her because of the type of people she has begun hanging around with. The neighbours house is likely within the prohibited distance so she wouldn't be able to stay there anymore.

I just wanted to touch on the car loan that you co-signed. Go see a lawyer about that. You are entitled to a FREE 15 minute consult before committing. I think it's very important that you deal with that NOW otherwise she could do a whole lot of damage to your credit rating and not only that, saddle you with the expense of a loan, while she continues to have legal status over the car because it's in her name..

libby74 · Aug 1, 2010

$50.00 is reasonable rent?!

I thought you said she was working? She should be paying more than $50.00 to live somewhere.

If she had her own apartment it would cost her probably $600.00 or $700.00 or more just for the rent. Then add utilities and groceries and laundry on top of it all.

Ooops, I was trying to be sarcastic and failed.
I was making her give me $300 per paycheck ($600 monthly)to prove that she could live on her own. The money was going directly into her savings account. DH & I wanted her to see if she could actually afford to live on her own and pay her own bills. I agree, giving the neighbor $50 is just trying to make herself feel a little better about sponging off of him. At least, in her own mind, she can "hey, I'm paying rent!"

About the car loan: I called the bank the other day and talked to the loan officer who did the actual paperwork. I explained to him that I wanted my name off the loan and that if that wasn't possible I wanted to be listed as a co-owner of the car. He spent a good amount of time answering all the questions and concerns I have. His advice was this: if I'm a co-owner and she has an accident that's her fault I can be sued, too. If she defaults on the loan I actually have the option of making the payments (never!) or telling the bank they can take the car. She would have 3 weeks to come up with the money she owes them or they will sell the car. If they get less than the remaining amount of the loan she & I would be responsible for making up the difference. I told him I was worried about what that could do to my (and DH's) credit rating. He assured me that they would work with me in anyway possible to make sure my creidt was affected. Also, once she had paid off at least 30% of the loan, there's a possibility the co-signer's name can be removed.
The bottom line is, apparently, be patient and assume she doesn't want to be without a car.

Update on DD & Her Dramas (sorry, kind of long)

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